PDA

View Full Version : Phylogeographical Analysis of the J2b2 M241 Geno 2.0 Heatmap



RHAS
11-11-13, 18:08
(Comparing historical data with heatmap hotspots.)

https://scontent-a-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash2/548573_497601260298034_850483163_n.jpg

Map Source: https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:11
1. Balkans & Greece Cluster

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/906472_634784396579719_661420815_o.jpg

Seemingly the center of the J2b2 activity, the Balkan peninsula is the home of the Greeks, Macedonians, Thracians and Illyrians. Every other area in the heatmap has some sort of reference to at least one of these peoples, in particular the Greeks, Thracians and Macedonians. Thrace, Greece and Phrygia (Macedonian immigrants to Anatolia) all participated in the Trojan war and references about Troy we find also in other J2b2 hotspots like India, The Rhineland and Portugal. The first historical record about the Thracians is found in the Iliad, where they are described as allies of the Trojans in the Trojan War against the Greeks. In Greek mythology Thrax was considered to be the son of Ares. The first historical attestation of the Macedonians occurs in the works of Herodotus during the mid-5th century BC. Macedonia or Macedon was an ancient Greek kingdom. The kingdom, centered in the northeastern part of the Greek peninsula, was bordered by Epirus to the west, Paeonia to the north, the region of Thrace to the east and Thessaly to the south. The rise of Macedon, from a small kingdom at the periphery of Classical Greek affairs, to one which came to dominate the entire Hellenic world, occurred under the reign of Philip II. For a brief period, after the conquests of Alexander the Great, it became the most powerful state in the world, controlling a territory that included the former Persian empire, stretching as far as the Indus River; at that time it inaugurated the Hellenistic period of Ancient Greek civilization. It is likely the J2b2`s living in this area originated here and share history with Thracian, Illyrian, Macedonian and Greek cultures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrace
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thracians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyrians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greece
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Graecia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenic_civilization
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_the_Great
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy

"Cruciani et al.’s E-V13 and J2-M12 coalescence times bear a striking similarity to carbon-14-based date calculations for certain archaeological sites in the Maritsa river valley and its tributaries, near the city of Nova Zagora, Bulgaria (Nilolova, 2002). These sites are associated directly with the proto-Thracian culture of the southern Balkans that came to dominate the region during the first millennium BCE. Sites surveyed included Ezero, Yunatsite, Dubene-Sarovka and Plovdiv-Nebet Tepe, all of which had deep associations with the developing EBA proto-Thracian culture of the region."
Haplogroup E3b1a2 as a Possible Indicator of Settlement in Roman Britain by Soldiers of Balkan Origin.
http://www.jogg.info/32/bird.htm

"The majority of the haplogroups (R1a-M17, G2a-P15, I2-M438, J1-M267 and J2b-M102) shows times since expansion which ranges from approximately 4,5Kya to 2,7Kya, compatible with Bronze Age and the development of the Helladic civilizations, more specifically with the spread of Mycenaean culture (Montjoy 1998)."
The Genetic Signature of Neolithic in Greece.
http://amsdottorato.cib.unibo.it/3628/1/Anagnostou_Paolo_tesi.pdf

"Regarding Hg J-M12/M102, which is discernable from India to Europe, the M12/M102* chromosomes display a very high YSTR diversity, whereas on the other hand, the J-M241 sub-lineage has low diversity in the Balkans, indicating different demographic histories. Although Hg J-M241 shows high variance in India, its place of origin is still uncertain. As J-M241 has older expansion times in Sicily, Apulia and Turkey, it may have arrived in the Balkans from elsewhere."
Y-chromosomal evidence of the cultural diffusion of agriculture in southeast Europe.
http://www.unipv.eu/on-line/Home/AreaStampa/documento2986.html

"J2b has a quite different distribution from J2a. J2b seems to have a stronger association with the Chalcolithic cultures of Southeast Europe, and is particulary common in the Balkans, Central Europe and Italy, which is roughly the extent of the European Copper Age culture."
Eupedia.com, 2013.
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_J2_Y-DNA.shtml

"The Neolithic component in the SEE paternal gene pool is most clearly marked by the presence of the J–M241 (more frequent in the Southern Balkans) lineage, and its expansion signals associated with Balkan microsatellite variation correlate with the Neolithic period."
Implications of the role of Southeastern Europe in the origins and diffusion of major Eurasian paternal lineages.
http://arheologija.ff.uni-lj.si/documenta/pdf36/36_6.pdf

"Both the sub-branches of haplogroup J2-M172 (J2a-M410 and J2b-M102) are found in the two Greek regions. The main branch is J2a-M410, a higher frequency of this haplogroup is observed for Euboea (15.6%) rather than Korinthia (10.9%). The inner structure of J2a-M410 reveals that the main branch for Euboea is J2a-M67, which accounts for the 40% of the total J2a-M410 haplotypes while the majority of the Korinthia haplotypes (75%) falls within the J2a-M67 and J2a-DYS445≤7 branches. The sister clade of J2a-M410, J2b-M102 shows a higher frequency in Euboea (9.4%), with the majority of haplotypes belonging to the J2b-M241 sub-branch (77.8%). On the other hand Korinthia shows a frequency of haplogroup J2b-M241 of 5.5%, with all haplotypes belonging to the J2b-M241 lineage."
The Genetic Signature of Neolithic in Greece.
http://amsdottorato.cib.unibo.it/3628/1/Anagnostou_Paolo_tesi.pdf

"Haplogroup J2b-M12 was frequent in Thessaly and Greek Macedonia while haplogroup J2a-M410 was scarce. Alternatively, Crete, like Anatolia showed a high frequency of J2a-M410 and a low frequency of J2b-M12."
Differential Y-chromosome Anatolian Influences on the Greek and Cretan Neolithic, 2008.
http://www.atlascom.gr/HELLENIC_DNA_PAPER.PDF


"Interesting results from the lineage analysis can be summarized as follows: (i) R-L23*, the eastern branch of haplogroup R-M269, is present in Eastern Bulgaria since the post glacial period; (ii) haplogroup E-V13, which probably originated in Western Asia, has a Mesolithic age in Bulgaria from where it expanded after the spread of farming marked by haplogroup G-P15, J-M410 representatives; (iii) haplogroup J-M241 probably reflects the Neolithic westward expansion of farmers from the earliest sites along the Black Sea."
Y-Chromosome Diversity in Modern Bulgarians: New Clues about Their Ancestry.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0056779

"Paternal genetic heritage was studied on DNA from 1,141 individuals analyzed for Y chromosome markers (data from the Institute for Anthropological Research, Zagreb, Croatia and from the published sources) (Barač et al., 2003; Rootsi et al., 2004; Peričić et al., 2005a, 2005b). The individuals were from the continental parts of the Balkan peninsula, the north-west Adriatic and the south-east Alpine areas as well as from the Eastern Adriatic islands, i.e. the areas where the different Illyrian trybes settled during the Iron Age period. The sample was analyzed for Y chromosomal haplogroup frequencies in 9 populations and classified as I1a, I1b*-P37, R1a-SRY1532, R1b-M173, E3b1-M78 and J2e1 haplogroups."
Language Bounderies and Microevolutionary processes in South-Eastern Europe.
http://www.anthroinsula.org/resources/Iliri-english%20text%20version.pdf

"Magna Graecia (Latin meaning "Great Greece", Greek: Μεγάλη Ἑλλάς, Megálē Hellás) is the name of the coastal areas of Southern Italy on the Tarentine Gulf that were extensively colonized by Greek settlers; particularly the Achaean colonies of Tarentum, Croton, and Sybaris, but also, more loosely, the cities of Cumae and Neapolis to the north. The colonists, who began arriving in the 8th century BC, brought with them their Hellenic civilization, which was to leave a lasting imprint in Italy, particularly on the culture of ancient Rome."
Magna Graecia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Graecia

"At the start of Augustus' sole rule (30 BC), the original core auxiliary units in the West were composed of warlike tribesmen from the Gallic provinces (especially Gallia Belgica, which then included the regions later separated to form the provinces Germania Inferior and Germania Superior), and from the Illyrian provinces (Dalmatia and Illyricum). By 19 BC, the Cantabrian and Asturian Wars were concluded, leading to the annexation of northern Hispania and Lusitania. Judging by the names of attested auxiliary regiments, these parts of the Iberian peninsula soon became a major source of recruits. Then the Danubian regions were annexed: Raetia (annexed 15 BC), Noricum (16 BC), Pannonia (9 BC) and Moesia (6 AD), becoming, with Illyricum, the Principate's most important source of auxiliary recruits for its entire duration."
Auxiliaries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auxiliaries_(Roman_military)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWtDzafUxa4

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:16
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgAROA7ckkk

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/184237_496319183759575_16157473_n.jpg
(Image:Orpheus wearing a Phrygian Cap, See 2. Anatolia/Asia Minor Cluster)

Orpheus, the son of the Thracian king Oiagros was a figure from Greek/Thracian mythology. He was a legendary musician, poet, and prophet in ancient Greek religion and myth. The major stories about him are centered on his ability to charm all living things and even stones with his music, his attempt to retrieve his wife, Eurydice, from the underworld (Tartaros) , and his death at the hands of those who could not hear his divine music. As an archetype of the inspired singer, Orpheus is one of the most significant figures in the reception of classical mythology in Western culture, portrayed or alluded to in countless forms of art and popular culture including poetry, opera, and paintings.

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:18
2. Anatolia/Asia Minor Cluster

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/996635_628107213914104_1173937926_n.jpg


The Northern hotspot in Anatolia on the J2b2 heatmap corresponds to the territory of the ancient Bithynians and Phrygians. The Bithynians are immigrants to Asia Minor from the Balkans, their original homeland is situated in Thrace were they were called the Thyni. Phrygians (ca. 1200 - 700 BC) are also ancient immigrants to Anatolia from the Balkans (Macedonia) were they were originally known as the Bryges. The Phrygians were allied to Troy and participated in the Trojan wars. Phrygians are also known for the Gordian Knot legend which together with their Macedonian ancestry links them to Alexander the Great and for their Phrygian Cap which would be the hat the god Mithras (popular with Roman Legionnaires) is wearing. Herodotus claims the Phrygians founded the Armenian Nation. Both areas were also Roman provinces. The origin history of the people/region in the south of Asia Minor is slightly harder to connect directly to the Balkans/Greece but it is situated roughly were we find the Hellenized Armenian Seleucid Kingdom(s) of Commagene and Sophene, and on a side note the ancient site of Gobekli Tepe wich by some is believed to be the original garden of Eden. The Commagene dynasty claimed ties with Alexander the Great (Macedonia) and Antiochus I Theos of Commagene was allied to the Roman general Pompey. Anatolia in general is also the place where we find the city of Troy, the river Xanthus and the city of Tarsus. Anatolia was part of the Roman empire for about 15 centuries. (Roman Empire + Byzantium) While it’s possible that the J2b2`s found in Anatolia, immigrated to Asia minor as Roman Soldiers (recruited from Thrace and/or Macedon) or have some form of Greek heritage (Alexander the Great), they seem to be especially linked to Bithynians and Phrygians whose origins are documented by Greek historians like Herodotus to be situated in the Balkans (Macedonia & Thrace).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygian_cap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bithynia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bithyni
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thyni
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seleucid
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commagene
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophene
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scamander
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarsus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xanthus

"Several authors have proposed that the Indo-European language presently spoken by Armenians arose during the Bronze Age, when Indo-European speaking tribes from the Balkans and Greece invaded Anatolia and Transcaucasia, leading to the subsequent spread of their culture and language. In this study, we have detected a number of lineages that are prominent in the Balkans (I2*, I2b*, J2b1 and J2b2) at low levels throughout Ararat Valley, Gardman and Lake Van, the latter of which also contains haplogroups commonly associated with Bronze Age Greece (ie, J2a8-M319 (4.9%), and E1b1b1-M78 and its sublineages (3.9%)). While this may suggest genetic input from early Greek or Phrygian tribes, it is also possible that these low levels of Balkan lineages arrived in Armenia at a later time, such as during one of the many incursions into the area during the reign of the Macedonian, Roman and Byzantine empires."
Neolithic patrilineal signals indicate that the Armenian plateau was repopulated by agriculturalists.
http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v20/n3/full/ejhg2011192a.html

"I-P37 and J-M12 are dated to 1,100BC and 1,200BC, at around the time that e.g. the Phrygians from the Balkans are believed to have migrated to Asia Minor. I-P37 and J-M12 reach their maxima in areas north of Greece where the Phrygians are said to have originated."
How Y-STR variance accumulates: a comment on Zhivotovsky, Underhill and Feldman (2006)
http://dienekes.blogspot.nl/2008/07/how-y-str-variance-accumulates-comment.html

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/73/Bust_Attis_CdM.jpg/430px-Bust_Attis_CdM.jpg
Attis wearing a Phrygian Cap.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/02/Mithra_sacrifiant_le_Taureau-005.JPG/522px-Mithra_sacrifiant_le_Taureau-005.JPG
Mithras wearing a Phrygian Cap.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/Judgement_Paris_Altemps_Inv8563_n2.jpg/678px-Judgement_Paris_Altemps_Inv8563_n2.jpg
Paris of Troy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_(mythology)) wearing a Phrygian cap. Marble, Roman artwork from the Hadrianic period (117-138 CE).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYdP5ywMcxk

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:20
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4iV1kT1L_0

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:25
3. Rhineland & Boulogne Cluster

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1412764_628020043922821_2086965139_o.jpg

The small hotspot in North West Europe on the left in the J2b2 map seems to be situated around the now French town of Bologne-Sur-Mer, in Roman times known as Gesoriacum, the port Portus Itius was believed to be situated there. The bigger hotspot on the right seems to have its center between the river Meuse and the Rhine. This area was heavily Romanized with dozens of fortresses and/or towns (many are not shown on this map), most notably the Dutch city of Nijmegen (In Roman times called Noviomagus), the German city of Koln in Roman times know as Colonia Agrippina (which was the largest Roman city north of the Alps), the Belgian town of Tongeren in Roman times called Atuatuca, the modern German city of Xanten with its fortress Castra Vetera and the modern German City of Neuss in Roman times called Novaesium. The last 2 seems to be right in the center of the J2b2 Hotspot. J2a members with Xanten derived surnames like Santen are also reported in these areas. While most agree that the name of the city is derived from an executed Roman soldier from the Theban legion who later became a saint, there are those who connect its name to the river god Scamandros/Xanthos who dwelled near the river Scamander in the vicinity of Troy. There is also a river named Xanthus in Anatolia.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/704363_473217516068948_508554809_o.jpg

All major Roman settlements north of Mainz (Britain excluded) are located in the 2 J2b2 areas. Many Roman legions were stationed in this area over the years, for instance; Legio V Alaudae, Legio XX Valeria Victrix, Legio X Gemina, Legio IV Macedonica and Ala I Thracum an auxiliary unit with Thracian Horsemen. It is known that the Romans used the Balkans as a major recruiting area for legionnaires and there are artifacts known that suggest some of these legionairs settled in the Rhineland after their military service was completed. Interesting also are the references to Troy in this region which include; The Trojan heritage claimed by the Dukes of Kleve, The Roman history writer Tacitus who tells of Greek inscriptions at the fortress of Asciburgium connected to Odysseus (just like the Portuguese city Lisbon), and the Frankish Trojan origin myth regarding the Sicambri tribe. Several J2b2`s in/from this area claim indirect descent from Charlemagne. J2b2`s from this region are likely to have Thracian, Greek or Macedonian ancestry brought to this region in the form of Roman legionairs. The supposedly Trojan origins of the Sicambri (Clovis) tribe and the dukes of Kleve (Arenatium) is interesting.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niederrheinischer_Trojamythos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legio_V_Alaudae
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legio_X_Gemina
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlemagne
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sicambri
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xanten

"In deze studie wordt een tot nu toe niet bekende concentratie van de haplogroepen J in oostelijk Brabant aangetroffen. Het betreft hier voornamelijk J2 en oude, gevestigde families. Het is niet onmogelijk dat hier sprake is van families van nazaten van ´Romeinse´soldaten. Ook in het grensgebied van Engeland en Schotland is een concentratie van J2 families gevonden. In dat gebied zijn ook resten van tempels van de Iraanse god Mitras bekend en blijkt er een boogschuttereenheid uit het Midden/Oosten gelegerd geweest te zijn. Romeinse aanwezigheid in het land van Cuijck en aan de randen van de Peel (de naam is afkomstig van de naam die de Romeinen aan het gied gaven: Locus Paludosus ofwel moerassige streek) is bekend, zoals ook landmetingen van militairen die zich er gevestigd hadden en landbouw bedreven."
Project Genetische Genealogie in Nederland. (Dutch)
http://www.barjesteh.nl/DNAproject.htm

Translated: "In this study is an untill now unknown concentration of J haplogroups found in eastern Brabant. These mainly are old established J2 families. It is not impossible that these families are descendants of Roman Soldiers. Also in the border area of England and Scotland concentrations of J2 families are found. In these areas temples of the Iranian god Mithras are known to have excisted and there appears to be remnants of an archer unit stationed in the Middle / East. Roman presence in the country in that area of Cuijck and at the edges of the Peel (the name comes from the name the Romans gave to the area: Locus paludosus either swampy area) is known, as surveying of soldiers who had established themselves here and were agriculture experts."

"Nog een aardigheidje voor Oost-Brabant: daar is een relatieve concentratie van haplogroep J gevonden. Volgens genetisch genealogen zijn die mensen waarschijnlijk nazaten van de oude Romeinen, gelegerd in Noviomagus (Nijmegen) of rond Locus Paludosus (De Peel)."
Artikel/Boekrecensie "Zonen van Adam in Nederland", Eindhovens Dagblad dinsdag 03 februari 2009.

Translated: "One remarkable fact about this research is the concentration of J(2) found in the province of North Brabant, Genetic Genealogist believe these people are decended from Roman Soldiers stationed in Noviomagus (City of Nijmegen) and Locus Paludosis (De Peel)"

"Het voorkomen van J houdt mogelijk verband met de Romeinse tijd. Zij komen m.n. voor in Noord-Oost Brabant, waar het Romeinse leger nog lang aanwezig is geweest. Wellicht dat ook het voorkomen van de haplogroepen G en E hiermee verband houden."
Project Genetische Genealogie 2008, Website Nederlandse Genealogische Vereniging 2011.

Translated: "The occurence of Haplogroup J is possibly linked to Roman times. It is large present in North East brabant, were the Roman military was present for a long time. It is possible that Haplogroups E and G are also related to these times."

"„Ceterum et Ulixen quidam opinantur longo illo et fabuloso errore in hunc Oceanum delatum adisse Germaniae terras, Asciburgiumque, quod in ripa Rheni situm hodieque incolitur, ab illo constitutum nominatumque; aram quin etiam Ulixi consecratam, adiecto Laertae patris nomine, eodem loco olim repertam, monumentaque et tumulos quosdam Graecis litteris inscriptos in confinio Germaniae Raetiaeque adhuc extare.“
Tacitus, Germania.

"In contrast to many other Germanic tribes, no Merovingians claimed to be descended from Wodan. Instead, the sacred tradition of a cart pulled by bulls seems to be present from the early Merovingians on. The bulls that pulled the cart were taken as special animals, and according to Salian law the theft of those animals would impose a high sanction. In the grave of Childeric I (died 481) was found the head of a bull, craftily made out of gold."
Frankish Mythology.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankish_mythology

https://www.mtholyoke.edu/courses/rfonfa/ppf02/images/iliad/141624.jpg
Title: Fight of Achilles with the River Scamander (Xanthos)
Artist: Runge, Philipp Otto (1777-1810) Location: Hamburg Kunsthalle, Hamburg, Germany


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_1COdzfYOk

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:27
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fDJg49eO0E

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:32
4. Spain & Portugal Cluster

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1395182_628104387247720_1078771643_n.jpg

Ancient Tartessos was an old harbor city/trading post mentioned first in Greek sources from about the middle of the first millennium BC. Greeks and Phoenicians competed to gain influence in the Tartessos region. The area was rich in metals. A Tartessian king with the name Arganthonios is known to have invited a Greek group of Phocaeans (close to Troy, Xanthus and Phrygia) to settle in his city. He also gave them large amounts of silver to pay for defensive measures for the Phocaeans homeland in Asia Minor. Greek trading posts are believed to have existed in this region, like Portus Menesthei which surprisingly enough is linked to a Trojan myth regarding the settlement of the Trojan king Menestheus in Iberia. Lisbon on the edge of the J2b2 heatmap area in Portugal has an origin myth connected to Odysseus, just like the Rhineland fortress of Asciburgium. Tartessos is believed by some to be the legendary city of Atlantis. It is in this region that the Pillars of Hercules are located and here Hercules/Heracles stole the Cattle of Geryon as one of his Ten Labours. It is the home of the Spanish cult of the Bull as much as Knossos, was the home of the Minoan cult of the Bull. Tartessos was probably destroyed by Cathagians, but recent finds also show a flood event at the time of its disappearance from history. The Conii or Cynetes are a group of people we find in the Algarve region in Roman times after the fall of Tartessos. While they lived in Celtic areas it is Herodotus who distinguished them from the Celts. The Conii were allied to Rome. Several Roman cities existed in the region. A retirement settlement for Roman legionnaires from the Legions V Alaudae (also present in Xanten, Rhineland and Dacia, Balkans) and X Gemina (also present in the Rhineland and the Balkans) was built at Merida (Emerito Augusta). Biblical archeologists often identify the place-name Tarshish in the Hebrew Bible with Tartessos, though others connect it to Tarsus in Anatolia (see Anatolia/Asia Minor Cluster) or other places as far as India. (See entry for Jonah in the Jewish Encyclopedia.) Tarshish, like Tartessos, is associated with extensive mineral wealth (Iberian Pyrite Belt)." While the origins of the Tartessians remains unknown, it is known they were in contact with ancient Greeks (Phocaeans) who even seem to have settled in the region, based on that fact it seems possible for the J2b2`s in the Portugal region to have Greek ancestry. Another origin possibility for the J2b2s in this region would be the settlement of Roman legionnaires with Thracian, Macedonian or Greek ancestry, from the same stock that would populate the Rhineland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tartessos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tartessian_language
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lissabon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emerita_Augusta
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cynetes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phocaea
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odysseus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arganthonios
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legio_V_Alaudae
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legio_X_Gemina

"Lisbon's name was written Ulyssippo in Latin by the geographer Pomponius Mela, a native of Hispania. It was later referenced as "Olisippo" by Pliny the Elder and to the Greeks as Olissipo (Ολισσιπών) and Olissipona (Ολισσιπόνα). According to legend, the location was named for Ulysses, who founded the settlement after he left Troy to escape the Greek coalition. Later, the Greek name appeared in Vulgar Latin in the form Olissipona."
Lisbon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisbon

"MENESTHEI PORTUS (ὁ Μενεσθέως λιμήν), a harbour of Hispania Baetica, between Gades and Asta. (Strab. iii. p.140; Ptol. 2.4.5; Marcian p. 40.) In its neighbourhood was the oracle of Menestheus (Strab. l.c.), to whom, also, the inhabitants of Gades offered sacrifices. (Philostr. Vit. Apoll v. l.) The Scholiast on Thucydides (1.12) relates that Menestheus, being expelled by the Theseidae, went to Iberia."
Dictionary of Greek and Roman Geography, illustrated by numerous engravings on wood.
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.04.0064:entry=menesthei-portus-geo


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rov38Xe1OOs

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:33
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbemSdSm-nY

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:36
5. Qatar & Bahrain Cluster

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1451531_634783916579767_806420941_n.jpg

At the center of the J2b2 hotspot in the Persian Gulf we find the states Bahrain and Qatar. These countries were among others part of the Ottoman Empire (Anatolia/Asia Minor Cluster) and at one point also belonged to Portugal (Portugal/Spain Cluster). The countries are positioned in the middel of the old Greco-Roman trade routes to India. In the 5th century BC, the Greek historian Herodotus referred to the seafaring Canaanites as the original inhabitants of Qatar. The Greeks came to the Gulf with Alexander the Great (Macedonia) and settled in Failaka in Kuwait, in Bahrain, in the Emirate of Sharjah and had logged all the ports that could be turned into profitable trading posts. It was in the first century AD that Pliny the Elder, a Roman writer, used the work “Catharrei” to refer to the people who lived in this area. In the following century, Ptolemy, the famous Greek geographer, added the word “qatara” over the peninsula on his map of the Arab countries, which is believed to refer to the Qatari town of Zubarah. J2b2 inhabitants of Qatar and Bahrain could very well have either Portuguese (Greek, Roman-Balkanic), Ottoman (Phrygian -> Macedonian) or Greek (Macedonian) ancestry.

"The Greek admiral Nearchus is believed to have been the first of Alexander's commanders to visit this islands, and he found a verdant land that was part of a wide trading network; he recorded: “That in the island of Tylos, situated in the Persian Gulf, are large plantations of cotton tree, from which are manufactured clothes called sindones, a very different degrees of value, some being costly, others less expensive. The use of these is not confined to India, but extends to Arabia.” The Greek historian, Theophrastus, states that much of the islands were covered in these cotton trees and that Tylos was famous for exporting walking canes engraved with emblems that were customarily carried in Babylon. Ares was also worshipped by the ancient Baharna and the Greek colonists. It is not known whether Bahrain was part of the Seleucid Empire, although the archaeological site at Qalat Al Bahrain has been proposed as a Seleucid base in the Persian Gulf. Alexander had planned to settle the eastern shores of the Persian Gulf with Greek colonists, and although it is not clear that this happened on the scale he envisaged, Tylos was very much part of the Hellenised world: the language of the upper classes was Greek (although Aramaic was in everyday use), while Zeus was worshipped in the form of the Arabian sun-god Shams. Tylos even became the site of Greek athletic contests."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bahrain


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahrein
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bahrain
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Qatar

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:45
6. Pakistan & India Cluster

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/913947_634784779913014_45060071_o.jpg

The hotspot between India and Qatar would be the area around the modern town of Karachi (Pakistan). The area of Karachi was known to the ancient Greeks by many names: Krokola, the place where Alexander the Great (Macedonia) camped to prepare a fleet for Babylonia after his campaign in the Indus Valley; 'Morontobara' (probably Manora island near Karachi harbor), from whence Alexander's admiral Nearchus set sail; and Barbarikon, a port of the Greco-Bactrian kingdom. This is also the area were the Indus Civilization was located. Several settlements/colonies were founded by Alexander the Great, some of which had as many as 7000 Macedonians living within their borders. The colony Alexandria on the Indus was home to approximately 10000 Thracian veterans fighting in the Macedonian Army. Several tribes in Pakistan to this day claim descend from Alexander the Greats Army. During the siege of the capital of the Mallians, modern Multan, Alexander was seriously wounded by an arrow; he owed his survival to Abreas, Peucestas and a bodyguard named Leonnatus, who protected the king with the sacred shield of Troy which they had taken years earler from the temple of Athena during Alexanders visit to the ancient city of Troy. While Alexander did not penetrate India so far eastwards to cover the all the J2b2 hotspots in India, his successor king Menander of the Indo Greek kingdom did. Eventually the Macedonian Indo-Greek satrapies were conquered by the Indian emperor Sandrokyptos from the Mauryan Empire. There are more theories about the presence of J2b(2) in India though. There are those for example who claim that some J2b(2) lineages from the Caucasus were part of the Indo-Aryan invasion of the indus valley alongside R1a and those who claim a Neolithic J2 expansion into India. Another theory even tells of Indian origins of the Greeks and Macedonians which would bring us back to the Balkans. Considering however the other findings regarding the rest of the J2b2 heatmap areas and excluding the Indian origin theory of the Greeks and Macedonians one can easily imagine the J2b2`s in India to be descended of the Army of Alexander the Great. (Greeks/Macedonians, Thracians)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karachi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nearchus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Greek_Kingdom
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_trade_with_India
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandria_in_the_caucasus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandria_Eschate
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandria_on_the_Indus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chandragupta_Maurya
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahajanapada
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indus_Valley_civilization

"The Saluja’s have been a dynamic and mobile group of business people and professionals from North India. They hail from the region north of the river Jhelum, that divides the Jhelum & Gujrat districts, an area along the Salt mines (now in Pakistan). Historical records indicate that Alexander the Great of Macedonia came to India (326 B.C) crossing the Khyber Pass to Taxila near Rawalpindi. Alexander advanced to the northwest bank of the river Jhelum to the village of Haranpur, where allegedly the Macedonians set up their base camp prior to the battle with King Porus. It is quite conceivable that people from that area of North India particularly Haranpur, Jalalpur & surroundings to have Genes of people from Greece. In fact, DNA Analysis suggests that Saluja’s belong to the DNA Haplogroup J2b, which has its origin in Greece. J2b (M12, M314, M221, M102), and is mainly found in the Balkans, Greece, Italy, and India (possibly from Neolithic Greeks)*****J2b1 (M205) - formerly J2b1b. The Saluja family history can be traced directly to this historical melting pot."
Migration of Indians Across Continents spanning generations: A Case History of the Saluja Family.
http://www.amazon.com/Migration-Indians-Continents-spanning-generations/dp/0615469035

"In which country did Mr. J2b2 live? Did Mr. J2b2 live in the Balkans and then his descendants move to India. Or was was it that Mr. J2b2 lived in India and then his descendants moved to the Balkans. One of the theories is that Mr. J2b2's descendant were part of Alexander the Greats army which made itself all the way to India."
Barr-Kumarakulasinghe’s and other families.
http://barrkumar.com/dna/whats_j2b2.html

"Although, on a general scale, we can argue for largely the same prehistoric genetic inheritance in Indian tribal and caste populations, this does not refute the existence of genetic footprints laid down by known historical events. This would include invasions by the Huns, Greeks, Kushans, Moghuls, Muslims, English, and others. The political influence of Seleucid and Bactrian dynastic Greeks over northwest India, for example, persisted for several centuries after the invasion of the army of Alexander the Great."
The Genetic Heritage of the Earliest Settlers Persists Both in Indian Tribal and Caste Populations.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002929707605412

"Both E-V13 and J-M12 have also been used in studies seeking to find evidence of a remaining Greek presence in Afghanistan and Pakistan, going back to the time of Alexander the Great."
Wikipedia.org - Haplogroup E V-68.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_E-V68_(Y-DNA) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_E-V68_(Y-DNA))

RHAS
11-11-13, 18:46
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fx3TYjoCN5w

------------

Conclusion

"While no definitive claims regarding this research can be made, we can make a number of interesting observations. For instance; All highlighted areas on the J2b2 heatmap have had direct and/or indirect cultural/personal contact with the people described in the Balkan/Greece cluster. (Thracians, Macedonians, Greeks). We looked at 6 different clusters on the J2b2 heatmap, 5 of them have one or more Trojan 'origin' myth(s) present in the region. (Greece/Balkans, Anatolia/Asia minor, Rhineland & Boulogne, Pakistan & India and Portugal & Spain.) All areas involved have had direct (Rhineland, Balkans, Anatolia, Greece, Portugal) or indirect (Qatar, India, Pakistan) (via trade routes) contact with the Romans. Ancient Phrygian and Bithynian origin accounts (Macedonia, Thrace) are compatible to the J2b2 Heatmap. At least 2 Roman legions (Legio V Alaudae, Legio X Gemini) can be identified who were present in at least 3 heatmap areas (Rhineland, Portugal/Spain, Balkans) in 2 of these areas they are known to have settled. (Rhineland, Portugal/Spain) Of course, there are more ways for J2b2 members to have spread to the areas highlighted on the J2b2 heatmap as being suggested in this paper, it is interesting however to see how easily all these regions are connected through Greek, Macedonian and/or Thracian mythology, history and migrations."

Nobody1
11-11-13, 18:48
as for Emerita Augusta;
It was a veteran colony founded in 25 BC for veterans of LEG X Gemina and LEG V Alaudae;
Since it was Roman law that only Roman citizens were allowed to serve in the Legions and by 25 BC only the City of Rome, Italic tribes (Social War) and Gallia Cisalpina (Caesar) held Roman Citizenship those Veteran Legionaries were exclusively Italic/Pelasgian (Umbrian/Etruscan) from Roman Italy; And therefor largely J2a and not J2b; Plus R1b-U152 and G2a; but since all of it is largely absent from this area it has nothing - absolutely nothing to do with the Romans or fictitious Thracians, Macedonians and Greeks in legions they were never a part of;

RHAS
14-11-13, 06:41
as for Emerita Augusta;
It was a veteran colony founded in 25 BC for veterans of LEG X Gemina and LEG V Alaudae;

Correct, and it was a Roman town after that for centuries to come, V Alaudae continued to exsist to until about the year 68. X Gemina lasted until the 4th century. And given the fact members of these legions were among its first inhabitants one could envision some sort of continuity of this tradition during its existence, like a well known Military veteran resort in the Netherlnds that was build for Dutch East Indian soldiers 2 centuries ago and now houses Dutch veterans (immigrants and native) from many wars after that. The continuity is in the legions/regiments and its taditions.


as for Emerita Augusta;
Since it was Roman law that only Roman citizens were allowed to serve in the Legions and by 25 BC only the City of Rome, Italic tribes (Social War) and Gallia Cisalpina (Caesar) held Roman Citizenship those Veteran Legionaries were exclusively Italic/Pelasgian (Umbrian/Etruscan) from Roman Italy

Roman citizenship was granted to the entire Italian peninsula in about 90 BC, including the "Greek and Illyrian influenced" South.


as for Emerita Augusta;
those Veteran Legionaries were exclusively Italic/Pelasgian (Umbrian/Etruscan) from Roman Italy; And therefor largely J2a and not J2b; Plus R1b-U152 and G2a;

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/599143_501273933264100_273656457_n.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/67/Pelasgians.jpg

adamo
14-11-13, 12:48
Funny how the Dardanelles region of Troy that Aeneas migrated from towards Italy has Pelasgian smeared all over it.

RHAS
24-11-13, 17:36
"J2b2a-L283 was discovered by Family Tree DNA through its "Walk Through The Y" program, and is predominantly Middle-Eastern, Mediterranean and European. The M12/M241 frequency peak in the Balkan Peninsula and Italy observed by Semino et al. [35] and Cruciani et al. [45], may instead belong to sub-clade L283. A recent Z631 sub-branch expansion from east to west through the heart of Europe to the UK along with presence in Italy and Spain might be associated with Roman expansion using mercenaries and slaves acquired in the Balkans."
Generation of high-resolution a priori Y-chromosome phylogenies using "next-generation" sequencing data.
http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2013/11/22/000802.1.full.pdf

RHAS
17-05-14, 02:01
Phrygia <-----> Spain.

"Phrygia developed an advanced Bronze Age culture. The earliest traditions of Greek music derived from Phrygia, transmitted through the Greek colonies in Anatolia, and included the Phrygian mode, which was considered to be the warlike mode in ancient Greek music. Phrygian Midas, the king of the "golden touch", was tutored in music by Orpheus himself, according to the myth."
Phrygians.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygians


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tkVz3GhxeI