What haplo was among people of Keltiminar and among people of Pit-Comb ware cultures?

Robert6

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I would guess N1, because of the link with Pit-Comb Ware
pottery existed 20000 years ago in China, and N1 brought it through Siberia to Europe (Khvalynsk 7000 years ago http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khvalynsk_culture)
Finno-Ugric is related to N1c1
Based on STR markers
The European N1c1 the clade N1c1a1a1a_L550
is much younger than the European R1a_Z283
So the R1a_Z283 was before the N1c1a1a1a_L550 in Europe
 
Based on STR markers
The European N1c1 the clade N1c1a1a1a_L550
is much younger than the European R1a_Z283
So the R1a_Z283 was before the N1c1a1a1a_L550 in Europe

there is also N1a in Europe
N1c1 is relatively young, but N1 was probaly around in West Eurasia long time ago
 
there is also N1a in Europe
N1c1 is relatively young, but N1 was probaly around in West Eurasia long time ago
N1a is only in Balkans, there is no N1a in North Eastern Europe and no N1a in Central Asia.
The ancestor of N1a came to Hungary in the time of Iron age.
 
L550 is not the only N1C1 European clade. Please check here:
http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag150/Alex_Chartorisky/SNP-N-TREE4_zpsb6162baf.jpg

There are Carelian and Savonian clades without L550 mutation and even without VL29 mutation. L550 is just one branch of VL29 which as whole is European.
Yes, there are three European N1c1 branches
the N1c1_L550
the N1c1_CTS9976
and the N1c1_.Z1935
These branches have the age 3000 years old(descedants from three men which lived 3000 years ago).
 
In the glottochronological tree of linguist Starostin the Burushaski language is in the same branch together with the Ket language
The Burusho people have mostly R haplogroup
The Ket people have mostly Q haplogroup.
I think that Keltiminar people spoke a language close to the Burusho language,
and people from the Pit comb ware spoke a language that gived a substratum to German language.
 
Pit-comb.
N1c VL29. 4000 years old, both sons found in Europe. Or mutation before that.
Whatever was there most likely did not survive in big numbers.
 
Pit-comb.
N1c VL29. 4000 years old, both sons found in Europe.
Pit-comb ware is ~ 6200 years old(4200 BC)
The N1c VL29 is ~ 4000 years old
There is 2000 years of difference

N1 appeared in Europe in Iron age, while the R1a in Europe is from the time of late Neolithic
Pit-Comb Ware is Neolithic/Late Neolithic culture
 
Almost no R1b in the territories of Pit Comb Ware culture

Sorry, I meant R1b in Kelteminar, not Pit Comb Ware, despite relationships. Kazakhstan has been vastly depopulated and repopulated. Kelteminar is very southern, so R1b is just my guess.
 
Yes, there are three European N1c1 branches
the N1c1_L550
the N1c1_CTS9976
and the N1c1_.Z1935
These branches have the age 3000 years old(descedants from three men which lived 3000 years ago).

N1c are Yakut
they split some 8000 years ago, maybe in Central Asia
 
I didn't understand why you mention Khvalynsk Chalcolithic age culture?
Khvalynsk people belonged to Pontid race,
and the Pontid race is now dominant in west Caucasus.

N1 brought the first pottery to Europe from China
Khvalynsk was the 1st culture in Europe with this type of pottery
I don't think Khvalynsk were N1, but their must have been some contact with N1, maybe even some exchange of mtDNA
Pit-Comb also had this pottery. What about the Kelteminar?

What is the Pontid race?
And how do you recognize it? Skeletons?
 
N1c are Yakut
they split some 8000 years ago, maybe in Central Asia
Yakuts came from North-Eastern Mongolia and from Baikal regions these regions are far away from Uzbekistan-Turkmenistan(far away from Keltiminar Culture), and have 25% Mongolian words in their language
 
What is the Pontid race?
And how do you recognize it? Skeletons?
Anthpologist Trofimova( Трофимова Т. А. ) wrote about this, that people of Khwalynsk culture were of Pontid subtype.

Pontid subtype is among Adyghe Abkhasians Mishar Tatars(they live close to Mordovia) western Georgians(Megrels Laz)
part of Russians from Don - Khopyor regions, and among part of southern Ukranians.


Alans and Scythians also belonged to Pontid subtype


Pontid subtype is part of Mediteranean race
 
Yakuts came from North-Eastern Mongolia and from Baikal regions these regions are far away from Uzbekistan-Turkmenistan(far away from Keltiminar Culture), and have 25% Mongolian words in their language

Yakuts - N1c - were iron age cattle herders on the steppe.
They were defeated by the Mongols west of lake Bajkal.
Only a few survived and fled to present day Yakutia, the are not Turkic, yet they are surrounded by Turkic speaking people.

As cattle herders on the steppe they may have traveled a long way before their defeat.
Where from nobody seems to know.

Finns and Saami - N1c1 - were hunters near Finland since 600 BC.
Some say they were cattle herders before they moved northwest.
 
Anthpologist Trofimova( Трофимова Т. А. ) wrote about this, that people of Khwalynsk culture were of Pontid subtype.

Pontid subtype is among Adyghe Abkhasians Mishar Tatars(they live close to Mordovia) western Georgians(Megrels Laz)
part of Russians from Don - Khopyor regions, and among part of southern Ukranians.


Alans and Scythians also belonged to Pontid subtype


Pontid subtype is part of Mediteranean race

Some 6 the century Alans near the Don have been identified as G2, right?
 

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