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Sianna
15-09-10, 23:53
Hi

I'm quite new to the mtDNA "stuff" and Linguistic trying to somehow "see through". I came hear looking for answers of the relationship between (P)IE Sumerian and Raetic. I read with great interest the thread about identifying the orignal IE mtDNA and went through the different maps, but although I read it several times, I sort of can't really understand it thoroughly.)

I'm currently doing some reading in comparativ indo-european mythology. As the Author I'm reading somehow was a bit non-challant towards the Semitic influence (sorry "diffusion") and quasi-ignored the Sumerians I started reseraching about a Sumerian - (P)IE relationship which actually gave me more of a headache.....

My point is, that I find it difficult to neglect the influence of a culture that has had a major impact on Semitic cultur, that was a near neighbour to some IE. Sumerian emerged in the 4th millenium BCE (Writing started around 3200 bce). Whereas for the first IE branches to emerge (Indic, Anatolian, Greek) we have to wait until the 2nd millenium BCE, Iranian seems to have emerged in the 1st millenium. I couldn't find any year for the PIE culture only the mention of Copper Age, but the emergence of metallurgy occured first in the Fertile Crescent and spread from there (4th Millenium Mesopotamia). I think my problem is the huge influence which is given to a reconstructed PIE culture and the ignorance of the influence of a historically proven "living" culture (Sumer).

I stumbled over some interesting studies from Alfred Toth that show some connections between Sumerian, Hungarian and Raetic language (and Sumerian, Egyptian, Hebrew). But am not in a position to really judge them.

So I wondered, if actually mtDNA or Y-chromosom studies could actually give another image - falsify or verify something.

I would be glad, if someone with a greater understanding of mtDNA or yChromosoms could give me his/her ideas about this.

Thank you
Sianna

Aristander
16-09-10, 23:46
I adding the link to Toth's paper for informational purposes. I have read Toth and while his paper is quite interesting, at times I felt he was reaching just a bit in some of his conjectures. I don't really doubt that the Raetic language is related to Etruscan and there is an apparent DNA link between the Etruscans and Anatolia, however I do have some questions about his links to Semetic languages.
This is something that has interested me for many years and I wish you luck with your investigation.
http://www.federatio.org/mi_bibl/Toth_Brunner_Raetic.pdf

Sianna
17-09-10, 01:29
Hi

Then let me add another one about Hungarian, Sumerian and Egyptian - Hungarian, Sumerian and Hebrew.

Toth has been critised by someone called Schumacher and somewhere he takes position, but can't remember where (I went through all his papers, you can find many on the link you posted.)

szabir.com/blog/hungarian-sumerian-and-egyptian-hebrew/

(just add the three "w" at the begining.)


Can you tell me something about a Sumerian DNA Link?

Kind regards
Sianna

Maciamo
20-09-10, 22:06
It's not possible to find a correlation between mtDNA and specific ancient linguistic groups at the moment. The mtDNA phylogenetic tree is far more complex than the Y-DNA tree. What's more mtDNA mutations are much slower to develop, which makes it almost irrelevant for population studies in historical times.

Fsdrm
30-04-16, 09:32
Then let me add another one about Hungarian, Sumerian and Egyptian - Hungarian, Sumerian and Hebrew.

It is called pure pseudo linguistics.