Celtic - Serbian parallels

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So by what I understand How yes No you are supporting the Idea that Bryges were Celts the Briganti tribe or relative to them, that means you exclude the Burgundi theory for Bryges, and you Bring South Thracian more close to Celtic than Germanic and Slavic. is that that point and conclusion?

well, I do not know.... languages and cultures of compact ethnic group carriers of certain gene mix can change through history...Bryges might or might not not have been Celtic, but a part of them that perhaps traveled from Balkan to UK might have been celticized during the voyage...

however, I do think that most of I2a2 was at some time in their history associated with Celts... that link keeps reoccurring...but I find it hard to explain language shift in I2a-din speakers...they must have been living deep in Slavic surrounding for long time... perhaps language shift happened in Galicia in Ukraine....which is hotspot of I2a-Din and has name that is easily mark of Celtic settlement....

800px-Ukraine-Halychyna.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galicia_(Eastern_Europe)

Haplogroup_I2a.gif



so what could have happened in that Scordisci and other Celtic tribes from Balkan go north upon Roman invasion and settled areas such as west Ukraine and south Poland where they accept Slavic language and from there later spread first to Bohemia and east Germany and than to Balkan.....
 
Following the logic of the user "how yes no", I took the liberty to weave some similarities between Gaelic words and modern day Albanian language. I'm sure you will be perplexed by this uproarious discovery that should by no means go unnoticed!

Lo' and behold fellow Eupedians:

ambassador: Gaelic *ambacto - Albanian "a ma ba k'to" (trans.: can you do this for me? as when an ambassador goes on and about asking favours from governments)

sugar: Gaelic *siúcra - Albanian "shiqer" (as when a person from Llap visits their neighbours only to ask for a handful of sugar)

Love: Gaelic *Gra - Albanian gra means women (as in the subjects to whom one makes love)

Fellowship: Gaelic *Páirt - Albanian " parí " (as in when you make a fellowship of men to ask for a bride)

This is a major opus, therefore excuse this limited thesaurus I've provided due to short notice. I shall keep you up-to-date with novelties on this discovery.
 
Following the logic of the user "how yes no", I took the liberty to weave some similarities between Gaelic words and modern day Albanian language. I'm sure you will be perplexed by this uproarious discovery that should by no means go unnoticed!

I think that Illyrian language was kind of Celtic or very related to Celtic, so Albanian language as probably somewhat related to Illyrian, should have indeed lot of words shared with Celtic people.

reason to think there is large similarity between illyrian and Celtic languages is that in mythology Illyrus is brother of Celtus and Galas and son of Galatea (which may stand for Galatia area in Anatolia)

However, be aware that there are also theories that argue that Celtic was about culture not about single language...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyria

I suggest you to check out dictionary of proto-Celtic words

http://www.utoronto.ca/elul/English/218/PVL-selections.pdf

but please do it in separate thread, as you will likely have lot of materials that do not fit in this thread....

as for the words above first two are shared by most or all european languages... and so is the one for fellowship ('pair' in english)... so be aware to look for words that do not exist in PIE and are not shared in all or most of european languages...

taking out those words from your examples, reduces your list to single word:
Love: Gaelic *Gra - Albanian gra means women (as in the subjects to whom one makes love)

"gra" reminds me on verb "grejati" - to make warm in serbian
and noun "igra" = game, playing

 
Following the logic of the user "how yes no", I took the liberty to weave some similarities between Gaelic words and modern day Albanian language. I'm sure you will be perplexed by this uproarious discovery that should by no means go unnoticed!

Lo' and behold fellow Eupedians:

ambassador: Gaelic *ambacto - Albanian "a ma ba k'to" (trans.: can you do this for me? as when an ambassador goes on and about asking favours from governments)

sugar: Gaelic *siúcra - Albanian "shiqer" (as when a person from Llap visits their neighbours only to ask for a handful of sugar)

Love: Gaelic *Gra - Albanian gra means women (as in the subjects to whom one makes love)

Fellowship: Gaelic *Páirt - Albanian " parí " (as in when you make a fellowship of men to ask for a bride)

This is a major opus, therefore excuse this limited thesaurus I've provided due to short notice. I shall keep you up-to-date with novelties on this discovery.

Are you trying to do this to make a point here, because it does not make the slightest sense. :LOL:

Regarding how-yes-no, I have nothing to say because you didn't listen in the past. You have absolutely no understanding of linguistic methodology, and have absolutely willingness either to understand it (I also remember your adament opposition to the very idea that Proto-Slavic adopted a lot of loanwords from Germanic and began to only fragment in the wake of the Migration Period, something which is generally accepted), and I think is pointless to continue arguing with you there.
 
Indeed I am respected Taranis. Unfortunately, my tone of humor, to put it lightly, went unnoticed by some.
In my opinion the respected how yes no has been exposed to some Serbian and now his subconscious is playing tricks on him by making everything around him sound like Serbian, which does not make up for his lack of 101 Linguistics.
 
well lets stop provoke each other.


How Yes no,

yes I2a Din might or indeed has connection.

the other choice is local native Balcan,

many times I support the Idea that Thracians were I2,

for me it seems like I2a (Balcanic suclades) are connected both with Balkans and Ucraine,

on the other hand making Celts I2a? hmmm
although I do not Deny, it is little difficult,
interesting case the I2a British Isles,
from Balkans to Britain? or tottaly different?
 
Regarding how-yes-no, I have nothing to say because you didn't listen in the past. You have absolutely no understanding of linguistic methodology, and have absolutely willingness either to understand it (I also remember your adament opposition to the very idea that Proto-Slavic adopted a lot of loanwords from Germanic and began to only fragment in the wake of the Migration Period, something which is generally accepted), and I think is pointless to continue arguing with you there.

you have nothing to say because all your arguments in previous post, regarding links in mythologies, turned out to be just your ego based belief without any support....
so you simply want to exit discussion in a way that makes you look above it.....
but I am not here to prove my worth or to lower your worth (you do that yourself) I was explaining alternative view on voyage of I2a-Din... idea that part of its history was as Celto-Germanic people is definitively an option... regardless of your linguistic arguments...

considering my objection to Germanic loanwords in slavic languages, I was not objecting existence and widespread of those, I was objecting those of your explanations that were biased and irational, divorced from logic....loanwords in slavic languages are easily explainable with assimilation of some Germanic speaking tribes...not by cultural and every kind of supremacy of Goths as you in your racist mindset have tried to put it...

well lets stop provoke each other.
How Yes no,

yes I2a Din might or indeed has connection.

the other choice is local native Balcan,

many times I support the Idea that Thracians were I2,
i think diversity of I2 would be higher there if that was the case....
Thracians were maybe R1a people... same as Russians...

I2a is complex... I think it was wide spread in area and was participating in genesis of ancient Greeks as well ...


for me it seems like I2a (Balcanic suclades) are connected both with Balkans and Ucraine,
those are frequencies... source of the clade (first man with mutation) is proposed to be somewhere in north Germany...

on the other hand making Celts I2a? hmmm
although I do not Deny, it is little difficult,
I do not say Celts were I2a
I say most of I2a2-Din people was at some point in history (around 1AD) considered Celtic or even Germanic people....

interesting case the I2a British Isles,
from Balkans to Britain? or tottaly different?
current hypothesys of Ken Nordvedth is from Germany to both...

but I was thinking it may have been from Balkan to UK e.g. by ships to Iberia and than by ships to UK... like Balkan Chelidoni became Kaladuni in Iberia and Caledonii in UK...
which can be traced back knowing about legend of origin of Scotish people
http://www.geo.ed.ac.uk/home/scotland/arbroath_english.html
interestingly, they have considered themselves as Scythians...



Most Holy Father and Lord, we know and from the chronicles and books of the ancients we find that among other famous nations our own, the Scots, has been graced with widespread renown. They journeyed from Greater Scythia by way of the Tyrrhenian Sea and the Pillars of Hercules, and dwelt for a long course of time in Spain among the most savage tribes, but nowhere could they be subdued by any race, however barbarous. Thence they came, twelve hundred years after the people of Israel crossed the Red Sea, to their home in the west where they still live today. The Britons they first drove out, the Picts they utterly destroyed, and, even though very often assailed by the Norwegians, the Danes and the English, they took possession of that home with many victories and untold efforts; and, as the historians of old time bear witness, they have held it free of all bondage ever since. In their kingdom there have reigned one hundred and thirteen kings of their own royal stock, the line unbroken a single foreigner.
http://www.geo.ed.ac.uk/home/scotland/arbroath_english.html


pay attention to timing 1200 years after people of Israel crossed Red sea to west escaping their slavery in Egypt... as this happened 1400BC, it means that Caladunii sailed from Iberia to UK only at 200 BC, but they stayed before that for very long time in Iberia...

in Iberia in Celtic area of Gallaecia next to the Caladuni you also find Celtic Seurbi and Helleni who were all probably part of same wave of colonization as Chelidoni...
it is comparable to collonization of Americas and Australia much later....


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Iberia_300BC.svg


movement of people from Balkan to UK would account for similarities in myths, and would left genetic imprint...
e.g. that is much more likely source for unexpectedly increased E-V13 in UK and Portugal than settlement of Roman soldiers as S.Byrd proposed...
but could have also been the way in which I2a clades arrived to uk

what I proposed is same origin in some ancient history of Balkan Bryges and UK Brigantes... I suspected Bryges/Brigantes as in england (not in ireland) their position seems to match somewhat I2a2-isles spread on map of sparkey....it is known that Bryges did give Phrygians... Maciamo's map places hotspot of I2a in Phrygia& Galatia and also in area of Albania where we find Bryges...
but

if they carried I2a2 that became I2a2-Isles, their movement would have been much before historic times, before I2a2 differentiated into Isles branch...in fact, Bryges came to Balkan from Lusatia which is in Germany during late bronze age... hence Bryges could have been carriers of I2a2 to both UK and Balkan...
this means that myths and similarities I mention have came to existence before their migration to Balkan...

but myths are related to tuath de Daanan...
tribe of Dan...Tuatha de Danann myths seems to be very PIE and most similar to Celtic myths..

in fact Danann suggest link to ancient Greek tribe known as Danaans....
what I argued is the link between tribal names Brigantes/Bryges/Phrygians and Zoryani/Zeruiani/Serians and Danaans / Acheans... note that this is long time back in history.... tribal name can be cultural or religious issue, not necessarily same genetics, but in most cases there is also partly shared genetics...

curiously, Tuatha de Danann also relate their origin to Scythia as their first king is Agnoman of Scythia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuatha_Dé_Danann


well, it is all just an idea... not well formed theory...
and I do not really have much time or interest to work it out...
but it would be nice if someone who knows more think of it...
 
Following the logic of the user "how yes no", I took the liberty to weave some similarities between Gaelic words and modern day Albanian language. I'm sure you will be perplexed by this uproarious discovery that should by no means go unnoticed!

Lo' and behold fellow Eupedians:

ambassador: Gaelic *ambacto - Albanian "a ma ba k'to" (trans.: can you do this for me? as when an ambassador goes on and about asking favours from governments)

sugar: Gaelic *siúcra - Albanian "shiqer" (as when a person from Llap visits their neighbours only to ask for a handful of sugar)

Love: Gaelic *Gra - Albanian gra means women (as in the subjects to whom one makes love)

Fellowship: Gaelic *Páirt - Albanian " parí " (as in when you make a fellowship of men to ask for a bride)

This is a major opus, therefore excuse this limited thesaurus I've provided due to short notice. I shall keep you up-to-date with novelties on this discovery.

even if I don't agree all the time with him (but almost, because I can guess on his answers that he has a very important knowledge (and logic) about linguistic, a knowledge I should be very glad to share with him) I begin to understand why Taranis is sad sometimes, reading some elucubrations plays - there are laws in linguistic and etymology, don't forget it - and nevertheless i'm not at all a defender of the officiality in science
'ambacto' : try to show a community of origin by comparing a compact ancient word in a language with a modern complete predicat (sentance) in a modern language is a child's play
'siucra' is a loan world from an old I-E origin (sanskrit 'çarkarâ') BUT PASSED THROUGH ARABIC ('sukkar') and it got to be common in almost every modern language of Europe and don't prove any special community shared exclusively by Celts and others peoples -
'gra' was 'gradh' << 'grad' and come for I know from latin or a ?*-celto-italic (latin 'grâtus' : "pleasant", "nice", "agreable")
for 'pairt' I don't know but I should guess a common origin with latin or more generally italic or *celto-italic

it's interesting to do guesses but we have to be carefull when doing it and to gather more than a handful of possibly cognate words before affirm a link between two or more now distant cultures
happy and studius new year for all of us
 
Following the logic of the user "how yes no", I took the liberty to weave some similarities between Gaelic words and modern day Albanian language. I'm sure you will be perplexed by this uproarious discovery that should by no means go unnoticed!

Lo' and behold fellow Eupedians:

ambassador: Gaelic *ambacto - Albanian "a ma ba k'to" (trans.: can you do this for me? as when an ambassador goes on and about asking favours from governments)

sugar: Gaelic *siúcra - Albanian "shiqer" (as when a person from Llap visits their neighbours only to ask for a handful of sugar)

Love: Gaelic *Gra - Albanian gra means women (as in the subjects to whom one makes love)

Fellowship: Gaelic *Páirt - Albanian " parí " (as in when you make a fellowship of men to ask for a bride)

This is a major opus, therefore excuse this limited thesaurus I've provided due to short notice. I shall keep you up-to-date with novelties on this discovery.

even if I don't agree all the time with him (but almost, because I can guess on his answers that he has a very important knowledge (and logic) about linguistic, a knowledge I should be very glad to share with him) I begin to understand why Taranis is sad sometimes, reading some elucubrations plays - there are laws in linguistic and etymology, don't forget it - and nevertheless i'm not at all a defender of the officiality in science
'ambacto' : try to show a community of origin by comparing a compact ancient word in a language with a modern complete predicat (sentance) in a modern language is a child's play
'siucra' is a loan world from an old I-E origin (sanskrit 'çarkarâ') BUT PASSED THROUGH ARABIC ('sukkar') and it got to be common in almost every modern language of Europe and don't prove any special community shared exclusively by Celts and others peoples -
'gra' was 'gradh' << 'grad' and come for I know from latin or a ?*-celto-italic (latin 'grâtus' : "pleasant", "nice", "agreable")
for 'pairt' I don't know but I should guess a common origin with latin or more generally italic or *celto-italic

it's interesting to do guesses but we have to be carefull when doing it and to gather more than a handful of possibly cognate words before affirm a link between two or more now distant cultures
happy and studius new year for all of us
 
I do not deny that are cognates between south slavic and celtic language but some of the cognates from here seems forced.
A good cognate,linked to bagpipe,but not to celts from Great Britain,to those from Portugal:
bagpipe - in english - gajde in albanian - gajde in serbo-croatian and gaiida in bulgarian,gajta/gaita de fole in portughesse/spanish/galician.
Is not linked to latin,to germanic languages or to slavic languages,in other slavic languages is called different.
In romanian is cimpoi,no ideea from where this is taken.
And a custom that could be a influence from celts in Balkans,they are seeing the dragon in folk traditions as some positive creature that guard the lands from some evil female deity.
And if you want some serbian folklore celtic music here is something for you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ptwl9LUFrU
 
taranis

I'm not ignorant. I'm sticking to facts, not fantasy.
You're interpreting too much in this. When Strabo says that the Greeks encountered Celts on every continent doesn't mean that Celtic tribes settled on every continent. In fact, there's a far more plausible explanation for this: Galatian mercenaries operated in the entire eastern Mediterranean and provided service to the basically all of the Hellenistic sucessor kingdoms in the region, including at the court of the Ptolemaic dynasty in Egypt. There's no need for a mythic Celtic kingdom in North Africa for which there is zero evidence.

now tell me where is native Celtic R1b in Africa? zero...
but there is plenty of native I2a1 all around north Africa....
I am convinced these I2a1 people were Garamantes and as other Gomer ( Cimmerian ) derived people were original Celts...





The Garamantes were barbers. Period. End of story.

look at this in google

morocco mzoura

the-mysterious-moroccan-megalithic-menhirs-of-mzora

an-afro-asiatic-connection-to-celtic-languages
 
taranis

look at this in google

morocco mzoura

the-mysterious-moroccan-megalithic-menhirs-of-mzora

Hello Dublin,

I'm sorry to say this, but megalithic sites are no evidence for Celtic languages. Megalithic traditions in Europe go back far into the Neolithic, and are very widespread, from the Mediterranean to Denmark, and are also found outside of Europe. And, while it is not known what language(s) the people of Neolithic Europe spoke, they are generally thought to have been speakers of non-Indo-European languages.

an-afro-asiatic-connection-to-celtic-languages

This is very a different story. There are rivaling hypotheses on how the various branches of the Celtic languages are related to each other. The Afroasiatic substrate hypothesis assumes that the original division in the Celtic languages was between the Continental Celtic (ie. Celtiberian, Gaulish) and Insular Celtic (ie. Brythonic - Breton, Cornish, Welsh and Goidelic - Irish, Manx Gaelic, Scottish Gaelic). This was based on the following features:

- The Continental Celtic languages had a Subject-Verb-Object word order (SVO), as well as very complex grammar very similar to other "old" Indo-European languages such as Latin, Classical Greek or Sanskrit.

- In contrast to this, in the Insular Celtic languages, the standard word order is Verb-Subject-Object (VSO), and features like consonant mutations and inflected prepositions, which are very untypical of the Indo-European languages, but found in the Afroasiatic languages. Thus idea of the Afroasiatic Substrate Hypothesis is that the pre-Celtic inhabitants of Britain were speakers of an Afroasiatic language, and that the substrate was responsible for these peculiar features in Insular Celtic.

However, it should be pointed out that this substrate hypothesis does not apply to Proto-Celtic (the ancestor language of all Celtic languages), but to Insular Celtic only. However, this substrate hypothesis assumes that the Insular Celtic hypothesis is correct in the first place (since it is not undisputed in scholarly circles). The rivaling hypothesis is the Q/P-Celtic hypothesis, which assumes that Gaulish and Brythonic are more closely related. Additionally, there is very little in the way of any "hard" evidence for an Afroasiatic substrate.

None of the above, even if the Afroasiatic Subrate Hypothesis and the Insular Celtic hypothesis were correct, would prove a Celtic presence in Africa, and certainly not that the Garamentes were a Celtic people.
 
hi taranis

I'm sorry to say this, but megalithic sites are no evidence for Celtic languages. Megalithic traditions in Europe go back far into the Neolithic, and are very widespread, from the Mediterranean to Denmark, and are also found outside of Europe. And, while it is not known what language(s) the people of Neolithic Europe spoke, they are generally thought to have been speakers of non-Indo-European languages.

Thank you for pointing at the crucial problem of Celtic sciences. The megalithic sites were and still are associated with Celts. Because original documented sites were found in Britain and Ireland, during the Celtic revival, inhabitants of these countries which spoke Gaelic languages were branded Celts. This is the original wrong hypothesis. This is why we have so many weird and unexpected things when it comes to Celtic culture, language and genetics.
In my opinion Gaelic language speakers are not Celts. They had contacts with Celts due to Celtic invasions of Gaelic countries and this is where the common words come from. Celts or galls were always regarded in Gaelic countries as foreigners, and the word for foreigner in Gaelic is gall. Gaulish languages (the actual Celtic languages) have a lot of similarities with Serbian and other Slavic languages because they were either one and the same people originally, or because Serbs and Celts lived together on same territories for a long time and thus influenced each other languages.
 
As to who built megalithic sites this will have to remain a mystery at least for now. But finding all these stone circles in north Africa, Balkans, Asia and north America, is forcing the re-evaluation of the farce which is “megalithic Celts were common ancestors of western Europeans...”
 
taranis, hyn

Instead, the Germanic people refered to thsemelves as something akin to "Touta-" ("people", "tribe") - a word which is also attested in Celtic languages (Gaulish "Toutatis" - "tribal father", Irish "Tuath", Welsh "Tud"), Baltic languages (Latvian, Lithuanian "Tauta") and even modern Germanic languages themselves ("Dutch", "Deutsch").

In Serbian there is an old word "Tušta" pronounced "tushta" which means all. The expression in Serbian "Tušta i tma" means lots and lots of people, so many it is impossible to count them all, like in this sentence: “Skupilo se sveta tušta i tma” meaning “So many people gathered, it was impossible to count them”. "Stuštiti se" means to all run down together like in a battle.
Maybe this is the missing Serbian equivalent of “tuatha” you were looking for.
 
This resulted in the formation of a gradient of haplogroup 1 genes throughout the continent, the lowest frequency of these ancient genes being found in Turkey, and the highest frequency in Ireland, with intermediate frequencies in continental populations. In Ireland 78.1% of all men have the haplogroup 1 gene.
In Ireland men with Gaelic names have higher frequencies of this ancient marker than men with non-Gaelic names. For example, men in Ireland with surnames of English origin have 62% haplogroup 1 genes; men with Scottish names have 52.9% and men with Norman and Norse names have 83%. In Leinster, 73.3% of men with Gaelic surnames have this gene, in Munster, 94.6% and in Ulster 81.1%.
The most striking finding was that in Connaught, the westernmost point of Europe, almost all men (98.3%) carry this particular gene. This means that the people of Connaught have been relatively isolated, genetically, from the movements of people that shaped the genetic makeup of the rest of the continent. By comparison, in the east of the country there has been a lot more mixing of genes coming from foreign sources.
The prevalence of ancient genes in Ireland suggests that the Irish have largely maintained their pre-Neolithic genetic heritage. There has been little genetic influence from outside the country since the first people came to Ireland almost 9,000 years ago.
 
but in Britain

In 2007, Bryan Sykes produced an analysis of 6000 samples from the OGAP project in his book Blood of the Isles.[3] Later, Stephen Oppenheimer in his 2006 book The Origins of the British used the data from Weale et al. (2002), Capelli et al. (2003) and Rosser et al. (2000) for Europe. In opposition to Neolithic origin theories, which remain strong, Sykes and Oppenheimer argued for significant immigration from Iberia into Britain and Ireland. Much of this argument was based upon Y DNA evidence, however by 2010 several major Y DNA studies presented more complete data, showing that the oldest-surviving male lineages had mostly migrated to Britain from the Balkans, and ultimately from the Middle East, not from Iberia.[4][5][6]
In the North Welsh town of Abergele there is a very high percentage of haplogroup E1b1b1 (33%), which is thought to have dispersed around Europe mainly from the Balkans.[15]
 
and more on genetic Atlantean pople

In Trinity College Dublin, Prof. Dan Bradley and his team are using Irish Dna to explore our ancient origins and connections with other peoples. As part of this research, they have discovered that 20% of men in the north-west of Ireland are descended from just one man, Niall of the Nine Hostages, the well known high king from the 4th century who brought St Patrick as a slave to Ireland.

The Irish are strongly predisposed to the genetic variants that can trigger diseases such as cystic fibrosis, an enzyme deficiency called phenylketonuria and haemochromatosis, the disease that caused the death of former tanaiste Brian Lenihan.
Yet significant susceptibility levels for these disorders are also exhibited by others in what is generally described as the Celtic people. This includes what Bradley describes as the “Atlantic façade”, places along the Atlantic seaboard where the Celtic languages were spoken including Brittany, Scotland, Wales, Cornwall and also northern Spain, particularly in the Basque regions.
 
Dublin, please start citing your sources and indicating that quotes are quotes rather than your own writing.

In Ireland 78.1% of all men have the haplogroup 1 gene.
...
In Ireland men with Gaelic names have higher frequencies of this ancient marker than men with non-Gaelic names.
...
The prevalence of ancient genes in Ireland suggests that the Irish have largely maintained their pre-Neolithic genetic heritage. There has been little genetic influence from outside the country since the first people came to Ireland almost 9,000 years ago.

"Haplogroup 1" is a really, really old term for haplogroup R1b. The fact that this term is being used indicates how outdated this information is.

Haplogroup R1b is indeed more frequent among Gaelic and Brythonic peoples than among, say, Anglo-Saxon descendants, but it's not, as your source says, indicative of "pre-Neolithic genetic heritage." In fact, it's strong evidence against it. For an introduction, try reading Maciamo's R1b page.

In opposition to Neolithic origin theories, which remain strong, Sykes and Oppenheimer argued for significant immigration from Iberia into Britain and Ireland. Much of this argument was based upon Y DNA evidence, however by 2010 several major Y DNA studies presented more complete data, showing that the oldest-surviving male lineages had mostly migrated to Britain from the Balkans, and ultimately from the Middle East, not from Iberia.[4][5][6]

"From Iberia" is a largely outdated theory based on modern frequencies, and "from the Balkans" is a bit simplistic, and doesn't tell the whole story. The historical migration of Haplogroup R1b is a complex subject.

In the North Welsh town of Abergele there is a very high percentage of haplogroup E1b1b1 (33%), which is thought to have dispersed around Europe mainly from the Balkans.[15]

"The Balkans" is too narrow; E1b is Southern European in general in the context of Europe. A Welsh town having a high frequency of it indicates a founder effect. They possibly descend from a Roman soldier (unless a more detailed later analysis has proven this wrong), but there are also plenty of other possibilities.

In Trinity College Dublin, Prof. Dan Bradley and his team are using Irish Dna to explore our ancient origins and connections with other peoples. As part of this research, they have discovered that 20% of men in the north-west of Ireland are descended from just one man, Niall of the Nine Hostages, the well known high king from the 4th century who brought St Patrick as a slave to Ireland.

These conclusions have been considered questionable from the beginning, including by the authors themselves. To begin with, we don't know Niall's haplotype. All they really demonstrated was a regional founder effect of R1b in Ireland.
 
i would like to add sources but i am nor yet allowed to post links :)

"Haplogroup 1" is a really, really old term for haplogroup R1b

don't be picky. you know what i mean.

Haplogroup R1b is indeed more frequent among Gaelic and Brythonic peoples than among, say, Anglo-Saxon descendants, but it's not, as your source says, indicative of "pre-Neolithic genetic heritage." In fact, it's strong evidence against it

my source is Trinity College Dublin stady. Trinity College Dublin genetics department was aworded as one the best in the world.


"From Iberia" is a largely outdated theory based on modern frequencies, and "from the Balkans" is a bit simplistic, and doesn't tell the whole story.

says who?

the study of irish and uk brown bear remains (now extinct) has shown that they discend from iberian genetic sub type. this means that at some stage there was a land mass connecting british isles and iberia. if bears could go accross so could the people.


"The Balkans" is too narrow; E1b is Southern European in general in the context of Europe. A Welsh town having a high frequency of it indicates a founder effect. They possibly descend from a Roman soldier (unless a more detailed later analysis has proven this wrong), but there are also plenty of other possibilities.

source is wikipedia genetic map of britain.
 
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