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Thread: Autosomal map : African admixture (from Dodecad)

  1. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Well Dorian, I don't pretend to hurt you first of all, but I think you are complicating the argument to keep the reason when the discussion is over. The distances are perfectly clear, there's nothing more to understand in regards for the Palaeo African position.

    The features that you identify as "East Asian" in the Bushmen have really NOTHING to do with Asia. Palaeo African populations have usually a curious diversity in the facial traits, but it's just due to this: they are very Paleolithic and have retained most of the "original modern human seed" to make it easy to understand. In other words, they are more related to the "homos" who evolved in different forms all over the world.

    I mean, this features (doesn't matter if "Asian looking" or something else) are absolutely native to Africa, hence, associated to Negroids. It's not the same, even not slightly close in no way, to what you find among any Mongoloid population in genetic terms. They are Pre-Asian.

    My English vocabulary perhaps is not enough rich to explain it in a more proper way, but I think the idea it's clear. Palaeo Africans are true negroids with independence of their strange (or not) appearence. But if you prefer to avoid the term Negroid: Palaeo Afrians are more African genetically speaking than Neo Africans.
    Very well explained.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Well Dorian, I don't pretend to hurt you first of all, but I think you are complicating the argument to keep the reason when the discussion is over. The distances are perfectly clear, there's nothing more to understand in regards for the Palaeo African position.

    The features that you identify as "East Asian" in the Bushmen have really NOTHING to do with Asia. Palaeo African populations have usually a curious diversity in the facial traits, but it's just due to this: they are very Paleolithic and have retained most of the "original modern human seed" to make it easy to understand. In other words, they are more related to the "homos" who evolved in different forms all over the world.

    I mean, this features (doesn't matter if "Asian looking" or something else) are absolutely native to Africa, hence, associated to Negroids. It's not the same, even not slightly close in no way, to what you find among any Mongoloid population in genetic terms. They are Pre-Asian.

    My English vocabulary perhaps is not enough rich to explain it in a more proper way, but I think the idea it's clear. Palaeo Africans are true negroids with independence of their strange (or not) appearence. But if you prefer to avoid the term Negroid: Palaeo Afrians are more African genetically speaking than Neo Africans.
    I appreciate your reply as you appear to have expressed yourself better, thanks for trying Knovas. The Palaeo-African components are not less or more Asian, if you think I meant that Palaeo-African is more East Asian then I apologize. I thought I made myself clear but apparently my words don't make sense to you.

    I said that there are commonalities in East Asia that relate to the phylogeny and certain dna traits as a result of ancient out of Africa migrations. These early migrations may or may not be responsible for the very small but commonly observed traces of Palaeo-African admixture found in Southwest Asian populations, or populations with significant amounts of SW Asian admixture.

    There is no Asian in Palaeo-African components, you have it backwards, there is rather Palaeo-African elements that are still visible in East Asians and Southwest Asian admixture.
    Last edited by Dorianfinder; 29-11-11 at 11:18.

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    Ok, we can partly agree. However, even having this shared elements, Neo Afrian it's still closer to Eurasia, so my point from the beggining is that Palaeo African populations in the most purest form, are the "real" Sub-Saharans, Africans, or Negroids. Doesn't matter how you call it.

    The Euro7 Calculator does not include any of these populations, there only appear Neo Africans and the lecture is succesful (99-100%). I don't see any problem to read it, and I personally expect the same for Palaeo Africans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wilhelm View Post
    It's not my fantasies, you can see the percentages here, West-Eurasia K=10 (the last Eurogenes run) :

    http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/09/g...ross-west.html

    Sub-Saharan for Spaniards : 0%
    The Dodecad Project does not agree.

    In addition are you implying that studies like Achilli et alia are wrong or malicious or incompetent?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Ok, we can partly agree. However, even having this shared elements, Neo Afrian it's still closer to Eurasia, so my point from the beggining is that Palaeo African populations in the most purest form, are the "real" Sub-Saharans, Africans, or Negroids. Doesn't matter how you call it.

    The Euro7 Calculator does not include any of these populations, there only appear Neo Africans and the lecture is succesful (99-100%). I don't see any problem to read it, and I personally expect the same for Palaeo Africans.
    Are you familiar with SNP Map? It's a useful tool if you want to know whether a small amount of any admixture is due to statistical noise. I have been using it for a while now and have improved my understanding ten fold by playing around with the settings and comparing snp frequencies of various populations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Taranis View Post
    Actually, Tartessisan was a non-Indo-European language.
    Some reputed linguists would say the contrary. The correct answer right now is filiation of Tartessian is unknown. My guess is Tartessos was a heavily orientalised Celtic society.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorianfinder View Post
    Are you familiar with SNP Map? It's a useful tool if you want to know whether a small amount of any admixture is due to statistical noise. I have been using it for a while now and have improved my understanding ten fold by playing around with the settings and comparing snp frequencies of various populations.
    I'm not familiar with it. Thanks for showing it to me, I'll keep it in mind ;)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    I'm not familiar with it. Thanks for showing it to me, I'll keep it in mind ;)
    It's my pleasure, let me know what you think.

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    It's quite strange how some agenda driven forum members keep on posting material clearly geared to exaggerating certain DNA admixtures. Over and over, the same tired, outdated and sometimes plainly erroneous or compromised data, most of the time focused on haplogroup frequencies rather than autosomal DNA which, of course, provides a much more accurate portrait of a given population group's genome components. Such individuals are just intent (pathologically driven, it seems) on producing annoyance in their audience. I's beyond pathetic. Don't you people have a life?

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    It's really boring to read posts about Sub-Saharan ancestry in both Spain and Portugal, trying to show how "relevant" it is. Just now, a few hours ago, a known t.r.o.l.l. spamming about the brotherhood between North Africans and Iberians...and we can go on again and again. No need to say, I understand what you mean.

    In the last days the Forum remained calmly, but it's impossible to have the same everyday. This thread has different moments: some posts where, in fact, no way useful, but worth to mention that a serious discussion was also possible. No problem if the dinamic is the last one, and all reasonable points of view are Welcomed.

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    By the way, Slovenians have exactly the same sub-sharan as Spaniards at Dodecad, 0.5%, but obviously nobody talks about it, very curious. Oh, and the African map of Maciamo should be updated, the total African for Slovenians is 1%

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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    Some reputed linguists would say the contrary. The correct answer right now is filiation of Tartessian is unknown. My guess is Tartessos was a heavily orientalised Celtic society.
    Why should Tartessos have been a "heavily orientalized Celtic society"? It doesn't really make sense to expect a 'advanced' Celtic language as Tartessian is supposed to be, this far south and as early on the Iberian penninsula. Besides, I haven't seen any convincing evidence published thus far (including the works by Koch et al.- which you properly refer to) that would have persuaded me otherwise.

    As others have noted, the writing system is hardly suitable for writing an Indo-European language at all.
    Last edited by Taranis; 05-12-11 at 11:36.

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