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Maciamo
30-04-13, 10:26
The global financial crisis and euro crisis have caused VAT (value added tax) rates to increase considerably in most EU countries since 2008, reaching an average of 21.3%. The highest rate is to be found in Hungary, which will inflate the price of your purchases by a whopping 27%. Here is a summary of the VAT increments over the last five years.

Hungary : from 20 to 27%
Croatia : from 21 to 25%
Finland : from 22 to 24%
Romania : from 19 to 24%
Ireland : from 21 to 23%
Portugal : from 20 to 23%
Greece : from 13 to 23%
Italy : from 20 to 21% (soon to 22%)
Czech Republic : from 20 to 21%
Netherlands: from 19 to 21%
Latvia : from 18 to 21%
Lithuania : from 18 to 21%
Spain : from 18 to 21%
Estonia : from 18 to 20%
United Kingdom : from 17.5 to 20%
Cyprus : from 15 to 18%

The rates remained unchanged in the following countries.

Denmark : 25%
Norway : 25%
Sweden : 25%
Belgium : 21%
Austria : 20% (but considering to raise to 22%)
Slovakia : 20%
Slovenia : 20%
France : 19.6%
Germany : 19%
Malta : 18%
Luxembourg : 15%

Yetos
01-05-13, 20:28
when this kind of tax raise above 30% I wonder what difference would have Capitalism and Communism.
since in private property the taxes are much different in states

LeBrok
02-05-13, 03:27
In Capitalism you know how much taxes you pay, in communism you don't.

Yetos
02-05-13, 07:52
that is a good point,
but considering that state takes extra 30% and how much for your health and retirement insurance (another 20-30%) and how much extra if you have your own house,
hmmm no difference, state is not the owner of everything, but is your boss,
no difference, considering that your deposists are also not controled by you.
2000 Capitalism is not different that 70's communism, at least as i watvh him in his 3rd world system in ex Yugoslavia.

I mean in ex-Communism I had to work for my food and my votka since cola was forbiden,
in modern capitalism when state finally takes more than 60% total (sum all taxes) I also have to work for my food which maybe is worse full of conservatives,
so the only difference is that at Communism time I worked 'for the people' and party saved me from hunger.
at modern capitalism time I work for the ' bank numbers' of the money I do not own and the plenty of goods that i can not taste,

only the 'brain wash' changed comparing ex-communism and modern Capitalism, except the decades of 50's-70's Capitalism when Caynes and big leaders rule the land

It is not coincidence that ex-communists are now big 'funs' of Banking system

LeBrok
02-05-13, 09:34
The recent Greek situation is from too much socialism, and lack of capitalism (especially in investing and production).

Maciamo
02-05-13, 11:15
when this kind of tax raise above 30% I wonder what difference would have Capitalism and Communism.
since in private property the taxes are much different in states

True capitalists usually prefer a liberal economy, with free exchange of goods and low taxes. The rise of taxes in Europe are only meant to pay for socialist programmes, like public pensions, subsidised healthcare, and the like.

Actually pensions may be one of the main reasons behind the current economic crisis in Europe. All economists have known for decades that governments wouldn't be able to pay for pensions once baby boomers started to retire en masse from about 2007 (for those whose retirement age is set at 60) or 2013 (for the majority retiring at 65).

The US subprime mortgage crisis of 2007-2008 that caused the global credit crunch was wholly unrelated to the pension crisis, but happened to coincide with it, which made matters worse for Europe, where the population is ageing faster than in the USA.

That's why Europe isn't going to see the end of the crisis any time soon unless the pension system is seriously amended, with a considerably higher pension age (70 might be good to keep the system running). Unfortunately most ordinary people will never accept that, which is why governments don't have much alternative than to raise taxes and cut other expenses (like reducing the number of civil servants).

ElHorsto
02-05-13, 11:47
True capitalists usually prefer a liberal economy, with free exchange of goods and low taxes. The rise of taxes in Europe are only meant to pay for socialist programmes, like public pensions, subsidised healthcare, and the like.


But capitalists prefer these circumstances only as long as they believe they will benefit. If they are afraid to go bakrupt, then they try to force the government to bail them out. The social programmes are one side of the story only. For instance the purchase of the toxic financial waste from the banks (the case "Bad Bank" Hypo Real Estate) costed 140 Billion EURO for Germany alone. This is more than what the unemployed cost in Germany.

ElHorsto
02-05-13, 12:54
This is more than what the unemployed cost in Germany.

Ok, if I did the math right, this was meant per year.

nordicwarbler
02-05-13, 13:48
True capitalists usually prefer a liberal economy, with free exchange of goods and low taxes. The rise of taxes in Europe are only meant to pay for socialist programmes, like public pensions, subsidised healthcare, and the like.

Actually pensions may be one of the main reasons behind the current economic crisis in Europe. All economists have known for decades that governments wouldn't be able to pay for pensions once baby boomers started to retire en masse from about 2007 (for those whose retirement age is set at 60) or 2013 (for the majority retiring at 65).

The US subprime mortgage crisis of 2007-2008 that caused the global credit crunch was wholly unrelated to the pension crisis, but happened to coincide with it, which made matters worse for Europe, where the population is ageing faster than in the USA.

That's why Europe isn't going to see the end of the crisis any time soon unless the pension system is seriously amended, with a considerably higher pension age (70 might be good to keep the system running). Unfortunately most ordinary people will never accept that, which is why governments don't have much alternative than to raise taxes and cut other expenses (like reducing the number of civil servants).

Wow I actually agree with this entire statement. Spot on. This crisis isn't going anywhere because of demographics.

LeBrok
02-05-13, 18:20
Actually pensions may be one of the main reasons behind the current economic crisis in Europe. All economists have known for decades that governments wouldn't be able to pay for pensions once baby boomers started to retire en masse from about 2007 (for those whose retirement age is set at 60) or 2013 (for the majority retiring at 65).


Exactly, the mountains of unfunded liabilities.

ElHorsto
02-05-13, 18:40
That's why Europe isn't going to see the end of the crisis any time soon unless the pension system is seriously amended, with a considerably higher pension age (70 might be good to keep the system running). Unfortunately most ordinary people will never accept that, which is why governments don't have much alternative than to raise taxes and cut other expenses (like reducing the number of civil servants).

True. Actually this should have nothing to do with taxes, because the pensions in most european countries are based on a special pension pool which was filled only by the past labourers for the current retirees. If it is not sufficient for all, then well ok, it is their problem. But it has this single pension purpose only. There was a reason why it was separated from the household.

Maciamo
02-05-13, 22:35
True. Actually this should have nothing to do with taxes, because the pensions in most european countries are based on a special pension pool which was filled only by the past labourers for the current retirees. If it is not sufficient for all, then well ok, it is their problem. But it has this single pension purpose only. There was a reason why it was separated from the household.

I agree. People should be free to save for their pensions by themselves. Governments in Europe just assume that all people are too stupid or immature to manage their assets. The attitude of the state towards the population is not much better than colonial paternalism.