View Full Version : Democracy is back!

16-11-11, 20:27
Most EU leader even in the UK (as long as its not including them:innocent:) are all touting 'More Europe' as the solution to the current debt crisis.

But more Europe is hard to achieve because the line that investors want to see is complete fiscal integration to allow the Euro to function properly. Fiscal integration is going at least to mean treaty change and should really end in a referendum to the people asking them if they want what will essentially be a fusing of sovereignty.

So to gauge the mood of Europeans such as yourself on whether such a referendum in a time of crisis would end badly lets vote on it.

Do you want to create a federal Euro-core with all nations involved in the Euro?

• Centralised taxation
• Money from richer regions being distributed to the poorer regions
• Germans and French holding sway over decision making in your region
• Regional parliaments loosing significant political power

*PS I have no idea how to change the poll question, DOH!

Anton, Bear's den
16-11-11, 21:52
"Money from richer regions being distributed to the poorer regions"

This item will cause the greatest debate, do you think that rich states will agree to fed the poorer ones?

16-11-11, 23:31
I have corrected the poll question.

I am definitely in favour of more integration.

17-11-11, 02:02
Funny that that poll comes from a Briton, the most eurosceptic country on the European map. No offense, of course, I think Britain has everything it needs to effectively self-govern herself. I answered no to the question for many reasons, but here is the ones that bug me most. First of all the EU will only be as strong as its weakest member, and membership has been cheap in the last decade. Some of the current members have blatently cheated, lied or forged reports about filling the conditions to apply for membership. Imagine how bad it is now that they have free reins (but I am sure you all read the papers...). Another reason I don't want more Europe is that "integration" is a failure. We have no common infrastructure, travelling from A to B means you need to book 2, 3 or more train tickets, busses carry some sort of currencies and a couple of power plug adaptors. You need a good grip on languages that you were not taught at school and you need to deal with customs and local legislation if you are a smoker, a drinker or if you have a cat. My personal experience has taught me that as a nurse's aide with a Belgian diploma, I can work in Ireland but not in France, and that I need to further my education to get work in Germany, cause nursing in Germany is different from Ireland (people's organs are not at the same place, I bet...). I could go on for hours ranting about it, but you would lose patience with me. In one word, the day the EU can come with a solid project that will effectively improve the citizens living standards and make their life easier and more enjoyable, I will gladly jump on the wagon. The lame experimental laboratory ran by pen-pushers that we call EU disgusts me every day more and more. Time to slay the monster.

17-11-11, 05:35
I don't know. There are decent arguments for and against and neither argument has absolutely convinced me either way.

If it goes to a referendum I don't think it will pass as the poorer EU countries will vote in favour if it means more financial help, whilst the wealthier (and more populace) regions will not be in favour of handing out more money. So governments will over-ride popular opinion on this and decide for themselves, although Germany and France already hold sway over decision making in my region so nothing would change in that respect.