Genetic make-up of Europe

I cannot post URL's yet, but the Aurignacian culture began around 40,000 to 35,000 and is located in France in Europe and South West Asia, since Haplogroup I holds on to hte claim of originating in Europe they could not of been Aurignacian, this culture is from Haplogroup R.

The current estimates for the age of R is about 28,000 years old. R split from P about 30,000 years ago, which itself split from NOP 35,000 years ago.

Considering that haplogroups N is mainly found in Siberia, O in East Asia, P in Central Asia, and Q from the Middle East and Central Asia to the Americas, it is extremely doubtful that R appeared in Europe. The most likely place is Central Asia.

I have explained that in the history of R1b. You can visualise this on the R1b migration map.

Even haplogroup K, parent of NOP, L and T, probably originated somewhere between the Middle East and Central Asia. This would explain the dispersal of N, O, P and Q around Asia, and the presence of L in South Asia. T is a back migration to North-East Africa, probably through the Arabian peninsula.

People of Aurignacian culture must have belonged either to haplogroup IJ (the main haplogroup in Paleolithic Europe and Middle East) or to an extinct haplogroup. All the evidence is consistent with a development of R1 and R2 in Central Asia, then a spread of R1a to the Eurasian steppes, and of R1b to Anatolia via the (northern) Middle East. Typically European subclades of R1b (R1b-S28, R1b-L21, R1b-M167) have a coalescence time of around 4500 to 5000 years ago, except R1b-S21 which is even younger (around 3500 years old).
 
The current estimates for the age of R is about 28,000 years old. R split from P about 30,000 years ago, which itself split from NOP 35,000 years ago.

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This is what you say, whereas a Doctor of of Science says,
V
V
V
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Y-DNA Haplogroup R is perhaps the most prominent Y-DNA lineage on Earth today. The date for its origin is in the Paleolithic Era, 35-40kya.

The origin of Haplogroup R dates to 30-35kya in the Paleolithic Era and Pleistocene Epoch. Its entry into Europe at this point coincides with the spread of the Aurignacian culture across Eurasia. Haplogroup R is further linked with the spread of proto-Indo-European languages that took hold as the early languages in large portions of Europe and Asia.
"
 
Based on the Distribution of Y-chromosome DNA in Europe, here is a list of countries based on their ethnic percentages.

Foreword

Celts

There isn't a homogeneous Celtic ethnicity. Pre-Roman Europe had a strong Celtic culture ranging from Central Europe to the British Isles and Iberia. Celtic people can be divided in these rough categories, each associated with a subclade of R1b-S116+ (subclade markers are in brackets) :

- Rhine-Alpine-Italic Celts (S28)
- Scottish Celts (M222)
- Irish Celts (M37)
- Atlantic Celts* (M167)
- Basques (M65, M153)

* Northern Iberia, Western France, Cornwall, Wales.

Germans

What people call "Germanic ethnicity" is in fact a mixture of northern continental R1b (S116-, S21+) and I haplogroups (I1 + I2b). In Scandinavia and East Germany, the inclusion of a strong Slavic component (R1a) make them a slightly different ethnicity from the English, Dutch, Belgian or West Germans.

Slavs

The original Slavic (or Aryan or Kurgan) people belonged to haplogroup R1a. This haplogroup is also common in Central Asia, Iran and India, thanks to the great Indo-Aryan migrations.

Greco-Romans

The Ancient Greeks were an admixture of European and Near-Eastern people. The paternal side shows a strong Near-Eastern component, making modern Greek Y-DNA closer to Turkish, Syrian, Lebanese and even Iraqi one than to that of Western or Northern Europe. According to Y-DNA frequencies observed in Europe, Southern Italy and the Balkans were heavily settled by the Ancient Greeks, or their Neolithic ancestors that did not yet call themselves "Greeks".

We are still unsure about the original Y-DNA types of the Romans, but due to the proximity of the Greek colonies, and the fact that Etruscans were also of Near Eastern origins, it is likely that the Romans were an admixture of Near-Eastern J2, G2 and E3b with the native Italo-Celtic R1b. As the Romans played a major role in spreading Near-Eastern haplogroups in and north of the Alps, I will refer to the J2-G2-E3b admixture as Greco-Roman, and the Italic R1b just as "Celtic". Haplogroup G2 correlates strongly with the spread of J2 with a ratio of 1 G2 for 3 J2 in average, suggesting that these haplogroups spread together from Anatolia, while the European E3b had a different origin (probably in the Balkans).


Most Celtic countries in Europe (R1b-S116+)

  • Ireland : about 75% of Y-DNA
  • Spain & Wales : about 70%
  • Scotland : about 65%
  • France & Portugal : about 55%
  • Italy : about 40%
  • Switzerland & England : about 35%
  • Belgium : about 30%
  • Germany : about 25%
  • Netherlands & Denmark : about 20%

Most Germanic countries in Europe (I1 + I2b + R1b-S116-)

  • Netherlands & Iceland : about 70% of Y-DNA
  • Sweden : about 65%
  • Denmark : about 58%
  • Norway : about 55%
  • England : about 53%
  • Belgium : about 48%
  • Germany : about 40%
  • Austria : about 34%
  • Finland : about 32%
  • Czech Republic : about 26%
  • Switzerland : about 22%
  • France : about 21%
  • Slovakia : about 19%
  • Estonia : about 18%
  • Poland : about 14%

Most Slavic countries in Europe (R1a + I2a2)

  • Belarus & Croatia : about 70% of Y-DNA
  • Poland : about 65%
  • Ukraine: about 62%
  • Russia (historical) : about 57%
  • Bosnia : about 55%
  • Slovakia : about 50%
  • Bulgaria : about 47%
  • Czech Republic : about 43%
  • Romania : about 40%
  • Hungary : about 37%
  • Serbia : about 35%

Most Indo-European countries (R1a + R1b)

  • Wales : about 84% of Y-DNA
  • Ireland : about 82%
  • Scotland : about 80%
  • Poland : about 73%
  • Spain : about 72%
  • England : about 71%
  • Iceland & Belgium : about 65%
  • Netherlands & Germany : about 60%

Most Paleolithic European (Cro-Magnon) countries (I1 + I2)

  • Croatia : about 51% of Y-DNA
  • Sweden : about 44%
  • Norway & Bulgaria : about 37%
  • Denmark : about 36%
  • Serbia : about 35%
  • Iceland : about 33%
  • Belarus & Finland : about 29%
  • Netherlands & Hungary : about 25%
  • Czech Republic : about 24%
  • England, Germany & Romania : about 21%
  • Belgium : about 20%

Most Greco-Balkanic (or Near Eastern) countries in Europe (E-M78 + T + J + G2a)

  • Greece : about 58% of Y-DNA
  • Albania : about 48%
  • Turkey : about 45%
  • Italy : about 40%
  • Macedonia Portugal : about 38%
  • Romania : about 33%
  • Austria & Bulgaria : about 30%
  • Switzerland : about 25%
  • Hungary : about 22%
  • France : about 20%
  • Germany : about 16%

Most Uralo-Finnic countries in Europe (N1c1)

  • Finland : about 60% of Y-DNA
  • Latvia & Lithuania : about 40%
  • Estonia : about 35%
  • Russia (historical) : about 23%
  • Sweden : about 7%


-------------------

Here are a few ethnic combinations (must have at least 20% of each). I use the term "Greek" or "Greco-" as an abbreviation to mean "Near-Eastern" (actually Levant + Anatolia + Greece + Balkans), i.e. the people associated with the early farming.

Most Greco-Celtic countries (R1b + E + T + G2a + J2)

  • Portugal : about 90% of Y-DNA
  • Italy : about 82%
  • France : about 75%
  • Switzerland : about 60%

Most Italo-Celto-Germanic countries (R1b + I)

  • Netherlands : about 95% of Y-DNA
  • Ireland & Wales : about 90%
  • England & Scotland : about 85%
  • Belgium : about 78%
  • Denmark & France : about 75%
  • Germany : about 65%
  • Switzerland : about 58%
  • Italy : about 55%

Most Slavo-Germanic countries

  • Iceland : about 95% of Y-DNA
  • Sweden & Norway : about 85%
  • Czech Republic : about 72%
  • Austria & Slovakia : about 65%

Most Greco-Slavic countries

  • Ukraine : about 85% of Y-DNA
  • Serbia & Greece : about 80%
  • Albania & Bulgaria : about 77%
  • Romania : about 70%
  • Hungary : about 65%
  • Austria : about 60%

Most Uralo-Slavic countries

  • Lithuania : about 85% of Y-DNA
  • Latvia & Russia : about 80%
  • Estonia : about 70%

I believe some of this figures require revision.
 
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This is what you say, whereas a Doctor of of Science says,
V
V
V
"
Y-DNA Haplogroup R is perhaps the most prominent Y-DNA lineage on Earth today. The date for its origin is in the Paleolithic Era, 35-40kya.

The origin of Haplogroup R dates to 30-35kya in the Paleolithic Era and Pleistocene Epoch. Its entry into Europe at this point coincides with the spread of the Aurignacian culture across Eurasia. Haplogroup R is further linked with the spread of proto-Indo-European languages that took hold as the early languages in large portions of Europe and Asia.
"

No, this is what the ISOGG says (they are the reference in terms of Y-DNA haplogroups and age estimates) :

ISOGG said:
Y-DNA haplogroup R is believed to have arisen approximately 27,000 years ago in Asia. The two currently defined subclades are R1 and R2.

* Haplogroup R1 is estimated to have arisen during the height of the Last Glacial Maximum (LGM), about 18,500 years ago, most likely in southwestern Asia.

What are your sources ?
 
^
^
This is what you say, whereas a Doctor of of Science says,
V
V
V
"
Y-DNA Haplogroup R is perhaps the most prominent Y-DNA lineage on Earth today. The date for its origin is in the Paleolithic Era, 35-40kya.

The origin of Haplogroup R dates to 30-35kya in the Paleolithic Era and Pleistocene Epoch. Its entry into Europe at this point coincides with the spread of the Aurignacian culture across Eurasia. Haplogroup R is further linked with the spread of proto-Indo-European languages that took hold as the early languages in large portions of Europe and Asia.
"
Javolno, this is the old R theory, but it seems now this old theory is obsolete...
R1 is now considered to have originated 18,500 BP (see Karafet 2008) and R1b is now supposed to have entered in Europe with Indo european migrations.

Bernard
 
That's correct. I have mentioned that in the description of European haplogroups. For the sake of simplicity (to avoid confusing novice readers) and I considered ethnic groups here as being modern ethnicities, not ancient ones. Modern ethnic groups are the admixtures I described above.

This information is simply fantastic.

(I am a novice in this theme of Genealogical DNA, and I wish I would have seen it before).

You have given here a whole and ordered introduction to the theme. And if you delve, you can go down to the full description of the terms, the technics involved, almost to sequencing itself.

This is what I was looking for!

Many, many thanks.
 
This information is simply fantastic.

(I am a novice in this theme of Genealogical DNA, and I wish I would have seen it before).

You have given here a whole and ordered introduction to the theme. And if you delve, you can go down to the full description of the terms, the technics involved, almost to sequencing itself.

This is what I was looking for!

Many, many thanks.

I couldn't agree more. As a novice myself, I've only been delving into this subject for six months or so, and have yet to find any web-based information that even comes close. Full marks to Maciamo and a great festive season to all.
 
Found a map for E1b1b1a2 distribution in Europe.

HgE1b1b1a2.png
 
e is supposed to be ultimatly from the horn and ethiopia and then evolved into balkanic e subclade and north african e subclades etc! e is ethiopid in origin! ethiopids left east africa and evolved into east mediterranean balkan greeks and the berbers of northwest africa this is looking at the male side only though
 
This thread needs some updating. After realising that G2a probably came to Europe along with the Indo-Europeans during the Bronze Age, I now think that it would make more sense to list G2a as Indo-European too, along with R1a and R1b. It's actually Caucasian, but since the limit between the steppe, north Anatolian and Caucasian cultures isn't clear, and the two groups were obviously very connected, it's not a bad idea to merge them. In that case, the most Indo-European countries based on Y-DNA percentages are :

  1. Wales 88%
  2. Ireland 83%
  3. Scotland 81.5%
  4. Poland 75%
  5. Spain 74%
  6. England 73%
  7. France 68.5%
  8. Belgium 67.5%
  9. Germany 65.5%
  10. (Southern-Central Russia 65%)
  11. Iceland 65%
  12. Portugal 64%
  13. Slovakia 64%
  14. Switzerland 63%
  15. Netherlands 62%
  16. Czech Republic 61%
  17. Italy 58.5%
  18. Denmark 58%
  19. Ukraine 58%
  20. Austria 57%
  21. Norway 56%
  22. Belarus 55%
  23. Hungary 54.5%
  24. Russia 53%
  25. Latvia 52%
  26. Georgia 51%
  27. Romania 45%
  28. Sweden 45%
  29. Lithuania 43%
  30. Estonia 40%
  31. Croatia 38%
  32. Turkey 33.5%
  33. Bulgaria 33%
  34. Iran 33%
  35. Greece 27.5%
  36. Albania 27%
  37. Syria 26.5%
  38. Serbia 23%
  39. Cyprus 21%
  40. Iraq 20.5%
  41. Bosnia 19%
  42. Lebanon 14.5%
  43. Finland 11%

Russia ranks low because it has a significant Uralic population (N1c1). Ukraine and Georgia rank low because of of the Middle Eastern influence (J2, E1b1b, T) but also Central Asian haplogroups (Q, P, K, F, C3). Ukraine, Belarus and Russia also inherited from a lot of Carpathian I2a2, which I think could have come from the integration of the Cucuteni-Tripolye culture to the Corded Ware culture. Poland is therefore more representative of the Bronze-Age northern steppe population.

Now that I have added the frequencies for mtdna U subclades I would like to rank countries by percentage of Indo-European haplogroups. The problem is that many mtDNA haplogroups are found both in Paleolithic Europeans and Indo-Europeans, since after all they are all Europeans. This is the case of haplogroup H, V and U5. Besides K and T were surely part of the main IE haplogroups, but also among Neolithic immigrants from the Near-East. The only haplogroups for which we can be relatively (but not absolutely) confident that they are of Pontic-Caspian and/or Caucasian (i.e. Indo-European) origin are U2, U3, U4, I, W and X2. The ranking below will be based on these 6 haplogroups, but is therefore lower than the real percentage of Indo-European origin. H, V and U5 can potentially add over 50% to the total of each country (more likely something like 20 to 30%).

  1. (Adygea/North Caucasus 43%)
  2. (Bashkirs/Volga-Ural 27%)
  3. Latvia 23%
  4. Bulgaria 22.5%
  5. Denmark 17.5%
  6. Finland 17.5%
  7. Slovenia 17%
  8. Serbia 16.5%
  9. Lithuania 14.5%
  10. Russia 14%
  11. Poland 13.5%
  12. Macedonia 13.5%
  13. Czech Republic 13.5%
  14. Netherlands 13.5%
  15. Portugal 13.5%
  16. Sweden 13%
  17. Scotland 12.5%
  18. Estonia 12.5%
  19. France 12.5%
  20. Italy 12.5%
  21. Ireland 12%
  22. Croatia 12%
  23. Ukraine 11.5%
  24. Austria 11.5%
  25. Romania 11%
  26. Norway 11%
  27. England 10.5%
  28. Switzerland 10.5%
  29. Greece 10.5%
  30. Germany 10%
  31. Spain 10%
  32. Albania 10%
  33. Wales 8.5%
  34. Belgium 8%


MtDNA is much more evenly widespread and patterns do not emerge based on this selection. It will in all likelihood be clearer once H, V, T, U5 and K subclades can be taken into consideration. Furthermore the data for whole countries is not always reliable. There are huge regional variations in countries that have been studied in detail like Spain, Croatia or Russia.

The data I found for the subclades of U is based on small sample size (hence prone to bias) for most countries except Ireland, the Balkans, Poland, Latvia and Finland. Data was particularly sparse for Scandinavia, the Netherlands, Belgium, France, Austria and the Czech Republic, and I couldn't find anything at all for Hungary.

The Bashkirs of the Volga-Ural region (where horses were first domesticate and the war chariot invented) have 18%. However they have 34% of Mongoloid mtDNA (A, C, D, F1, G, M7, M8a, N9a, Y). On the Y-chromosome side, the Bashkirs have 73% of R1 (R1a1a + R1b1b1 + R1b1b2) and 25% of Mongoloid haplogroups (C3, N, O). In other words, if we exclude the later Mongoloid admixture, the Y-DNA is almost 100% R1a and R1b, with just a little bit of I, G2a, E1b1b, J2 and T. Applying the same process to mtDNA (multiplying by 3/2) the percentage passes from 18% to 27%, including 22.5% of U4.

The Republic of Adygea in the North Caucasus (matching roughly the geographic location of the Maykop culture) would rank first in the list with 37.5% of the 6-haplogroup admixture. They have one of the highest percentage of mtDNA T (16%), also linked to the Indo-Europeans. If we recalculate the percentages by excluding the 15% of Mongoloid and Central Asian mtDNA, the Adygei would have 43% of the U2-U3-U4-I-W-X admixture.
 
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Mtdna haplogroup T could potentially be an important Indo-European marker. Its highest frequencies are found around the Caspian Sea and the Caucasus, and its settlement patterns undeniably match the Indo-European migrations, covering all Europe, with enclaves in Central Asia and India as well as in Xinjiang and southern Siberia.

Here is an alternative ranking using the same mtDNA admixture as above + T.


  1. (Adygea/North Caucasus 61.5%)
  2. Latvia 32%
  3. (Bashkirs/Volga-Ural 31.5%)
  4. Denmark 29.5%
  5. Bulgaria 29%
  6. Netherlands 27.5%
  7. Sweden 25.5%
  8. Poland 25%
  9. Lithuania 24.5%
  10. Czech Republic 24.5%
  11. Macedonia 24.5%
  12. Italy 24.5%
  13. Portugal 24.5%
  14. Ireland 24%
  15. Scotland 24%
  16. Switzerland 24%
  17. France 24%
  18. Russia 24%
  19. Slovenia 23%
  20. Norway 22%
  21. England 21.5%
  22. Finland 21.5%
  23. Serbia 21.5%
  24. Germany 21%
  25. Greece 20.5%
  26. Estonia 20.5%
  27. Austria 20%
  28. Croatia 19.5%
  29. Wales 19.5%
  30. Romania 19%
  31. Ukraine 18.5%
  32. Belgium 18%
  33. Spain 18%
  34. Albania 16.5%

It does look more correct, but still far from perfect due to the absence of H, V and U5.
 
How is that the place were indoeuropeans came from, the Pontic Steppes, only about 10% of R1b is found ?
 
How is that the place were indoeuropeans came from, the Pontic Steppes, only about 10% of R1b is found ?

Because most of them migrated ! One particularity of prehistoric/ancient steppe nomads is that they didn't stay in place because they didn't have cities or towns and most of them didn't practice any form of agriculture (they tried it a bit during the Pontic Neolithic but gave it up in favour of exclusive herding because the steppe climate wasn't well suited to primitive farming). Therefore it's easy for them not to leave much evidence of their passage behind them, archaeological or genetic. The North Caucasus was more settled so more evidence remained.

The people living in the Pontic-Caspian region now mostly descend from later arrivals from the northern forest-steppe and from Central Asia. I made a list in 5000 years of migrations from the Eurasian steppes to Europe. I am not sure which group was the last to be predominantly R1b, but I'd say either the southern Yamna people or the Cimmerians. It is pretty much certain that the Scythians and Sarmatians were already in great majority R1a1 because 1) they came from Central Asia and 2) ancient Scythian Y-DNA has been tested and was constantly R1a1.

The strong incidence of I2a2 (with a tint of E1b1b, J2 and T) in modern Ukraine, Belarus and central European Russia is most probably a remnant of the Cucuteni-Tripolye people, who had developed the largest towns on earth (bigger than in Mesopotamia or Egypt) around 4000-3500 BCE. They were absorbed by the steppe people to form the Globular amphora culture, then progressively dispersed around the region for the last 5500 years. Their genetic impact is important because they maintained a huge population in hundreds of towns in modern Moldova and the western half of Ukraine.
 
I know im not allergic to anything and i can pretty much eat anything.. I also know that i cannot have too much intake of sugars and salts as diabetes runs in my family as well as high blood pressure and cholesterol..
 
Interesting. I am Anatolian born and raised in a place called Bogazliyan between Yozgat and Kayseri so at the direct middle of Turkey and Anatolia. I always wonderd why me and my fam. looked liked Greeks and also from the people of the Balkans..
 
In Scandinavia and East Germany, the inclusion of a strong Slavic component (R1a) make them a slightly different ethnicity from the English, Dutch, Belgian or West Germans.

Recently there have been some discussions in the German media wether East and West Germans are two ethnic groups. There was a hot topic especially job discrimination and if East Germans form a distinct ethnicity. Of course it was primarly meant on a cultural bases, but this gives a completly new view on it *lol*

I know it's pure chance, but it is really amazing to see how the former East and West German border matches roughly with the predominental distribution of Y-DNA. I'm just waiting for the tabloids to discover this, haha :D
 
East and West Germans, two ethnic groups?! That is silly. :LOL:

Actually, the R1a component is not necessarily Slavic. Granted, the West Slavic peoples migrated into the area of modern Eastern Germany during the migrations period, however in the area probably R1a was already abundantly present since the Corded Ware culture. Also, Scandinavian R1a arrived there probably with the Battle Axe culture (offshot of Corded Ware). Basically, R1a in eastern Germany could be easily of both Germanic or Slavic origin. But it's a bit hard to tell (I don't know much about subclades of R1a, that might shed some light though).

Genetically, there's much more of a north-south difference in Germany than an east-west one, with Germanic influence (I1, R1b-U106, R1a) in the north and Celtic influence (R1b-P312) in the south and the extreme west. R1a was also probably enriched by the Slavic migrations. Modern Germany was probably also enriched by Haplogroup N as a result of the post-WWII explusions from historic eastern Germany, since the original population of East Prussia was of Baltic descend.
 
Hmm, that's really interesting, I've never read it that detailed. How much genetic impact do you think did the East Colonization of the Holy Roman Empire have during the Middle Ages in the area of modern eastern Germany?


(Neues von Thilo Sarrazin (jetzt holt er schon wieder wieder aus): "Süddeutschland schafft sich ab; Norddeutsche tragen ein bestimmtes Gen in sich" *lol*)
 

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