Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 74

Thread: Pharaoh Tutankhamun, Akhenaten and Amenhotep III were R1b

  1. #1
    Satyavrata Achievements:
    Three FriendsRecommendation First ClassVeteran50000 Experience PointsTagger First Class
    Maciamo's Avatar
    Join Date
    17-07-02
    Location
    Lothier
    Posts
    6,584
    Points
    342,370
    Level
    100
    Points: 342,370, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 86.0%


    Ethnic group
    Celto-germanic
    Country: Belgium - Brussels



    Arrow Pharaoh Tutankhamun, Akhenaten and Amenhotep III were R1b



    The Egyptians have tested autosomal and Y-DNA markers of three Pharaohs of the 18th dynasty : Amenhotep III, his son Akhenaten and grandson Tutankhamun. The aim was to determine the cause of death of Tutankhamun, who died at age 19. It appears to have been malaria.

    Although not yet published officially, the Y-DNA results were said to confirm the paternity between the Pharaohs. The video from Discovery Channel shows the Y-STR results*, which appear to be R1b and indeed the European R1b1b2 rather than the Levantine/Egyptian R1b1a. R1b1b2 is quite rare in modern Egypt (2% of the population) and was assumed to have come mostly through the Greek and Roman occupation. R1b1a makes up 4% of the Egyptian male lineages and dates from the Paleolithic.

    The 18th dynasty (starting in 1570 BCE) follows the period of Indo-European expansion to Europe (4300-2000 BCE), India, Persia and the Middle-East (1700-1500 BCE). The Hittites took over central Anatolia from 1750 BCE, and the Mitanni (of Indo-Iranian origin) ruled Syria from circa 1500 BCE.

    Egypt's 18th dynasty inaugurated the New Kingdom after the Second Intermediate Period, when the Hyksos ("foreign rulers") took over power between 1650 and 1570 BCE. It is very possible that the 18th Dynasty was of Hyksos origin, which could be Hittite or of other Indo-European origin. The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colors associated with the mercenary Mitanni. This strongly suggest an Indo-European origin indeed, as the steppe people were mounted archers, and the Mitanni are of proven IE origin.


    *Only three STR results have been officially published : DYS393=13, DYS458=16, GATA-H4=10

    N.B. : There is always the possibility that the video did not show the actual results of the Pharaohs, but those of someone of Western European descent from the US, thinking that nobody would look carefully. This would seriously damage the credibility of Discovery Channel though. I would be that they completed made up the video and the images bear no relation to the narrative.
    Last edited by Maciamo; 16-03-10 at 10:46.

  2. #2
    ^ lynx ^
    Guest


    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    N.B. : There is always the possibility that the video did not show the actual results of the Pharaohs, but those of someone of Western European descent from the US, thinking that nobody would look carefully. This would seriously damage the credibility of Discovery Channel though. I would be that they completed made up the video and the images bear no relation to the narrative.
    This wouldn't surprise me. IMO Discovery Channel is highly overrated.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Three Friends5000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Wilhelm's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-10-09
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    1,639
    Points
    9,830
    Level
    29
    Points: 9,830, Level: 29
    Level completed: 80%, Points required for next Level: 120
    Overall activity: 5.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b-S26
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1

    Ethnic group
    Celtiberians
    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    I believe some Pharaos were blonde or red-haired, it could certainly be of indo-european origin.

  4. #4
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    4,517
    Points
    29,233
    Level
    52
    Points: 29,233, Level: 52
    Level completed: 53%, Points required for next Level: 517
    Overall activity: 66.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    They had their chance to publish everything at same time. Why didn't they? Double checking or political correctness not to offend majority of Egyptians of other haplotypes?
    This playing down might mean that it was R1b. Time will tell.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    28-12-09
    Posts
    20

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b1b
    MtDNA haplogroup
    L2

    Ethnic group
    Portuguese
    Country: France



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    If the video shows the actual results of the Pharaohs and their haplogroup is R1b1b2, it is worth to mention that even if R1b1b2 is quite rare in modern Egypt (2% of the population), it is more frequent in NorthWest African where its frequencies are between 7-15% in some regions (Sfax, Tunis, Oran )....
    R1b1b2 is estimated to have arisen approximately 4,000 to 8,000 years ago in southwest Asia and to have spread into Europe and North Africa from there.

    By the way, the closest match I have found for Tut's haplotype is not with europeans from YHRD but in my haplotypes database with a Tunisian from Gabes. It is known also that some other pharaohs like Sheshonk were of northwest african origin...

  6. #6
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    rms2's Avatar
    Join Date
    30-05-09
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Posts
    304

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R-L21 (S145, M529)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U5a2

    Ethnic group
    British/Irish
    Country: United States



    Talking

    It looks like that apparent R1b1b2 haplotype is that of King Tut:

    http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.co...-02/1266545829

    This video is also quite informative.

  7. #7
    Regular Member Achievements:
    3 months registered
    Androcle's Avatar
    Join Date
    13-03-10
    Posts
    8

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    L2a

    Country: France



    This article is very interesting.
    Please correct Hyskos to Hyksos.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Achievements:
    3 months registered
    Androcle's Avatar
    Join Date
    13-03-10
    Posts
    8

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    L2a

    Country: France



    Thank you for the corrections.

  9. #9
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    23-02-10
    Location
    Palais de l'Elysée
    Posts
    231
    Points
    3,585
    Level
    17
    Points: 3,585, Level: 17
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 265
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
    Schwaben
    Country: France



    I think he could be R1a

  10. #10
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    Marianne's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-03-09
    Location
    Athens
    Posts
    260


    Country: Greece



    I didn't really do my homework on this, but from what I can remember from history class, some pharaoh lineages where Greek. I can't remember which ones and I can't check at the moment because I'm at work but could this be why their y-dna is different than the majority of Egyptians?

  11. #11
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    23-02-10
    Location
    Palais de l'Elysée
    Posts
    231
    Points
    3,585
    Level
    17
    Points: 3,585, Level: 17
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 265
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
    Schwaben
    Country: France



    The Ptolémées (R1a) and the last femal Kleopatra - Julius ( J2)

  12. #12
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience Points
    Marianne's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-03-09
    Location
    Athens
    Posts
    260


    Country: Greece



    Ptolemees were for sure a Greek dynasty. The name is also Greek. That I can remember.

    I can't remember which other dynasties were Greek though

  13. #13
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    rms2's Avatar
    Join Date
    30-05-09
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Posts
    304

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R-L21 (S145, M529)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U5a2

    Ethnic group
    British/Irish
    Country: United States



    Quote Originally Posted by willy View Post
    The Ptolémées (R1a) and the last femal Kleopatra - Julius ( J2)
    How did you come up with that?

  14. #14
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    rms2's Avatar
    Join Date
    30-05-09
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Posts
    304

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R-L21 (S145, M529)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U5a2

    Ethnic group
    British/Irish
    Country: United States


  15. #15
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three Friends1 year registeredTagger Second Class10000 Experience PointsOverdrive

    Join Date
    07-11-12
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    2,056
    Points
    15,771
    Level
    38
    Points: 15,771, Level: 38
    Level completed: 16%, Points required for next Level: 679
    Overall activity: 99.2%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a* (inferred)

    Country: Germany



    Question: has there been any verification/falsification of the story regarding Pharao Tutankhamum's Y-Haplogroup?

  16. #16
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    23-02-10
    Location
    Palais de l'Elysée
    Posts
    231
    Points
    3,585
    Level
    17
    Points: 3,585, Level: 17
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 265
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
    Schwaben
    Country: France



    NO simply rumors on the web

  17. #17
    Landlord Achievements:
    Veteran5000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    23-05-09
    Location
    Antony, France
    Posts
    55
    Points
    5,837
    Level
    22
    Points: 5,837, Level: 22
    Level completed: 58%, Points required for next Level: 213
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R-L21
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U6a7a1

    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by Taranis View Post
    Question: has there been any verification/falsification of the story regarding Pharao Tutankhamum's Y-Haplogroup?
    The source of Y-haplogroup of Tut is here: http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/king...rnal-line.html
    The question is: are the pherograms in the video those of Tut? If yes, Tut is R1b.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Achievements:
    3 months registered
    Aristander's Avatar
    Join Date
    15-07-10
    Posts
    194

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a1b*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1

    Ethnic group
    German
    Country: USA - Texas



    Quote Originally Posted by secherbernard View Post
    The source of Y-haplogroup of Tut is here: http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/king...rnal-line.html
    The question is: are the pherograms in the video those of Tut? If yes, Tut is R1b.
    It sure looked that way to me too. Looking at the labels on the screen during the plotting it looked like they were KV55. Also if I remember correctly there was a letter found from Tut's queen Ankhesenamun, to the King of the Hittites requesting that he send one of his sons to her as a husband since her husband had died. Perphaps this had happened in the past and Tut's actual male line was from an Hittite or Indo-European "Royal Family?"
    I also remember that the Hittite prince died along the way to Egypt and Ai or Horemheb became Pharoh.

  19. #19
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three Friends1 year registeredTagger Second Class10000 Experience PointsOverdrive

    Join Date
    07-11-12
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    2,056
    Points
    15,771
    Level
    38
    Points: 15,771, Level: 38
    Level completed: 16%, Points required for next Level: 679
    Overall activity: 99.2%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a* (inferred)

    Country: Germany



    Quote Originally Posted by Aristander View Post
    It sure looked that way to me too. Looking at the labels on the screen during the plotting it looked like they were KV55. Also if I remember correctly there was a letter found from Tut's queen Ankhesenamun, to the King of the Hittites requesting that he send one of his sons to her as a husband since her husband had died. Perphaps this had happened in the past and Tut's actual male line was from an Hittite or Indo-European "Royal Family?"
    I also remember that the Hittite prince died along the way to Egypt and Ai or Horemheb became Pharoh.
    Well, that story certainly looks plausible. So, with all likelihood, we may be really talking about Ankhenaten here? Wow.

    Also, there may be a reason why the detail about Tutankhamun's Y-Haplogroup wasn't published: the chair of the Egyptian Supreme Council of Antiquities, Dr. Zahi Hawass, was personally in charge of the whole DNA analysis, and made sure that only personally-picked Egyptians were chosen to immediately work on the mummies. The issue with Hawass is, he claims that he is so picky because he wants to treat the mummies with respect, in reality he is also somebody who's extremely conservative in his views regarding ancient Egypt and who doesn't like paradigm changes in regard for some things in ancient Egypt. The idea that the pharaos of the 18th dynasty may not have been of native Egyptian descend is something that doesn't quite fit in there. While this may sound a little like conspiracy (which I don't like), it may be a perfectly plausible explanation why nothing serious has been published there...

  20. #20
    Baron Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran
    willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    23-02-10
    Location
    Palais de l'Elysée
    Posts
    231
    Points
    3,585
    Level
    17
    Points: 3,585, Level: 17
    Level completed: 34%, Points required for next Level: 265
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
    Schwaben
    Country: France



    0 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    R1b is found in Egypt this is not a rare haplogroup on that area some central Africans are R1b at high % thats not extraordinary the Pharaohs were R1b as many other Egyptians . No need the Hittites Kings to explain R1b just a reverse back paleolithic migration to Africa long time before the first civilization

  21. #21
    Regular Member Achievements:
    3 months registered
    Aristander's Avatar
    Join Date
    15-07-10
    Posts
    194

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a1b*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1

    Ethnic group
    German
    Country: USA - Texas



    I doubt it was Ankhenaten, I would guess it probably happened to the lineage during the time of the Hyksos occupation or maybe around the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos. I think there is some doubt about who was the father of Sekenenre or maybe evenAhmose I, who was the founder of the 18th dynasty.

  22. #22
    Junior Member Achievements:
    3 months registered

    Join Date
    24-09-10
    Posts
    1


    Country: Greece



    Another thing to mention: Read Manetho's "Aegyptiaka", the most known egyptian historian. He has a Egypt's Kings listing there, starting from Greek Gods such as Zeus etc. not Egyptian Gods. Could that be a clue that the rulers of Egypt were originally Greeks (I am not talking about after Alexander's the Great dynasties such as Ptolemees and Kleopatra who were for sure Greeks).
    Most historian do not accept that and they thing that this was due to the antisemitic bias of Manetho, and of course that does not much with the accepted timings... but who knows... there are so many things we still don't know... even the Troyan war was considered to be mythology some decades ago...

  23. #23
    Marquis Achievements:
    Veteran5000 Experience Points
    Carlitos's Avatar
    Join Date
    01-09-10
    Location
    Occident.
    Posts
    863
    Points
    7,499
    Level
    25
    Points: 7,499, Level: 25
    Level completed: 90%, Points required for next Level: 51
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E1b1b1a3 V22+
    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c

    Ethnic group
    Ethnic group of those who are going to die.
    Country: Spain



    Should be of Iberian origin.

  24. #24
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class25000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    4,517
    Points
    29,233
    Level
    52
    Points: 29,233, Level: 52
    Level completed: 53%, Points required for next Level: 517
    Overall activity: 66.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    No, no, Canadian.

  25. #25
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Three Friends5000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Wilhelm's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-10-09
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    1,639
    Points
    9,830
    Level
    29
    Points: 9,830, Level: 29
    Level completed: 80%, Points required for next Level: 120
    Overall activity: 5.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b-S26
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1

    Ethnic group
    Celtiberians
    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    Quote Originally Posted by willy View Post
    R1b is found in Egypt this is not a rare haplogroup on that area some central Africans are R1b at high % thats not extraordinary the Pharaohs were R1b as many other Egyptians . No need the Hittites Kings to explain R1b just a reverse back paleolithic migration to Africa long time before the first civilization
    But the western european branch of R1b is very rare in Egypt, and is not found in Central Africa

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Pharaoh Tutankhamun OFFTOPIC about Tartessos and Hollywood
    By Carlitos in forum History & Civilisations
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 11-07-11, 20:09

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •