Politics To Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, Slovens, Hungarians..:wasn't life under socialism better?

[Ike]

1. They had a slogan:" Kosovo works, Belgrade is being build" which was true.
2. Albanians had to shed blood for those few apartments build by Belgrade. Serb regime was oppressive and bloody similar with Palestine today.

Ok, lets start with this period of Communist Yugoslavia:

1. So could people in the oil-platform chant : "North Sea works, London is being built". That slogan that went had nothing to do with reality.

Anyways, in those times Kosovo still had about 2/3 Albanians. Could you explain how did Communists divide the taxes on ethnic basis? Or you're saying that from whole population of Kosovo had somehow been taken more money than from the rest of country?

2. Example please. What was Serb regime in those days? What men consisted it? What did they accomplished or what were they trying to do?
Example of blood and similarities with Palestine today?

 

[albanopolis]

Ok, lets start with this period of Communist Yugoslavia:

1. So could people in the oil-platform chant : "North Sea works, London is being built". That slogan that went had nothing to do with reality.

Anyways, in those times Kosovo still had about 2/3 Albanians. Could you explain how did Communists divide the taxes on ethnic basis? Or you're saying that from whole population of Kosovo had somehow been taken more money than from the rest of country?

2. Example please. What was Serb regime in those days? What men consisted it? What did they accomplished or what were they trying to do?
Example of blood and similarities with Palestine today?

Actually the slogan was: "Trebce works, Belgrade is being build" in reference to Trebce mine in Mitrovica.
That mine was the lifeline of Yugoslav regime securing a good sum of hard currency.
I don't know how old are you but there have been successive Albanian uprisings
I don't remember exactly how many were before 1967 but there was one in 1967, 1974, 1981, 1989, 1998
They were all put down bloodily by Serbian army causing many casualties and immigration.
In 1998 was an expected event by all western powers known the bloody history of uprisings
Now that's all history but my point is to your reference that Albanians wanted to have an enlarged country on the back of Serbian territories
Many in the west did not believe that Kosovo was a serbian territory. Otherwise they would not have been ready to separate it from Serbia.
Its not like the west hated Serbia and they decided to punish her by taking territories.
There was a consensus that Kosovo was a colony and was been ripped off its riches by the colonizers.

 

[albanopolis]

You write something completely different.

And do not answer the questions:

Where did Albanians live better:
a) in Albania (Enver Hoxha and companions)
b) In Serbia and Yugoslavia

Where did Albanians have better human rights:
a) in Albania (Enver Hoxha and companions)
b) in Serbia and Yugoslavia.

Where did Albanians themselves like more to live:
a) in Albania (Enver Hoxha and companions)
b) in Serbia and Yugoslavia

Which did state give for development undeveloped areas:
a) Albania (Enver Hoxha and companions)
b) Serbia and Yugoslavia for undeveloped areas whee Albanians lived.

You maybe don't know how much the amount was given by Republic of Serbia and Yugoslav Federation for areas where Albanians lived but you can find, or you can ask older Albanians, they will tell you.

But the biggest problem is to restore the Middle Ages, in Yugoslavia was big progress, but today, examples:

ISIS fighter from Kosovo praises jihad in Syria
http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2013/10/isis_fighter_from_ko.php

Albanians Fighting for ISIS earn $65/day, come from Middle Class Families
http://europenews.dk/en/node/83259

ISIS Albanian Mujahideen celebrating the liberation of Mosul in Iraq
http://tune.pk/video/3933167/isis-albanian-mujahideen-celebrating-the-liberation-of-mosul-in-irak

In regard to your observation that Albanians are fighting for Isis: Its unfortunately true.
Many low intelligence Albanian folks have joined the movement. But Serbs to are also fighting in Russian side in Ukraine. Many Serbs were killed in Libia during Ghadaf war with western powers.
But you can not equate the actions of some individuals with the nation as a whole.
There are individuals who have joined the movement for religions reasons, others for adventure, many are being payed by their sponsors. Its certainly not a good thing to see but its not something unheard of. You are aware of american citizens fighting for Taliban in Afghanistan.
They were caught by the American army and were jailed in US.

 

[Ike]

Actually the slogan was: "Trebce works, Belgrade is being build" in reference to Trebce mine in Mitrovica.That mine was the lifeline of Yugoslav regime securing a good sum of hard currency

Exactly as in my example. I've just put an oil-platform instead.

I don't know how old are you but there have been successive Albanian uprisings
I don't remember exactly how many were before 1967 but there was one in 1967, 1974, 1981, 1989, ...
They were all put down bloodily by Serbian army causing many casualties and immigration.

That not true. There was no Serbian army in those times. JNA and it's leadership were only partly Serbian. And there was no bloody uprising. Post pictures or other data, if you think otherwise.

In 1998 was an expected event by all western powers known the bloody history of uprisings.
Now that's all history but my point is to your reference that Albanians wanted to have an enlarged country on the back of Serbian territories
Many in the west did not believe that Kosovo was a serbian territory. Otherwise they would not have been ready to separate it from Serbia.
Its not like the west hated Serbia and they decided to punish her by taking territories.
There was a consensus that Kosovo was a colony and was been ripped off its riches by the colonizers.

This is after the fallout of Yugoslavia, and it's mainly untrue. We know what happened in Kosovo, and we talked with sincere Albanians, who were not willing to give up their integrity for a fistful of dollars. Some of them live peacefully in Belgrade right now:
http://www.emperors-clothes.com/interviews/albanian.htm

And the very end you can read where would he really like to live. Very on topic.

Offtopic (suggest you start a separate thread if you want to respond on this part):
He correctly predicted the sad future for Kosovo in years to come, and also predicted the emergence of new wave of Albanian irredentism that we see nowdays is summoning a new Balkan war. We now have calls for Natural Albania, forced Albanization of population. That guy Kresnik Spahiu who supported that act was even the deputy president of the Supreme Court of Albania?!

 

[LeBrok]

ISIS fighter from Kosovo praises jihad in Syria
http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2013/10/isis_fighter_from_ko.php

Albanians Fighting for ISIS earn $65/day, come from Middle Class Families
http://europenews.dk/en/node/83259

ISIS Albanian Mujahideen celebrating the liberation of Mosul in Iraq
http://tune.pk/video/3933167/isis-albanian-mujahideen-celebrating-the-liberation-of-mosul-in-irak

Wow, this is a punch below the belt, dude!

 

[albanopolis]

Exactly as in my example. I've just put an oil-platform instead.



That not true. There was no Serbian army in those times. JNA and it's leadership were only partly Serbian. And there was no bloody uprising. Post pictures or other data, if you think otherwise.



This is after the fallout of Yugoslavia, and it's mainly untrue. We know what happened in Kosovo, and we talked with sincere Albanians, who were not willing to give up their integrity for a fistful of dollars. Some of them live peacefully in Belgrade right now:
http://www.emperors-clothes.com/interviews/albanian.htm

And the very end you can read where would he really like to live. Very on topic.

Offtopic (suggest you start a separate thread if you want to respond on this part):
He correctly predicted the sad future for Kosovo in years to come, and also predicted the emergence of new wave of Albanian irredentism that we see nowdays is summoning a new Balkan war. We now have calls for Natural Albania, forced Albanization of population. That guy Kresnik Spahiu who supported that act was even the deputy president of the Supreme Court of Albania?!

I don't see the need for a new topic
It will be a waste of time
I can't change you views, neither can you mine
The trauma Serbs have caused to the national psyche of Albanians will never be healed.
The topic of socialism is interesting
Slavs are largely responsible for that creature. It was not all bad though. Regardless the huge number of victims it caused as mentioned in the above had some positive imprints in societies.
Yugoslavia had the mildest for of socialism.

 

[albanopolis]

Its certainly not a good thing.
Most imams get schooled in Arabic countries which are hotbed of radicalization.
Albanians have not a school of their own for clerics of any religion.

 

[King Bardhyl]

@ Ike& Garrick
I don’t want to lose much time with you guys. I want to stay at two interesting moments.
First this theory of 100.000 albanian who emigrate to Serbia is very curios and I insiste that you elaborate better this theory, because never heard before.
Second:
Your words
“But the biggest problem is to restore the Middle Ages, in Yugoslavia was big progress, but today, examples:

ISIS fighter from Kosovo praises jihad in Syria
http://www.longwarjournal.org/archiv...er_from_ko.php

Albanians Fighting for ISIS earn $65/day, come from Middle Class Families
http://europenews.dk/en/node/83259

ISIS Albanian Mujahideen celebrating the liberation of Mosul in Iraq
http://tune.pk/video/3933167/isis-al...-mosul-in-irak”

Where did you owe this article, LeBrok?
You should note that there are people who read what we write and you can not mock the intelligence of readers
The human being first observes and then draws conclusions . With a simple observation, you are trying to confuse the discussion about communism, Albanians and Serbs and Islamic fundamentalism.
I am willing to discuss all three, but let's share from each other. Let`s don’t make confusion.



Conclusion


Regarding the discussion on the Albanians and the Serbs let pass here:
http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/27710-Illyrian-Albanian-Continuity?p=439209#post439209
I have invited you different time , this time i challenge you both and others. Enough with bored.
Let's put on the table and see who has the greatest.

Yugoslavia was destroyed by you Serbs.
Milosevic sent you four times with tanks and you come back four times with tractors.

About communism i have expressed my opinion about the issue.
My words:
“Practical communism, implemented was a creature of Slavic Orthodoxy”.
And i am ready to discuss with you. But before that i want to be clear your intellectual level is not the same as the Yetos.
So, I am making an question: who is the most important book for an comunist, the Bible Communism?

P.S.
You should not refer Yetos. There are three weeks and he still today could not tell me one name of a greek hero of Greek revolution. According to my information he have an problem of health. He can not stay more than 5 min sit in a chair.

 

[King Bardhyl]

Wow, this is a punch below the belt, dude!

Ncncncq, they hit themselfe.
Yours was a punch below the belt, dude!

You have stay in the middle, you are an moderator.
P.S.
I have made you this question:
What are the features that define that a certain group of people constitute an ethnos?

Is this:
Your words:
“We can say that although linguistically Northern Macedonia changed a lot, but there is overwhelming genetic continuity with ancient Macedonians or Greeks, if you will. Their diet is close to Greeks, and similar music, ethnic cloths and many customs”.?

 

[Ike]

I don't see the need for a new topic
It will be a waste of time
I can't change you views, neither can you mine
The trauma Serbs have caused to the national psyche of Albanians will never be healed.
The topic of socialism is interesting
Slavs are largely responsible for that creature. It was not all bad though. Regardless the huge number of victims it caused as mentioned in the above had some positive imprints in societies.
Yugoslavia had the mildest for of socialism.

And I lived among those Serbs, and I've seen them doing their best trying to keep Yugoslavia lasting as a multinational state. Even when we all departed from them, the small Yugoslavia was still the only country where all nationalities exercised their citizens right properly. We can see that from migrations and census percentages. It is were clear what territories people escaped (we can assume why) and that migrations went towards small Yugoslavia (only Serbia and Montenegro by that time). You always claim nonsense here, and fail to explain why would Croats or Albanians be coming into Serbia if their rights or lives were jeopardized. I don't really care about Serbs, but in the same time you miss to explain why did Albanians on Kosovo started real ethnic cleansing of other Kosovo ethnicities as soon as they got a chance:

http://www.errc.org/article/five-years-of-ethnic-cleansing-of-gypsies-from-kosovo/1924
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Articles/Rifati_Kosovo.htm

You play a role of victim here, but this was a trend from decades ago, and it turn out more serious as federal government went weaker.

In communist Yugoslavia the number of Albanians quadrupled during that four decades of what Albanians like to call terror. Pristina had less than 10 thousand people in 1949, and it went up to 110 thousands in 1981. The "evil communist" built hospitals, roads, railway, library (most modern one in Yugoslavia - it had conveyer belts and elevators for the books), University, etc. We all know how well communists treated Albanians. Your needs were put before anyone else's because they thought that by treating you special you'd come down to your senses and become decent citizens of the country. And I sincerely mourn the trauma you've inflicted to yourself by abusing your rights in Yugoslavia and then going rogue persuaded by you CIA allies whose only goal was to destroy our country.

If interested, people can read about the culmination of that disgusting and auto-destructive behavior from ex Pristina Jewish community president (and a historian):
http://www.emperors-clothes.com/interviews/keys.htm

 

[albanopolis]

And I lived among those Serbs, and I've seen them doing their best trying to keep Yugoslavia lasting as a multinational state. Even when we all departed from them, the small Yugoslavia was still the only country where all nationalities exercised their citizens right properly. We can see that from migrations and census percentages. It is were clear what territories people escaped (we can assume why) and that migrations went towards small Yugoslavia (only Serbia and Montenegro by that time). You always claim nonsense here, and fail to explain why would Croats or Albanians be coming into Serbia if their rights or lives were jeopardized. I don't really care about Serbs, but in the same time you miss to explain why did Albanians on Kosovo started real ethnic cleansing of other Kosovo ethnicities as soon as they got a chance:

http://www.errc.org/article/five-years-of-ethnic-cleansing-of-gypsies-from-kosovo/1924
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Articles/Rifati_Kosovo.htm

You play a role of victim here, but this was a trend from decades ago, and it turn out more serious as federal government went weaker.

In communist Yugoslavia the number of Albanians quadrupled during that four decades of what Albanians like to call terror. Pristina had less than 10 thousand people in 1949, and it went up to 110 thousands in 1981. The "evil communist" built hospitals, roads, railway, library (most modern one in Yugoslavia - it had conveyer belts and elevators for the books), University, etc. We all know how well communists treated Albanians. Your needs were put before anyone else's because they thought that by treating you special you'd come down to your senses and become decent citizens of the country. And I sincerely mourn the trauma you've inflicted to yourself by abusing your rights in Yugoslavia and then going rogue persuaded by you CIA allies whose only goal was to destroy our country.

If interested, people can read about the culmination of that disgusting and auto-destructive behavior from ex Pristina Jewish community president (and a historian):
http://www.emperors-clothes.com/interviews/keys.htm

Interesting point of view!
All ethnicitys in Yugoslavia were treated well, and all of them with no exception took up arms against Serbia!
Even though Serbia was not trying to dominate their lives or rip off their reaches!
I would guess that every other ethnicity but Serbia were idiots!
What other explanation could be because they were treated humanly and they violently rebelled this treatment1

 

[Ike]

Interesting point of view!
All ethnicitys in Yugoslavia were treated well, and all of them with no exception took up arms against Serbia!
Even though Serbia was not trying to dominate their lives or rip off their reaches!
I would guess that every other ethnicity but Serbia were idiots!
What other explanation could be because they were treated humanly and they violently rebelled this treatment1

Only the terrorist of KLA and NATO took up arms against Serbia. Serbia didn't wage war against any of the 6 SFR Yugoslavia republics. You're just making that up to paint a bad picture of Serbia that, you think, would somehow take responsibility from Albanians for their violent and stupid actions.

 

[FBS]

Hahaha Ike and his LaLa land. I lived in Yugoslavia, we had cases when 14 year olds were sent to Goli Otok. Everything was done under the sheet, so the world would not know. We were heavily in debts, and we just realized that after Titos death. It was a beautiful dream while it lasted. Life under socialism was not better, at least not the one that was created by slavic nations and imported by others. In Albania and Romania was one of the harshest, Bulgaria was not better either. In YU it was all milk and honey for the ruling class and their minions. The rest were equally poor.

 

[albanopolis]

Only the terrorist of KLA and NATO took up arms against Serbia. Serbia didn't wage war against any of the 6 SFR Yugoslavia republics. You're just making that up to paint a bad picture of Serbia that, you think, would somehow take responsibility from Albanians for their violent and stupid actions.

There was an armed struggle by Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia.
ll against Serbia!

 

[King Bardhyl]

[h=3]Vukovar statements[/h] In a May 2012 interview, Nikolić was quoted by Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung to have said that ″Vukovar was a Serb city and Croats have nothing to go back to there″.^[42] Croatian President Ivo Josipović criticized Nikolić for this statement and conditioned future cooperation on Nikolić's withdrawal of the statement.^[43]
The following day Nikolić's office issued a statement saying that Nikolić never made any such statement and called it a ″treacherous lie″.^[44] However, Michael Martens, the journalist of the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung subsequently published the audio recording showing that Nikolić had indeed made that statement.^[45]
[h=3]Comments about Srebrenica massacre[/h] On 2 June 2012, Nikolić stated on Montenegrin television that "there was no genocide in Srebrenica. In Srebrenica, grave war crimes were committed by some Serbs who should be found, prosecuted and punished. [...] It is very difficult to indict someone and prove before a court that an event qualifies as genocide." Nikolić also stated that he wouldn't attend the annual commemoration of the Srebrenica massacre: "Don't always ask the Serbian president if he is going to Srebrenica, my predecessor was there and paid tribute. Why should every president do the same?"^[46]
Bakir Izetbegović, a member of Bosnia and Herzegovina's presidency, said Nikolic's comments insulted the survivors. He elaborated "the denial of genocide in Srebrenica will not pave the way for co-operation and reconciliation in the region, but on the contrary may cause fresh misunderstandings and tensions. "^[46] Catherine Ashton, foreign policy chief of the European Union, condemned his comments and stated that "the EU strongly rejects any intention to rewrite history."^[47] The United States State Department deplored Nikolić's statement and considered them unfounded and counterproductive.^[48]
On 25 April 2013, Nikolić apologised for the crimes committed by any individual in the name of Serbia and the Serbian people. He also asked for forgiveness for Serbia for the crime committed in Srebrenica.^[49][50][51] The apology came after Nikolić was criticised during the presidential election in 2012 for denying that 'there was no genocide in Srebrenica', although the act has been accepted as a genocide by his predecessor Boris Tadić.^[49] However, the news was not fully accepted in the media in Bosnia and Herzegovina and Nikolić was said to have not still recognised the massacre of Srebrenica as genocide.^[50]





Still has not apologized for the crimes committed against Albanians.

 

[King Bardhyl]

There was an armed struggle by Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia.
ll against Serbia!

All are guilty, only Serbs are innocent.Some example of Serbian innocence:
Arkan the transformation:
Before

After

The politician

And his guys

The wedding of the national serbian hero

With some members of Greenpeace, called Arkan's Tigers, during a campaign for the protection of Tigers settlement.

 

[King Bardhyl]

And the end of the "hero".

 

[LeBrok]

Ncncncq, they hit themselfe.
Yours was a punch below the belt, dude!

You have stay in the middle, you are an moderator.
P.S.
I have made you this question:
What are the features that define that a certain group of people constitute an ethnos?

Is this:
Your words:
“We can say that although linguistically Northern Macedonia changed a lot, but there is overwhelming genetic continuity with ancient Macedonians or Greeks, if you will. Their diet is close to Greeks, and similar music, ethnic cloths and many customs”.?

As long as you don't learn or believe in genetics we have nothing to discuss. You'll be always ultra nationalistic Albanian seeing the world through a prism of hatfull feeling to all your neighbors. Actually not much different from many others coming to such threads venting their nationalistic insecurities, and showing neighbors how much better they are.

 

[King Bardhyl]

As long as you don't learn or believe in genetics we have nothing to discuss. You'll be always ultra nationalistic Albanian seeing the world through a prism of hatfull feeling to all your neighbors.

I am not an ultra nationalistic, and i am not hating nobody.
The reason why i am registred member here is because this guys, Ike, Garrick, Yetos, and others duped with their posts and insulted my people and my country. All these things you see and do not react by becoming part of this lousy game.I do the honor this forum with my presence. Find me another person here, that to protect his ideas has used so much material and so many resources in this forum. Amd i had never used albanian sources, not because this did not exist, but i was sure that at the end i will be accused for nationalism.





So i do not accept your charges.

 

[LeBrok]

I am not an ultra nationalistic, and i am not hating nobody.
The reason why i am registred member here is because this guys, Ike, Garrick, Yetos, and others duped with their posts and insulted my people and my country. All these things you see and do not react by becoming part of this lousy game.I do the honor this forum with my presence. Find me another person here, that to protect his ideas has used so much material and so many resources in this forum. Amd i had never used albanian sources, not because this did not exist, but i was sure that at the end i will be accused for nationalism.





So i do not accept your charges.

Actually not much different from many others coming to such threads venting their nationalistic insecurities, and showing neighbors how much better they are from them.