Genetic analysis of the presumptive blood from Louis XVI, king of France

The Adyghe language do not belong to the Turkish language and according to wikipedia :
Adyghe language Belong to the Northwest Caucasian languages, also called Abkhazo-Adyghean, or sometimes Pontic .

Damn, my mistake. Sorry, yeah. I must have mistaken the Adyghe for another ethnic group in the area. :ashamed2:
 
Damn, my mistake. Sorry, yeah. I must have mistaken the Adyghe for another ethnic group in the area. :ashamed2:

Bullshit men ! G2a3b1 came in Europe during the bronze age ( 4500 years old) and the Indo european expansion this haplogroup was surely an elite among what we call the " germanic" tribes let fall these tribes of caucasus ! G2a3b1 is found also in India in the Indo Aryans ... G2a3b1 is the only true Indo European haplogroup
 
Bullshit men ! G2a3b1 came in Europe during the bronze age ( 4500 years old) and the Indo european expansion this haplogroup was surely an elite among what we call the " germanic" tribes let fall these tribes of caucasus ! G2a3b1 is found also in India in the Indo Aryans ... G2a3b1 is the only true Indo European haplogroup

Err, I was talking exclusively about the classification of the Adyghe language. :startled:
 
OK sorry so the subject is well Genetic analysis of the presumptive blood from Louis XVI, king of France ? Adyghe language is not a Turkish language of course thats right ! excuse me ...
About the King Luis XVI he belongs to G2a3b1 (Germanic Indo European haplogroup)
 
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The G2a3b1 is not of indian origine .

According to wikipedia:

Haplogroup G2a3b1 (y-dna) in wikipedia :
"This haplogroup represents the majority of haplogroup G men in most areas of Europe west of Russia and the Black Sea. To the east, G2a3b1-except in the northwestern Caucasus Mountains area-is just a large or small minority among G persons in such locales as Turkey the Middle east, Iran the southern Caucasus area,China and India."

G2a3b1 in Wikipedia:

"Relation to High Mountain Areas?
Undocumented descriptions of the distribution of the more general G2a category in Europe (which actually would be dominated by G2a3b1) have spoken of unusual concentrations of G2a in mountainous area of Europe,"

G2a3b1 in wikipedia:

Haplogroup G2a3b1Possible time of originperhaps 5,000 years BP Possible place of origin perhaps Iran or Caucasus Mtns. or Middle eastAncestorHaplogroup G2a3b (L141)DescendantsG2a3b1, G2a3b1a, G2a3b1b, G2a3b1cDefining mutationsP303 or S135 (G2a3b1), L140 (G2a3b1a), U1 (G2a3b1a1), L13/S130 (G2a3b1a1a) L43/S147 (G2a3b1a2), L42/S146 (G2a3b1a2a), rs34136765=T+ (G2a3b1a2a1),L297 (G2a3b1a2a2), L139 (G2a3b1a3),rs2538860=A+ (G2a3b1a4)
 
G2a3b1a King Louis XVI

Hi to all,

My brother (I'm female) tested his y-dna and via our father and paternal line we are haplogroup G2a3b1a1. The extra 1 at the end indicates that my paternal line was "downstream" (next downward in sequence) from G2a3b1a. It has been estimated that we seperated from G2a3b1a approximately 2,500 years ago (by geneticists). There is much conflict as to the origins of haplogroup, but is has been presumed to be of Middle Eastern origin.

Thank you Willy Knight for you "keen" input. You may very well now see why I call myself Melusine (the name is attached to my paternal line).

I've done my genealogy and my paternal lines does go to the Capetians via female marriages. IF this y-dna test of the "bloody Hanky" proves to be correct, and that King Louis XVI was haplogroup G2a3b1a, then there is no doubt that paternally we also come from the paternal ancestors of Robert The Strong , a long time ago for sure. (not just via marriages with daughters.)

My ancestor was born in France many eons ago, but, I do have his pedigree until circa 1560. Our family were "nobles" who became Huguenots, and lost everything. I have good reason to "assume" that my ancestor was either of a "bastard line", or of a collateral paternal cousin line, however I have a "brickwall" here.

Melusine:heart:
 
Hi to all,

My brother (I'm female) tested his y-dna and via our father and paternal line we are haplogroup G2a3b1a1. The extra 1 at the end indicates that my paternal line was "downstream" (next downward in sequence) from G2a3b1a. It has been estimated that we seperated from G2a3b1a approximately 2,500 years ago (by geneticists). There is much conflict as to the origins of haplogroup, but is has been presumed to be of Middle Eastern origin.

Thank you Willy Knight for you "keen" input. You may very well now see why I call myself Melusine (the name is attached to my paternal line).

I've done my genealogy and my paternal lines does go to the Capetians via female marriages. IF this y-dna test of the "bloody Hanky" proves to be correct, and that King Louis XVI was haplogroup G2a3b1a, then there is no doubt that paternally we also come from the paternal ancestors of Robert The Strong , a long time ago for sure. (not just via marriages with daughters.)

My ancestor was born in France many eons ago, but, I do have his pedigree until circa 1560. Our family were "nobles" who became Huguenots, and lost everything. I have good reason to "assume" that my ancestor was either of a "bastard line", or of a collateral paternal cousin line, however I have a "brickwall" here.

Melusine:heart:

You are welcome Melusine,

Yes Melusine I think G2a3b1 could be viewed as a real aristocratic marker among the French people and in first among the FRANKS themselves not this degenerated aristocrats who come from the "Bourgeoisie" (the ones with high heels and make-up) a clear sign of degeneracy ;) According to Y-DNA testing, the majority of Frenchmen are R1b1b2 , which is also the group found predominantly in Ireland, Basque country, and Wales.This seems to suggest thatthe majority of Frenchmen are not descended from Franks (who would have a different Y-DNA marker), but from a pre-Celtic Stone Age people that is signified by R1b1b2 who is probably a neolithic or may be paleolithic haplogroup ...
 
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Some might be interested to hear this about G2a. About a year ago, I contacted Bryan Sykes regarding his references to 'pockets of old Wodans' [very old I haplogroup signatures] which he claims can be found in the 'Pictish' areas of Scotland and in parts of Wales in 'Blood of the Isles'. I wondered if these ancient I signals might possibly match any of Nordtvedt's clades such as I2a2b-Isles, I2a2a-Disles or I2b1a-English.

Sykes courteously replied, saying that he now thought the haplotypes were of the G2a type.

G2a is not really an interest of mine, but I wondered if some might find that information useful. If Sykes is correct [and he did not explain why he had changed his mind, and nor did he elaborate further] the age of these G2a signatures in Scotland and Wales must rule out any Germanic influence, at least in Britain. Neither of this British areas was subject to high levels of 'invader' genetic input.
 
Bullshit men ! G2a3b1 came in Europe during the bronze age ( 4500 years old) and the Indo european expansion this haplogroup was surely an elite among what we call the " germanic" tribes let fall these tribes of caucasus ! G2a3b1 is found also in India in the Indo Aryans ... G2a3b1 is the only true Indo European haplogroup

Willy, with respect, that is quite a claim! :shocked: What about R1a1? Many population geneticists of unassailable reputation regard R1a1 as a 'Kurgan marker'. It too is found among the Brahmin elite of India, and most likely was carried there by our Aryan friends...
 
Willy, with respect, that is quite a claim! :shocked: What about R1a1? Many population geneticists of unassailable reputation regard R1a1 as a 'Kurgan marker'. It too is found among the Brahmin elite of India, and most likely was carried there by our Aryan friends...

I'd like to second that. R1a1 is, with all likelihood the Y-Haplogroup associated with the Indo-Europeans. It's been founded in the graves of the Corded Ware culture, the Andronovo culture, the (Proto-Scythian?) Tagar culture as well as graves that presumably belong to the early Tocharians. I think the case for R1a1 being associated with the original Indo-Europeans is very strong.
 
Willy, with respect, that is quite a claim! :shocked: What about R1a1? Many population geneticists of unassailable reputation regard R1a1 as a 'Kurgan marker'. It too is found among the Brahmin elite of India, and most likely was carried there by our Aryan friends...

It depends some R1a have nothing to do with the Indo europeans the Slavic R1a is not the same than the Indian R1a the situation is the same for R1b1 : a large old paleolithic haplogroup on the Eurasiatic continent and also on Afica (R1b1) anyway : some subclades of R1a are surely associated to the Indo Aryans or first Indo Europeans In India R1a is found in the upper caste and in the lowers I am sorry but G2a3b1 is exclusively found in the upper caste. The situation is not easy to understand I know ...
 
It depends some R1a have nothing to do with the Indo europeans the Slavic R1a is not the same than the Indian R1a the situation is the same for R1b1 : a large old paleolithic haplogroup on the Eurasiatic continent and also on Afica (R1b1) anyway : some subclades of R1a are surely associated to the Indo Aryans or first Indo Europeans In India R1a is found in the upper caste and in the lowers I am sorry but G2a3b1 is exclusively found in the upper caste. The situation is not easy to understand I know ...

Willy,
Please could you supply a reference for this. I am very interested.
 
Bullshit men ! G2a3b1 came in Europe during the bronze age ( 4500 years old) and the Indo european expansion this haplogroup was surely an elite among what we call the " germanic" tribes let fall these tribes of caucasus ! G2a3b1 is found also in India in the Indo Aryans ... G2a3b1 is the only true Indo European haplogroup

I cannot say whether G2a3b1 is exclusively Indo-European or Neolithic. We need more ancient Y-DNA to determine that.

G2a3 in general has a distribution that could fit the southern European route of Neolithic diffusion (Anatolia => Greece => Italy => France => Iberia).

However STR markers seem to point at a more recent origin of G2a3b1, surely too recent to be of Neolithic origin, and more likely of Bronze Age origin. In that case it would have migrated along with R1b1b2a from the eastern Black Sea region to central and western Europe. The only problem with this theory is that G2a3b1 is quite rare in the Danube basin, contrarily to R1b1b2a. Perhaps it is because G2a3b1 were Caucasian metal workers who went directly to mountainous regions like the Alps, the Apennines and northern Spain in search of gold, copper and tin.

If that is so, we still cannot know if G2a3b1 people belonged to the elite or the working class (or slave class ?) of the Indo-Europeans. The high density of G2a3 in mountainous areas rather suggest that they were mine workers and metallurgists, so not the elite. The tremendous demographic explosion of R1b1b2a from the Bronze Age onwards is more consistent with a polygamist society dominated by R1b1b2a men.
 
It depends some R1a have nothing to do with the Indo europeans the Slavic R1a is not the same than the Indian R1a the situation is the same for R1b1 : a large old paleolithic haplogroup on the Eurasiatic continent and also on Afica (R1b1) anyway : some subclades of R1a are surely associated to the Indo Aryans or first Indo Europeans In India R1a is found in the upper caste and in the lowers I am sorry but G2a3b1 is exclusively found in the upper caste. The situation is not easy to understand I know ...

G2a3b1 may be found in the Hindu upper castes, but it is a very rare haplogroup (under 1% of the Brahmins). R1a1 is clearly the dominant Brahmin haplogroup, followed by R2, J2 and R1b1b2.

I am only aware of one study that found 11.9% of G2a among the Dravidian upper caste. But that was a tiny sample size (n=59) and so was not representative at all.
 
The use of the word indo ? is not accurate .

Why is that? 'Indo' here refers to the 'Indo-European' [otherwise known as 'Kurgan' or 'Aryan'] peoples and languages.
 
The high density of G2a3 in mountainous areas rather suggest that they were mine workers and metallurgists, so not the elite..


The haplogroup G were quite likely the original inhabitants of Europe. As Indoeuropean tribes started migrating to Europe the original inhabitants lost their territories to escape to inaccessible high altitude terrain for safety. It was very common that people living in mountain areas were isolated and more protected from outside invaders. ususally people living in mountain areas also preserve their heritage more effectively than those living in lowland areas.

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the Origin of Y-dna haplogroup G in Wapedia:
Haplogroup G (Y-DNA)

Origins

Various estimated dates and locations have been proposed for the origin of Haplogroup G. The National Geographic Society places haplogroup G origins in the Middle East 10-20,000 years ago and presumes that people carrying the haplogroup took part in the spread of the Neolithic Two scholarly papers have also suggested an origin in the Middle East, while differing on the date. Semino et al. suggested 17,000 years ago. Cinnioglu et al. suggested the mutation took place 9,500 years ago. [The oldest skeletons confirmed by ancient DNA testing as carrying haplogroup G date only from the 7th century C.E. and were found in present-day Bavaria, Germany.
 
Why is that? 'Indo' here refers to the 'Indo-European' [otherwise known as 'Kurgan' or 'Aryan'] peoples and languages.

There is no evidence that y-dna Haplogroup G in europe originated in india to call it an indo european.
 

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