Economy Retirement age increased by a few years - for or against ?

Good point Lebrok, i do think people love to sensationalize global warming, obesity, old age.
We love to think about how doomed we all are!

I wonder though if we are becoming to automated, we now have auto check outs in the UK in supermarkets meaning they save money on staff, personally I prefer them as they are quicker and easier that queuing for small talk with some half wit. I have done work with an international printer who are moving their whole business model online, they are basically planning on closing their entire franchise net work over the net ten years. They make a bigger margin the customer get a lower price by cutting out the franchise who acts as a middle man. The internet has allowed them a sales outlet which used to be the high street. While you might argue this is win win, its just more jobs lost, I wonder how we match up a growing population with falling jobs?
 
here in italy there was a scandal some decades ago:
basically the government allowed some of its public workers the so called "Baby Pensions".
Baby Pensions = In 1973 with the Rumor Government where approved pensions for statal workers as soon as they reached 14 yeras and sixth months of contributions for women married with children, or 20 yeras of contributions for men public workers or for women without children.
Thankfully these kind of injustices were eliminated in 1992.
In Italy in the past (more), but also nowdays, public workers are more protected (expecially on pensions, as they still go to pension earlier than private workers) than private workers; this is a huge injustice.. the wearing effect of time on men is the same for everybody public or private worker.. then why are they still threated differently??... i have a personal answer to this.. because they are votes for socialists... that so socialists and egualitarian aren't because they threat people differently...
 
There needs to be flexibility in the age of retirement as some people wish to carry on working, while others can't wait to retire. Should the age increase? I'm not too keen on an increase, but if there are finacial problems in a country then a small increase might be sensible, as long as medical research backs up the ability of the population to cope.
 
The thing is, if people wanted to, they could retire at 40 or 50. If people choose to be a 9-5 slave all their life then expect to work later, of course. It makes sense if our population is getting older and there's not enough working people to support them.
 
I found this:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/eco_gdp_per_cap_in_190-economy-gdp-per-capita-1900
It shows GDP per capita in 1900 for many countries, in today’s dollars.

It means that GDP per person has risen roughly 10 fold, in last 110 years. It makes sense when we compare what life was like in our countries 100 years ago and now. We have bigger and nicer houses, fast shiny cars, phones, tv, more food, bigger bellies, clothes, travel, health care, fly around the world, you name it.
How is it possible?
Do we work harder? - No
Do we work longer? - No
So how can we produce 10 times as much as hard working people of the past? How today's worker can produce as much as 10 workers century ago? Did we become a super humans, supermen? What do we have they didn't?
A magic wand maybe? :shocked:

Well, we have machines, machines everywhere. Many more, faster and efficient machines than ancestors did one hindered years ago. Machines harvest, produce, dig, carry goods, lift loads, build cars, calculate, solve problems, wash, pump, cut. Generally they do work for 10 men. Today’s people are as efficient at work as our grandpas were long time ago, but the production progress, the GDP growth was achieved by our beautiful machines. Often undervalued, and working tirelessly behind the scenes, are taken for granted, and are forgotten how valuable they are. Surely people have to operate and maintain them, but the combination of workers and our powerful machines is awesome.

its not only usage of machines,,,
we have learned that merchandize is not just a real product, but anything one may wish to buy....
majority of products today are non touchable things like informations and services....
industry has turned into a matter of convincing people to buy what they do not really need...
and very process of convincing is another new industry with lot of money...
but with steadily growing population it is matter of time where real products like food and water (and maybe even air one day?) will become scarce resources and their price will rise...so we will again work just to feed ourselves...

and population needs to keep steady increase as otherwise there will be not enough money for retired people....
in mean time, nature is turning in fast pace into one big garbage can where we dispose of all products that we do not really need...

to conclude, this can not last forever....
economist should think of better models of aranging resource usage of a society...

there is illusion being created about carrying for environment by talks of CO2... but CO2 is not a problem, it is merely a consequence....when temperature rises CO2 rises as well....real problem is destroyed ozone layer due to immature techologies we use - e.g. for our refrigerators... real problems are piles of garbage that we produce increasingly more....we are civilization that destroys itself...

taking that into account i am not sure I need to worry about retirment.... life as we know it may ceaze to exist before that time...
 
The pyramid of ages in Europe already started to inverse itself when I was a kid, we learned and studied that at school. The retirement scheme for public workers is not enough to assure the currently working population an income when they'll hit retirement age. By then, what those people paid all their life through taxes and contribution will barely be enough to cover their basic expenses, as some pensioners in Spain can confirm today. The whole current system should be scrapped, governments should encourage people to invest into private retirement schemes, but that would deprive these governments of a very big slice of cake. Keeping people in their job as long as possible has a double advantage. First, elderly active people contribute actively to the running of society and government expenses, and second, work keeps them away from hospitals and nursing homes. In the US, lots of people keep working beyond retirement in order to benefit from employer-financed healthcare cover. I think it would be a good option for Europe to implement that kind of healthcare cover, as universal healthcare is a major issue across the EU.
The bottom of the problem is to find a balance that would allow willing people to retire at their own chosen age without penalising the working population or keeping the youngsters away from much needed jobs... I am also in favour of a two to five years extra contribution to the workforce, to align the retirement age to the ever-expending life expectancy. Sadly, it means I will have to work until 70 to 72 years myself...
 
the new french predident announced today he will drop the retirement age in france from 62 to 60.
 
If I'm healthy I'll gladly work till I'm a 100. Find the job that you like or like the job that you have, and problem of retirement is solved. The retirement system should be substituted with "handicap compensation" only for people that can't work for health reason.
Find a job that you like, be creative, think positive, enjoy life (that includes your job), make smart choices (life is not a rocket science). Unless you're lazy, sick, hate your job and life in general, you shouldn't care for retirement age.

PS. This post is not directed at anyone of posters.
 
If I'm healthy I'll gladly work till I'm a 100. Find the job that you like or like the job that you have, and problem of retirement is solved. The retirement system should be substituted with "handicap compensation" only for people that can't work for health reason.
Find a job that you like, be creative, think positive, enjoy life (that includes your job), make smart choices (life is not a rocket science). Unless you're lazy, sick, hate your job and life in general, you shouldn't care for retirement age.

PS. This post is not directed at anyone of posters.


I agree with you to a point Le Brok. Most people think retiring will give them free time to do all the things they did`nt have the time to do
when working but the reality is often different. There are some who cannot mentally cope with so much available time on their hands and can become depressed. Many are still healthy and energetic but now with no real outlet for it.
Unless you have been able to sort out a good pension scheme you may also find you are not financially able to do the things you wanted to.
On another note however , if we did`nt get retired there would be even less work for the next generation and goodness knows even those armed with degrees are often having trouble finding work places to-day.
 
I agree with you to a point Le Brok. Most people think retiring will give them free time to do all the things they did`nt have the time to do
when working but the reality is often different. There are some who cannot mentally cope with so much available time on their hands and can become depressed. Many are still healthy and energetic but now with no real outlet for it.
I know what you mean hope. From my observations, most of folks don't have defined interests, hobbies, or passion for anything, or will to do anything; except watching tv, sleeping, eating, drinking, and generally roaming around the house or yard - just to fill the day. They also work, but work is wherever life had lead them to. The job for them is either indifferent or just hated. No wonder they are looking forward to retirement, so they don't need to go there, but not because they have extensive plans for retirement. Just one less dreadful think to do, or fewer things they don't need to do.
I'm sorry to say that, but most of ordinary citizens are like children. They'd rather not do anything unless they are pushed by circumstances. If they do something, it usually is about money, sometimes a spouse. Most of them feel dislike to new or ongoing education, self improvement, career change or anything new and unknown.
The more I understand the more normal citizen scares me, lol.


Unless you have been able to sort out a good pension scheme you may also find you are not financially able to do the things you wanted to.
This, and what I said above gives me a realization that we are never going to get away with retirement program.


On another note however , if we did`nt get retired there would be even less work for the next generation and goodness knows even those armed with degrees are often having trouble finding work places to-day.
This is because are economies are messed up at the moment.
Well, actually not mine (Alberta, Canada), we need 20,000 workers right now. The economists painting even bleaker picture, because baby boomers are retiring en mass. We need them to stay working as long as they can. Isn't it something?
The key, to solving many social problems, is good economy.
 

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