23andMe Share your 23andMe Ancestry Composition

European 98.1%

Northwestern European 96.2%

British & Irish 71.6%

French & German 5.3%

Scandinavian 1.0%

Broadly Northwestern European 18.3%

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Southern European 0.7%

Iberian 0.3%

Broadly Southern European 0.5%

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Broadly European 1.2%


South Asian 1.7%

Broadly South Asian 1.7%


Middle Eastern & North African < 0.1%


North African < 0.1%


Unassigned < 0.1%

http://imgur.com/a/UWBBk?

Known ancestry: English (especially Southwest English ancestry), Scottish (with a bit of Orcadian), 1/32 German, Irish and supposedly some French on my dad's side, though I haven't verified that. I'm assuming there's probably some Welsh in there too.
 
It genuinely bothers me that I have so much "broad" results, what does that signify? Also, I have heard that anything under a certain percentage is just noise, how do they decide what that is? I chuckled at the N.African and E.Asian, and unsure how I got French and German, perhaps it's a guess based on migration patterns and haplo? I'll compare both "conservative" and "speculative". Anyway, here it is:

Conservative:
Northwestern European: 52.8%
-British & Irish: 8.6%
-Broadly Northwestern European: 44.1%
Broadly European: 44.5%
Unassigned: 2.8%

Speculative:
Northwestern European: 90.4%
-British & Irish: 66.0%
-French & German: 1.9%
-Scandinavian: 1.7%
-Broadly Northwestern European: 20.8%
Eastern European: 4.8%
Southern European: 1.0%
-Broadly Southern European: 1.0%
Broadly European: 3.4%
Middle Eastern & North African: 0.2%
-North African: 0.2%
-Broadly M.Eastern & N.African <0.1%
East Asian & Native American: <0.1%
-East Asian: <0.1%
-Broadly East Asian: <0.1%
Unassigned: <0.1%
 
It genuinely bothers me that I have so much "broad" results, what does that signify? Also, I have heard that anything under a certain percentage is just noise, how do they decide what that is? I chuckled at the N.African and E.Asian, and unsure how I got French and German, perhaps it's a guess based on migration patterns and haplo? I'll compare both "conservative" and "speculative". Anyway, here it is:

Conservative:
Northwestern European: 52.8%
-British & Irish: 8.6%
-Broadly Northwestern European: 44.1%
Broadly European: 44.5%
Unassigned: 2.8%

Speculative:
Northwestern European: 90.4%
-British & Irish: 66.0%
-French & German: 1.9%
-Scandinavian: 1.7%
-Broadly Northwestern European: 20.8%
Eastern European: 4.8%
Southern European: 1.0%
-Broadly Southern European: 1.0%
Broadly European: 3.4%
Middle Eastern & North African: 0.2%
-North African: 0.2%
-Broadly M.Eastern & N.African <0.1%
East Asian & Native American: <0.1%
-East Asian: <0.1%
-Broadly East Asian: <0.1%
Unassigned: <0.1%
Not a problem, Northwest European is thought to have come from Germanic tribes. Scandinavians tend to have a lot of NW European also so NW European + Scandinavian= You Germanic ancestry. Since the Dutch tend to have 1/4 British/Irish there might be a little more Germanic ancestry in your British/Irish results; but we need to wait for 23andme to allow us to download IronAge Germanic DNA to their system to be absolutely sure.

For Broadly Southern European, we are not quite sure what that component. However speculatively speaking, I can't help but notice; just looking at the Broadly Southern European Map, you can see an exaggerated image of what was once the European Roman Empire; especially 2.5%+ so I have a hunch that Broadly Southern European might have had at least some involvement with the Roman Empire.


Broadly European is probably WHG ancestry that all the Europeans have in common, Broadly European tends to mimic the WHG map


Ultimately in a conservative standpoint, we are not sure entirely what we are looking at. I talked with customer service about the issue and apparently 23andme have been getting their samples from Europeans living in the vicinity for generations. We need to wait for 23andme to give us the green light to download Iron Age samples before we can know precisely what we are looking at. As for the North African/East Asian, I'm curious to see if you have any distant ancestors whom were North African themselves, if not it's probably just noise since the percentage is so low. :)

Here are the maps of the 23andme components.

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/autosomal_maps_dodecad.shtml#23andMe
 
Not a problem, Northwest European is thought to have come from Germanic tribes. Scandinavians tend to have a lot of NW European also so NW European + Scandinavian= You Germanic ancestry. Since the Dutch tend to have 1/4 British/Irish there might be a little more Germanic ancestry in your British/Irish results; but we need to wait for 23andme to allow us to download IronAge Germanic DNA to their system to be absolutely sure.

For Broadly Southern European, we are not quite sure what that component. However speculatively speaking, I can't help but notice; just looking at the Broadly Southern European Map, you can see an exaggerated image of what was once the European Roman Empire; especially 2.5%+ so I have a hunch that Broadly Southern European might have had at least some involvement with the Roman Empire.


Broadly European is probably WHG ancestry that all the Europeans have in common, Broadly European tends to mimic the WHG map


Ultimately in a conservative standpoint, we are not sure entirely what we are looking at. I talked with customer service about the issue and apparently 23andme have been getting their samples from Europeans living in the vicinity for generations. We need to wait for 23andme to give us the green light to download Iron Age samples before we can know precisely what we are looking at. As for the North African/East Asian, I'm curious to see if you have any distant ancestors whom were North African themselves, if not it's probably just noise since the percentage is so low. :)

Very interesting, thank you for the clarification. My father always claimed English/Dutch/Lithuanian/Russian but we were unable to confirm (he lost many family members and hasn't much of a family history to speak of, does not even know surnames outside of his mother (Skanke)), all we had to go on was a Prussian Iron Cross war medal. As far as the E.Asian and N.African is concerned, approximately how long ago would that have been for such a small percentage? Unfortunately, we have little family history on my fathers side and I am assuming that this is where those would have come from. Thank you again, hopefully we can get that Iron Age DNA into the system!
 
Thank you for the information, Twilight. My father always claimed English, Irish, Lithuanian, Russian, and Dutch descent but had little family history to go on (only his parents surnames, Sanders and Skanke, and an old Prussian war medal) so I was never able to investigate my ancestry on that side. My mother had a good deal of records, thankfully, and traced back to Ireland for many generations. For the E.Asian/N.African could be on my fathers side for all I know (how far back would you think for such a low percentage) but I feel that it may just be noise. Thank you again, the Iron Age dna project would be nice to see.
 
Thank you for the information, Twilight. My father always claimed English, Irish, Lithuanian, Russian, and Dutch descent but had little family history to go on (only his parents surnames, Sanders and Skanke, and an old Prussian war medal) so I was never able to investigate my ancestry on that side. My mother had a good deal of records, thankfully, and traced back to Ireland for many generations. For the E.Asian/N.African could be on my fathers side for all I know (how far back would you think for such a low percentage) but I feel that it may just be noise. Thank you again, the Iron Age dna project would be nice to see.

You're welcome. I actually never knew my Biological Dad due to a nasty divorce at the age of 2 so I totally understand ^_^. I got reintroduced to my Biological family back in Highschool; at least paper trail thanks to the genealogists at Seattle Public Library. If there any Genealogists at your Local Library or in other libraries in Pennsylvania, that might be a good start to trace your Paternal Ancestry.


As for the 0.2% North African, I believe 23andme has a new feature that determines how long ago your North African ancestor could have lived; you can find the answer in your Ancestry Composition. ;) Note that the 6th chromosome has had a bad reputation in the past for housing Noise DNA. If your North African DNA is in your Mtdna, it's likely that you simply had an ancestor whom had an Mtdna in common with the Berbers/Egyptians.

 
23 and me
European 99.1
NW European
British & Irish 57.9
French & German 8.1
Scandanavian 2.2
Finnish 0.5
Broadly NW European 26.6

Southern European
Broadly Southern European 2.5
Asheknzai <0.1
Broadly European 1.0
SSA 0.8
West African 0.8
East Asian 0.2
Unassigned ,0.1

DNA-Land.com
West Eurasian
100

NW Euro 46
SW Euro 25
NE Euro 23 (n Slavic 18 + Finnish 5.4)
S Central Euro 4.1
Ambiguous 1.1

And this is where I stopped putting my DNA into various calculators. Just too much unknown. I'm almost 95 percent NW Euro according to 23andme and 46 percent on DNA Land.
 
In my experience some of the people who keep obsessing about trying every new calculator are, in many cases, just trying to confirm their "desire" or "bias" in terms of what they want to see.
 
In my experience some of the people who keep obsessing about trying every new calculator are, in many cases, just trying to confirm their "desire" or "bias" in terms of what they want to see.

Yeah some do, but the calculators that test for ancient ancestry (like various hunter-gatherer or farmer ancestries) are very interesting to me.

Then again:

Idiot at the computer: come on! Come on! Show me that WHG percentage!
Yeah!!!
 
In my experience some of the people who keep obsessing about trying every new calculator are, in many cases, just trying to confirm their "desire" or "bias" in terms of what they want to see.
So what's your point :)
 
So what's your point :)

I thought I was pretty clear. I guess not. :)

The thing for which these tests and calculators are best, imo, is for comparison with people of your area. In my case, for example, it was clear from the first 23andme test and the dienekes calculator that I fit exactly with the people of my two ancestral areas. In fact I plot almost exactly right in between Bergamo and TSI. When the sample from Piemonte(actually a border area between Liguria/Piemonte/Lombardia and Emilia) became available I plotted extremely close to that.

So, I'm exactly who I thought I was.

If, however, you come from a "mixed" background, as most Americans do, it becomes very muddy. Historical borders from the time of the nation states don't correspond to ancient "population" enclaves, who were themselves combinations of prior groups in different proportions.

If you're a mixed American who wants to know what percent German, English, Scottish, Irish, French Huguenot and Scandinavian you are, these tests can't do it. Either the populations are too similar, or they're going to be differently computed based on where centrums are located and named etc.

So, a strange situation has developed where if you know where all your ancestors lived for the last 500 years, the tests accurately confirm it. If you don't know, they won't tell you with any great degree of accuracy.

Now, as Davef said, it's interesting to know what ancient populations contributed to that. How much EEF, WHG, CHG etc. How close am I to MN people, or steppe people, or, if the genomes are ever released, Etruscans, or Romans, or the ancient Ligures or the Bell Beakers. I'm interested in knowing what ancient populations created us.

I'm not going to find that out from 23andme or any of these other companies.

I'll give you an example of what I mean by confirmation bias in all of this. A lot of Americans and Canadians have family traditions of having an American Indian ancestor and are very invested in the idea. I knew one of them. All the early tests he took showed no such ancestry. He took test after test after test until he found one that gave him a tiny percentage. Now, is it real or just noise, an artifact of that particular algorithm? I have no idea, but he's now happy. The other side of that story is that when people like this take a dna test it more often than not turns out that the "Indian" ancestor was actually a person with some SSA ancestry who said that in order to "pass" into white society.

Or, for another example, I knew a man obsessed with the idea that he was descended from the Norman aristocracy of England and was therefore convinced that he had Scandinavian ancestry. He took all these tests, looking for the one that would give him the highest possible "Scandinavian" score. Far be it from me to burst his bubble and tell him that I doubt that at this stage anyone, particularly anyone at a commercial testing site, can tell the difference between a Danish Viking and an Anglo-Saxon peasant farmer. For no doubt typically masculine reasons, he much preferred being descended from Danish Vikings.

See, different strokes for different folks. Maybe I'm doing the same thing coming at this from a totally different angle. My mother's family tree is littered with the surname of our local robber baron aristocrats. I nevertheless imbibed a hatred for them with my mother's milk, probably literally. :) (My birth area has always been a hot bed of anarchism, socialism, communism, and before that of any populist uprising that developed.) I have no desire to be connected to them. I much prefer to think I'm descended from retainers who took their surname. I also think that's objectively the most likely. On the other hand, I wouldn't take a test to see if we're related to the last descendants of that family even if they were willing to do it. See what I mean? :)

Ed. I always try to be completely honest. Upon reflection, I would probably take such a test if it were offered. Let's just say I hope it's never offered, and if it is and I took it, that my family wouldn't be related to them. :)
 
Last edited:
I thought I was pretty clear. I guess not. :)

The thing for which these tests and calculators are best, imo, is for comparison with people of your area. In my case, for example, it was clear from the first 23andme test and the dienekes calculator that I fit exactly with the people of my two ancestral areas. In fact I plot almost exactly right in between Bergamo and TSI. When the sample from Piemonte(actually a border area between Liguria/Piemonte/Lombardia and Emilia) became available I plotted extremely close to that.

So, I'm exactly who I thought I was.

If, however, you come from a "mixed" background, as most Americans do, it becomes very muddy. Historical borders from the time of the nation states don't correspond to ancient "population" enclaves, who were themselves combinations of prior groups in different proportions.

If you're a mixed American who wants to know what percent German, English, Scottish, Irish, French Huguenot and Scandinavian you are, these tests can't do it. Either the populations are too similar, or they're going to be differently computed based on where centrums are located and named etc.

So, a strange situation has developed where if you know where all your ancestors lived for the last 500 years, the tests accurately confirm it. If you don't know, they won't tell you with any great degree of accuracy.

Now, as Davef said, it's interesting to know what ancient populations contributed to that. How much EEF, WHG, CHG etc. How close am I to MN people, or steppe people, or, if the genomes are ever released, Etruscans, or Romans, or the ancient Ligures or the Bell Beakers. I'm interested in knowing what ancient populations created us.

I'm not going to find that out from 23andme or any of these other companies.

I'll give you an example of what I mean by confirmation bias in all of this. A lot of Americans and Canadians have family traditions of having an American Indian ancestor and are very invested in the idea. I knew one of them. All the early tests he took showed no such ancestry. He took test after test after test until he found one that gave him a tiny percentage. Now, is it real or just noise, an artifact of that particular algorithm? I have no idea, but he's now happy. The other side of that story is that when people like this take a dna test it more often than not turns out that the "Indian" ancestor was actually a person with some SSA ancestry who said that in order to "pass" into white society.

Or, for another example, I knew a man obsessed with the idea that he was descended from the Norman aristocracy of England and was therefore convinced that he had Scandinavian ancestry. He took all these tests, looking for the one that would give him the highest possible "Scandinavian" score. Far be it from me to burst his bubble and tell him that I doubt that at this stage anyone, particularly anyone at a commercial testing site, can tell the difference between a Danish Viking and an Anglo-Saxon peasant farmer. For no doubt typically masculine reasons, he much preferred being descended from Danish Vikings.

See, different strokes for different folks. Maybe I'm doing the same thing coming at this from a totally different angle. My mother's family tree is littered with the surname of our local robber baron aristocrats. I nevertheless imbibed a hatred for them with my mother's milk, probably literally. :) (My birth area has always been a hot bed of anarchism, socialism, communism, and before that of any populist uprising that developed.) I have no desire to be connected to them. I much prefer to think I'm descended from retainers who took their surname. I also think that's objectively the most likely. On the other hand, I wouldn't take a test to see if we're related to the last descendants of that family even if they were willing to do it. See what I mean? :)
Yes I see what you mean and your right. I don't even pay much attention too percentages any more just how they compare to other people with similar backgrounds. Bias in the interpretation of results, whether from the person being tested or from others, is a massive problem in genetics and anthropology.
 
I thought I was pretty clear. I guess not. :)

The thing for which these tests and calculators are best, imo, is for comparison with people of your area. In my case, for example, it was clear from the first 23andme test and the dienekes calculator that I fit exactly with the people of my two ancestral areas. In fact I plot almost exactly right in between Bergamo and TSI. When the sample from Piemonte(actually a border area between Liguria/Piemonte/Lombardia and Emilia) became available I plotted extremely close to that.

So, I'm exactly who I thought I was.

If, however, you come from a "mixed" background, as most Americans do, it becomes very muddy. Historical borders from the time of the nation states don't correspond to ancient "population" enclaves, who were themselves combinations of prior groups in different proportions.

If you're a mixed American who wants to know what percent German, English, Scottish, Irish, French Huguenot and Scandinavian you are, these tests can't do it. Either the populations are too similar, or they're going to be differently computed based on where centrums are located and named etc.

So, a strange situation has developed where if you know where all your ancestors lived for the last 500 years, the tests accurately confirm it. If you don't know, they won't tell you with any great degree of accuracy.

Now, as Davef said, it's interesting to know what ancient populations contributed to that. How much EEF, WHG, CHG etc. How close am I to MN people, or steppe people, or, if the genomes are ever released, Etruscans, or Romans, or the ancient Ligures or the Bell Beakers. I'm interested in knowing what ancient populations created us.

I'm not going to find that out from 23andme or any of these other companies.

I'll give you an example of what I mean by confirmation bias in all of this. A lot of Americans and Canadians have family traditions of having an American Indian ancestor and are very invested in the idea. I knew one of them. All the early tests he took showed no such ancestry. He took test after test after test until he found one that gave him a tiny percentage. Now, is it real or just noise, an artifact of that particular algorithm? I have no idea, but he's now happy. The other side of that story is that when people like this take a dna test it more often than not turns out that the "Indian" ancestor was actually a person with some SSA ancestry who said that in order to "pass" into white society.

Or, for another example, I knew a man obsessed with the idea that he was descended from the Norman aristocracy of England and was therefore convinced that he had Scandinavian ancestry. He took all these tests, looking for the one that would give him the highest possible "Scandinavian" score. Far be it from me to burst his bubble and tell him that I doubt that at this stage anyone, particularly anyone at a commercial testing site, can tell the difference between a Danish Viking and an Anglo-Saxon peasant farmer. For no doubt typically masculine reasons, he much preferred being descended from Danish Vikings.

See, different strokes for different folks. Maybe I'm doing the same thing coming at this from a totally different angle. My mother's family tree is littered with the surname of our local robber baron aristocrats. I nevertheless imbibed a hatred for them with my mother's milk, probably literally. :) (My birth area has always been a hot bed of anarchism, socialism, communism, and before that of any populist uprising that developed.) I have no desire to be connected to them. I much prefer to think I'm descended from retainers who took their surname. I also think that's objectively the most likely. On the other hand, I wouldn't take a test to see if we're related to the last descendants of that family even if they were willing to do it. See what I mean? :)

Great explanation, Angela! It's very much how I feel. My unknown will stay unknown. My "Indian" could be anything from that SSA that does repeatedly show up to some other unknown. But almost none show me to be carrying American Indian DNA. But...I have physical characteristics that are common in Asiatic peoples like Mongolian spots and dry earwax and olive skin all from that supposed "Indian" ancestor. So for me, I wasn't really trying to find or verify Native American ancestry, but why I have those characteristics vs. what my DNA shows. So I latch onto those non NW Euro results. I really don't care what it is, I just know there is an answer. :) Now, that SSA ancestry was dismissed by my father because he is positive it is a mistake. He does have bias.
 
Great explanation, Angela! It's very much how I feel. My unknown will stay unknown. My "Indian" could be anything from that SSA that does repeatedly show up to some other unknown. But almost none show me to be carrying American Indian DNA. But...I have physical characteristics that are common in Asiatic peoples like Mongolian spots and dry earwax and olive skin all from that supposed "Indian" ancestor. So for me, I wasn't really trying to find or verify Native American ancestry, but why I have those characteristics vs. what my DNA shows. So I latch onto those non NW Euro results. I really don't care what it is, I just know there is an answer. :) Now, that SSA ancestry was dismissed by my father because he is positive it is a mistake. He does have bias.

I hope no offense was taken. I was actually referring to a well known figure in the world of population genetics, among other personal examples from people I've known. I didn't know you also were investigating such a possibility.

It's natural for people to want to know more about their "roots". I totally understand it. It's just that I honestly don't think that these tests can give people the kind of specific answers they're seeking. They should also be wary of just seeking a test which will give them what they "want".

When something "unusual" for one's area shows up, if someone is interested in really finding out if a test result is accurate, often the best thing to do is to go the old fashioned genealogical research route. A close friend of mine, of mostly Irish plus other British Isles ancestry, with family which has been located in New England for hundreds of years, did have one of these "Indian" ancestor stories in the family. He took the 23andme test and got 2% SSA. He was surprised, and so was I, frankly. As recent papers have shown, this usually happens in families with close connections to the south. Well, he started doing research. It turns out that one of his ancestors was a slave who escaped to freedom on the Underground Railroad, braving great dangers. He was so fearful, after the Dred Scott decision, of being re-enslaved, that he went all the way to Canada where he became a blacksmith and had a long and prosperous life. At a certain point, one of his now mixed descendants, the "Indian" in the family, moved down to Vermont and into my friend's family tree. He's quite proud of this ancestor, as he should be, in my opinion.
 
@ Angela, no offense at all! I do love the paper trail as well. It just grows cold with poor whites and minorities in the 18th and 19th centuries. And one of my ancestors was adopted from a brothel..so..there's that. My DNA test actually gave me some insight on who shares my SSA ancestry and one of my distant cousins is the writer/star of Hamilton, Lin-Manuel Miranda. If you're up to an interesting take on interracial love stories google him. His white ancestor is the brother to my ancestor who may have married a former slave as well. I have a ton of new relatives in GEDMatch from that union. But that came from a "documented" purely European line where someone said they were white when they moved into the community and no one knew differently. My "Scottish" line. I loved finding that! Sorry to ramble, your input is very welcome and insightful as always.
 
My results are:

ToBeOrNotToBe 100%


European 99.6%


Ashkenazi Jewish 97.5%

Eastern European 0.7%

Southern European 0.5%

(Broadly Southern European 0.5%)

Northwestern European 0.1%

(Broadly Northwestern European 0.1%)

Broadly European 0.8%


Middle Eastern & North African 0.3%


Middle Eastern 0.3%

Broadly Middle Eastern & North African < 0.1%


East Asian & Native American < 0.1%


Broadly East Asian & Native American < 0.1%


Unassigned < 0.1%



 
Also, Maciamo, what would be SUPER interesting would be a map of Ashkenazi admixture, to see which areas received the most "marrying out"
 
The new 23andMe experience, starting in 2016 and replacing the old version of other customers the early months of 2017, has been a disappointment for many veteran users. One major let down is that it is no longer possible to search for people with whom to share by location or other profile fields unless these people appear in our DNA Relatives (which means that they must share at least one DNA segment). I thought it would be a good opportunity to share our results here. My aim is to compile a frequency table by country and region, so that people understand better how they compare with other individuals from the same region or from the rest of Europe.

Please only share your results if all your ancestors come from the same country! Kindly also mention your ancestral region(s) within that country so that results can be classify more accurately.

Dear Maciamo what is mean by Balkan DNA in 23 and me. Mine is as follows.

European
98.9%
Balkan
88.8%
Italian
3.6%
Iberian
0.4%
Broadly Southern European
5.1%
Broadly European
0.9%
Sub-Saharan African
0.9%
West African
0.9%
East Asian & Native American
0.1%
East Asian
0.1%
Broadly East Asian
0.1%
Middle Eastern & North African
< 0.1%
North African
< 0.1%
Broadly Middle Eastern & North African
< 0.1%
Unassigned
< 0.1%



Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum
 
[FONT=&quot]European99.6%
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Eastern European68.6%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Southern European18.6%

Balkan15.2%

Broadly Southern European3.4%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Northwestern European5.1%

French & German0.9%

British & Irish0.5%

Finnish0.1%

Broadly Northwestern European3.5%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Broadly European7.3%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Middle Eastern & North African0.3%
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]North African0.3%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]East Asian & Native American< 0.1%
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]East Asian< 0.1%

Broadly East Asian< 0.1%

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Broadly East Asian & Native American< 0.1%



[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Sub-Saharan African< 0.1%
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Central & South African< 0.1%



[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Unassigned[/FONT][FONT=&quot]< 0.1%

[/FONT]
 
My updated results:

Southern European53.5%
Balkan41.8%
Italian0.3%
Broadly Southern European11.4%
Eastern European22.4%
Northwestern European7.3%
French & German1.7%
Finnish0.2%
Broadly Northwestern European5.3%
Ashkenazi Jewish
0.3%
Broadly European14.7%
East Asian1.6%
Yakut0.8%
Broadly East Asian0.8%
Broadly East Asian & Native American0.2%
 

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