Genome of Iron Age Thracian

Yaan · Aug 6, 2014

Sile said:
H1 ydna is only in india , bulgaria and romania

u3b mtdna is 23% in modern assyrian people and is linked with U7 which is 22% of assyrian people

we can surmise this thracian was maybe an old hittite and moved to thrace when the hittite nation imploded and migrated ~1100BC

They are not tested for male lines!
H1 male line Bulgarian? R u crazy about 0.5 % of the Bulgarian carry this gene, so u r absolutely wrong.

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

Yaan said:
They are not tested for male lines!
H1 male line Bulgarian? R u crazy about 0.5 % of the Bulgarian carry this gene, so u r absolutely wrong.

All the test they have done for each of the 4 thracians so far.........bold = tested and positive , non-bold is tested and negative

P192-1
C1b2-Z12417
E-CTS9663/M5514/PF1774
E-M5428
E-Z15671
E1a2b-Z15104
E2b-Z15833
G-M3481/PF2880
G-M3580/PF3046
G-Z3104
G-Z3247
G2-Z6474
H1a1d2-Z4361
H1a1d2c2-Z12603
H1b1-Z14031
H1b1-Z14057
H1b2-Z14266
H1b2-Z14274
H3a-Z13440
H3b1-Z13710
Q1b1a1-FGC1904/Y2220
T1-L490

T2G2
E1-M5534/PF1809
E1a2b1a1a1-Z14974
E1b1a1a1c2b2-Z16055
E2-Z15727
H1a2a1-Z14731
H1b1-Z14070

V2
E2b-Z15833
G-M3494/Z3226
G-Z6318
H1a1d1-Z14596
H1b1-Z13987
H1b2-Z14274
H1b2a-Z14374
H1b2a-Z14375
H3b1-Z13642
H3b1-Z13710

K8
D1b1d1a-Z14831
E1a2-Z15140
E1b1a1a1c2c1a-Z16102
E2b-Z15823
E2b-Z15833
G-Z3247
G-Z3285
G2-Z3274
H1a1d2-Z14516
H1b2-Z14274
H3b1-Z13710

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

Alan said:
Kalasha have up to 20% H1*. H1 is found in South-Central Asia and Southeast Iran/Balochistan.

Kalasha have also quite high frequency of U2e.

As I said in the past, Kalasha are not a heterogenous bunch who evolved from mixings. If anything they are the remnant of an ancient Indo-Iranian people of the region. U3b and HV are quite signicant among Kurds, Iranians and Mesopotamians makes me wonder if the Thracians did not came somewhere from this region.

Also I believe Thracians were the closest you could get to Indo_Iranian speakers (maybe beside Tocharians).

thanks...excellent

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalash_people

Have you any other info on these people

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

Sample P192-1 was found at the site of a pit sanctuary near Svilengrad, Bulgaria, excavated between 2004 and 2006. The pits are associated with the Thracian culture and date to the Early Iron Age (800–500 BC) based on pottery found in the pits. A total of 67 ritual pits, including 16 pits containing human skeletons or parts of skeletons, were explored during the excavations. An upper wisdom tooth from an adult male was used for DNA analysis.

Sample T2G2 was found in a Thracian tumulus (burial mound) near the village of Stambolovo, Bulgaria. Two small tumuli dating to the Early Iron Age (850–700 BC) were excavated in 2008. A canine tooth from an inhumation burial of a child (c.12 years old) inside a dolium was used for DNA analysis.

Sample V2 was found in a flat cemetery dating to the Late Bronze Age (1500–1100 BC) near the village of Vratitsa, Bulgaria. Nine inhumation burials were excavated between 2003 and 2004. A molar from a juvenile male (age 16–17) was used for DNA analysis.

Sample K8 was found in the Yakimova Mogila Tumulus, which dates to the Iron Age (450–400 BC), near Krushare, Bulgaria. An aristocratic inhumation burial containing rich grave goods was excavated in 2008. A molar from one individual, probably male, was used for DNA analysis.

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

These samples include both human DNA and DNA from environmental contaminants such as bacteria and fungi, which introduces a great deal of noise into the data. The very small number of SNPs for these samples also contributes to the noise in the data. This noise shows up in the results below as Negroid or Mongoloid admixture.
In spite of the noise, a few things can be learned. The two samples from the Thracian tumuli, T2G2 and K8, and the Bronze Age sample V2 had significant amounts of the K12b Gedrosia component. The amounts of the Gedrosia component seen in these samples are much larger than the 1.5–3.3% of the Gedrosia component seen in Bulgarians today. Note that the Gedrosia component is associated with R1b but not with R1a.
All of the samples have significantly more of the dv3 West European component than the dv3 East European component. Note that Thracians were typically described by ancient writers as having blue eyes and red hair, and that red hair is a predominantly Western European trait.

P192-1
globe4

90.47% European
9.53% African
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Asian

globe10

85.37% Atlantic_Baltic
10.34% Palaeo_African
4.29% West_Asian
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Australasian
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Neo_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southern

globe13

45.10% Mediterranean
42.11% North_European
9.71% Palaeo_African
3.08% West_Asian
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Arctic
0.00% Australasian
0.00% East_African
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian
0.00% West_African

K7b

75.63% Atlantic_Baltic
16.32% Southern
4.11% African
3.94% West_Asian
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian

K10a

48.93% Atlantic_Baltic
44.15% Mediterranean
6.91% Palaeoafrican
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Red_Sea
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Sub_Saharan
0.00% West_Asian

K12b

45.82% Caucasus
26.87% Atlantic_Med
21.68% North_European
2.36% Sub_Saharan
2.01% Northwest_African
1.26% Siberian
0.00% East_African
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Gedrosia
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

dv3

42.86% Mediterranean
19.81% West_European
19.50% West_Asian
9.70% East_European
7.77% Northeast_Asian
0.36% Northwest_African
0.00% East_African
0.00% Neo_African
0.00% Palaeo_African
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

MDLP World-22

32.35% Austronesian
27.04% Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic
17.80% North-East-European
15.94% Indo-Iranian
6.88% Samoedic
0.00% Arctic-Amerind
0.00% East-Siberean
0.00% East-South-Asian
0.00% Indian
0.00% Indo-Tibetan
0.00% Melanesian
0.00% Mesoamerican
0.00% Near_East
0.00% North-Amerind
0.00% North-European-Mesolithic
0.00% North-Siberean
0.00% Paleo-Siberian
0.00% Pygmy
0.00% South-African
0.00% South-America_Amerind
0.00% Sub-Saharian
0.00% West-Asian

Old World 26

15.97% Sardinian
14.70% Finnish
10.85% Palestinian
9.94% Dai
7.98% Yakut
7.27% Gujarati
7.14% Naxi
6.57% Yoruba
6.39% Kenya-Bantu
5.06% Mbuti-Pygmy
2.96% Archaic
1.90% Biaka-Pygmy
1.62% Kalash
0.95% She
0.50% Melanesian
0.16% Japanese
0.00% Basque
0.00% Bedouin
0.00% Brahui
0.00% Burusho
0.00% Druze
0.00% Lahu
0.00% Mandenka
0.00% Mozabite
0.00% Papuan
0.00% San

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

T2G2
globe4

76.67% European
23.32% African
0.01% Amerindian
0.00% Asian

globe10

53.38% West_Asian
20.22% Atlantic_Baltic
17.12% Palaeo_African
9.28% Australasian
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Neo_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southern

globe13

51.47% West_Asian
15.94% North_European
11.78% Palaeo_African
8.80% East_African
7.12% Australasian
4.89% Arctic
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Mediterranean
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian
0.00% West_African

K7b

60.48% West_Asian
23.69% African
14.49% South_Asian
1.33% Atlantic_Baltic
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% Southern

K10a

35.95% West_Asian
15.13% Atlantic_Baltic
15.01% Palaeoafrican
14.33% South_Asian
13.64% Mediterranean
3.14% East_Asian
2.81% Sub_Saharan
0.00% Red_Sea
0.00% Siberian
0.00% Southeast_Asian

K12b

54.44% Gedrosia
19.46% Sub_Saharan
13.43% Atlantic_Med
11.30% South_Asian
1.34% Caucasus
0.03% East_Asian
0.00% East_African
0.00% North_European
0.00% Northwest_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

dv3

51.27% West_Asian
33.26% West_European
7.63% Neo_African
6.95% Southeast_Asian
0.89% Palaeo_African
0.01% South_Asian
0.00% East_African
0.00% East_European
0.00% Mediterranean
0.00% Northeast_Asian
0.00% Northwest_African
0.00% Southwest_Asian

MDLP World-22

Insufficient SNPs

Old World 26

18.90% Finnish
14.14% Kenya-Bantu
12.32% Yoruba
10.35% Gujarati
8.43% Yakut
7.03% Palestinian
6.90% Archaic
6.71% Mbuti-Pygmy
6.70% Dai
4.18% Naxi
2.72% Biaka-Pygmy
1.21% Kalash
0.18% Bedouin
0.17% San
0.04% She
0.00% Basque
0.00% Brahui
0.00% Burusho
0.00% Druze
0.00% Japanese
0.00% Lahu
0.00% Mandenka
0.00% Melanesian
0.00% Mozabite
0.00% Papuan
0.00% Sardinian

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

V2
globe4

58.89% European
20.61% Asian
11.91% African
8.59% Amerindian

globe10

43.70% Atlantic_Baltic
24.26% West_Asian
12.27% East_Asian
11.29% Neo_African
8.47% Australasian
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Palaeo_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southern

globe13

39.58% North_European
27.22% West_Asian
12.61% West_African
12.60% East_Asian
7.56% Australasian
0.42% Arctic
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% East_African
0.00% Mediterranean
0.00% Palaeo_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

K7b

44.14% West_Asian
28.34% Atlantic_Baltic
18.46% African
5.72% East_Asian
3.34% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southern

K10a

60.73% Atlantic_Baltic
16.10% Sub_Saharan
10.95% West_Asian
6.53% East_Asian
5.68% Southeast_Asian
0.01% Siberian
0.00% Mediterranean
0.00% Palaeoafrican
0.00% Red_Sea
0.00% South_Asian

K12b

44.15% North_European
20.14% Sub_Saharan
15.06% Gedrosia
9.62% Siberian
7.67% Caucasus
3.35% Southeast_Asian
0.01% East_Asian
0.00% Atlantic_Med
0.00% East_African
0.00% Northwest_African
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

dv3

42.02% West_Asian
37.17% West_European
11.74% Neo_African
5.15% Southeast_Asian
3.93% East_European
0.00% East_African
0.00% Mediterranean
0.00% Northeast_Asian
0.00% Northwest_African
0.00% Palaeo_African
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

MDLP World-22

46.09% North-East-European
22.90% Sub-Saharian
16.90% West-Asian
8.74% Mesoamerican
5.37% South-America_Amerind
0.00% Arctic-Amerind
0.00% Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic
0.00% Austronesian
0.00% East-Siberean
0.00% East-South-Asian
0.00% Indian
0.00% Indo-Iranian
0.00% Indo-Tibetan
0.00% Melanesian
0.00% Near_East
0.00% North-Amerind
0.00% North-European-Mesolithic
0.00% North-Siberean
0.00% Paleo-Siberian
0.00% Pygmy
0.00% Samoedic
0.00% South-African

Old World 26

23.45% Sardinian
19.42% Finnish
17.05% Gujarati
8.80% Yoruba
6.84% Basque
6.75% Yakut
6.35% She
5.73% Kenya-Bantu
3.36% Archaic
1.13% San
0.75% Melanesian
0.37% Bedouin
0.00% Biaka-Pygmy
0.00% Brahui
0.00% Burusho
0.00% Dai
0.00% Druze
0.00% Japanese
0.00% Kalash
0.00% Lahu
0.00% Mandenka
0.00% Mbuti-Pygmy
0.00% Mozabite
0.00% Naxi
0.00% Palestinian
0.00% Papuan

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

K8
globe4

97.86% European
1.65% Amerindian
0.49% African
0.00% Asian

globe10

46.81% West_Asian
36.90% Atlantic_Baltic
13.62% Southern
2.68% Palaeo_African
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Australasian
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Neo_African
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian

globe13

39.15% West_Asian
36.95% Mediterranean
20.05% North_European
2.99% Palaeo_African
0.85% Southwest_Asian
0.00% Amerindian
0.00% Arctic
0.00% Australasian
0.00% East_African
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% West_African

K7b

46.44% Atlantic_Baltic
36.25% West_Asian
17.30% Southern
0.00% African
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian

K10a

47.35% Atlantic_Baltic
32.21% West_Asian
18.41% Mediterranean
2.02% Palaeoafrican
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Red_Sea
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Sub_Saharan

K12b

32.79% Atlantic_Med
29.27% Gedrosia
17.54% North_European
17.50% Caucasus
2.90% Northwest_African
0.00% East_African
0.00% East_Asian
0.00% Siberian
0.00% South_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian
0.00% Sub_Saharan

dv3

39.88% West_European
24.25% East_European
14.34% West_Asian
12.79% Mediterranean
5.86% South_Asian
2.87% Palaeo_African
0.01% Northwest_African
0.00% East_African
0.00% Neo_African
0.00% Northeast_Asian
0.00% Southeast_Asian
0.00% Southwest_Asian

MDLP World-22

75.04% Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic
9.27% Melanesian
9.00% West-Asian
6.68% South-African
0.02% North-East-European
0.00% Arctic-Amerind
0.00% Austronesian
0.00% East-Siberean
0.00% East-South-Asian
0.00% Indian
0.00% Indo-Iranian
0.00% Indo-Tibetan
0.00% Mesoamerican
0.00% Near_East
0.00% North-Amerind
0.00% North-European-Mesolithic
0.00% North-Siberean
0.00% Paleo-Siberian
0.00% Pygmy
0.00% Samoedic
0.00% South-America_Amerind
0.00% Sub-Saharian

Old World 26

35.08% Finnish
20.05% Yakut
17.38% Basque
10.37% Bedouin
6.09% Gujarati
4.40% Yoruba
3.70% Archaic
2.44% Mbuti-Pygmy
0.47% Naxi
0.01% Kalash
0.00% Biaka-Pygmy
0.00% Brahui
0.00% Burusho
0.00% Dai
0.00% Druze
0.00% Japanese
0.00% Kenya-Bantu
0.00% Lahu
0.00% Mandenka
0.00% Melanesian
0.00% Mozabite
0.00% Palestinian
0.00% Papuan
0.00% San
0.00% Sardinian
0.00% She

joeyc · Aug 6, 2014

Wow with all that west asian they must be some of those milions of slaves who arrived during the Roman Era. Just like the copper age Iberian farmer.

Yetos · Aug 6, 2014

@ SIle
not the Thracians with Blue eyes, but with Green eyes, blue eyes was considered Persian by ancients, and later the Cumans and GekTurks

Yetos · Aug 6, 2014

@ Alan ,

The case of Romani is very strange, cuase we find many kinds, like The Hungarian who have no connection with the ones in Greece, etc etc,
the theories of Egyptian origin or India origin etc etc, are going pass and return,
U3b in Europe is very common and indicator of central Europe's Romani, while H1 is mostly in south balkans like Albania Bulgaria Greece,

the existance of U3b the age 2,8 -2,5 ky burried in a way of culture gives more than we could expect,
for example one male with that mtDNA can not help, but if his mother born him and was alive in the area?

we find either an isolated case, either a migration trail at a time we could not imagine, think if that was older by 1 or 2 millenium, what could we say then?

think if that a Polish Romani? how old is U3 in Poland? did it came from |North to thrace?
or the oposite? could Polish Romani passed from Thrace? and not from steppes?

Alan · Aug 6, 2014

Sile said:
These samples include both human DNA and DNA from environmental contaminants such as bacteria and fungi, which introduces a great deal of noise into the data. The very small number of SNPs for these samples also contributes to the noise in the data. This noise shows up in the results below as Negroid or Mongoloid admixture.
In spite of the noise, a few things can be learned. The two samples from the Thracian tumuli, T2G2 and K8, and the Bronze Age sample V2 had significant amounts of the K12b Gedrosia component. The amounts of the Gedrosia component seen in these samples are much larger than the 1.5–3.3% of the Gedrosia component seen in Bulgarians today. Note that the Gedrosia component is associated with R1b but not with R1a.
All of the samples have significantly more of the dv3 West European component than the dv3 East European component. Note that Thracians were typically described by ancient writers as having blue eyes and red hair, and that red hair is a predominantly Western European trait.

Bam in the face of all those people who claimed Caucasus_Gedrosia genes are "assimilated" natives into the genetic pool of Indo Europeans! farmers lack this but suddenly when Indo_Europeans appear (Thracians) it's huge!

Sile The problem which I mentioned long time ago, is that people associate the "West European" component with West Indo Europeans while the "East European" with the eastern Indo Europeans.
But as I said "West European" like component was likely more prevelant in ancient Indo Europeans than the "Eastern European one, beside both beeing actually very similar and having probably evolved/split allot after the Indo Europeans.

If we take a look at Indo_Aryans in India EVEN they have more of this "West European" like component than "East European". EVEN the Ukrainians have more of it!

The North European genes spred by proto Indo Europeans must have been at first more West European like. So R1a was also spred together with "West European" like genes, of course in combination to Caucasus_Gedrosia.

This makes also sense if you take into account that proto ANE was ancestral to Caucasus_Gedrosia and North European. Inside this North European component the West European is slightly closer to Caucasus_Gedrosia than East European is.

Proto_North European must have been more West European like and throughout the centuries it split into an East European and West European branch.

Kurds have slightly more West European than East European. Ukrainians have slightly more West than East European, Iranians, Balkanians and Indians the same.

Thracians were described BY ALL ancient records as red haired and blue eyed. And now allot of them have allot more Caucasus_Gedrosia than modern Balkanians. Heck the frequency even reaches numbers typical of modern West Asians!

This should be a prove that light hair and light eyes are not connected to "North European" component exclusively. Those kind of traits must have been a genetic mutation which occured earlier.

Alan · Aug 6, 2014

joeyc said:
Wow with all that west asian they must be some of those milions of slaves who arrived during the Roman Era. Just like the copper age Iberian farmer.

I assume this was meant to be sarcastic. Roman era slaves during copper age

Yetos · Aug 6, 2014

@ Alan
Thracians had Green eyes, even today original Pomaks and not lowland Pomaks have significant green eyes
Blue eyes were the Persians and later cumans and GekTurks

Sile · Aug 6, 2014

Yetos said:
@ SIle
not the Thracians with Blue eyes, but with Green eyes, blue eyes was considered Persian by ancients, and later the Cumans and GekTurks

Gedrosia is in eastern Persia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gedrosia

Alan · Aug 6, 2014

Sile said:
Gedrosia is in eastern Persia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gedrosia

Gedrosia is modern Balochistan. Gedrosia is in the east of Persia and not eastern Persia. Persia is south of Media/Parthia and west of Gedrosia.

mihaitzateo · Aug 6, 2014

All thos K and MDLP do not make much sense,a test is contradicting with another test.

Alan · Aug 6, 2014

mihaitzateo said:
All thos K and MDLP do not make much sense,a test is contradicting with another test.

Not really. If we take into account that Caucasus_gedrosia and North European have same origin. And that some of the Caucasus_Gedrosia genes get eaten up by North European and vica versa depending on the K runs is a sign for that there are Genes which are on the edge of these both, or more precise ancestral to both. So genes which end up as Caucasus_Gedrosia in one run and as North European in another must be those genes who are very close to the root.

However this is only the case in P192-1

The other samples do not show "contradicting" results in different K's.

Sile · Aug 7, 2014

Alan said:
Not really. If we take into account that Caucasus_gedrosia and North European have same origin. And that some of the Caucasus_Gedrosia genes get eaten up by North European and vica versa depending on the K runs is a sign for that there are Genes which are on the edge of these both, or more precise ancestral to both. So genes which end up as Caucasus_Gedrosia in one run and as North European in another must be those genes who are very close to the root.

However this is only the case in P192-1

The other samples do not show "contradicting" results in different K's.

But all show an inclination of more west European than east European

like my Dv3 below .................even though I have a west-asian marker I am far more western european than eastern european

#	Population	Percent
1	West_European	35.48
2	Mediterranean	33.62
3	West_Asian	14.07
4	East_European	9.91
5	Southwest_Asian	5.29
6	Northwest_African	1.43
7	Neo_African	0.09
8	Palaeo_African	0.09
9	South_Asian	0.03

and K7b below

#	Population	Percent
1	Atlantic_Baltic	55.72
2	Southern	26.21
3	West_Asian	17.43
4	South_Asian	0.44
5	African	0.2

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	N_Italian (Dodecad)	2.49
2	North_Italian (HGDP)	4.94
3	Bulgarians (Yunusbayev)	5.35
4	Romanians (Behar)	5.57
5	Bulgarian (Dodecad)	6.2
6	O_Italian (Dodecad)	6.87

Clearly, the indo-iranic people means indian-iranian ..........and they are west-asian and south-asian haplogroups

joeyc · Aug 7, 2014

West European has more EEF/South West Asian alleles in it.

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