Parthenon marbles: should they come back?

What do you believe? Should the Parthenon Marbles return to the country that created them?

Or should the Marbles stay in the country that saved them from the prospect of probable destruction or damage? I can see both sides of the argument.

Aberdeen said:

Or should the Marbles stay in the country that saved them from almost certain destruction? I can see both sides of the argument.

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We are not under Ottomans now. What has been stolen, must be returned! After all the Brits have Stonehenge.

Okay, I edited my original comment because it was a deliberate exaggeration. But since the Turks had owned the Marbles for centuries, they did have a right to sell them or give them away. And nobody has proven that Lord Elgin didn't have permission to take them. It's unlikely he could have removed the Marbles if he didn't have permission from the Turks, who were the owners at the time.

Aberdeen said:

Okay, I edited my original comment because it was a deliberate exaggeration. But since the Turks had owned the Marbles for centuries, they did have a right to sell them or give them away. And nobody has proven that Lord Elgin didn't have permission to take them. It's unlikely he could have removed the Marbles if he didn't have permission from the Turks, who were the owners at the time.

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Even if he purchased them rightfully from the Ottomans, again it does not mean anything. It is ethically a theft, for the real owners would never sell them. It is like you ask the Germans during the occupation to sell you the Acropolis along with the sacred rock ...

Echetlaeus said:

Even if he purchased them rightfully from the Ottomans, again it does not mean anything. It is ethically a theft, for the real owners would never sell them. It is like you ask the Germans during the occupation to sell you the Acropolis along with the sacred rock ...

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So, would you say that the current government of Greece has no title to Paleolithic artifacts found in Greece? After all, the people who made them probably weren't ancestral to the modern Greeks.

Aberdeen said:

So, would you say that the current government of Greece has no title to Paleolithic artifacts found in Greece? After all, the people who made them probably weren't ancestral to the modern Greeks.

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Proof or it did not happen!
You are trying to be smart here, but

And the paleolithic stuff belong to the place that they were found :cool-v:

It should be sent to Nashville where a proper Parthenon stands in it's top glory.



And where Athina feels at home:






I think Greeks should rebuild whole Acropolis to show first that they care about their heritage.

LeBrok said:

It should be sent to Nashville where a proper Parthenon stands in it's top glory.

And where Athina feels at home:

I think Greeks should rebuild whole Acropolis to show first that they care about their heritage.

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Indeed, very beautiful, but fake. I am really impressed by this kind of statement from someone who is in a History forum. I asked myself, what the heck is this guy talking about? Is he for real? Then I realised that you say that just to piss me off, but of course these kind of statements do not touch me.

There is a point trying to preserve it for it reminds us who we are. It is a piece of history. BTW Athena likes to live in the sacred land where she was born one day from Zeus' head.

Cheers !

P.S. By the way reveal your ethnicity like everyone else here. Then I may understand better with whom I talk and the intentions behind your sayings? Is that OK with you brah?

By the way, why so many Canadians in here and generally outsiders?
Where are the real Eurobros?

I am sure that the real Eurobros will support me. Canadians are very tightly related to the Brits, and of course, like them, they try to be nice to everyone else, except in the case when their direct interests are at stake. What a race these Brits are! They tell you one thing and they mean whatever ...

Echetlaeus said:

Indeed, very beautiful, but fake.

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Fake but still so real and beautiful. Where is your original one? Oh right, your Christian forefathers closed this pagan temple and moved Athena to Constantinople and ... lost it. Nice.
In this case isn't the fake one better than none? You should be a little bit happy, no?

What if I'm Turk or Albanian? Do you have a reason to hate me more now?

LeBrok said:

Fake but still so real and beautiful. Where is your original one? Oh right, your Christian forefathers closed this pagan temple and moved Athena to Constantinople and ... lost it. Nice.
In this case isn't the fake one better than none? You should be a little bit happy, no?

What if I'm Turk or Albanian? Do you have a reason to hate me more now?

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C'mon, with that logic let the Brits have copies, they can make them brand new after all. You a little bit irrational here, don't you think?

Why do you talk about Christian forefathers? When the Roman Empire changed the original religion, this was the end Hellenism. Everything Greek was pagan for them. And yes, they destroyed everything !
Now, as far as your ethnicity is concerned, well I want to see if you have sources of bias in your blood. Is that inappropriate? I have revealed my ethnicity already!
From your statements so far I may think the same way, that is, should you be Turkish or Albanian will mean that you will have higher probability to attack me.

Echetlaeus said:

When the Roman Empire changed the original religion, this was the end Hellenism. Everything Greek was pagan for them. And yes, they destroyed everything !

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Yeah, blame it on the Romans. I bet the Persian feel the same love towards the Greeks and Alexander (not so) Great.

FBS said:

Yeah, blame it on the Romans. I bet the Persian feel the same love towards the Greeks and Alexander (not so) Great.

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OP disapproves your statement. And perhaps you should try to answer the question of this thread.

Echetlaeus said:

OP disapproves your statement.

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? who/what disapproves my statement? By "statement" you meant my opinion, right?

FBS said:

? who/what disapproves my statement? By "statement" you meant my opinion, right?

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What is your opinion about the Parthenon Marbles Sir?
This is the question of this thread!

Echetlaeus said:

What is your opinion about the Parthenon Marbles Sir?
This is the question of this thread!

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Ups, sorry for not following your orders SIR! I have expressed my opinion, maybe not the way you liked it, but that's how these forums are... Hope that you will get more than your own opinion in your OP. Good luck with it. Over and out.

FBS said:

Yeah, blame it on the Romans. I bet the Persian feel the same love towards the Greeks and Alexander (not so) Great.

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Yes, that's the example I should have used (although I still think my reference to Paleolithic artifacts was valid).

Greece must return to Iran everything that Al the Great looted from Ecbatana or no return of the Elgin Marbles.

FBS said:

Ups, sorry for not following your orders SIR! I have expressed my opinion, maybe not the way you liked it, but that's how these forums are... Hope that you will get more than your own opinion in your OP. Good luck with it. Over and out.

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Bro, OP = Original Poster
You have not said specifically what you mean, are you in favour of return or you are against? Is that so difficult to say in a clean and direct, laconic may I add, way?

Aberdeen said:

Yes, that's the example I should have used (although I still think my reference to Paleolithic artifacts was valid).

Greece must return to Iran everything that Al the Great looted from Ecbatana or no return of the Elgin Marbles.

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I agree with that ! If we have something that does not belong to us, it must be returned if asked officially by Persia.

Then, we ask officially to get ANY artifact that was taken from our country from all museums around the world. The same must be done by Egypt and all the other ancient civilisations. Then you, living in the New World, or pro-barbaric countries, can show your own artifacts, or at least what you have.

Over and out, I hope you feel right now!