Germanic-Slavic Friendship

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This excerpt can be found in "Chronica Poloniae Maioris" ("Greater Poland Chronicle"), written ca. year 1280:

"Germo est quoddam instrumentum in quo duo boves simul iuncti trahendo aratrum seu plaustrum incedunt, sic et Theutunici cum Slavis regna contigua habentes simul conversacione incedunt, nec aliqua gens in mundo est sibi tam communis et familiaris veltui Slavi et Theutonici."

In English:

"Germo is a type of vehicle in which two oxen are yoked together to draw a plough or pull a cart, and so the Germans and the Slavs having common borders pull together, there is no people in the world so familiar and friendly to one another as the Slavs and the German(ic)s."
 
I guess the Germans changed their minds later, since by WWII Slavs were subhumans who were to be exterminated like the Jews, and their nice flat farmlands were to be given to the more industrious German "volk".

As early as 1925, Hitler suggested in Mein Kampf that the German people needed Lebensraum ("living space") to achieve German expansion eastwards (Drang nach Osten) at the expense of the inferior Slavs.

"As for the ridiculous hundred million Slavs, we will mould the best of them as we see fit, and we will isolate the rest of them in their own pig-styes; and anyone who talks about cherishing the local inhabitants and civilising them, goes straight off into a concentration camp!"
H. R. Trevor-Roper; Gerhard L. Weinberg (18 October 2013). Hitler's Table Talk 1941-1944: Secret Conversations. Enigma Books. p. 466



"
Nazi ideology viewed the Slavic peoples as non-Aryan Untermenschen("sub-humans"), who were targeted for enslavement, expulsion and extermination."
Gumkowski, Janusz; Leszczynski, Kazimierz; Robert, Edward (translator) (1961).Poland Under Nazi Occupation (First ed.). Polonia Pub. House. p. 219.

"Hitler viewed the Slavs as "a mass of born slaves who feel the need of a master"
David Welch (17 June 2013). Hitler: Profile of a Dictator. Routledge. p. 74

"
the plan for Poland was drawn up at the end of November 1939. The plan envisaged removal of the majority of the population of conquered counties, with very small and varied percentages of the various conquered nations undergoing Germanisation, expulsion into the depths of Russia, and other fates, the net effect of which would be to ensure that the conquered territories would be Germanized."
 
Totally true in 1280, but now Latins

Even Slavic's are dividing

Because of Serb-Croat conflict and Poland/Ukraine-Russia
 
Totally true in 1280, but now Latins

Even Slavic's are dividing

Because of Serb-Croat conflict and Poland/Ukraine-Russia

Slavics were divided ever since churches divided among themselves between Orthodox and Catholic,without mentioning Bogomilism,if they ever were together or had consciousness of Pan Slavism back then which i doubt,even in modern times failed many times despite changing ideology or the religious role.
 
I guess the Germans changed their minds later, since by WWII Slavs were subhumans who were to be exterminated like the Jews, and their nice flat farmlands were to be given to the more industrious German "volk"...
you can find such kind of rascist anti-slavonic hate much earlier by Marx&Engles, the founder of the 'scientific' socialism. Sources: MEW 9, 248, MEW 8, S. 541-547.
 
Totally true in 1280, but now Latins

Even Slavic's are dividing

Because of Serb-Croat conflict and Poland/Ukraine-Russia

Serbs and Croats have no good relations, unfortunately, and there are reasons why this is so.

Although, I'm convinced that relations can be better, especially with assistance of friendly European countries.

However Serbs have excellent relations with Poles and Slovaks, also with Czechs.

Slovak poet S. Tomasik wrote lyrics for anthem which was accepted, among others, by Yugoslavs (composer is unknown). It is beautiful song: Hey Slavs. Slovaks and Serbs have many family ties. Serbs greatly appreciate Slovakia for holding to international principles and respect for territorial integrity of Serbia.

Polish - Serbian friendly relations dating back to Middle ages (even with family ties between rulers) and continued after in alliance against Ottomans and their Muslim Balkan allies. Polish knights and soldiers participated in defense of Serbia. Good relations continued far, till World War Two, where Poles and Serbs were among biggest victims of the Second World War. Yes, recognition Serbian province Kosovo by a Polish government overslaughed excellent relations but everything is subject to change. In all other issues relations are on the rise, Poland is important partner of Serbia on its EU path.

Czechs and Serbs are related with many ties, historical and present days, and interests. Again as with Poles, there is one fleck which is not eternal but everything other is positive and Czech Republic and Serbia especially have good business ties.

As you can see, the picture is different if it is spreading to more relations compared to what you wrote.
 
As the situation is now, with Great Britain leaving EU, Germany and Poland seems to be the main economical motors of the European Union.
 
As the situation is now, with Great Britain leaving EU, Germany and Poland seems to be the main economical motors of the European Union.
Poland is still far away from giving the money to support others. It needs substantial economic reforms to unleash capital market and entrepreneurial spirit, and give it 10 years.
Revenue by EU countries: http://ec.europa.eu/budget/figures/interactive/index_en.cfm
Transfer payments by country: http://ec.europa.eu/budget/figures/interactive/index_en.cfm
 
Poland is still far away from giving the money to support others. It needs substantial economic reforms to unleash capital market and entrepreneurial spirit, and give it 10 years.
Revenue by EU countries: http://ec.europa.eu/budget/figures/interactive/index_en.cfm
Transfer payments by country: http://ec.europa.eu/budget/figures/interactive/index_en.cfm

I wondered why Serbia has no Polish investments. I do not know what the situation is with the surrounding countries. Perhaps this is the explanation.
 
DNA Land Ancestry Report for RISE98 (Battle Axe man from Lilla Beddinge in southern Sweden):

RISE_98.png


Autosomally 50% "Northwest Euro" and 43% "North Slavic" plus Y-DNA haplogroup R1b-U106:

https://s18.postimg.io/6tvoh3wux/RISE98.png

RISE98.png
 
In the Middle Ages there were many cases when German settlements were established right next to Slavic ones and later they merged, creating one settlement. A good example is Großbrembach in Thuringia. The merging of Slavic and German parts of the town was commemorated with this "Siamese Twins" relief on local town hall (one of the "Siamese Twins" represents Slavic inhabitants, the other one represents German inhabitants). The merging of the two neighbouring villages took place in the 16th century:

333 Freizeittipps für Thüringen (109): Siamesische Zwillinge in Großbrembach | Thüringer Allgemeine

Das am Ratskeller angebrachte Wahrzeichen von Großbrembach (Landkreis Sömmerda) symbolisiert den Zusammenschluss zweier ethnischer Gemeinschaften. Im 16. Jahrhundert vereinigten sich das germanische Bornbrembach und das slawische Windischenbrembach zu einem Dorf.

D0R0003259145.JPG
 
Yes, well, things certainly changed didn't they? Three hundred years later you were untermenschen who could be exterminated.

That's the problem with these kinds of noxious ideologies; they can so take over someone's mind that they can think and do the most appalling things...

See "General Plan Ost", which proposed that millions of German and other "Germanic" settlers would be moved into the conquered territories, and the original Slavic inhabitants were to be annihilated, removed, or enslaved.

Bendersky, Joseph W. (2007). A concise history of Nazi Germanyp. 161-2. Rowman & Littlefield Publishers Inc., Plymouth, United Kingdom


"The Untermensch concept included Jews, Roma and Sinti (Gypsies), and Slavic peoples such as Poles, Serbs, and Russians.[7] The Slavs were regarded as "Untermenschen", barely fit for exploitation as slaves.[23][24] Hitler and Goebbels compared them to the "rabbit family" or to "stolid animals" that were "idle" and "disorganized" and spread like a "wave of filth".[25]

Biology classes in Nazi Germany schools taught about differences between the race of Nordic German "Übermenschen" and "ignoble" Jewish and Slavic "subhumans".[26] The view that Slavs were subhuman was widespread among the German masses, and chiefly applied to the Poles. It continued to find support after the war.[27]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Untermensch

This is how Polish soldiers were treated:

"At Ciepielów, after a pitched battle, three hundred Polish prisoners were taken. Despite all the evidence, the German commander declared that these captured soldiers were partisans, irregular fighters unprotected by the laws of war. The Polish officers and soldiers, wearing full uniform, were astonished. The Germans made them disrobe. Now they looked more like partisans. All of them were gunned down and thrown in a ditch. In the short Polish campaign, there were at least sixty-three such actions. No fewer than three thousand Polish prisoners of war were murdered...As one general maintained, “Germans are the masters, and Poles are the slaves.” The army leadership knew that Hitler’s goals for the campaign were anything but conventional. As the chief of staff summarized, it was “the intention of the Leader to destroy and exterminate the Polish people.” Soldiers had been prepared to see the Polish civilian population as devious and subhuman. One of them was so convinced of Polish hostility that he interpreted a Pole’s death grimace as the expression of irrational hatred of Germans."
http://www.theatlantic.com/internat...-the-masters-and-poles-are-the-slaves/283017/

Or this...
In Cracow, Polish intellectual accomplishment clashed with the Nazi image of the country and so the Nazis sought turned to destruction. "The entire professoriate of the renowned university was sent to concentration camps," writes Snyder. "The statue of Adam Mickiewicz, the great romantic poet, was pulled down from its pedestal on the Market Square."

How on earth could a Polish person support a Nazi ideology? It seems to me the grossest sort of disloyalty to one's own people.

 
Yes, well, things certainly changed didn't they? Three hundred years later you were untermenschen who could be exterminated.

That's the problem with these kinds of noxious ideologies; they can so take over someone's mind that they can think and do the most appalling things...

See "General Plan Ost", which proposed that millions of German and other "Germanic" settlers would be moved into the conquered territories, and the original Slavic inhabitants were to be annihilated, removed, or enslaved.

Bendersky, Joseph W. (2007). A concise history of Nazi Germanyp. 161-2. Rowman & Littlefield Publishers Inc., Plymouth, United Kingdom


"The Untermensch concept included Jews, Roma and Sinti (Gypsies), and Slavic peoples such as Poles, Serbs, and Russians.[7] The Slavs were regarded as "Untermenschen", barely fit for exploitation as slaves.[23][24] Hitler and Goebbels compared them to the "rabbit family" or to "stolid animals" that were "idle" and "disorganized" and spread like a "wave of filth".[25]

Biology classes in Nazi Germany schools taught about differences between the race of Nordic German "Übermenschen" and "ignoble" Jewish and Slavic "subhumans".[26] The view that Slavs were subhuman was widespread among the German masses, and chiefly applied to the Poles. It continued to find support after the war.[27]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Untermensch

This is how Polish soldiers were treated:

"At Ciepielów, after a pitched battle, three hundred Polish prisoners were taken. Despite all the evidence, the German commander declared that these captured soldiers were partisans, irregular fighters unprotected by the laws of war. The Polish officers and soldiers, wearing full uniform, were astonished. The Germans made them disrobe. Now they looked more like partisans. All of them were gunned down and thrown in a ditch. In the short Polish campaign, there were at least sixty-three such actions. No fewer than three thousand Polish prisoners of war were murdered...As one general maintained, “Germans are the masters, and Poles are the slaves.” The army leadership knew that Hitler’s goals for the campaign were anything but conventional. As the chief of staff summarized, it was “the intention of the Leader to destroy and exterminate the Polish people.” Soldiers had been prepared to see the Polish civilian population as devious and subhuman. One of them was so convinced of Polish hostility that he interpreted a Pole’s death grimace as the expression of irrational hatred of Germans."
http://www.theatlantic.com/internat...-the-masters-and-poles-are-the-slaves/283017/

Or this...
In Cracow, Polish intellectual accomplishment clashed with the Nazi image of the country and so the Nazis sought turned to destruction. "The entire professoriate of the renowned university was sent to concentration camps," writes Snyder. "The statue of Adam Mickiewicz, the great romantic poet, was pulled down from its pedestal on the Market Square."

Indeed.
Good that in the times of the Nazi's they didn't had genetic researches and all this we have today,who knows how they would have spin their ideology.I can see right now many people practice it on the internet labeling haplogroups as White-European,African,Semitic etc.
 
In the Middle Ages there were many cases when German settlements were established right next to Slavic ones and later they merged, creating one settlement. A good example is Großbrembach in Thuringia. The merging of Slavic and German parts of the town was commemorated with this "Siamese Twins" relief on local town hall (one of the "Siamese Twins" represents Slavic inhabitants, the other one represents German inhabitants). The merging of the two neighbouring villages took place in the 16th century:

333 Freizeittipps für Thüringen (109): Siamesische Zwillinge in Großbrembach | Thüringer Allgemeine



D0R0003259145.JPG
True.
There was friendship among Polish and Germanic nobility hunting down the Polabian "pagan" Slavs (sad this people ended very bad).Often a church religious union,when religion was more than being Germanic or Slavic.
 
[/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR][/I]How on earth could a Polish person support a Nazi ideology? It seems to me the grossest sort of disloyalty to one's own people.

I perhaps missed this info from your quote but which Polish person that supports nazi ideology you are reffering to?

If this in any way is related to this topic, then German-Slavic friendship idea is absolutely anti-Nazi in all ways possible, just as you kindly demonstrated above.
 
Indeed.
Good that in the times of the Nazi's they didn't had genetic researches and all this we have today,who knows how they would have spin their ideology.I can see right now many people practice it on the internet labeling haplogroups as White-European,African,Semitic etc.

I think about that too. Thank goodness the Nazis didn't have modern genetic testing at their disposal.

Of course, a lot of these white nationalist, skin head groups, if they ever came to power, would have those tools. It's just like ISIS, in a way. A lot of these alienated, disturbed young men can be brain washed into believing this idiocy. They're the expendable cogs in the machine. That's why these groups are and have to be monitored very carefully, so that the minute they turn from idiotic ideology to action they can be taken out. There's no danger of that here, but I worry, ironically, about eastern Europe. It sometimes sounds as if from victims some of them moving into becoming perpetrators. That would be a tragedy.
 
I perhaps missed this info from your quote but which Polish person that supports nazi ideology you are reffering to?

If this in any way is related to this topic, then German-Slavic friendship idea is absolutely anti-Nazi in all ways possible, just as you kindly demonstrated above.

I don't quite understand, Arvistro.

Do you not think there are white supremacist, white nationalist, Nazi like groups proliferating all over eastern Europe? I think it's very alarming.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/american/adl/skinhead-international/skins-poland.html

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/behind-russias-ultra-nationalist-crackdown-135205956.html

It's also ironic, as I said. It's almost as if the attitude is that the ideology was right on, but it's just that the Germans made a mistake in not including the Slavs with the ubermenschen.

That would be the exactly wrong message to take away from that horror.

As for its presence in the population genetics world, I don't think it's a surprise to you that there are a lot of Slavic members on sites like Stormfront, is it? Of course, there are Spanish and Greek, and I think there used to be Italian members too. Maybe there still are. I don't know because I try to stay as far away from that stuff as possible.

I only discovered this by following a link on dienekes' website years ago. I had no idea before that. One member there, of Polish descent, even mentioned how his grandfather, I think, was a member of an all Polish regiment or something that was raised by the Nazis. It was a shock to me, I can tell you.

As for our own Board, I really hope we don't have anyone on here who holds to those kinds of ideas, but I'm very concerned because a long time poster, despite several warnings not to do so, has for the last couple of months been posting video after video, news stories, magazine articles, all from monitored, notorious white supremacist sites. How many times can you make a mistake like that? How many times can I tell other members who complain that it's just a mistake? More importantly, those kinds of sites are monitored by the FBI. Do we want them following that trail here.

Maybe you're not aware that one of these people came on this Board to threaten me for "making waves", and that LeBroc was repeatedly threatened for being a "traitor" to his ethnic group?

There are evil, out of control people involved with this "hobby", and I want them as far away from me and this Board as possible.
 
The Untermensch concept included Jews

Actually Hitler and his National Socialists hated Jews because they considered them as superior to Germans:

Source: http://www.toqonline.com/archives/v4n4/TOQv4n4Jones.pdf

Nazi Anti-Semitism was in reality fuelled by resentment and envy over Jewish success, power and influences:

(Hitler considered Jewish influence in Germany to be high, and he thought that the USSR was ruled by Jews):

Jewish_Ubermenschen.png


Socialists of all kinds generally tend to hate all groups which excell in one way or another. This hasn't changed.

Both the International Socialists (= Communists) and the National Socialists (= Nazis) hate successful groups.

Of course apart from their own groups (e.g. international workers & peasants; or German workers & peasants).
 
I don't quite understand, Arvistro.

Do you not think there are white supremacist, white nationalist, Nazi like groups proliferating all over eastern Europe? I think it's very alarming.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/american/adl/skinhead-international/skins-poland.html

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/behind-russias-ultra-nationalist-crackdown-135205956.html

It's also ironic, as I said. It's almost as if the attitude is that the ideology was right on, but it's just that the Germans made a mistake in not including the Slavs with the ubermenschen.

That would be the exactly wrong message to take away from that horror.

As for its presence in the population genetics world, I don't think it's a surprise to you that there are a lot of Slavic members on sites like Stormfront, is it? Of course, there are Spanish and Greek, and I think there used to be Italian members too. Maybe there still are. I don't know because I try to stay as far away from that stuff as possible.

I only discovered this by following a link on dienekes' website years ago. I had no idea before that. One member there, of Polish descent, even mentioned how his grandfather, I think, was a member of an all Polish regiment or something that was raised by the Nazis. It was a shock to me, I can tell you.

As for our own Board, I really hope we don't have anyone on here who holds to those kinds of ideas, but I'm very concerned because a long time poster, despite several warnings not to do so, has for the last couple of months been posting video after video, news stories, magazine articles, all from monitored, notorious white supremacist sites. How many times can you make a mistake like that? How many times can I tell other members who complain that it's just a mistake? More importantly, those kinds of sites are monitored by the FBI. Do we want them following that trail here.

Maybe you're not aware that one of these people came on this Board to threaten me for "making waves", and that LeBroc was repeatedly threatened for being a "traitor" to his ethnic group?

There are evil, out of control people involved with this "hobby", and I want them as far away from me and this Board as possible.
Ok, to that I agree.
I misinterpreted that posting of Slavic-Germanic friendship examples was seen as sympathizing of nazi. Although perhaps it would make some sense that when doing German-Slavic friendship topic the initial post would feature "the relationship of both groups was complicated and XX century featured the nazi..., but here I want to show examples that both ethnic groups could live together in harmony..".

Anyway this is true that in East Europe there is a room for extremism, political or not. But not just East Europe, anywhere where there is a social stress.
I observed it myself in very young age, when I had issues with jobs and salaries and had to live eating potatoes only (a little exaggeration). I was at state of aggression against the world and I can easily see how in such a state of insecurity, when someone is pointing to the guilty ones and does it with authority... How people can follow that pointer like a sheep.
 
Nazi was an ideaology with twisted facts to fullfil political agenda. The agenda was to conquer and control the land and people, as it always has been.


Hitler himself was a 1/4 Jew. On some occasions he stated Czech were Mongoloid, while Kyrgyz were of the Aryan stock. He considered Croats and Russian Cossacks as descendants to Goths. Nazi wanted to be to be on their side.
Croats supported their historic allies Austrians and Hungarians. Cossacks had sour relations with Soviet authorities since Russian civil war

As per general Ost plan Percentages of ethnic groups to be destroyed and/or deported by Nazi Germany from future settlement areas

Latvians 50%
Estonians 50%
Czechs 50%
Russians 50–60% to be physically eliminated and another 15% to be sent to Western Siberia
Ukrainians 65%
Belarusians 75%
Poles 80–85%
Lithuanians 85%
Latgalians 100%.



Jews and gypsies to be eliminated. Basically, the entire eastern Europe meant to cleansed of locals.
 

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