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View Full Version : Does Western Europe afraid of bulgarian and romanian "invasion" ?



marto9304
12-12-13, 20:07
I can't stop reading that the british people are afraid of that and they expect ''us'' ! The United Kingdom Independent Party (UKIP) continues the propaganda that hundreds of thousands of bulgarians and romanians are going to immigrate to the UK and are going to take the jobs of the british people , they are going to drain the social & healthcare system etc. etc.

According to statistics the too few people of the bulgarians living in the UK are taking benefits from the country. Don't these people have the right to get help if they feel difficulties at some time after they have been living, working, paying taxes to this country ? Or the UK wants to get just workers to pay taxes but to give nothing in return ? We all know that there is negative birthrate of the native population of each European country so the working forces are needed indeed.

I watched interviews of british that are talking about the ''wave'' like a cataclysm.

How should we, the bulgarians feel about that ? We have thousands of british people living in our country because of the climate and the nature etc. etc. should we start talking like ''they are taking our places'' or what... it's ignorant..

I feel incredibly offended.

Idun
12-12-13, 20:21
You can feel offended all you want but the economy is weak in the north also, bad employment, the welfare is going to break soon, there really is no good reason to migrate.
Build your own country up, that is how we have done it, Bulgaria has the possibility to be very wealthy and competitive.
And comparing the Europeans living and travelling in Bulgaria, they are not there for welfare benefits, they bring money in the country.

Goga
12-12-13, 20:26
Migration waves will always occur in Europe, it will never stop. It's happening for at least 10000 years now, non-stop! In the last 200 years, first the Jews were hated in Europe, then natives of formal European colonies were not welcome here, then immigrants from Southern Europe, like Greeks, Spanish, Portuguese and Italians. Then Arabs from North Africa and Turkish Muslims came to Europe. These last Islamic groups are still hated in Europe. Then came the refugees from the Balkans, Middle East and Africa. Now it's time for the Eastern Europeans to come to Western Europe again. The question is who is next? Migrating is part of human nature. Maybe someday Europeans will become ecological refugees again..

Idun
12-12-13, 20:34
Migration waves will always occur in Europe, it will never stop. It's happening for at least 10000 years now, non-stop! In the last 200 years, first the Jews were hated in Europe, then natives of formal European colonies were not welcome here, than immigrants from Southern Europe, like Greeks, Spanish, Portuguese and Italians, than Arabs from North Africa and Turkish Muslims came to Europe. These last groups are still hated in Europe. Then came the refugees from the Balkans, Middle East and Africa. Now it's time for the Eastern Europeans to come to Western Europe again. The question is who is next? Migrating is part of human nature. Maybe someday Europeans will become ecological refugees again..

Huge migrations are rare and some of those you listed where full blown invasions that sent the continent to centuries of warfare..

EDIT. Missed the last 200 years part, but I still disagree. Looking from historical, cultural and genetical perspective the present migrations are very big and rare.

Goga
12-12-13, 20:44
I was not talking about the magnitude of migration waves. I was talking about immigration into Western Europe in general. Also immigration and emigrations occur in all parts of the world in all continents and not only in Europe.

Idun
12-12-13, 20:45
I was not talking about the magnitude of migration waves. I was talking about immigration into Western Europe in general. Also immigration and emigrations occur in all parts of the world in all continents and not only in Europe.

Many Europeans migrating to Middle East and Africa?

Goga
12-12-13, 20:55
Many Europeans migrating to Middle East and Africa?
I'm talking about other races. South East Asian immigration into the Middle East. Africans into the Middle East. Immigration inside Latin America, immigrations inside West Asia, immigrations inside China, other Chinese immigrations, immigrations inside Africa, Indian immigrations, immigratuions inside the Indian subcontinent. Immigrations from Central Asia into Iran etc. , all kind of migration all over the globe. Human migrations occure everywhere.

Goga
12-12-13, 20:56
We're all part of this world, this planet Earth...

marto9304
12-12-13, 21:18
You can feel offended all you want but the economy is weak in the north also, bad employment, the welfare is going to break soon, there really is no good reason to migrate.
Build your own country up, that is how we have done it, Bulgaria has the possibility to be very wealthy and competitive.
And comparing the Europeans living and travelling in Bulgaria, they are not there for welfare benefits, they bring money in the country.

I do not agree this double standard of the western / northern countries of Europe. The EU is considered to be as an union of free free trade market but at the same time it works as some sort of a federation in which only a certain group of countries get a bonus of it. "We are all equal but some of us are more equal than the others" ... The goods that my country got from the EU (from the Western countries) were only investments. But what kind of investments ? Technomarket , Technopolis , Kaulfland, Mr Bricolage, Billa , Lidl etc. etc. etc.. which destroyed the small and medium business. The people leave their money to these stores and then the money are moved out of the country. The taxes from the turnover of the companies are not payed here either. The Electric Utilities were bought from other countries as well so they declare the price that the bulgarians pay. The money are moved out of the country again. Total mafia...

Jackson
12-12-13, 22:47
I can't stop reading that the british people are afraid of that and they expect ''us'' ! The United Kingdom Independent Party (UKIP) continues the propaganda that hundreds of thousands of bulgarians and romanians are going to immigrate to the UK and are going to take the jobs of the british people , they are going to drain the social & healthcare system etc. etc.

According to statistics the too few people of the bulgarians living in the UK are taking benefits from the country. Don't these people have the right to get help if they feel difficulties at some time after they have been living, working, paying taxes to this country ? Or the UK wants to get just workers to pay taxes but to give nothing in return ? We all know that there is negative birthrate of the native population of each European country so the working forces are needed indeed.

I watched interviews of british that are talking about the ''wave'' like a cataclysm.

How should we, the bulgarians feel about that ? We have thousands of british people living in our country because of the climate and the nature etc. etc. should we start talking like ''they are taking our places'' or what... it's ignorant..

I feel incredibly offended.

I fear what our government will do, or rather what it won't do. You have to understand that it is not a personal jibe at Bulgarians and Romanians in particular, but that with so many people having the opportunity to come here at a time when we have plenty of unemployment, and our social services are struggling already, it is stupid to allow so many immigrants in. There are already companies in Bulgaria and Romania arranging jobs for people in the UK, waiting until they can come here, so there definitely will be incomers. It's the principle that is the main problem, although large numbers will create problems, even if most of them are good people. It simply defies logic.
I used to know a Bulgarian guy in school, he was respectful and hard working, but that is largely irrelevant because opening up our society to such large numbers of people will cause problems. Ultimately it will just lead to more competition for jobs, more strain on social services, and we will still be in a financial and economic mess, and also add in the risk of ethno-cultural problems, and the possibility that bad eggs will arrive as well as good eggs (as you get in every population), and i do not see a reason for it being a good thing.
Our social elite just likes to bend over backwards for foreigners while their own people struggle, i have no problem with the Bulgarians or Romanians in particular. If the tables were the other way around, i would oppose large movement opportunities from Britain to Romania and Bulgaria as well.
It's just a funny world in which this constant internationalist agenda is causing chaos.

Jackson
12-12-13, 22:56
Migration waves will always occur in Europe, it will never stop. It's happening for at least 10000 years now, non-stop! In the last 200 years, first the Jews were hated in Europe, then natives of formal European colonies were not welcome here, then immigrants from Southern Europe, like Greeks, Spanish, Portuguese and Italians. Then Arabs from North Africa and Turkish Muslims came to Europe. These last Islamic groups are still hated in Europe. Then came the refugees from the Balkans, Middle East and Africa. Now it's time for the Eastern Europeans to come to Western Europe again. The question is who is next? Migrating is part of human nature. Maybe someday Europeans will become ecological refugees again..

Yes that is true, but that doesn't mean we should just stand by and let it happen when it is a dangerous thing, that's a very apathetic attitude. I don't mind very low-level immigration as long as they integrate and provided it has benefits, that is common to most countries and normal. There is nothing to be gained from this, or at least nothing that can't be achieved through less dangerous approaches. Our governments are centre and socialist leaning, they are all obsessed with borrowing more and more money that they will never be able to pay back, they might as well use it to fund the state-sponsored employment and skills training of the people we have unemployed, if they want to do something. We need more primary and secondary industry here again, too.

In short we need to start getting things done again, we need to be self-confident. We have a massive economic collapse on it's way anyway, might as well prepare for that while we have the chance too, but they'd rather just fiddle at the edges until the money collectors come round to break their legs and take their property (a figure of speech).

Jackson
12-12-13, 22:58
We're all part of this world, this planet Earth...
And while it remains a fractured, violent and ruthless entity we need to look out for ourselves and our interests in order to survive and succeed.