Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 26

Thread: The Y-DNA of the megalithic people

  1. #1
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

    The Y-DNA of the megalithic people

    With the recent papers about BB, Balkans and Portugal, a more clear picture about the people that spread the Megalithic culture in the Late Neolithic / Chalcolithic could be displayed.

    Portugal_LN/Chalco I2a1b x2, G2a2, I2a1a1a1b
    SE_Iberia_Chalco I x2, CF
    Central_Iberia_Chalco I2, I2a2(a) x9, G2a2 (x2), I x2, I2a1a1a
    UK_Neo I2a2(a1) x10, I2a1b(1) x12
    France_MLN I2a1b x2
    Remedello I x3
    GAC I2a2(a1b) x8, I, I2, BT, CT

    The old Anatolian EEF wave linked to G2a seems passed away, and I2a clades take over Western Europe from Portugal or Britanny, delivering a 25% WHG to such pops.

    It's quite interesting the possibility to link also GAC (Globular Amphora Culture) with such I2a wave: they were not using so much megaliths but instead pits and cists, but as their territory (RDA, Poland, west Ukraine) coincides greatly with that of the Funnelbeaker culture (TRB), and such culture provided the megalithism in north Europe, it could be though that the GAC pop had it's origin in such culture. By the way the collpase of GAC coincides with the apparition of the CWC and the R1a clades by 2900 BC.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  2. #2
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Veteran10000 Experience PointsThree Friends
    Sile's Avatar
    Join Date
    04-09-11
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    3,934
    Points
    23,241
    Level
    46
    Points: 23,241, Level: 46
    Level completed: 70%, Points required for next Level: 309
    Overall activity: 59.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2-Z19945*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a

    Ethnic group
    Alpinoid
    Country: Australia



    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    With the recent papers about BB, Balkans and Portugal, a more clear picture about the people that spread the Megalithic culture in the Late Neolithic / Chalcolithic could be displayed.

    Portugal_LN/Chalco I2a1b x2, G2a2, I2a1a1a1b
    SE_Iberia_Chalco I x2, CF
    Central_Iberia_Chalco I2, I2a2(a) x9, G2a2 (x2), I x2, I2a1a1a
    UK_Neo I2a2(a1) x10, I2a1b(1) x12
    France_MLN I2a1b x2
    Remedello I x3
    GAC I2a2(a1b) x8, I, I2, BT, CT

    The old Anatolian EEF wave linked to G2a seems passed away, and I2a clades take over Western Europe from Portugal or Britanny, delivering a 25% WHG to such pops.

    It's quite interesting the possibility to link also GAC (Globular Amphora Culture) with such I2a wave: they were not using so much megaliths but instead pits and cists, but as their territory (RDA, Poland, west Ukraine) coincides greatly with that of the Funnelbeaker culture (TRB), and such culture provided the megalithism in north Europe, it could be though that the GAC pop had it's origin in such culture. By the way the collpase of GAC coincides with the apparition of the CWC and the R1a clades by 2900 BC.
    Remendello x 3 are all I2a1a1-M26 associated with sardinians and central germans

    Remendello is in north Italy , far away from Portugal and Brittany ( france )
    có che un pòpoło no 'l defende pi ła só łéngua el xe prónto par èser s'ciavo

    when a people no longer dares to defend its language it is ripe for slavery.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    But close to France and its Chaséen...
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  4. #4
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    Also it's quite interesting the case of Ukraine_Neolithic (5500-4800) with R1b linages and I2a2 x3 and I2a2a1b x4, with autosomal highly EHG. Some radical steppist to say something about that?
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  5. #5
    Elite member Achievements:
    3 months registered1000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    02-07-16
    Posts
    396
    Points
    4,041
    Level
    18
    Points: 4,041, Level: 18
    Level completed: 48%, Points required for next Level: 209
    Overall activity: 33.0%


    Country: Germany



    I don't think all of these are Megalithic cultures. Perhaps you meant Western European LN/Chalcolithic in general?

  6. #6
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    3,487
    Points
    21,453
    Level
    44
    Points: 21,453, Level: 44
    Level completed: 79%, Points required for next Level: 197
    Overall activity: 44.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    Quote Originally Posted by MarkoZ View Post
    I don't think all of these are Megalithic cultures. Perhaps you meant Western European LN/Chalcolithic in general?
    the earliest megalithic in Evora, Portugal was actualy pré-Neolithic 8 ka
    Cardium Ware arrived in the area ca 7.4 ka

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almendres_Cromlech

  7. #7
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    3,487
    Points
    21,453
    Level
    44
    Points: 21,453, Level: 44
    Level completed: 79%, Points required for next Level: 197
    Overall activity: 44.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
    the Chaséen in France is not chalcolithic, it has no relation with Remedello
    only in Iberia, early chalcolithic seems related with the older megalithic sites

  8. #8
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    Attachment 8710

    The late Neolithic / Chalcolithic areas high in I2a come to be similar to those with megalithism. And true, the Chasséen is not Chalcolithic, but I was taking an horizon.

    In the map Sardinia appears with megalithism and is also high in I2a.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  9. #9
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    In nord Italia, tale fase coincide con la fase di vita della necropoli di “Remedello di Sotto” (BS); gli uomini della cultura di Remedello (affine a quella emiliana di Spilamberto e a quella di Fontbuisse nel sud della Francia) depongono, nelle tombe individuali, prevalentemente asce e punte di frecce in pietra di tradizione neolitica;
    La définition de la culture de Remedello est délicate du fait que les types d'objets présents dans cette culture se retrouvent également dans les cultures contemporaines. C'est notamment le cas des poignards en cuivre de type "Remedello" que l'on retrouve sur toute l'Italie, mais aussi en Suisse et dans le sud de la France
    The Po bassin has not natural copper resources. A Remedello "poignard" was found inside a dolmen near Marseilles.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  10. #10
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    7,639
    Points
    80,000
    Level
    87
    Points: 80,000, Level: 87
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 150
    Overall activity: 99.5%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Gentlemen, the source of the Remedello ore was probably southern Tuscany, as shown by Otzi's Remedello style ax.

    http://www.iceman.it/en/oetzi-treach...central-italy/

    My comment from a prior thread:

    "Now, since Otzi and his ax are dated to 3300 BC, and the axe is Remedello type, the people of Remedello were doing this work before any movement from the steppe. (In fact, Otzi's axe is older than the oldest Remedello axe found.)Again, I think it's Balkan and if the technology was not brought by G2a people, might have been brought by I2a people. After all, Remedello seems to be all I2a, and for hundreds of years.

    https://books.google.com/books?id=kQ...20type&f=false


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  11. #11
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    It's a fact that there was a Chasséen cultural spread from France to North Italy (Lagozza); moreover after checking that the megalith builders were I2a, the origin of the Remedello people must be more in the west than in the Balkans; the technology is another issue.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  12. #12
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    7,639
    Points
    80,000
    Level
    87
    Points: 80,000, Level: 87
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 150
    Overall activity: 99.5%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    It's a fact that there was a Chasséen cultural spread from France to North Italy (Lagozza); moreover after checking that the megalith builders were I2a, the origin of the Remedello people must be more in the west than in the Balkans; the technology is another issue.
    How can the fact that Remedello carried I2a prove that there was a population migration from the west when I2a was all over the Balkans, the source of the metallurgical knowledge as well.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  13. #13
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    3,487
    Points
    21,453
    Level
    44
    Points: 21,453, Level: 44
    Level completed: 79%, Points required for next Level: 197
    Overall activity: 44.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    How can the fact that Remedello carried I2a prove that there was a population migration from the west when I2a was all over the Balkans, the source of the metallurgical knowledge as well.
    IMO the Balkans seem the most likely origin for Remedello.

    Chasséen were trading tools made from rare stones all over France, and later also into southern England.
    Many of the rare stones came from the Alps, in between France and Italy, where they may have met Remedello tradesmen.
    But they were not trading copper or copper objects. This 'poignard', if it came thorugh Chasséen, it was an exception.

    I-M26/L158 has often been put forward as a likely candidate to have spread with megalithic, but I don't see any subclade with the proper TMRCA, which I would expect around 6.5 ka.

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-L158/

    There is the 7.7 ka TMRCA for the Z2049 subclade, which may be the time this I2a HG subclade integrated in the Cardium Ware movement, but at that time, Cardium Ware hadn't reached megalith territory yet.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    How can the fact that Remedello carried I2a prove that there was a population migration from the west when I2a was all over the Balkans, the source of the metallurgical knowledge as well.
    Well, you have a cultural (migration?) influence in N. Italy from the Chaséen, it's provided who the Megalithic builders were mostly I2a, and the Remedello were I2a. You say that metallurgy comes from the Balkans and that there were I2a also, but we know the track of the metallurgy? the Balkan I2a are the same as the Remedello? the Balkan I2a were the majority in a given culture?

    @ bicicleur, daggers are also found in the Provençal Fontbouisse Culture, much more primitive than those of Remedello.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  15. #15
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    7,639
    Points
    80,000
    Level
    87
    Points: 80,000, Level: 87
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 150
    Overall activity: 99.5%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    The flow of metallurgy was east to west as we can see by the dating as well as well as the nature of the technology.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  16. #16
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Three Friends10000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Maleth's Avatar
    Join Date
    22-03-14
    Location
    Malta
    Posts
    1,831
    Points
    13,562
    Level
    35
    Points: 13,562, Level: 35
    Level completed: 31%, Points required for next Level: 488
    Overall activity: 17.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    EV13 - (A7136)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H

    Country: Malta



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Megalithic is a general term for using big stones that falls in different categories. I don't believe they all stem from one group of peoples with a dominant haplogroup. It also seem to be a practice associated with agriculture.

  17. #17
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran10000 Experience Points
    Awards:
    Community Award
    bicicleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    27-01-13
    Location
    Zwevegem, Belgium
    Posts
    3,487
    Points
    21,453
    Level
    44
    Points: 21,453, Level: 44
    Level completed: 79%, Points required for next Level: 197
    Overall activity: 44.0%


    Country: Belgium - Flanders



    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maleth View Post
    Megalithic is a general term for using big stones that falls in different categories. I don't believe they all stem from one group of peoples with a dominant haplogroup. It also seem to be a practice associated with agriculture.
    no, megalithism in Europe was initiated by HG, not by the incoming Anatolian farmers, proper dating of the earliest megaliths proves it
    probably a few subclades of I2a were involved, but I have no idea which ones

  18. #18
    Regular Member Achievements:
    Three Friends10000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Maleth's Avatar
    Join Date
    22-03-14
    Location
    Malta
    Posts
    1,831
    Points
    13,562
    Level
    35
    Points: 13,562, Level: 35
    Level completed: 31%, Points required for next Level: 488
    Overall activity: 17.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    EV13 - (A7136)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H

    Country: Malta



    Quote Originally Posted by bicicleur View Post
    no, megalithism in Europe was initiated by HG, not by the incoming Anatolian farmers, proper dating of the earliest megaliths proves it
    probably a few subclades of I2a were involved, but I have no idea which ones
    Megalithism is a generic word. Europe does not have one type of Megalithic remains. There are stone circles (probably the oldest, who as you say could well be formed by HG) , portal tombs, tombs where the entrance has been eroded with just a tomb in the ground (portal grave), then the more elaborate Megalith constructions such as those in Malta. Göbekli Tepe in Turkey and stone circles in Evora Portugal probably date during the same periods but are very different types of Megalithic structures. In this regard I am presuming that it is highly unlikely that Megalithic even in Europe as a whole can be attributed to one type of Haplogroup. The whole Megalithic subject is still highly debated world wide.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megalith

  19. #19
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    @Angela, Metallurgy could spread westwards but I have displayed the presence of a Chasséen-like culture in Italy, sharing also the Y-DNA. Can you propose something similar?

    @ bicicleur, you might take caution, the stones can't be dated when were erected.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  20. #20
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    7,639
    Points
    80,000
    Level
    87
    Points: 80,000, Level: 87
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 150
    Overall activity: 99.5%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    Quote Originally Posted by berun View Post
    @Angela, Metallurgy could spread westwards but I have displayed the presence of a Chasséen-like culture in Italy, sharing also the Y-DNA. Can you propose something similar?

    @ bicicleur, you might take caution, the stones can't be dated when were erected.
    This is your source?

    Did you notice there's not a single citation and they ask for it to be edited? Plus, are they claiming this is the source of Terramare?

    "Lagozza [ edit this page |

    It is dated to about 3900 to 3400 vC. The name given to the site is the Lagozza lake settlement north of Milan ( Upper Italy ). The Lagozza culture was spread from Languedoc and Provence toSoutheast France, through Liguria to Lombardy and Emilia , with foothills to Pisa and Ripoli, Molfetta and the Bari area. The settlements ( Terramaren ) are also on the shores.
    The single-colored ceramic consists mostly of black or occasionally also from red polished fine-grained material without decoration. Occasional embellishments according to Chassey style disappeared soon.
    To stone tools there are in addition pointed necked Beilen, sometimes Microliths as trapezes and triangular cross tailor , and rhombic and triangular, stalked partly arrowheads. Bones were made from bones, trailers, and also some harpoons . Weaving weights and spinning whites are made of clay."

    According to this source, Lagozza is possibly derived from Chaseen.
    https://books.google.com/books?id=Xn...ulture&f=false

    I don't know whether Lagozza and/or Remedello carry genetic ancestry from south-eastern France versus the Balkans. Maybe it's both; it's immaterial to me. What I am trying to express is that until we have ancient dna from these cultures, and highly resolved at that, we just won't know.

    Sometimes, pots are just pots, not people. Look at Remedello itself; all the indicia of "steppe" culture and not one ounce of steppe blood. (That culture, btw, to address your point, must have come from the east, not France.) If Olalde et al is to be believed, whatever happened in the rest of Europe, perhaps even southern France, there was little if any Iberian influx in terms of people into the Central European area where northern Bell Beaker formed.

    All this certainty about cultures from which we either don't have adna or it's not resolved enough is, imo, unwarranted.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  21. #21
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1 year registered5000 Experience Points
    berun's Avatar
    Join Date
    24-11-15
    Posts
    568
    Points
    5,331
    Level
    21
    Points: 5,331, Level: 21
    Level completed: 57%, Points required for next Level: 219
    Overall activity: 99.0%


    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    I just took the first google ref, if you are more happy with an academic ref: LAGOZZA E CHASSEY - INQUADRAMENTO CRONOLOGICO E CULTURALE DELLE CERAMICHE DELLA LOMBARDIA OCCIDENTALEE DEL SUD-EST DELLA FRANCIA:
    Questo contributo essenzialmente è il risultato di una serie di riflessioni relative alle produzioni ceramiche del Neolitico nel Sud della Francia e nell’Italia centro-settentrionale tra 4500 e 3500 a.C. Questo fondamentale periodo del Neolitico in Europa Occidentale è stato identificato nel corso degli ultimi decenni come un orizzonte costituito da tre culture imparentate: Chassey in Francia, Cortaillod in Svizzera, Lagozza in Italia (LAVIOSA ZAMBOTTI 1939-1940, BAILLOUD, MIEGDEBOOFZHEIM 1955, VAQUER 1975, BORRELLO 1977 pubblicato nel 1984); o ancora nella prospettiva di un modello statico : il gruppo culturale Chassey/Cortaillod/ Lagozza(BORRELLO 1980; 2006)
    By the way, Genetiker's admixture tables display the three Remedello individuals as 20% WHG + 80% EEF, an usual admixture among Megalithic socities. Ötzi had a 10% and a 85%... but he was G2a.
    "What I've seen so far after my entire career chasing Indoeuropeans is that our solutions look tissue thin and our problems still look monumental" J.P.Mallory

    "The ultimate homeland of the group [PIE] that also spread Anatolian languages is less clear." D. Reich

  22. #22
    Advisor Achievements:
    VeteranThree Friends50000 Experience PointsRecommendation Second Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    7,639
    Points
    80,000
    Level
    87
    Points: 80,000, Level: 87
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 150
    Overall activity: 99.5%


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    There is nothing in anything you have posted which proves your point, but you're free to believe whatever you choose.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  23. #23
    Regular Member Achievements:
    31 days registered250 Experience Points
    Apsurdistan's Avatar
    Join Date
    13-04-17
    Posts
    163
    Points
    76
    Level
    1
    Points: 76, Level: 1
    Level completed: 26%, Points required for next Level: 74
    Overall activity: 81.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I1a3-Z63
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H5c

    Ethnic group
    Bosniak-Yugoslav-Slavic-Balkan?
    Country: Yugoslavia



    How the hell did they build those things? They're freakin heavy and huge! And some have perfect edges and spheres like those stone circles.

  24. #24
    Regular Member Achievements:
    OverdriveVeteranThree Friends25000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    02-10-11
    Posts
    3,411
    Points
    28,938
    Level
    52
    Points: 28,938, Level: 52
    Level completed: 27%, Points required for next Level: 812
    Overall activity: 46.0%


    Ethnic group
    Makedonian original
    Country: Greece



    Metallurgy is a generic term for all metalls.

    For example we know the gold existed at middle east and there was an amateur metallurgy
    BUT we consider Varna and souroundings as first metallurgy of Gold.
    And Gold metallurgy moved from WEST TO EAST,
    SOMETHING THAT NOBODY EVER NOTICED.

    Bronze is found elsewhere probably,
    BUT we consider Metallurgy of ARSENIC BRONZE start somewhere at SW Caucasus, Maykob.
    and from there spread, so for Europe from EAST TO WEST, (that is the main theory basis for IE theory)
    on controversary TIN BRONZE moves from Europe to Asia
    ΠΑΣΑ ΕΠΙΣΤΗΜΗ ΧΩΡΙΖΟΜΕΝΗ ΑΡΕΤΗΣ
    ΠΑΝΟΥΡΓΙΑ ΟΥ ΣΟΦΙΑ ΦΑΙΝΕΤΑΙ
    ΑΡΙΣΤΟΤΕΛΗΣ

  25. #25
    Regular Member Achievements:
    OverdriveVeteranThree Friends25000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    02-10-11
    Posts
    3,411
    Points
    28,938
    Level
    52
    Points: 28,938, Level: 52
    Level completed: 27%, Points required for next Level: 812
    Overall activity: 46.0%


    Ethnic group
    Makedonian original
    Country: Greece





    Quote Originally Posted by Apsurdistan View Post
    How the hell did they build those things? They're freakin heavy and huge! And some have perfect edges and spheres like those stone circles.
    He did, using THE FORCE




    some fun, joke,
    human mind, if can noit realise something, creates alliens, daemons, gods, etc
    ΠΑΣΑ ΕΠΙΣΤΗΜΗ ΧΩΡΙΖΟΜΕΝΗ ΑΡΕΤΗΣ
    ΠΑΝΟΥΡΓΙΑ ΟΥ ΣΟΦΙΑ ΦΑΙΝΕΤΑΙ
    ΑΡΙΣΤΟΤΕΛΗΣ

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •