PDA

View Full Version : Question about Bulgarians and haplogroups!



Yaan
17-12-11, 11:53
I have a couple of questions regarding the haplogroups of the Bulgarians.
1. The Y DNA samples,seem not to be right,there are up to now not a lot of studies on Bulgarians.In 23andme there are like 30 samples, in Family Tree like 170(100 Y DNA), and there are 2-3 more which are never more then 150-170 samples,so it is totally inconclusive, still the frequencies for E(V13) vary from 18% to 22 and I2a is between 27% and 35%,yet here they are different. I do remember that the frequencies for Bulgarian I2a was 33% but because of nationalistic Croat who felt offended that such " Croatian" haplogroup such be observed in such high levels in Bulgarians it was changed. Also Bulgarians in all samples have more R1a (14%-20%,in bigger study maybe more) then R1b which is in most studies really law. J2 is just about right. G2a is high in Bulgarians in all of the studies at least 5 %,and the most in the Balkan if we do not count Turkey. There is a really big sample of almost 860 people now, so when the results come you can change them, maybe there would be not need,but I think there will be. So we can just wait. There is not 250 samples in the study of Bulgarians here!
;2. The mtDNA is not right, I will give a link to a extremely big sample study.Would you please, change it. The people tested in this study were man,so Y DNA is also coming soon.They are also in the processof testing 100remains of people from Bulgaria from the Antic times until the Middle Ages.
3. I would like to ask why in this forum J2 is seen as Middle Eastern,sure it can also be observed there,and the roots are there, but saying J2 is Mesopotamian only is like saying R1a is Indian and R1b Anatolian. J2 in Europa should be market as Med or Balkan!Also E(V13) is hard core European it is observed almost exclusively in Europe in the Middle east and North Africa there is more G2a and R1b than E(V13)Thanks in advance for your attention and keep on the good work!

zanipolo
17-12-11, 20:40
I have a couple of questions regarding the haplogroups of the Bulgarians.
1. The Y DNA samples,seem not to be right,there are up to now not a lot of studies on Bulgarians.In 23andme there are like 30 samples, in Family Tree like 170(100 Y DNA), and there are 2-3 more which are never more then 150-170 samples,so it is totally inconclusive, still the frequencies for E(V13) vary from 18% to 22 and I2a is between 27% and 35%,yet here they are different. I do remember that the frequencies for Bulgarian I2a was 33% but because of nationalistic Croat who felt offended that such " Croatian" haplogroup such be observed in such high levels in Bulgarians it was changed. Also Bulgarians in all samples have more R1a (14%-20%,in bigger study maybe more) then R1b which is in most studies really law. J2 is just about right. G2a is high in Bulgarians in all of the studies at least 5 %,and the most in the Balkan if we do not count Turkey. There is a really big sample of almost 860 people now, so when the results come you can change them, maybe there would be not need,but I think there will be. So we can just wait. There is not 250 samples in the study of Bulgarians here!
;2. The mtDNA is not right, I will give a link to a extremely big sample study.Would you please, change it. The people tested in this study were man,so Y DNA is also coming soon.They are also in the processof testing 100remains of people from Bulgaria from the Antic times until the Middle Ages.
3. I would like to ask why in this forum J2 is seen as Middle Eastern,sure it can also be observed there,and the roots are there, but saying J2 is Mesopotamian only is like saying R1a is Indian and R1b Anatolian. J2 in Europa should be market as Med or Balkan!Also E(V13) is hard core European it is observed almost exclusively in Europe in the Middle east and North Africa there is more G2a and R1b than E(V13)Thanks in advance for your attention and keep on the good work!

you believe this for J then

http://www.goggo.com/terry/HaplogroupI1/European_Haplogroup_locations_circa_5,000BC.jpg

Yaan
17-12-11, 20:48
I believe that J2 together with G2a and R1a is one of the markers of the Indo Europeans. I think the origin of J2 is in parts of what is today Iran, North Iraq and Turkey,more or less the same as Kurdistan. But saying J2 is Mesopotamian is like saying R1b is Anatolian you see what I mean.
The oldest Europeans were I, than come the E(V13),T,J2b and N people.Then G2a,R1a and J2 and the newest Europeans are R1b. Is not a contest, we are all European,just R1b is kind of over rated, probably most if the guys here are R1b so that's why,but lest try to be neutral. I think IE was R1a,J2 and G2a, there is an other theory that it was J2 and E(V13)!
People focus to much on Y DNA, mt DNA is a lot more important. But I generally believe that E(V13),J2b,I and T were in the Balkan first,then R1a,J2 and G2a and last R1b come.Some from Roman soldiers,some from Celts but most of it from Central Asia.

Yaan
19-12-11, 20:17
Here it is the study, I hope the results for Bulgarian MT would be changed soon
http://www.box.com/shared/16h8i3vv27kn6hkpf4le
Soon Y DNA results would come as well!

Yaan
05-02-12, 19:16
So no replay? Why did the moderator did not change the Mt DNA for Bulgarians, I posted a link with 860 samples this is extremely conclusive.I would like to know on what are the Y DNA frequencies for Bulgarians based??

Shetop
05-02-12, 22:15
Y-CHROMOSOMAL HAPLOGROUPS IN BULGARIANS: http://www.proceedings.bas.bg/PDF0/9_03-16b.pdf

Maciamo
06-02-12, 12:55
Thanks for the new mtDNA study, Yaan. Don't worry if it takes time for me to reply as I am very busy and sometimes can't deal with such issues for one or two weeks. I will use this data for the tables as the previous study I had was unreliable.

I have updated the Bulgarian Y-DNA. It includes the data from Rosser et al. (2000), Karachanak (2008) and FTDNA.

Yaan
06-02-12, 16:58
Thanks for the new mtDNA study, Yaan. Don't worry if it takes time for me to reply as I am very busy and sometimes can't deal with such issues for one or two weeks. I will use this data for the tables as the previous study I had was unreliable.

I have updated the Bulgarian Y-DNA. It includes the data from Rosser et al. (2000), Karachanak (2008) and FTDNA.

Thanks for you quick response Maciamo and thank you for updating the date. The samples in the big research for MT DNA were taken from males so I expect later on this year also the results for Y DNA. May I ask you where can I find data for Bulgarian DNA for example this Rosser.Thanks one more time and congratulations for the really nice and educative site.