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ebAmerican
07-05-14, 21:23
FTDNA released MyOrigins the other day, and I thought I would post my results for fun. It would be interesting to see other peoples results, but I understand it is a private matter:good_job:

I have run many admixture tests through Gedmatch, and it's interesting to see the comparison of all the services.

6421

The orange dots are paternal matches and the blue dots are maternal matches - Family Finder.
I'm assuming the Anatolian marker found is part of my Neolithic connection, or possibly a more recent admixture - I don't know.

EUtest V2 K15 Admixture

6422

Fire Haired14
08-05-14, 01:43
You should do the Eurogenes K13 test at GEDmatch, and then transfer the results to the EEF-WHG-ANE calculator (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2013/12/eef-whg-ane-test-for-europeans.html). You can get an idea who your stone age ancestors were. The EEF reference sample Stuttgart, an ~7,000BP LBK farmer had about 20% WHG ancestry, so do the math and you'll be able to get an accurate idea what your real EEF(just represents middle eastern ancestry), WHG, and ANE percentages are.

LeBrok
08-05-14, 05:17
23andme labeled me overwhelmingly Eastern European with some connection to Scandinavia and Balkans.

Fire Haired14
08-05-14, 05:25
23andme labeled me overwhelmingly Eastern European with some connection to Scandinavia and Balkans.

Is that accurate, is the R1b from Scandinavia? 23andme was accurate for my uncle, they were able to tell he had British, Norwegian, and Puerto Rican ancestry(Spanish+Native American+West African), and from what i have read it is accurate for most people. Your Balkan connection may be because of Czechslovakian ancestry, since they have more Balkan-like ancestry than Poles.

LeBrok
08-05-14, 05:34
Is that accurate, is the R1b from Scandinavia? 23andme was accurate for my uncle, they were able to tell he had British, Norwegian, and Puerto Rican ancestry(Spanish+Native American+West African), and from what i have read it is accurate for most people. Your Balkan connection may be because of Czechslovakian ancestry, since they have more Balkan-like ancestry than Poles.
Balkan and Sweden are only at 3% level. I'm not sure what is exact subclade of my R1b. I still have about 30-40% of unassigned European. So some mystery is left for the future.

Silesian
08-05-14, 07:30
http://www.freeimagehosting.net/upl.php
Eastern branch R1b Z2105+ L277-/L584-
Poland, Silesia:
Father yDNA R1b1a2a1 + mtDNA H2a1
EEF 42.59
WHG 40.4124
ANE 16.99
My results R1b1a2a1 + U5b2a2
EEF 45.15
WHG 38.67
ANE 16.17
http://i.imgur.com/JiGlI7W.png

Sile
08-05-14, 08:34
You should do the Eurogenes K13 test at GEDmatch, and then transfer the results to the EEF-WHG-ANE calculator (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2013/12/eef-whg-ane-test-for-europeans.html). You can get an idea who your stone age ancestors were. The EEF reference sample Stuttgart, an ~7,000BP LBK farmer had about 20% WHG ancestry, so do the math and you'll be able to get an accurate idea what your real EEF(just represents middle eastern ancestry), WHG, and ANE percentages are.

Your making erred statements when you isolate EEF or WHG or ANE on their own. They come in a package and lazaridis has already given the combination in numbers and stated the area of the globe they are from. A statement which states that a High EEF means middle-east is a useless and wrong statement.
EEF in southern france is ~68 ...........is it middle-east!...........

Sile
08-05-14, 08:37
Balkan and Sweden are only at 3% level. I'm not sure what is exact subclade of my R1b. I still have about 30-40% of unassigned European. So some mystery is left for the future.

does 23andme count the "borrowed" ( from 1000genomes and other companies) data from the area you are assigned?

Grubbe
08-05-14, 13:01
My result in myOrigin:
6424
I suspect that the European Coastal Islands result is also Nordic, since I have no UK ancestry, as far as I know. But many in UK have Nordic ancestry (1000 years back or so), so the genes are probably very mixed.

Grubbe
08-05-14, 13:08
FTDNA released MyOrigins the other day, and I thought I would post my results for fun. It would be interesting to see other peoples results, but I understand it is a private matter:good_job:

I have run many admixture tests through Gedmatch, and it's interesting to see the comparison of all the services.

6421

The orange dots are paternal matches and the blue dots are maternal matches - Family Finder.
I'm assuming the Anatolian marker found is part of my Neolithic connection, or possibly a more recent admixture - I don't know.

EUtest V2 K15 Admixture

6422

You have about the exact same result as my uncle (100 % Norwegian), but he has 3 % Anatolian. I don't know what that could be either. And also he has about 5 % North Mediterranian. I see that in connection with the Anatolian/Caucasus result (don't know of any North Mediterranean ancestry the last 3-400+ years either).

Angela
08-05-14, 16:51
You should do the Eurogenes K13 test at GEDmatch, and then transfer the results to the EEF-WHG-ANE calculator (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2013/12/eef-whg-ane-test-for-europeans.html). You can get an idea who your stone age ancestors were. The EEF reference sample Stuttgart, an ~7,000BP LBK farmer had about 20% WHG ancestry, so do the math and you'll be able to get an accurate idea what your real EEF(just represents middle eastern ancestry), WHG, and ANE percentages are.

As far as EEF is concerned, 20% WHG is the upper limit; Lazaridis stated that it could be anywhere from a few percent up to 20%. Until we have some samples from the Near East we won't know.

In my opinion, the results of this very sophisticated study are becoming increasingly misunderstood as they are simplified, and perhaps even slightly distorted to make agenda driven points. It's like that kid's game, where a statement is made, then passed along a chain, and by the time you get to the end, the message is totally garbled, only worse, because some of the players are deliberately twisting the words.

I would concur with Sile's point about EEF being "Middle Eastern". EEF is EEF, a very particular mix that existed at a very particular time. I think it can be most accurately described as the signature of the early European farmers. I don't know how many times certain things need to be repeated before they sink in. The people who came to Europe bringing agriculture with them came from the region of the greater Near East, some perhaps from the Levant, but many from the more northern Near East. Regardless, those people are not identical to the people who currently inhabit the Near East, who now have a large ANE proportion, as well as an additional slice of SSA. They arrived 8-9,000 years ago.

Until we get samples tested from the Italian and southeastern European, including the Aegean, areas, we won't know whether the hunter gatherers in that area were like the hunter gatherers of central and northern Europe, or if perhaps they were not that different from the incoming farmers, meaning that the signature might indeed be Mesolithic and therefore older in Europe than 8,000 years ago, although there still might have been a substantial movement of actual people from, say, the Levant. The distance between Anatolia and the Balkans is the width of the Hellespont, which is only about 1.2 kilometers wide. Could the people have been so very different? Perhaps it was an insurmountable barrier in the Mesolithic. I don't know. I'm not willing to go out on a limb and say they weren't that different, but I think the results coming from the Bean project about the Mesolithic hunter gatherers in Greece having no mtDNA "U", and instead the Mesolithic and Neolithic samples having very small FST distances, and carrying mtDNA signatures X,K,J,H and T, is very suggestive.
See: http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2012/12/talk-by-christina-papageorgopoulou-on.html

Furthermore, if you go back in time, the northern and central European hunter-gatherers arrived in Europe either through the Middle East or Asia. Europe is a destination, not a source.

Finally, I don't know how many times it needs to be said...hunter-gatherers don't form an "ethnic" or even geographic group. All humans were hunter-gatherers until they adopted agriculture... some just did it earlier.

ebAmerican
08-05-14, 17:51
Eloquently said Angela ▲▲▲▲▲:good_job:

ebAmerican
08-05-14, 18:21
Grubbe - the more I look into my past the more connection I have to the North lands. I recently learned that my great grandma on my dad's side was born in Malmo Sweden. My grandmother on my dad's side was English, and my mother was Swedish and English. My great grandfather ++++++++ (1645 dad's side) was from Heidelberg, Baden-Württemberg. We have tracked down some distant relatives in Germany with our surname and it looks like we have Prussian decent before 1645. This could explain the Baltic levels in my admixture. It's awesome to see everything starting to fall into place, and these new DNA genealogical advances confirming our assumptions.

ebAmerican
08-05-14, 18:37
Fire Haired14 - thanks for the EEF/WHG/ANE calculator.

My results -

EEF: 46.61
WHG: 37.45
ANE: 15.93

I don't really know what it means, so I won't infer anything, but it is cool to compare to ancient samples like Otzi.

Fire Haired14
09-05-14, 00:09
Fire Haired14 - thanks for the EEF/WHG/ANE calculator.

My results -

EEF: 46.61
WHG: 37.45
ANE: 15.93

I don't really know what it means, so I won't infer anything, but it is cool to compare to ancient samples like Otzi.

WHG is based on an ~8,000BP Mesolithic hunter gatherer from Loschbour, Luxmebourg named Loschbour, he belonged to Y DNA pre-I2a1b, mtDNA U5b1a. EEF is based on an ~6,950 year old farmer named Stuttgart from Stuttgart, Germany who was apart of the Neolithic LBK culture and belonged to mtDNA T2c1d1, and ANE is based on an ~24,000 year old Upper Palaeolithic hunter gatherer named MA1 from Mal'ta Siberia who belonged to Y DNA R* and mtDNA U*(his own subclade, not found in modern people). To see what my opinon on the populations these individuals descended from click here (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eupedia.com%2Fforum%2Fthreads %2F29789-Revised-Laz-Ancient-genomes-suggest-three-ancestral-populations-for-Europeans&ei=nP1rU83CPOnEyQG-24EI&usg=AFQjCNHIw3jMHNFjJin0Ba8GL14cW2df1g&bvm=bv.66330100,d.aWc).

Laz 2013 created the original EEF-WHG-ANE admixture and Euroegenes created a calculator based on EEF-WHG-ANE results of European populations tested in Laz and their Eurogenes-K13 results, so that Europeans who have Eurogenes-K13 results can get accurate EEF-WHG-ANE results.

Since Stuttgart was probably around 20% WHG and 80% Middle eastern, your WHG percentage is actulley higher and your EEF/Middle eastern percentage is lower.

Davidski aka Polako, at Eurogenes created a Mammouth(MA1 or La Brana-1)-ME(Middle eastern)-ENA(Eastern non African)-SSA(Sub Saharan African) test. There are obviously some inaccuracies but the percentages of Mammouth ancestry for Europeans, west Asians, north Africans, and Siberians are very consistent with Laz. When i took European population's EEF-WHG-ANE results from Laz 2014 and made their EEF percentage 20% WHG, their WHG+ANE percentage was nearly identical to their Mammouth percentage and their EEF nearly identical to the ME percentage in Davidski's admixture.

So this is much closer to your actual EEF-WHG-ANe percentages.

North Eurasian hunter gatherer(WHG+ANE)=62.702%

Middle eastern(EEF)=37.288%

WHG=46.772%

EEF=37.228%

ANE=15.93%

So, if you went back ~9,000-10,000 years ago ~62.702% of your ancestors were hunter gatherers in north Eurasia(WHG was in Europe, and ANE mostly in eastern Europe and central Asia) and ~37.228% of your ancestors were some of the earliest farmers living in the Levant, Anatolia, and the Balkans.

Fire Haired14
09-05-14, 00:33
As far as EEF is concerned, 20% WHG is the upper limit; Lazaridis stated that it could be anywhere from a few percent up to 20%. Until we have some samples from the Near East we won't know.

In my opinion, the results of this very sophisticated study are becoming increasingly misunderstood as they are simplified, and perhaps even slightly distorted to make agenda driven points. It's like that kid's game, where a statement is made, then passed along a chain, and by the time you get to the end, the message is totally garbled, only worse, because some of the players are deliberately twisting the words.

I would concur with Sile's point about EEF being "Middle Eastern". EEF is EEF, a very particular mix that existed at a very particular time. I think it can be most accurately described as the signature of the early European farmers. I don't know how many times certain things need to be repeated before they sink in. The people who came to Europe bringing agriculture with them came from the region of the greater Near East, some perhaps from the Levant, but many from the more northern Near East. Regardless, those people are not identical to the people who currently inhabit the Near East, who now have a large ANE proportion, as well as an additional slice of SSA. They arrived 8-9,000 years ago.

Until we get samples tested from the Italian and southeastern European, including the Aegean, areas, we won't know whether the hunter gatherers in that area were like the hunter gatherers of central and northern Europe, or if perhaps they were not that different from the incoming farmers, meaning that the signature might indeed be Mesolithic and therefore older in Europe than 8,000 years ago, although there still might have been a substantial movement of actual people from, say, the Levant. The distance between Anatolia and the Balkans is the width of the Hellespont, which is only about 1.2 kilometers wide. Could the people have been so very different? Perhaps it was an insurmountable barrier in the Mesolithic. I don't know. I'm not willing to go out on a limb and say they weren't that different, but I think the results coming from the Bean project about the Mesolithic hunter gatherers in Greece having no mtDNA "U", and instead the Mesolithic and Neolithic samples having very small FST distances, and carrying mtDNA signatures X,K,J,H and T, is very suggestive.
See: http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2012/12/talk-by-christina-papageorgopoulou-on.html

Furthermore, if you go back in time, the northern and central European hunter-gatherers arrived in Europe either through the Middle East or Asia. Europe is a destination, not a source.

Finally, I don't know how many times it needs to be said...hunter-gatherers don't form an "ethnic" or even geographic group. All humans were hunter-gatherers until they adopted agriculture... some just did it earlier.

Actulley near eastern ancestry for Stuttgart was estimated from 55%-over 100%. It seems that there is a such thing as Middle eastern(mixture of west Eurasian and basal Eurasian), it is obvious when looking at PCAs, admixtures, and plenty of other stuff. I never said modern middle easterns are pure middle eastern, but they do come primarily from the same source as did early European farmers, and both have non-middle eastern ancestry. Also, European-specfic subclades of middle eastern mtDNA haplogroups are very distant from middle eastern-specific subclades, suggesting a very distant relationship between early European farmers and modern middle easterns.

I only trust estimates where east Asian is represented by a likely pure east asian population(ie. Onge, han, etc.), and i bet Bedouin have something inbetween 5.1 and 7.3 percent African ancestry, and therefore 80% Middle eastern ancestry for Stuttgart makes sense. When 20% WHG ancestry in Stuttgart is assumed and put than in to get WHG+ANe percentage for Europeans they are nearly identical to Mammouth(La Brana-1 or MA1 as reference) percentages given to Europeans in an admixture created by Davidski aka Polako at Eurogenes. In that admixture Sardinians who have been shown to have slightly more WHG than Stuttgart, score on average 33% WHG. Also, in PCAs Lezgin's who have about almost 30% ANE ancestry are about as shifted up in WHG-ANE direction as Sardinians and Stuttgart are, which is even more evidence Stuttgart had around 20% WHG ancestry.

20% WHG ancestry for Stuttgart is just my guess, i know it must be somewhere inbetween

Fire Haired14
09-05-14, 00:39
WHG was a single ethnicity it is just some admixed with other populations. It is no big deal if Mesolithic Greeks were practiculley middle easterns, with little genetic differences with incoming farmers, who ever said Greece was a genetic barrier?

Fire Haired14
09-05-14, 00:41
Your making erred statements when you isolate EEF or WHG or ANE on their own. They come in a package and lazaridis has already given the combination in numbers and stated the area of the globe they are from. A statement which states that a High EEF means middle-east is a useless and wrong statement.
EEF in southern france is ~68 ...........is it middle-east!...........

EEF is based on Stuttgart an ~6,950 year old LBK farmer from Germany. Laz revealed her ancestry and modern middle easterns ancestry primarily come from the same ancient middle eastern source, but they all have sometype of none middle eastern ancestry. All Europeans therefore, have a large amount of middle eastern ancestry, but for most from mainly farmers who left for Europe some 9,000 years ago and who are distantly but still closely related to modern middle easterns.

When looking at pigmentation it may be hard to believe for example that modern Swedes are over 30% middle eastern, but it's true. Alot can change in 9,000 years.

Sile
09-05-14, 08:35
https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/family-finder-pages/myorigins-methodology/

Is Razib from dodecad?....if so myOrigins is part of his creation

Angela
10-05-14, 01:32
WHG was a single ethnicity it is just some admixed with other populations. It is no big deal if Mesolithic Greeks were practiculley middle easterns, with little genetic differences with incoming farmers, who ever said Greece was a genetic barrier?


The terms and concepts have to be kept clear...jumbling everything together leads to sloppy conclusions. (In particular, concepts from the old calculators are no longer very informative in this kind of analysis. They are just later poolings of different migrations.)

The point was that the HG's in Greece and the Balkans, which are in Europe, in case it has escaped your notice, may not have been like the WHG's. The fact that their signature might overlap with that of HG's in Anatolia at that time (which may or may not be true) wouldn't make them any less European HG's, just like the fact that the affinity of ANE's for eastern populations doesn't make ANE's not European.

You are applying geographic and political and indeed ethnic terms to populations which existed thousands and thousands of years before these concepts ever developed. You have to imagine ancient groups converging on Europe from different directions (continents) at different times, two of which, the WHG and the ANE, are outside of modern variation.

Which brings me to the fact that although you are entitled to your own opinions, you are not entitled to your own facts.
Please take a look at page 40 of the revised Lazaridis et al paper for the source of these figures. There is no figure given for the Swedes, but one is given for Norwegians. The EEF figure is 41%. The only place in Europe where EEF falls to the 30% level is in the tiny Baltic countries, tiny in square miles, and tiny in population. The EEF average for Europe as a whole is at least 56%.

As for the differences between northern and southern Europeans, the difference is not down to the ANE perhaps brought by the Indo-Europeans. That is contrary to the positions taken by "internet authorities" in the past that Indo-Europeans were a very different population (which more lately they claim to be mostly ANE), and that these people literally wiped out everybody else, at least in central Europe.

In actual fact, the ANE component is a very minor player in Europe. It ranges from about 11% to 17%, with the only exception being southwest France, which has an extraordinarily low number of .13. Nowhere in Europe does the figure for ANE go above 20%. In the Near East it is higher, with some populations in the Caucasus getting 30%.

The difference in Europe is in terms of the WHG percentages. In that regard, the Estonians have .495, the Irish .464, the Scottish and the Norwegians .428 (which I don't think is a coincidence by the way). These are high figures, but they are for low population countries, and they are obviously also the countries where agriculture fared the worst because of climate until the agricultural package was adapted. On the central European highly populated plain, the EEF number is still 55%, and it is still 50% in England.

Luan
11-05-14, 00:52
European-85%
North mediterranean Basin-68%
Trans-Ural peneplain-17%

Middle Eastern-14%
Anatolia&Caucasus-14%

Sile
11-05-14, 01:10
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m153/vicpret/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/vicpret/media/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg.html)

mine

23andme has me at 99% european, but they cover only the last 500 years.
Indication that myOrigins goes back further than 500Years

Orillion
11-05-14, 21:08
What's the "noise threshold" in myOrigins admixtures? I've heard that in Gedmatch and 23andme, percentages below 1% were uninterpretable, but i might be wrong.

For example, here's numbers from my myOrigins admixture (can't post pictures, not enough postcount):

- North Circumpolar: 2%
- Central/South Asian: 2%
- Middle Eastern: 2%

Do these numbers even mean something, statistically?

Grubbe
13-05-14, 11:38
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m153/vicpret/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/vicpret/media/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg.html)

mine

23andme has me at 99% european, but they cover only the last 500 years.
Indication that myOrigins goes back further than 500Years

Yes, I am pretty sure at least some of the results must go back (far) more than 500 years.

I forgot to mention in my previous post (#9) that of course the vikings brought back to Norway quite a few celtic slaves. We still find "celtic" R1b in Norway, so probably there is that type of autosomal DNA as well. That could also account for some of my seeming ancestry from the British Isles in myOrigins. My father and maternal uncle also have a certain % from there. I guess most Norwegians have.

Grubbe
13-05-14, 11:40
What's the "noise threshold" in myOrigins admixtures? I've heard that in Gedmatch and 23andme, percentages below 1% were uninterpretable, but i might be wrong.

For example, here's numbers from my myOrigins admixture (can't post pictures, not enough postcount):

- North Circumpolar: 2%
- Central/South Asian: 2%
- Middle Eastern: 2%

Do these numbers even mean something, statistically?

I don't remember reading anything about "noise threshold" in myOrigins yet. You could try posting your question at the FTDNA forums, if you haven't already.

Sile
14-05-14, 08:35
from DNAexplained forum

checked with Dr. David Mittelman on this question and he provided the following information:
Anatolia & Caucasus – On the order of 5-10 K
Asian Northeast – On the other of 5-10 K
Bering Expansion – On the order of 10-15 K
East Africa Pastoralist – On the order of 3-5 K
East Asian Coastal Islands – On the order of 5-10K
Eastern Afroasiatic – On the order of 5-10 K
Eurasian Heartland – On the order of 5-10 K
European Coastal Islands – On the order of 2-4 K
European Coastal Plain – On the order of 1-3 K
European Northlands – On the order of 3-5 K
Indian Tectonic – On the order of 3-5 K
Jewish Diaspora – On the order of 1-2 K
Kalahari Basin – On the order of 50 K
Niger-Congo Genesis – On the order to 2-4 K
North African Coastlands – On the order of 5-10 K
North Circumpolar – On the order of 10 K
North Mediterranean – On the order of 5-10 K
Trans-Ural Peneplain – On the order of 2-4 K

Grubbe
14-05-14, 09:32
from DNAexplained forum

checked with Dr. David Mittelman on this question and he provided the following information:
Anatolia & Caucasus – On the order of 5-10 K
Asian Northeast – On the other of 5-10 K
Bering Expansion – On the order of 10-15 K
East Africa Pastoralist – On the order of 3-5 K
East Asian Coastal Islands – On the order of 5-10K
Eastern Afroasiatic – On the order of 5-10 K
Eurasian Heartland – On the order of 5-10 K
European Coastal Islands – On the order of 2-4 K
European Coastal Plain – On the order of 1-3 K
European Northlands – On the order of 3-5 K
Indian Tectonic – On the order of 3-5 K
Jewish Diaspora – On the order of 1-2 K
Kalahari Basin – On the order of 50 K
Niger-Congo Genesis – On the order to 2-4 K
North African Coastlands – On the order of 5-10 K
North Circumpolar – On the order of 10 K
North Mediterranean – On the order of 5-10 K
Trans-Ural Peneplain – On the order of 2-4 K

OK, if I understand this correctly: A certain % of North Circumpolar might be an influence streching back to 10 000 years, but it could also be much more recent (depending on the known papertrail).

BakodiP
14-05-14, 12:39
Here are my results:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/8584414/myorigins.jpg

Maternal German line is quite huge... More than I was expecting.
Paternal Y-DNA match Armenian line might be for the Anatolia & Caucasus, but TMRCA 800-1200 years.
North Mediterranen: ? :S Maybe Balkans.

Sile
14-05-14, 21:25
OK, if I understand this correctly: A certain % of North Circumpolar might be an influence streching back to 10 000 years, but it could also be much more recent (depending on the known papertrail).

true for you, but it also means they have used some ancient markers that go back to the dates that are stated. Only you know your more recent paternal line.

the program will also minimize the Jewish numbers in the test and also the European coastal plain. So if true then for me the 47% of ECP can only be a maximum time of bronze-age period , while my 22% of NM is much older. But what of my 9% of TUP ?

Sile
14-05-14, 21:32
Yes, I am pretty sure at least some of the results must go back (far) more than 500 years.

I forgot to mention in my previous post (#9) that of course the vikings brought back to Norway quite a few celtic slaves. We still find "celtic" R1b in Norway, so probably there is that type of autosomal DNA as well. That could also account for some of my seeming ancestry from the British Isles in myOrigins. My father and maternal uncle also have a certain % from there. I guess most Norwegians have.

well my closest genetic matches from ftdna is one from south Sweden and one from ireland ( 2nd cousins whatever that means in their description)
while 23andme which is only 500 years old has 19 x 2nd and 3rd cousins from North-east italy, 2 swabians , 2 dutch and 1 slovene...............plus another 150, 4th and 5th cousins from italy austria, swiss and france mostly

Icebreaker
14-05-14, 23:03
http://i.imgur.com/j505j2L.jpg

Luan
15-05-14, 02:48
well my closest genetic matches from ftdna is one from south Sweden and one from ireland ( 2nd cousins whatever that means in their description)
while 23andme which is only 500 years old has 19 x 2nd and 3rd cousins from North-east italy, 2 swabians , 2 dutch and 1 slovene...............plus another 150, 4th and 5th cousins from italy austria, swiss and france mostly
Can we find out what 2nd cousin mean. I have a match, he's Albanian from Montenegro.

Grubbe
15-05-14, 09:42
Can we find out what 2nd cousin mean. I have a match, he's Albanian from Montenegro.

A 2nd cousin could be just that, but in my experience my 2nd-4th cousin matches are often a few generations further back, due to multiple lines from one or a few common ancestors back in the 17. or 16. centuries.

Grubbe
15-05-14, 09:51
true for you, but it also means they have used some ancient markers that go back to the dates that are stated. Only you know your more recent paternal line.

the program will also minimize the Jewish numbers in the test and also the European coastal plain. So if true then for me the 47% of ECP can only be a maximum time of bronze-age period , while my 22% of NM is much older. But what of my 9% of TUP ?

Thank you. I didn't think of paternal lines here, though. I mentioned NC because I have a couple of known Forest Finns families among my ancestors in the 17. century. I have not any NC in myOrigins, though, but my father and my maternal uncle have. The three of us also have Finnish matches or Norwegiian matches with Forest Finnish ancestry. But I have not been able to find common ancestors with any of these. Most of them are in the 4th - remote cousins range.

Grubbe
15-05-14, 09:58
well my closest genetic matches from ftdna is one from south Sweden and one from ireland ( 2nd cousins whatever that means in their description)
while 23andme which is only 500 years old has 19 x 2nd and 3rd cousins from North-east italy, 2 swabians , 2 dutch and 1 slovene...............plus another 150, 4th and 5th cousins from italy austria, swiss and france mostly

Do you have any recent ancestors that you know of from these areas? If not, it seems also 23andme could go further back than 500 years? I haven't tested with them myself, so I can't compare.

Sile
15-05-14, 11:07
Do you have any recent ancestors that you know of from these areas? If not, it seems also 23andme could go further back than 500 years? I haven't tested with them myself, so I can't compare.

no, i do not have recent ancestors.....the dates are from 1645...........only only have a paper trail to 1688.

23andme state they only go back 500 years on their site.

BTW, 23andme are leaving USA and going to either Canada or Ireland ......because of FDA rules preventing them to test medical genes in USA people.

Grubbe
15-05-14, 11:27
no, i do not have recent ancestors.....the dates are from 1645...........only only have a paper trail to 1688.

23andme state they only go back 500 years on their site.

BTW, 23andme are leaving USA and going to either Canada or Ireland ......because of FDA rules preventing them to test medical genes in USA people.

To me, 1645 is "recent"! ;-) And it is within the 500 years of 23andme.

Sile
15-05-14, 12:32
To me, 1645 is "recent"! ;-) And it is within the 500 years of 23andme.

its a 2nd cousin genetic marker.....its not a paternal, paternal marker.....but it's a paternal , maternal marker

but 23andme never found it............ftdna did

Luan
15-05-14, 17:07
A 2nd cousin could be just that, but in my experience my 2nd-4th cousin matches are often a few generations further back, due to multiple lines from one or a few common ancestors back in the 17. or 16. centuries.
Thanks, I'm interested to know especially because his Albanian.

Sile
15-05-14, 21:59
MyOrigins did not gather data from numbers of people tested, but from SNPs found in people tested.........which is 270,000 plus

motzart
17-05-14, 03:59
Here are my 23andme results, Im going to get a real ftdna test soon. The 23andme ancestry side is lacking but I got the health results before it was shut down so totally worth it.

6431These are at the 'Standard' level

This one is at the 'Speculative' level.
My girlfriend and I had a good laugh about the 0.1% south asian, whatever that gives me, it doesn't let me eat spicy food.

6432 Here are my Eurogenes k13 admixture results too, I uploaded my results from 23andme to GEDMatch. I really wish they had the k20 calculator on there used for the Lazaridis study. I would like to see how I fit in to that.
6433


Here are my Hunter Gatherer VS Farmer results, I think this one on GEDMatch is newer than that excel file that is floating around, probably better?

6434

Fire Haired14
17-05-14, 04:08
Here are my 23andme results, Im going to get a real ftdna test soon. The 23andme ancestry side is lacking but I got the health results before it was shut down so totally worth it.

6431

FTDNA did a very good job for my uncle. It was able to tell he had Norwegian, British, Spanish, Native American, and west African ancestry. They did a good job for you to since they could tell you are British(you didn't score in any other category). FTDNA might be a waste of money.

motzart
17-05-14, 08:58
I would like the FTDNA 37 marker Y DNA test, 23andme still uses the ISOGG tree from 2009 in determining which Y DNA markers to check.

kuqezi
03-06-14, 21:50
Thanks, I'm interested to know especially because his Albanian.


Luan, you said your from the village Morina. Is your clan or fis Morina as well?

Mars
11-06-14, 18:55
My results are these: 85% european, 16% middle eastern (Anatolia & Caucasus). Being a northern italian, I'm not surprised by the fact my european is 69% North Mediterranean, anyway I expected some Central Coastal plains since the myOrigins population cluster for northern Italy is a mix between those two... The rest of my european (16%) is European Northlands instead... What do you think about it? Maybe some (strong) longobard or goth ancestry? Or some more recent admixture, in your opinion?
6477

Nobody1
11-06-14, 19:59
My results are these: 85% european, 16% middle eastern (Anatolia & Caucasus). Being a northern italian, I'm not surprised by the fact my european is 69% North Mediterranean, anyway I expected some Central Coastal plains since the myOrigins population cluster for northern Italy is a mix between those two... The rest of my european (16%) is European Northlands instead... What do you think about it? Maybe some (strong) longobard or goth ancestry? Or some more recent admixture, in your opinion?
6477

These are the Archaeological traces (burial sites/settlements) of the Langobarden in Italy [mostly Friaul, Trentino, Lombardy, Piedmont and Emilia] so if your from or near from such a location than good/higher chances the 16% Northland is from them;
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img571/7780/langobarden1.png

The 16% Middle East from the Anatolia and Caucasus seems the Neolithic area or later Pelasgian (Tyrrhenian) ancestry;

Mars
11-06-14, 22:17
Hard to say... I have ancestors from, roughly, some of those areas - Veneto and Emilia - though most of my ancestry is from Liguria. The only thing that comes to my mind is the "nordic" look on the venetian side of my family - I mean, most of them have blue eyes, fair skin and are frequently blonde. I inherited some of these traits, too.
The Anatolia-Caucasus is considered a signature of neolithic expansion into Europe by FamilyTree and National Geographic. The Pelasgian theory is fascinating although ;)

Gracchus
12-06-14, 22:54
My results:

6486
Mars, my results are similar to yours:
80% Mediterranean, this was obvious and 16% Scandinavia, I think it's not Longobard, but maybe this is my Visigoth part....
But you also have to add:
2% of morocco: maybe my part of the Islamic conquest of the peninsula (berebr?). And, oh a big surprise! 2% of African (est afrincan pastoralist) guess also because the Islamic conquest, or maybe this is earlier?? what do you thing about this?

Mars
13-06-14, 19:36
It's intriguing... It seems your DNA is a mosaic of different historic patterns... :) You haven't Anatolia and Caucasus, I though it was quite regular in southern europeans. You have some northern euro like me, it makes me think we actually inherited from the "barbarian" conquest of southern Europe during the late Roman Empire.
About the african traces, I think they depend on some afroasiatic and/or berberian ancestor from the early Middle Ages. I'm not good at quantifying these old influences, I mean, how old can it be? Anyways I think it's from the Moors. If it were, say, phoenician - they colonized the mediterranean coast of Spain - you should have some Anatolia & Caucasus, I think, but it's actually absent in your autosomal. More likely it's moor/arabian, IMHO.

Sile
13-06-14, 20:55
It's intriguing... It seems your DNA is a mosaic of different historic patterns... :) You haven't Anatolia and Caucasus, I though it was quite regular in southern europeans. You have some northern euro like me, it makes me think we actually inherited from the "barbarian" conquest of southern Europe during the late Roman Empire.
About the african traces, I think they depend on some afroasiatic and/or berberian ancestor from the early Middle Ages. I'm not good at quantifying these old influences, I mean, how old can it be? Anyways I think it's from the Moors. If it were, say, phoenician - they colonized the mediterranean coast of Spain - you should have some Anatolia & Caucasus, I think, but it's actually absent in your autosomal. More likely it's moor/arabian, IMHO.

agree, maybe he entered europe via spain side

Sile
13-06-14, 21:44
These are the Archaeological traces (burial sites/settlements) of the Langobarden in Italy [mostly Friaul, Trentino, Lombardy, Piedmont and Emilia] so if your from or near from such a location than good/higher chances the 16% Northland is from them;
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img571/7780/langobarden1.png

The 16% Middle East from the Anatolia and Caucasus seems the Neolithic area or later Pelasgian (Tyrrhenian) ancestry;

where is this map from?

Degredado
16-06-14, 23:39
What ancient populations could "European Northlands" and "European Coastal Plain" represent, respectively? MyOrigins shows that my european ancestry consists of North Mediterranean Basin and European Costal Plain. FTDNA relates the European Coastal Plain component in Southern Europe to the barbarian migrations, but what about the European Northlands element? It seems most people of southern european background have only one or the other, even if in sizeable amounts.

Could it be that certain barbarian groups had a predominantly Scandinavian essence, while others were more continental Germanic?

Mars
17-06-14, 17:00
^I think that southern euros with partial northland ancestry are a small minority. For example, northern italians and southern french are described as a combo of north mediterranean and european coastal plain (which is the western central euro cluster), as more southern populations are esentially north mediterranean. I think that northland admixture occurs in a few individuals only. It could be people with visigoth ancestry in Iberia and longobard or ostrogoth ancestry in Italy and other neighbouring regions. It's my two cents, of course...

AgnusDei
26-06-14, 20:02
Here are mine :

Middle Eastern : 62%
North African: 36%
Eastern Middle East : 26%
European : 17%
Southern European:17%
African: 11%
East Central African: 8%
West African : 3%
Jewish Diaspora : 10%
Ashkenazi diaspora:10%

PaschalisB
22-07-14, 14:08
My results:

6517

Dorianfinder
22-07-14, 15:15
My Origins results:

European:
Southern Europe 30%
Eastern Europe 22%
Scandinavia 22%

Middle Eastern:
Asia Minor 25%

Central Asia 1%

Mars
30-07-14, 17:48
My Origins results:

European:
Southern Europe 30%
Eastern Europe 22%
Scandinavia 22%

Middle Eastern:
Asia Minor 25%

Central Asia 1%
Interesting results. You probably have both some goth ancestors and at least one turk ancestor (that 1% central asian) in your family tree. Well, so I guess...

Dorianfinder
06-08-14, 04:54
Interesting results. You probably have both some goth ancestors and at least one turk ancestor (that 1% central asian) in your family tree. Well, so I guess...

Possibly Turkish or the Scandinavian could be pre-Scandinavian from Anatolia and the central Asian could be from those Greek Macedonians who traveled with Alexander the Great to central Asia. It could also be something else, Gedrosian and Russian ancestry. West Asian has an element of central Asian in it as well.

Athiudisc
28-08-14, 16:18
My results:

European 98%
- British Isles 48%
- Scandinavia 16%
- Western and Central Europe 15%
- Southern Europe 14%
- Finland and Northern Siberia 5%
Middle Eastern 2%
- Asia Minor 2%

My ancestry is evenly split between southwest Ireland (Gaelic surnames), northern England (surnames of English and Danish origin), northern Nederland (Frisian surnames) and southwest Germany (Rhine Franconian surnames).

Ricimer
29-09-14, 16:28
Results of a Spanish man with grandparents from Extremadura and Andalucia Oriental

European : 99%
Southern European:99%
Middle Eastern : 1%
North African: 1%

tlangford18
25-10-14, 04:31
Very cool! :D

Rowan
25-04-15, 15:56
MyOrigins results for an Italian:

- 79% Southern Europe
- 16% Asia Minor
- 5% Ashkenazi Diaspora

For comparison purposes this is my Eurogenes K13:

- 26.34% West_Med
- 25.31% North_Atlantic
- 21.08% East_Med
- 12.21% Baltic
- 8.68% West_Asian
- 4.74% Red_Sea
- 0.93% Sub-Saharan
- 0.53% Oceanian
- 0.13% Amerindian

LeBrok
25-04-15, 17:18
Welcome to Eupedia Rowan.

Rowan
25-04-15, 19:28
Welcome to Eupedia Rowan.

Thank you LeBrok!

Boreas
02-05-15, 19:06
My Results (myorigins)

Southern Europe: 37%
Anatolian: 33%
Eastern Europe: 17%
East Asian: 7%
Central Asia: 6%

Angela
02-05-15, 20:03
My Results (myorigins)

Southern Europe: 37%
Anatolian: 33%
Eastern Europe: 17%
East Asian: 7%
Central Asia: 6%

Interesting East Asian and Central Asian scores. I didn't think they'd be that high for some reason.

Boreas
02-05-15, 22:12
Interesting East Asian and Central Asian scores. I didn't think they'd be that high for some reason.

Why you are suprised? I didn't get it.

Angela
02-05-15, 23:03
Why you are suprised? I didn't get it.

Nothing nefarious...I'm just going by some old speculations that it was under 10%. Not much of a difference, true.

Regio X
07-05-15, 05:37
In actual fact, the ANE component is a very minor player in Europe. It ranges from about 11% to 17%, with the only exception being southwest France, which has an extraordinarily low number of .13. Nowhere in Europe does the figure for ANE go above 20%. In the Near East it is higher, with some populations in the Caucasus getting 30%.
Interesting! According to Dodecad K12b, French_Basque has 0% from Caucasus. And according to Eurogenes K15, just 0,83% from West Asian.


http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m153/vicpret/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/vicpret/media/miorigin_zps25e327a5.jpg.html)

mine

23andme has me at 99% european, but they cover only the last 500 years.
Indication that myOrigins goes back further than 500Years
Very different from mine (below). Strange!, since our results in Gedmatch are similar.

7219

It seems that Asia Minor reference population in myOrigins is the Armenian: https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/user-guide/family-finder-myftdna/myorigins-methodology/

Sile
07-05-15, 07:43
Interesting! According to Dodecad K12b, French_Basque has 0% from Caucasus. And according to Eurogenes K15, just 0,83% from West Asian.


Very different from mine (below). Strange!, since our results in Gedmatch are similar.

7219

It seems that Asia Minor reference population in myOrigins is the Armenian: https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/user-guide/family-finder-myftdna/myorigins-methodology/

my purple states North Mediterranean Basin ....your purple states southern Europe ..............my origins has different names and results for the same areas. This is how it work

Our pinks are different....mine includes Caucasus , yours does not

Each area has many names depending on what your origins tell them....so someone with a blue in the british isles area can only have Irish and Scottish as an example.

Regio X
07-05-15, 15:41
my purple states North Mediterranean Basin ....your purple states southern Europe ..............my origins has different names and results for the same areas. This is how it work

Our pinks are different....mine includes Caucasus , yours does not

Each area has many names depending on what your origins tell them....so someone with a blue in the british isles area can only have Irish and Scottish as an example.
I'm not sure if I understood you right.
The clusters are the same. They just had the names changed.
Your results above are from 1 year ago. See myOrigins in FTDNA now.

Here are my FTDNA closest match results (the match's mother is from Belluno; the father, from Venice):
7227

cylnlts
03-02-17, 14:45
My results by my origin:
Asia Minor % 70
Eastern Middle East %6
Western and central Europe %15
Eastern Europe %3
Northeast Asia %4
Central Asia %3
am I turkısh, Tatar, Azeri ?????? Mongoloid ??

Dibran
05-02-17, 19:19
These were my results(though I must admit it did not allow me to use the modified southeastern european calculator) so Idk how accurate this is. whoever added that version it is in view only.

I am Albanian

EEF: 78.45833506
WHG: 12.82318721
ANE: 8.718477732

brianco
06-02-17, 03:17
Gedmatch EUTEST V2 K13





Population




North_Sea

35.51



Atlantic

27.17



Baltic

11.50



Eastern_Euro

9.83



West_Med

9.72



West_Asian

2.67



East_Med

-



Red_Sea

1.36



South_Asian

1.71



Southeast_Asian

-



Siberian

0.44



Amerindian

-



Oceanian

-



Northeast_African

-



Sub-Saharan

-





















FTDNA My Origins

66% British
26% Scandinavia
7% Ashkenazi Diaspora
1% Central Asia








https://www.gedmatch.com/gifs/M081919_A3D925.gif

davef
06-02-17, 04:16
Do you have known Jewish ancestry? Your Ashkenazi score is meaningful

brianco
06-02-17, 04:28
No known Jewish ancestry :(


Do you have known Jewish ancestry? Your Ashkenazi score is meaningful

Kelmendasi
12-06-17, 22:46
https://s1.postimg.org/onu805avj/Screenshot-2017-04-13_11.45.34_LI.jpg

EastAnglian
01-08-17, 14:49
Gedmatch EUTEST V2 K13





Population



North_Sea
35.51


Atlantic
27.17


Baltic
11.50


Eastern_Euro
9.83


West_Med
9.72


West_Asian
2.67


East_Med
-


Red_Sea
1.36


South_Asian
1.71


Southeast_Asian
-


Siberian
0.44


Amerindian
-


Oceanian
-


Northeast_African
-


Sub-Saharan
-



















FTDNA My Origins

66% British
26% Scandinavia
7% Ashkenazi Diaspora
1% Central Asia







https://www.gedmatch.com/gifs/M081919_A3D925.gif




I have 4% Ashkenazi Diaspora with FTDNA but no Jewish ancestry.

Does anyone think they are picking up on a Mediterranean element?, obviously Ashkenazi is a blend of Jewish and European, it overlaps Italian and Greeks.

I was thinking my came over with the Romans.

JajarBingan
06-08-17, 12:25
Mine

East Europe 45%
Southeast Europe 45%
British Isles 4%
West Middle East 3%
Northeast Asia 2%
Traces: Siberia <1%

West Middle East and British Isles are obviously residues that didn't "fit" completely in the current East/Southeast Euro components.
The 2% Northeast Asian-like bit is consistent across calculators though. Usually I get 1.5% - 2% and I'm still wondering how ancient it is.