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Thread: Genetics of the Greek Peleponessus

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    Better yet, why don't you explain why this history supports this genetic study. Is that your intention?
    This study did not include the Albanians who later according to the historical documents became the bulk of the population in Peloponnese. Some Slavonians were replaced with Greeks and Anatolians. Black Death killed 40% to 70% of Byzantium which is why Arvanites were called to recolonise Morea.
    A better question would be why they did NOT test Southern Slavs, Vlachs and Albanians.
    Amicus Plato, sed magis amica veritas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ihype02 View Post
    This study did not include the Albanians who later according to the historical documents became the bulk of the population in Peloponnese. Some Slavonians were replaced with Greeks and Anatolians. Black Death killed 40% to 70% of Byzantium which is why Arvanites were called to recolonise Morea.
    A better question would be why they did NOT test Southern Slavs, Vlachs and Albanians.
    You may be interested in reading this article.

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-01802-4

    The Mediterranean shores stretching between Sicily, Southern Italy and the Southern Balkans witnessed a long series of migration processes and cultural exchanges. Accordingly, present-day population diversity is composed by multiple genetic layers, which make the deciphering of different ancestral and historical contributes particularly challenging. We address this issue by genotyping 511 samples from 23 populations of Sicily, Southern Italy, Greece and Albania with the Illumina GenoChip Array, also including new samples from Albanian- and Greek-speaking ethno-linguistic minorities of Southern Italy. Our results reveal a shared Mediterranean genetic continuity, extending from Sicily to Cyprus, where Southern Italian populations appear genetically closer to Greek-speaking islands than to continental Greece. Besides a predominant Neolithic background, we identify traces of Post-Neolithic Levantine- and Caucasus-related ancestries, compatible with maritime Bronze-Age migrations. We argue that these results may have important implications in the cultural history of Europe, such as in the diffusion of some Indo-European languages. Instead, recent historical expansions from North-Eastern Europe account for the observed differentiation of present-day continental Southern Balkan groups. Patterns of IBD-sharing directly reconnect Albanian-speaking Arbereshe with a recent Balkan-source origin, while Greek-speaking communities of Southern Italy cluster with their Italian-speaking neighbours suggesting a long-term history of presence in Southern Italy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Curius cat

    a question for you,

    by what you DNA you give Myceneans?

    by Y-Dna
    by autosomals?
    by What?

    The papper of Lazrides is clear,
    Myceneans are close to Minoans
    and since that is correct,
    then Albanians must be close to Cretans, !!!!!
    are they?

    So how come with what criteria,
    you found that Albanians are Myceneans?

    can you explain what your criteria on what you call Mycenean?

    At least can you give the Mycenean Y and Mt DNA?

    cause I have Mycenean mtDNA

    9006 9010 9033 9041 were are shown more than mt and YDna?

    in fact Minoan shows more European mt than Mycenean which shows more minor Asian/caucasian mt

    Only J2axxx is found at Myceneans and Minoans
    in fact the Y-Dna fits exactly with today % of Crete
    These scores are based on proportions obtained from a gedmatch calculator. They don't mean much. It would be cool if someone created a calculator that actually compares your genome to Mycenaeans and other ancients, but even that shouldn't be taken literally since a lot of south Europeans have shared ancestry with them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ihype02 View Post
    This study did not include the Albanians who later according to the historical documents became the bulk of the population in Peloponnese. Some Slavonians were replaced with Greeks and Anatolians. Black Death killed 40% to 70% of Byzantium which is why Arvanites were called to recolonise Morea.
    A better question would be why they did NOT test Southern Slavs, Vlachs and Albanians.
    ihype black death stroke at 1240 or at 1400?
    When someone is showing/pointing the MOON
    many of us look the FINGER, the first time
    But some
    continue to see the finger AFTER second and third time,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    ihype black death stroke at 1240 or at 1400?
    In the middle of 14th century.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death

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    Quote Originally Posted by ihype02 View Post
    In the middle of 14th century.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death
    man what is interesting is this

    Arbanites existed to Sterea from the time of Ducchy of Athens,
    at Theba from around 1240 Ad by invitation of Latin rulers of 4rth crusade De la Roche family,
    the title was Half baron of Theba
    baronia de Teba


    What is interesting?
    Why Plague hit only the Greeks and not Arbanites?
    at peloponese

    Destroyed doctoras always shit happens,
    and if the work is from the Academy of Athens, surely worths nothing,
    cause the Arbanites who entered Peloponese
    as I said enter around 1390 by license
    and later at 1410 by Palaiologos emperor's license

    So Arbanites Already Existed when plague stroke at S Greece, after 1340 and were already at the maximum around 1400.
    what were they? Immune to black death?
    Besides
    Plague is also connected with Crusaders and stroke Adriatic coasts more than Greece (Dubrovnik)

    so the theory you provide, even written by a Greek seems to be just an Hypothesis

    man plz

    it is just silly to say that Greeks died of plague
    and Arbanites were immune
    so they invite them to 'empty land',

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    man what is interesting is this

    Arbanites existed to Sterea from the time of Ducchy of Athens,
    at Theba from around 1240 Ad by invitation of Latin rulers of 4rth crusade De la Roche family,
    the title was Half baron of Theba
    baronia de Teba


    What is interesting?
    Why Plague hit only the Greeks and not Arbanites?
    at peloponese

    Destroyed doctoras always shit happens,
    and if the work is from the Academy of Athens, surely worths nothing,
    cause the Arbanites who entered Peloponese
    as I said enter around 1390 by license
    and later at 1410 by Palaiologos emperor's license

    So Arbanites Already Existed when plague stroke at S Greece, after 1340 and were already at the maximum around 1400.
    what were they? Immune to black death?
    Besides
    Plague is also connected with Crusaders and stroke Adriatic coasts more than Greece (Dubrovnik)

    so the theory you provide, even written by a Greek seems to be just an Hypothesis

    man plz

    it is just silly to say that Greeks died of plague
    and Arbanites were immune
    so they invite them to 'empty land',
    And the study says that South Italians and Peleponese are 85-96 percent alike, genetically. If the Peleponese are Albanian replacements, that would lead to South Italians being 85-96 percent like Albanians (which sounds very unrealistic).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    man what is interesting is this

    Arbanites existed to Sterea from the time of Ducchy of Athens,
    at Theba from around 1240 Ad by invitation of Latin rulers of 4rth crusade De la Roche family,
    the title was Half baron of Theba
    baronia de Teba


    What is interesting?
    Why Plague hit only the Greeks and not Arbanites?
    at peloponese

    Destroyed doctoras always shit happens,
    and if the work is from the Academy of Athens, surely worths nothing,
    cause the Arbanites who entered Peloponese
    as I said enter around 1390 by license
    and later at 1410 by Palaiologos emperor's license

    So Arbanites Already Existed when plague stroke at S Greece, after 1340 and were already at the maximum around 1400.
    what were they? Immune to black death?
    Besides
    Plague is also connected with Crusaders and stroke Adriatic coasts more than Greece (Dubrovnik)

    so the theory you provide, even written by a Greek seems to be just an Hypothesis

    man plz

    it is just silly to say that Greeks died of plague
    and Arbanites were immune
    so they invite them to 'empty land',
    Arbanites were called to recolonise the Southren Greece I never said they were immune to Black Death or anything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ihype02 View Post
    Arbanites were called to recolonise the Southren Greece I never said they were immune to Black Death or anything.
    ╬Ło

    Arvanites were called to support de la Roche, at Theba
    Then Aragons (Catalan Corporation) allow them enter Attica,
    and then Byzantines allow them to pass Isthmos.
    much much later than the plague,
    Palaiologos invited them 1fter the plague,
    and at 1460 at Venician castles were 10 000
    considering child per family that time we speak about 1500 families,
    all these until late 1700, then we have different situations

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    Venetian Chronicles estimate 30,000 Albanian men of army in 15th century. Albanians became so numerous that they revolted to expell the Greek speakers:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Bua

    A Venetian chronicler (Stefano Magno) records that "30,000 Albanian inhabitants in the mountains" of Peloponnese rose against the despot Thomas in 1453. In 1455 the Signory authorized the settlement of more Albanians in its Messenian colony.
    Source:https://books.google.com/books?id=GE...NOBboQ6AEINzAF

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