European Tree Names (offtopic from NE autosomal component)

[sparkey]

What is the etymology of Breton "hiliber"? Welsh "cerddin" and Cornish "kerdhynen" are obviously cognates, but "hiliber"?

[Armoricain]

Bonjour Sparkey et excusez moi de repondre en français, mais mon anglais est vraiment trop mauvais.
Mais une chance mon breton est meilleur.
J'utillise très souvent un dictionnaire, breton, qui est certainement l'un des plus complets :Le Favereau.
On y trouve beaucoup de comparaisons entre les differentes langues celtiques et beaucoup d'étymologie
On peut y lire, je resume: Hili ber ou ili ber, en vieux breton Elilub : Etiar- ijar

Un trouve un toponyme hillibrennou, qui viendrait mais l'auteur n'en est pas certain de Hili et Prenn
Prenn- lui, bien connu qui signifie arbre d'après le glossaire de Vienne: Prenne = arborem grandem
Voila, si cela peut vous aider.

[MOESAN]

Bonjour Sparkey et excusez moi de repondre en français, mais mon anglais est vraiment trop mauvais.
Mais une chance mon breton est meilleur.
J'utillise très souvent un dictionnaire, breton, qui est certainement l'un des plus complets :Le Favereau.
On y trouve beaucoup de comparaisons entre les differentes langues celtiques et beaucoup d'étymologie
On peut y lire, je resume: Hili ber ou ili ber, en vieux breton Elilub : Etiar- ijar

Un trouve un toponyme hillibrennou, qui viendrait mais l'auteur n'en est pas certain de Hili et Prenn
Prenn- lui, bien connu qui signifie arbre d'après le glossaire de Vienne: Prenne = arborem grandem
Voila, si cela peut vous aider.

thanks to Armoricain
'sorbier' is a specie of trees that encompasses 'alisier', 'cormier' in french, trees that produces comestible (eatable) fruits -
for breton 'hiliber' (sing. 'hiliberenn' ) seams the bad form of 'iliber' countaining 'ili' (berries) and per(-enn)= 'pear' ('birn'), a fruit - sometimes 'perili', 'pirili' - I suppose it is a generic term, not too precise (lost of the previous word shared with welsh and cornish -
from the same element, french 'cornouiller' : breton 'gwez(enn) ili-ho'
'prenn' in modern breton has the meaning of "timber", and 'pren(n)(-enn)' "tree" or "wood" or "timber" in welsh -

[Yetos]

ok I start a big effort here, maybe not even finish in 1 post,

English	Ancient Greek	Modern greek	description
acacia	akkakia	Ακκακια	From Ακις - ακανθος = thorn
oak	ΔΡΥΣ	Drys balanidia	Druid take their name after that tree Balanidia after Balanis (dryad name of Daphnaie nymphs- Ilex)
River reeds	Syrinx (Σωλην)	kalamia	Kalamindar is the Thracian name Comparing with Greek σωλην = pipe
laurel	daphne	dafne
Willow (salix alba)	?	Itea - Itia	Can’t find source in ancient Greek
Willow (Salix)	Κλαια (oreiad-Nymph)	κλαιουσα
hawthorn	krataigos	xagkathia	Akis – a(g)kanthos = thorn Sacred to wedding ceremony
alder	klethra	σκληθρα
birch	Βετουλη* (vetule-Bitule)	Σημυδα Semuda-simida	*the ancient name Βετουλη is mention in δημητρακου Lexicon Hederici Lexicon, I could not find any text.
hornbeam	?	Γαυρος gauros-gavros
Chestnut tree	Καστανεα Kastanea	Kαστανεα-ια
Dogwood	Keranos Kraneia *	Krania	* Kraneia is a known (h)amadryad daughter of Oxylos
Maple	Σφενδαμος Sphendamos-sphendamos	Σφενδαμη
Fern	Πτερ-η Pter-e	Φτρερη
strawberry	Χαμαικερασον *	Φραουλα fraoyla	Fragaria vesca, the wild one
Ash-tree	Φραξος (male)	Μελια	In ash trees lives the nyphs Μελιαι-Μελιαδες, modern name is after them.
Beech tree	Φηγος Fegos-Figos Οξια* Phigaleia (oreiad Nymph)	Οξια Oxia	*After Makedonian timber-river Axios, the shaped with axe (axis) wood, ready to burn, compare wood is (α)Ξυλο Xulo-Xilo
Holly	Υλος Ylos-Ilos* (fm) Ylh	Purnaria	*I find the term in some lexicon as Υλη but means wood for burn υλη. Υλοτομος = wood cutter for winter’s fire
(Holly )	Ιξος Ixos	Γκι gi
yew	Πρινος	πριναρια
hazel	Κορυς (= helmet) Λεπτοκαρυον (=thin shell nut)	Λεπτοκαρυα Φουντουκια* (Funduk)	*after Ottoman’s Puntuk(from Pontus) Modern Turkish Findik
Wallnut	Καρυα (karua-Karia the Nymph-Dryad) means hard	καρυδια
elm	Πτελεα Ptelea	Φτελια - λευκα
White poplar	Λευκη leuke (dryad)	λευκα
Black poplar	Heliada	Λευκα (καβακι)
Sloe, blackthorn	? *	Κορομελια , Τζιρνικια, Τζανερια, Αγριο-δαμασκηνια (wild-damson)	*since is μελια the ancient name is probably among the meliades nymphs or dryads
Almond	Αμυγδαλεα amygdalea	αμυγδαλια
plum	Προυμνη Proumne-Prumni (theophrastos)	δαμασκηνια
Fir tree	Πιτυς (Pitys-Pitis) Ελατη etc	Ελατη general name for abies family
Bay laurel tree	Δαφνη dafnis (oreiad)	dafni
rowan	Ooν (Oon)	Σορβο
elder	Ακταια (Theophrastos) (σ)αμμοβοτρυς	Κουφοξυλια Σαμπουκος (Sabuca)	* ακταια means on the beach, near sea sand, Βοτρυς is a description that describes the plant’s fruit formation, (sammoBotrys) means the Botrys style plant that lives at the sand,
Linden	Φιλυρα (dryad)	Φιλυρα
Fig tree	Συκεα	Συκια
Plane tree	Πλατανος Πλατανος	Πλατανος
Quinse tree	Κυδωνεα	Κυδωνια
Apple	Μηλεα	Μηλια	After meliades Nymphs
Pear tree	Απιδεα	Απιδια Αχλαδια
Pistacia	σχινος	Μαστιχη
Pistacia	Ταραμυθια	Τριμυθια
Myrtle	Μυρσινη Μυρτος	Μυρτια
Mulberry tree	Morea (hamadryad)	Μουρια
grape	Κληματις Αμπελος (daphnae nymph)	αμπελι

B.)
The nymphs of the trees

Dryas general trees
Dryada of relative with oak tree

αμαδρυας hamadryad means the lower in height (ground plants) living next to Dryades

Melades the one who live in Fruit trees, in Orchands
amameliades the one who live in the ground under the Meliades Nymphs (compare Greek χαμομηλι)

Ορειαδες oreiads the one who live in mountain forest, like pine trees

Κισσιαι The Ivy (kissos) like plants


etc

[Selwyn Greenfrith]

Thanks for righting the miswording - it was indeed meant to readoff something like: English names of British trees...

The fuller heading for Wych is: Wych Elm...so mayhap a kind of for Bergulme?

I take it you mean: Schierling not: Shierling?

[sparkey]

The fuller heading for Wych is: Wych Elm...so mayhap a kind of for Bergulme?

I think both are fairly specific in referring to Ulmus glabra, so only "kind of" in that they know it's an elm in both languages. The German etymology is pretty obvious... berg + ulme... but the English is less obvious. I had to look it up to find that wych is a cognate with wicker, both coming from the O.E. wice, meaning pliant.

I take it you mean: Schierling not: Shierling?

Yup... a typo from an English speaker not used to putting the "c" there for that sound.

[MOESAN]

I put here some gaelic translations for some trees, tu feed this almost dead thread -
maybe it would be of no use? -
all the way, it is a dictionary "work" because I do not speak gaelic even if I tried to learn it (or them) some years ago and can recognize some structures or derivations ... so some mistake could be occurred (I hope not)

english	irish gaelic	scottish gaelic
Oak	dair (darach)	darag, darach
Salow/willow	saileach	seileach
Hawthorne	crann sceiche	sgitheach
Alder	fearna	feàrna
Birch	beith	beithe
Hornbeam	?	?
Chestnut tree	cnô capail castàn	geanm-chnô
Dogwood	?	?
Maple	mailp
Fern	raithneach	raineach, roineach
Strawberry(#-tree)	sù talùn	sùbh-làir
Ash tree	fuinseog	uinnseann ?
Beech	feà, faibhile	crann-faibhile
Holly	cuileann	cuileann
Yew	iùr	iubhar, iuthar
Horse chesnut tree
Larch	learôg	guibhas-learaig
Hazel wood	coll	calltunn
Walnut tree	crann gallchnô	geinm-chnô
Elm	leamhàn	leamhan
Sloe	draighean dubh	draighneag
Blackthorn	draighean dubh	?
Plum tree	crann plumaî	?
Fir tree	giùis	giubhas
Rowan tree (mountain ash?)	caorthann	?
Elder	crann troim	craobh fhearna
Linden tree / Lime	teile, crann teile	teile
Aspen	?	critheach (critheann)
some gaelic speakers could confirm or correct?

[MOESAN]

you can notice the scottish gaelic spelling is more conservative than the irish one