Y-DNA Haplogroups of a Saudi Arabian Sample

Khalid_1

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In my previous thread titled (Misconception about Saudi and Yamani DNA) I wrote about why the study by (Abu-Amero et al) is not accurate. Today I brought this sample of 469 of mostly Saudies (95%+, the rest are dual nationalities with GCC). These results are from a project organized by a Saudi internet forum. I don't have time to put all details about the different subclades and geographical distribution, so sorry about that.

Y-DNA Haplogroups

- J: 70.14%
- E: 11.94%
- E1b1b: 8.52%
- E1b1a: 2.34%
- 1.06 Undetermined
- T: 5.75%
- R1: 5.54%
- G: 1.49%
- A: 2
- B: 1.06
- C+Q+O+L+H: 2.08%

 
In my previous thread titled (Misconception about Saudi and Yamani DNA) I wrote about why the study by (Abu-Amero et al) is not accurate. Today I brought this sample of 469 of mostly Saudies (95%+, the rest are dual nationalities with GCC). These results are from a project organized by a Saudi internet forum. I don't have time to put all details about the different subclades and geographical distribution, so sorry about that.

Y-DNA Haplogroups

- J: 70.14%
- E: 11.94%
- E1b1b: 8.52%
- E1b1a: 2.34%
- 1.06 Undetermined
- T: 5.75%
- R1: 5.54%
- G: 1.49%
- A: 2
- B: 1.06
- C+Q+O+L+H: 2.08%


Good Job Khalid! Here's the Saudi Ftdna project, it gives a break down per region, it will help your research.
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/saudiarabia/default.aspx?section=yresults
 
Good Job Khalid! Here's the Saudi Ftdna project, it gives a break down per region, it will help your research.

Thank you Azzurro. actually thats the sample that I based this statistics from, thanks for posting it.

Anyway the sample needs further investigation to determine the sub clades and mutations. But it is important because knowing the Saudi DNA frequencies is key in understanding surrounding populations and migrations, because Islamic invasions began from mostly Saudi Arabia.

This sample proves what I have been saying for a long time, which is that most people commit a big mistake when trying to determine Arabian DNA influence on a specific population, because they only look at J1 frequency, while J1 only constitutes 40%-65% in most samples. While the rest is mostly J2, E1b1b, and T.

The mistake that people make is assuming that Yaman is the purest place for Arabian DNA, this is historically wrong because Yemen and the rest of the Arabian peninsula were all equally Arabs. And more importantly, Islamic invasions and rule was mostly done by Arabs from modern day Saudi Arabia and south of levant and Mesopotamia, so the Yamani DNA is less relevant in trying to determine the trace of Arabic DNA in the places they conquered.

Another important factor to put in mind in determining the Arabian DNA is that the "Arabian" ethnicity did not necessarily begin and continuo with only one group of people, there was likely a lot of migrations from the north (levant and Mesopotamia) to the Arabian peninsula, these migrations were assimilated with the people of the Arabian peninsula and adopted their language and culture. So even if the porto-Arabians of the Arabian peninsula were mostly J1 people, that probably changed hundreds, and likely thousands of years before Islam. This was actually the view that Arabs before Islam were holding.
 
I posted a new post here, I don't know where did it go :(. I think the moderator has to approve the post. Approve it moderator :)
 
Good Job Khalid! Here's the Saudi Ftdna project, it gives a break down per region, it will help your research.

Thats the sample that I used, thanks for posting it. How did you have access to is anyway?
 
Thank you Azzurro. actually thats the sample that I based this statistics from, thanks for posting it.

Anyway the sample needs further investigation to determine the sub clades and mutations. But it is important because knowing the Saudi DNA frequencies is key in understanding surrounding populations and migrations, because Islamic invasions began from mostly Saudi Arabia.

This sample proves what I have been saying for a long time, which is that most people commit a big mistake when trying to determine Arabian DNA influence on a specific population, because they only look at J1 frequency, while J1 only constitutes 40%-65% in most samples. While the rest is mostly J2, E1b1b, and T.

The mistake that people make is assuming that Yaman is the purest place for Arabian DNA, this is historically wrong because Yemen and the rest of the Arabian peninsula were all equally Arabs. And more importantly, Islamic invasions and rule was mostly done by Arabs from modern day Saudi Arabia and south of levant and Mesopotamia, so the Yamani DNA is less relevant in trying to determine the trace of Arabic DNA in the places they conquered.

Another important factor to put in mind in determining the Arabian DNA is that the "Arabian" ethnicity did not necessarily begin and continuo with only one group of people, there was likely a lot of migrations from the north (levant and Mesopotamia) to the Arabian peninsula, these migrations were assimilated with the people of the Arabian peninsula and adopted their language and culture. So even if the porto-Arabians of the Arabian peninsula were mostly J1 people, that probably changed hundreds, and likely thousands of years before Islam. This was actually the view that Arabs before Islam were holding.

My pleasure Khalid :) , if you test with ftdna you can view different projects and it might be public, meaning you can research it on the net, I looked through the ftdna website. The best way to confirm your theories are with ancient dna, keep in mind to the great Caravan trades of the Arabian desert, this probably sparked migration into the area (historically speaking), then there was the great cultures like the Ghassanids. I think your doing a good job! I wish you the best on your research.
 
What is the name of the Saudi internet forum? Could you please tell me?

Can you read Arabic? its http://dnaarab.com


The best way to confirm your theories are with ancient dna

Ancient DNA does not survive in Saudi Arabian weather, living people can barley survive :embarassed:! even if mummified, let alone un mummified. I know some people that tried to test very old (don't know how old) samples but it wasn't traceable. In Egypt, where the climate along side the nile is less hot than Saudi Arabia, not a single mummy sample was traceable. The only sample that was allegedly traceable is Tutankhamen, but even that is widely rejected.

keep in mind to the great Caravan trades of the Arabian desert, this probably sparked migration into the area (historically speaking)

Up until the early 1900s, Sudan used to send financial aid to western Arabia. Arabis, especially Saudi Arabia, wasn't an attractive place for migration, and there isn't any documented large migrations in recent history. So its safe to say that the DNA did not change much

It is not very difficult to predict the ancient genetic structure of Modern Saudi Arabia because of its un attractiveness, and having only two ways to access it, South is Yaman, after that is sea. North is Mesopotamia and Levant. The north is strong enough for long enough to prevent major invasions and major movement of people for most of ancient history, so any gene flow was probably individual and limited to Arabia.

In Yaman J1 is 70%, with J2 and E1b1b it becomes 95%. And in the North J1, J2, and E1b1b is usually over 70%. So do the math
 
It is not that bad. Dry air helps preserve DNA, though heat is enemy. We have quite few samples from Israel and Syria dating 10 kya and more. We should have some from Arabian peninsula soon.
 
Maybe but its very unlikely. You can't compare the climate of the Mediterranean with Arabian desert.

These are the caves (Palestine and Iran) in which human remains was found

Raqefet_view.JPG



6001536.jpg
 
Interesting. Around when will we have some samples from the Arabian Peninsula? Do you know how old these samples will be (as old as good)?
When rich sheikh support archeologi. ;)
I just know it is possible to find ancient DNA there.
 
Good day All:

I'm a Saudi from Arabian Peninsula! and my hamble knowledge tells me it could very old as 10,000 ybp!!

It needs only the government more attention and support.

Thanks

 
Welcome to Eupedia Tarrooq. Nice to see so many educated Saudis here looking for more knowledge.
 
Welcome to Eupedia Tarrooq. Nice to see so many educated Saudis here looking for more knowledge.

I see the message between the lines, but no, most Saudis are not uneducated or ignorant. We are not symbols of development either, we are still a third world country, but not to the degree some put it. This is not a political forum so I don't want to elaborate here but I'm just give one example: most strange laws that some people in the west talk about is unknown to 90% of people here. A form of self fulfilling prophecy is when some find such laws and regulations in a country which are unknown even to its citizens, then find rare examples of them or interview activists protesting against them to picture it as something bigger than it is.

That can go either way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZJEoO7r_Ik


Anyway in regard to the subject to this thread, if any sample will be found, it mostly be from the southwest of KSA, its cooler in climate through the year due to its hight elevation and more lush





جنوب السعودية
 
I am looking for more regional data, from the Al-Jawf Region specifically.
 

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