Macedonians

An interesting article about descendants of ancient Macedonians in Pakistan

New Indo-European Language Discovered

A linguistics researcher at the Macquarie University in Australia has discovered that the language, known as Burushaski, which is spoken by about 90,000 people who reside in a remote area of Pakistan, is Indo-European in origin.

Prof Ilija Casule’s discovery, which has now been verified by a number of the world’s top linguists, has excited linguistics experts around the world.
An entire issue of the eminent international linguistics journal the Journal of Indo-European Studies is devoted to a discussion of his findings later this month.
More than fifty eminent linguists have tried over many years to determine the genetic relationship of Burushaski. But it was Prof Casule’s painstaking research, based on a comprehensive grammatical, phonological, lexical and semantic analysis, which established that the Burushaski language is in fact an Indo-European language most likely descended from one of the ancient Balkan languages.
Prof Casule said that the language is most probably ancient Phrygian.
The Phrygians migrated from Macedonia to Anatolia (today part of Turkey) and were famous for their legendary kings who figure prominently in Greek mythology such as King Midas who turned whatever he touched into gold. They later migrated further east, reaching India. Indeed, according to ancient legends of the Burushaski (or Burusho) people, they are descendants of Alexander the Great.


Tracing the historical path of a language is no easy task. Prof Casule said he became interested in the origins of Burushaski more than 20 years ago.
“People knew of its existence but its Indo-European affiliation was overlooked and it was not analyzed correctly. It is considered a language isolate – not related to any other language in the world in much the same way that the Basque language is classified as a language isolate,” he added.
The remoteness of the area that was independent until the early 1970s when it became part of Pakistan, ensured Burushaski retained certain grammatical and lexical features that led Prof Casule to conclude it is a North-Western Indo-European language, specifically of the Paleobalkanic language group and that it corresponds most closely with Phrygian.
Prof Casule’s work is groundbreaking, not only because it has implications for all the Indo-European language groups, but also provides a new model for figuring out the origins of isolate languages – where they reside in the linguistic family tree and how they developed and blended with other languages to form a new language.
http://www.sci-news.com/othersciences/linguistics/article00403.html
I remember this from a while back, and I thought group in question was the Kalash. They also aren't at all Macedonian, and this seems like a load of pseudo-science. Even if thethere are similarities, this doesn't make them by any means Macedonian.
 
leaving in An area named Delaware by Usaers , does not make you a delaware, when delaware nation exist,

all the rest is imperialistic propaganda of gun industry, and politicians wgho gain by war,

I still dont understanded what the fyromians will earn by that?

only hate and wars

BESIDES EVERY BODY KNOWS THAT THEY ARE FAKE MAKEDONIANS.

AND CLAIMING AS BEFORE THAT MODERN MAKEDONIANS ARE SLAVS YOU JUST MAKE ME A SLAV,

CAUSE I M A MODERN MAKEDONIAN

the makedonia that catherin2 was dreamingas also some others bulgarians after 1876,
and today some politicks, will never be exist,
only by force,
we shall not admit to a state of 3 nations, cause that was roman then british, Russian and today USA politic,
to create states that are not 1 nation but many,
we have our problems, we don't want inserted ones by others who want to divine and conquer

and what language will have the state that fyromians claim?
bulgarian? Greek? cause there is no Makedonian language,
only an ancient Greek dialect
and only a today mixed bulgarian dialect?
so create problem with lingua
which will be the prime minister?
a Fyrom or a Greek?
which will the national anthem?
the greek makedonian or the fyrom one?

you see we dont need to enter that bullshit,
simply find a name for them, without stealing my name
and co-existance

what are you trying to do people, a new 2 lingua switzerland in balkans?
or a state like belgium?

since as you say they are slavs let them name their country as yugo-slavia
or zapad-bulgaria or VestBulgaria, Paeonia, Bardaska, albano-slavia, J B TITOnia. Sandaskya
Nova-slavia, Central-Balkania, etc
the name i accept with mak in it
is PSEUDO-MAKEDONIA

AND I M NOT A SLAV
CAUSE I AM MAKEDONIAN



Macedonians are a mixture of ancient population and Slavs. Slavic element and the ancient one is at 50/50 ratio as we have seen on their y DNA studies. Before Slavs came Macedonians were assimilated to Greek culture. The kept their ethnicity until 4 century ad when the assimilation was complete. Greek writers have documented this event and the world knows. So Slav Macedonians have the wright to claim Macedonian heritage since they have Macedonian blood in their veins.
 
Macedonians are a mixture of ancient population and Slavs. Slavic element and the ancient one is at 50/50 ratio as we have seen on their y DNA studies. Before Slavs came Macedonians were assimilated to Greek culture. The kept their ethnicity until 4 century ad when the assimilation was complete. Greek writers have documented this event and the world knows. So Slav Macedonians have the wright to claim Macedonian heritage since they have Macedonian blood in their veins.
And which ydna is the Slavic one according to u? I2a-Din? R1a I accept for obvious reasons, although not all of it could be "Slavic".

And no, they don't have Macedonian blood in their veins, but rather Paeonian, Dardanian, and Thracian.
 
And which ydna is the Slavic one according to u? I2a-Din? R1a I accept for obvious reasons, although not all of it could be "Slavic".

And no, they don't have Macedonian blood in their veins, but rather Paeonian, Dardanian, and Thracian.

And what about the Macedonians from Pelagonia, Gevgelia and further south from today's Greek Macedonia?

Map of ethnic Macedonian territory from Eurominority;

images
 
And what about the Macedonians from Pelagonia, Gevgelia and further south from today's Greek Macedonia?

Map of ethnic Macedonian territory from Eurominority;

images
First of all, does not exist an macedonian ethnicity.
Second, i don't know who produce this kind of maps. Is this one the "scientific" works of your famous firomski academy?
 
Macedonians are a mixture of ancient population and Slavs. Slavic element and the ancient one is at 50/50 ratio as we have seen on their y DNA studies. Before Slavs came Macedonians were assimilated to Greek culture. The kept their ethnicity until 4 century ad when the assimilation was complete. Greek writers have documented this event and the world knows. So Slav Macedonians have the wright to claim Macedonian heritage since they have Macedonian blood in their veins.
We know few things about ancient Macedonians. If you read for example the page of Wikipedia about the language of ancient Macedonians, you can see that scholars have different opinions about their ethnicity.
If the today inhabitants of FYROM have in their veins blood from ancient populations of Balcan, this don't give the right to call themselves descendant of ancient Macedonians. They have the right to have their country and even to name it Macedonia, but they are slavs and they have nothing to do with Alexander The Great and stories like this.
 
We know few things about ancient Macedonians. If you read for example the page of Wikipedia about the language of ancient Macedonians, you can see that scholars have different opinions about their ethnicity.
If the today inhabitants of FYROM have in their veins blood from ancient populations of Balcan, this don't give the right to call themselves descendant of ancient Macedonians. They have the right to have their country and even to name it Macedonia, but they are slavs and they have nothing to do with Alexander The Great and stories like this.
On same basis Greeks shouldn't call themselves Greeks/Hellenes or English call themselves English. All similarities they have with ancient Greeks and Angles is location and similar language.
Perhaps we should let people to call themselves what they want? I don't mind calling Burma Myanmar, or Albania Shqiptar.
 
On same basis Greeks shouldn't call themselves Greeks/Hellenes or English call themselves English. All similarities they have with ancient Greeks and Angles is location and similar language.
Perhaps we should let people to call themselves what they want? I don't mind calling Burma Myanmar, or Albania Shqiptar.
First, let's not mix greeks in this story.
Second, i explained my opinion about the issue of the name.
And third, let's not mix politics with history, two different things. What the Great Powers decide for their interests is one thing and history is another.
 
Surely, there must be some ancient Macedonian blood in the current Macedonia, I don't think it would disappear but in terms of how much slav and how much ancient balkans are in the modern Macedonia, who knows? Only dna (au,Y and mt) can solve this.
 
Surely, there must be some ancient Macedonian blood in the current Macedonia, I don't think it would disappear but in terms of how much slav and how much ancient balkans are in the modern Macedonia, who knows? Only dna (au,Y and mt) can solve this.
Of course there is ancient Macedonian among the inhabitants of FYROM. I am sure that we can find this blood even in Japan, China, Australia, USA, or Brasile. But a nation is not (au,Y and mt).
 
Makes me wonder why we re-open that thread.
 
First of all the Ancient Macedonians lived far south of even what would be later known as Makedonia. They absorbed many Epirotes, Illyrians and Thracians and even resettled them in their cities which in turn increased their military power. They made up a large bulk of their famous phalangitai.

Even their royal family and many of the highest generals were actually Epirotes, which really makes Macedonians a newly formed or "expanded" ethnic group and that's when the problem of their language appears. We know for a fact that only the lowlands from the South spoke a language similar (or whatever) to Doric while the highlands and most of what became known as Makedonia were originally Illyrian and Thracian speakers.

Now going further north to Paeonia (modern FYROM), they're the last to be absorbed into their kingdom and it was actually the Roman/Byzantine Empire to finaly assimilate them into Greek speakers.

So in short, FYROMians have almost no Ancient Macedonian blood in their veins, but rather a Paeonian, Dardanian, Illyrian, Thracian, Slavic, etc mix.
 
What "blood" is in whom :LOL:
Republic of Macedonia is reality the sooner their neighbors accept that the better,or they might want dimwitted (sorry) "ancient" Balkan man another Balkan war on the "Macedonian" issue,which in first place they made a issue out of it.
However this Republic came into being is totally irrelevant one should read more.
I am from Republic of Macedonia.To me personally name such is Macedonia,Bulgaria,Serbia,Greece are totally irrelevant,i am citizen of that country,not by my own choice i was born there,however i will identify is only my own option.That is my opinion and i couldn't care less what others think.

Then ancient Macedonia is totally different issue and that is history on which i support neither side,i admire their history whatever they have been,but this history arose in "nationalization" instead.
 
Then i see many comments from Albanians,the amusing issue should be addressed,they call themselves Shqiptar and their country Shqiperia,that's how they were called by most of their neighbors.
Ever since creation of Republic of Albania they demand from their neighbors to be called Albanians instead Shqiptars,we respect that and call them as such,after all we all choose our names,they are called as such in R.Macedonia where they form large minority,but they very much have objection what other people call themselves as i see people from Albania.They even find derogatory their own name they use for themselves,but telling others how to call themselves,sorry that's bias and nationalism in typical Balkan style.
So Albanians come down a bit with that,i personally know many Albanians and had friends,not all think that way.
 
We know few things about ancient Macedonians. If you read for example the page of Wikipedia about the language of ancient Macedonians, you can see that scholars have different opinions about their ethnicity.
If the today inhabitants of FYROM have in their veins blood from ancient populations of Balcan, this don't give the right to call themselves descendant of ancient Macedonians. They have the right to have their country and even to name it Macedonia, but they are slavs and they have nothing to do with Alexander The Great and stories like this.

A Greek origin Columbia University history professor says that the language of ancient Macedonians was Thraco-Illyrian. Thracians or Illyrians had the ability to conduct a conversation with ancient Macedonians without the need of a translator. This explains the event that Illyrians or Thracians often intermarried with Macedonians. But Ethnically today's Macedonians have the same amount of ancient blood in their vans as Macedonians from Greece have.
 
What "blood" is in whom :LOL:
Republic of Macedonia is reality the sooner their neighbors accept that the better,or they might want dimwitted (sorry) "ancient" Balkan man another Balkan war on the "Macedonian" issue,which in first place they made a issue out of it.
Let me remeber you that at the beggining of 90s your country was totally isolated. The only country who opened the doors to your country was exactly Albania. Port of Durres was the only contact that you had with the world.
However this Republic came into being is totally irrelevant one should read more.
I am from Republic of Macedonia.To me personally name such is Macedonia,Bulgaria,Serbia,Greece are totally irrelevant,i am citizen of that country,not by my own choice i was born there,however i will identify is only my own option.That is my opinion and i couldn't care less what others think.
To you maybe it`s irrelevant but not for your compatriots, i mean here in this forum. Among other things, they like to play even with maps
Then ancient Macedonia is totally different issue and that is history on which i support neither side,i admire their history whatever they have been,but this history arose in "nationalization" instead.
Your government has another opinion.
 
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Of course there is ancient Macedonian among the inhabitants of FYROM. I am sure that we can find this blood even in Japan, China, Australia, USA, or Brasile. But a nation is not (au,Y and mt).

Yes exactly, I understand what your meaning is culture, identity, language defines an ethnic group to me this is more important than genetics as well, what I was trying to say is that the Macedonians today must have some Y, Mt and autosomal dna from the ancient Macedonians, so its partly in their blood.
 
I remember that i had an bad experience time ago discussing with you. I asked ten times about the Sun and you answered ten times about the Moon. My intention is not offending you, but when i read this your post, the first question that comes to my mind is, are you under the efects of the drugs?
Then i see many comments from Albanians,the amusing issue should be addressed,they call themselves Shqiptar and their country Shqiperia,that's how they were called by most of their neighbors.
We call ourselves Shqiptar and our country Shqiperi.
In English: Albanian and Albania.
In Italian: Albanese. Country:Albania
In Greek: Αλβανός, Alvanós. Country: Αλβανία, Alvanía
In serb language: албански, albanski. Country: Албанија, Albanija.
In the language of FYROM: Албански, Albanski. Country:Албанија, Albanija.
Ever since creation of Republic of Albania they demand from their neighbors to be called Albanians instead Shqiptars,we respect that and call them as such,after all we all choose our names,they are called as such in R.Macedonia where they form large minority,
This is something new for me and all Albanians. When you will be more lucid, maybe you will explain better this strange theory.
but they very much have objection what other people call themselves as i see people from Albania.
Problems with reading bro?
They have the right to have their country and even to name it Macedonia
They even find derogatory their own name they use for themselves,
No, we find derogatory this kind of posts. It`s a shame that you post things like this.
but telling others how to call themselves,sorry that's bias and nationalism in typical Balkan style.
No, we are not telling how you will call yourselves. But in Balcan there are other nationalities and we intend to respect all the Balcan people. You have an issue with your name and you have to resolve it with other people, not with us.So, until then, we will call your country FYROM and the inhabitants fyromski or firomski, it`s the same.
So Albanians come down a bit with that,i personally know many Albanians and had friends,not all think that way.
After reading your posts, i doubt that you have ever meet an Albanian in your life. I doubt if you are abble to find in the map Albania.
 
A Greek origin Columbia University history professor says that the language of ancient Macedonians was Thraco-Illyrian. Thracians or Illyrians had the ability to conduct a conversation with ancient Macedonians without the need of a translator. This explains the event that Illyrians or Thracians often intermarried with Macedonians. But Ethnically today's Macedonians have the same amount of ancient blood in their vans as Macedonians from Greece have.
There are many theories about the ethnicity of ancient Macedonians. There are different theories about their language:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Macedonian_language
For example, an important linguist, Giuliano Bonfante considered macedonians as Illyrians, but he didn`t considered Albanians as descendant of Illyrians.
Strabo for example tell us(i am using my words, it`s not a quote direct from the source) that ancient Macedonians and Epirotes, dress in similar way and cut their hairs almost in the same way, but they speak different languages.
These to explain to you that there are many theories and this things are complicated.
 
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Yes exactly, I understand what your meaning is culture, identity, language defines an ethnic group to me this is more important than genetics as well, what I was trying to say is that the Macedonians today must have some Y, Mt and autosomal dna from the ancient Macedonians, so its partly in their blood.

You know what? After 50 years for example E-V13 maybe will be the dominant haplogroup in FYROM.
 

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