Genetic history of Sicily : Greeks, Arabs, Normans and others

Well, in the Dodecad Ancestry Project here are some of the Sicilian percentages compared to other europeans :

Sicilians :
- North European : 13.7 %
- Near-Eastern : 15.9 %

North Italians :
- North European : 31 %
- Near Eastern: 4.6 %

Spaniards :
- North European : 38.1 %
- Near Eastern: 3 %

Basques :
- North European 39.9 %
- Near-Eastern 0 %

Greeks :
- North European 21.1 %
- Near-Eastern 11.1 %

French :
- North European : 50.2
- Near-Eastern : 1.8 %

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc...3a0JicjZmRE96bGc&hl=en&authkey=CPGxtqQM#gid=0

Was there anything on southern Italians?
 
The study linked on top of the page gives some of the subclades of J2 identified in Sicily, including the percentages for each region.

The overall percentages are :

- J2a4b (M67) = 3.81%
- J2a4b1 (M92) = 1.27%

- J2a4h1a (DYS445-6) = 4.66%

- J2b = 0.85%
- J2b2 (M241) = 4.66%

- Other J2 or J2* = 10.59%


The nomenclature has changed since both articles, so I have updated the subclade names based on the 2009 ISOGG tree.

What is called J2f in the study by Di Giacomo (on FamilyTreeDNA) is now J2a4b. Based on Di Giacomo's study, it looks like J2a4b has a Greek (or Anatolian) connection, rather than a Middle Eastern one. But this is because they do not give results for Lebanon. According to this other study of haplogroup J, J2a4b (M67) makes up one fifth of all Lebanese J2, and is indeed the only major subclade in Lebanon. It is Georgia and Calabria that have the highest percentage of J2a4b (M67) and J2a4b1 (M92), totalling 15.5%. In comparison Greece has a total of 7.6% for both subclades. Sicily has 2.4% of each, which is very similar to Lebanon, with 2.5% of each.

J2b is associated with the Neolithic spread of agriculture from Northern Greece and the Balkans. Interestingly it is most frequent in western Sicily, especially at the Western tip (Santa Ninfa) where E-V13, R1a and R1b are also very strong. E-V13 is always associated with J2b, so no surprise there. But the correlation with R1a and R1b could mean that J2b and E-V13 arrived together with those haplogroups, maybe directly from Central Europe or northern Italy.

I couldn't find information about J2a4h1a. This leaves over 15% of J2 of uncertain origin based on Di Gaetano's study.

If look at the subclades of J2 over the Mediterranean there are few discernible patterns. There is often more difference inside a same country than between regions. For instance, there is more difference between Crete and Macedonia than between Greece and Lebanon. This may simply be due to the fact that many subclades of J2 already existed before J2 spread from the Near East to Greece and Italy. Geographically isolated places like Crete developed their own subclades over time, but these represent only a tiny fraction of the overall J2. J2a4d (M319) is almost only found in Crete, but only makes up about 5% of the island's population.

J2b is the only subclade that seems to have originated, or at least come to represent a sizeable portion of the population, in Greece, and spread from there to the rest of Europe.

Maciamo it was mostly Peloponnesian Greeks who colonized Sicily and they have 15 % J2a and only 3 % J2b so you are absolutely wrong about J2b being the only J2 subclade that seems to represent a sizeable portion of the population. In fact the opposite seems to be true
 
ACtually, it's not true that J1 or J2 was carried by Arabs or Phoenicians.
Arabs did not have any signifant impact in Sicily, since they were a ultra-minority.
The Y-dna J in Sicily comes mostly from Greeks and from Neolithic migrations, as in the rest of Europe

"Another Y-chromosome marker that may have been spread to Europe by Phoenicians and Arabs is the subclade of haplogroup J labeled J*(xJ2) or Eu10. It originated in the southern part of the Fertile Crescent and is very common in Arabia and Palestine (Neolithic J2 or Eu9 is from the northern Fertile Crescent). Its frequencies are 0.9% in Northern Italy, 7.1% in Central Italy and 5.3% in Southern Italy (for a total of between 0.5% and 3.6% admixture). It's important to note that while Phoenician and Arab colonists undoubtedly carried Eu10, its expansion is dated to ~9000-6400 YBP and generally attributed to Neolithic migrations (Nebel et al. 2001). Therefore, levels of recent admixture may be even lower."

I am pleasantly surprised at the level of education at this forum. The Italians have no problem accepting the origin of certain haplogroups from beyond Europe. Nothing to do with my countrymen (I'm Spaniard). In fact the only one who does not accept the scientific reality is this spanish man. I am not surprised!
 
Very well said Ferreira... most spaniards have problems dealing with their african roots. I'm glad that we finally find a spaniard who is not delusional.
 
My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?
 
My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?

Both were Germanic people so it is hard to differentiate between the two. I don't know if Lombards have been definitively associated with I1, but certainly some Normans were I1.
 
My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?

I1-EE has a youthful TMRCA (only about 1,500 years) but connects to the I1-Z58 tree as a whole over 3000 years ago (see Nordtvedt). That is to say, it's a little bit of an outlier, so it's a bit difficult to trace its exact migration route during the Migration Period. Its modern center of frequency looks to be in Germany, maybe somewhere around Munich considering its extent into Italy, Switzerland, and the Czech Republic. I think that distribution looks like a good match with the Lombards, but the sample size is a bit low for me to be really confident.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the difference between Sicilians and mainland Italians is that Sicilians have sub-Saharan African Ancestry of at least 1% whereas the mainland has little to none. Not even the Calabrese have it.
 
DNA Cousins

I recently tested on 23andme and I found a 4th cousin with the Ventimiglia last name from Italy. I don't know if 4th cousins are considered closely related but am searching for info from family I'm not in contact with.

Sicily is such a beautiful island! I recently visited there and I found the people, the food (loved the Sicilian wines) and the scenery to be wonderful- all of which has been influenced by their "DNA history." Some of my family is from there (from the NW of the island Mother's side-Palermo/ Monreale and Father's side-Castelbuono/ Ventimiglia line originally from Liguria and a branch in Sicily) and most Sicilians we met seemed to think Norman influence in us but my Y-DNA is J2a4b and my MtDNA is H. I happen to be fair-haired with green eyes, like my mother but I can tan well if I spend time in the sun -going for the California blond look! My father has brown hair/ eyes but his brother is blond/ blue- go figure....I think it shows that we really cannot get all of who we are from just our Y and MtDNA- after all, there are other people in our genetic line with different Y and MtDNA Haplotypes but gave us many other characteristics from their autosomal genes and X chromosome which we are currently not taking into consideration.
 
So sad nobody talk about mtn dna of Sicilians.... am J1c1... and find little or nothing about.
only traces in Northern Europe, Ireland, wales, Iceland...? How my maternal ancester get so south?
or she was already there, since.... ever? I'm frustrated of the lack of studies about. Someone.....?
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the difference between Sicilians and mainland Italians is that Sicilians have sub-Saharan African Ancestry of at least 1% whereas the mainland has little to none. Not even the Calabrese have it.

Likely you're wrong.
 

This thread has been viewed 172961 times.

Back
Top