Is "lying" a crime ?

[Reinaert]

So if my wife asks me if a new outfit she has purchased and is very happy with looks good and I don't think it does, I should tell her the truth????

Yeah, if there is one thing a woman doesn't want to hear, it's the truth.

[edao]

I think lying is more complicated than being a 1 or 0.

Lies are more like shades of grey the off white ones are useful and help ease social relations, we all use them, but black ones are dangerous and usually lead to trouble.

I think lying is an intrinsic part of human social system. Dishonesty in the Capitalist system is huge problem in. Capatalism is the pursuit of profit over everything else to the point where a rip-off culutre has developed. Big business is not concerned about a fair price or quality products its about squeezing over ehads and charging as much as you can get away with. In truth this is hugely damaging dishonesty.

Sub-prime mortgages were sold to people who clearly couldn't afford them. The people selling them knew they would have sold on the debt before the time bomb went off, this was dishonesty and this quick buck mentality lead to devastation of the hopes of a whole generation.

[Maciamo]

Regarding this topic, I would like to recommend the short essay (26 pages) Lying (only available in e-book) by the great author and neuroscientist Sam Harris.

[Franco]

Lying is the basis of our civilisation.

[The Alani Dragon]

I have a real hatred of lying and don't lie to anyone or for anyone, even to the point of it being painful. To the question, would I ever consider lying? Only if it saved a life of someone I would consider worthy to lie for.

[Jackson]

I would think lying is only a crime in the sphere of justice and things told under oath. I very much dislike lying, and pure honesty is probably one of the most valuable things in the world, not least due to it's scarcity. However, not lying can be just as dangerous as lying, i don't doubt lies have prevented a lot of conflict throughout history, or at least as many as they have started.

Kind Regards,
Sam Jackson

[The Alani Dragon]

If you start to lie all the time, then what is your sense of reality? If you lie, then what you are is a lie. This is why I'm sticking with the truth.

[Cotys]

If you start to lie all the time, then what is your sense of reality? If you lie, then what you are is a lie. This is why I'm sticking with the truth.

That's really big of you, considering that you posted here my poem "On Dancing and Trancing", that you got from a different forum, without my signature, nor my name, nor a link to the forum you took it from. Of you don't consider plagiarism a lie?

Be so nice to post a link from where you took my poem, and acknowledge my authorship. I wrote it and posted it almost 2 months before you took it, from the forum we both wrote on, from a thread you knew very well, so you have no excuse to post it without my name, or a link from where you took it from.

To everyone else - sorry that I cannot provide the link for the poem in question, because I don't have enough postst here. It is posted on All Empires History Community, subforum "Literary Persuits", thread "My Poems", page #3, name "On dancing and Trancing".

[Riccardo]

Lying is the basis of our civilisation.

Totally agree. Lying is the only possibility for a peaceful coexistence. Without lies it would be impossible to survive as mankind. Even in nature we have examples of it.

[Grubbe]

telling a lie often comes back to cause problems later. As hard as it sometimes can be, telling the truth is better in the long run. The one time I justify telling a lie in my mind, is to protect hurt feeling. When someone asks a question about themselves and I know my honest answer will hurt them, I WILL lie rather than be hurtfully truthful? As grandmother used to say, "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all!" If I'm forced to give an answer, it will be a NICE one.

Frank

Yes, I quite agree!

[Grubbe]

Even in nature we have examples of it.

In nature?? Do animals lie?

[LeBrok]

In nature?? Do animals lie?

Because most, or maybe all, lying is in verbal form it is very hard for animals to lie.

My friends had a big dog. He was punished many times for taking food from countertop. One day he managed to pull and eat box of chocolates out off countertop. When they came home dog was unusually friendly, but in weird way. They had experienced this behaviour before, so it wasn't hard to figure out that the dog did something he shouldn't, and doesn't want to be punished.
I'm pretty sure if this dog could speak, he would be denying through his teeth, just to avoid the wrath of masters.

Other example of animals lying is when possum and some other animals are playing dead to trick enemies. They are lying that they are dead.

[Grubbe]

Because most, or maybe all, lying is in verbal form it is very hard for animals to lie.

My friends had a big dog. He was punished many times for taking food from countertop. One day he managed to pull and eat box of chocolates out off countertop. When they came home dog was unusually friendly, but in weird way. They had experienced this behaviour before, so it wasn't hard to figure out that the dog did something he shouldn't, and doesn't want to be punished.

I would interpret that behaviour more as a feeling of guilt or shame, because the dog knew he was not allowed to take it, and it knew that his masters probably would be angry, so he tried to make them less so by acting extremely friendly. Of course he would then give himself away, which is kind of the opposite of lying. I have experienced the same with cats, by the way.

[LeBrok]

I would interpret that behaviour more as a feeling of guilt or shame.

Aren't these the main reasons behind human lies, plus avoidance of punishment?

[Grubbe]

Aren't these the main reasons behind human lies, plus avoidance of punishment?

In humans, yes, but it also depends on the situation. But I don't think animals are capable of lying per se, in my opinion, just as they are not capable of laughing or crying (with tears - animals can of course experience pain, distress and sorrow like we do).

[LeBrok]

In humans, yes, but it also depends on the situation. But I don't think animals are capable of lying per se, in my opinion, just as they are not capable of laughing or crying (with tears - animals can of course experience pain, distress and sorrow like we do).

So what about possum playing dead? Isn't it lying?