PDA

View Full Version : P haplogroup - The father of YDN Q and R groups



Alpakut
09-05-15, 16:32
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDI7j1eftqk

Tell me your thoughts about the Kazakh man with the haplogroup P. What do you think about the migratory of haplogroup P peoples.

Alpakut
09-05-15, 16:34
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ulb_puMKRYQ

bicicleur
09-05-15, 20:03
there is P*-P295 of which there are few in Indonesia and the Philippines
and there is P1-M45 who is ancestral to Q and R

I estimate P1 split from P* more than 45000 years ago in northern India
P1 crossed the Hindu Kush and moved toward the Altaï Mts some 38000 years ago, around the time Q and R were born

as far as I know P1 tested negative for Q and R does not exist

or does it ?
you claim you are P-M45, that is P1
have you been tested for Q-M242 and R-M207 ?

if so, next question would be where did your ancestors survive the ice ages ?

oriental
09-05-15, 20:46
It gets very interesting. It could be that that the DNA did not mutate that much in Ice Age so they could be older thus spread over wider areas.

Here is the Karafet Report
http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.ca/2014/06/y-dna-macro-haplogroup-k-m526.html

bicicleur
10-05-15, 12:25
It gets very interesting. It could be that that the DNA did not mutate that much in Ice Age so thye could be older thus spread over wider areas.

Here is the Karafet Report
http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.ca/2014/06/y-dna-macro-haplogroup-k-m526.html

from the fact that P* and K2b1 are found today in Indonesia, Melanesia and Australia, they conclude that P1 originated in Indonesia
I don't think so
There is no archeological indication whatsoever for an expansion from Sundaland
There is proof of very early microliths in India
And there are many very old subclades of haplogroup H, which suggests an expansion from India
P* and P1 simply went a different direction the moment H expanded
There is ample archeological proof for expansion through the corridor between Hindu Kush and Altaï Mts

oriental
11-05-15, 21:27
When I look at the Toba eruption around 74,000 years ago and the absence of Hg. C, D, F and K in India which is the transit route to Southeast Asia makes me wonder if these Haplogroups might be older. Hg. K-526 was in Ust Isham in Siberia and in Sundaland shows Hg. K-526 was wide spread.

http://www.examiner.com/article/ust-ishim-man-genome-sequenced

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v514/n7523/full/nature13810.html

http://www.molecularecologist.com/2014/11/the-ust-ishim-genome/

http://dienekes.blogspot.ca/2014/10/high-coverage-genome-from-45000-year.html

http://www.nature.com/news/oldest-known-human-genome-sequenced-1.16194

http://www.mpg.de/8710423/genome-earliest-modern-human

http://eurogenes.blogspot.ca/2014/10/ust-ishim-belongs-to-k-m526.html

https://westhunt.wordpress.com/2014/10/23/ust-ishim-the-old-race/

Sundaland wasn't that big but India IS big. The diversification of Hg. K could have occurred in India before the Toba eruption 70,000 - 75,000 years ago.

There isn't a diverse environment in the Sudaland as much as India. Sundaland was basically a depression (which became sea with the rise of the sea level) with hills and mountains which became Southeast Asian islands.

India has desert (Thar), mountains (Himalayas), coastal plains (Bengal), river valleys (Ganges and Indus), plateaus (Deccan) which create a diversification of the human species.

The interpretation of "rapid" diversification of Hg. K makes me suspicious as Sundaland is quite small and the environment not so diverse. The distance of Hg. K-526 in Sundaland and in Ust Isham, Siberia also is a problem as it is too short a time to move from the Sundaland to Ust Isham, Siberia

oriental
12-05-15, 21:20
After looking at the maps and small globe that I have at home, I take it back that Sundaland is quite big. Also, it is in the tropics. Maybe the hot climate may have caused faster mutation rates thus the diversification. Still the distance from Siberia to Southeast Asia is problematic. It is problematic no matter which way it is looked at. There might be other factors unknown or overlooked. There hasn't been as thorough a testing of DNA in Asia as in Europe and America. More testing may reveal more knowledge and help solve many mysteries.

Alpakut
13-05-15, 04:26
there is P*-P295 of which there are few in Indonesia and the Philippines
and there is P1-M45 who is ancestral to Q and R

I estimate P1 split from P* more than 45000 years ago in northern India
P1 crossed the Hindu Kush and moved toward the Altaï Mts some 38000 years ago, around the time Q and R were born
Haplogroup P is very interesting. It is pointing towards a south-east asian origin:
http://www.ranhaer.com/attachments/forumid_97/140606182790b0cedf4d0872a7.jpg.thumb.jpg



you claim you are P-M45, that is P1
have you been tested for Q-M242 and R-M207 ?
No. But my parental tribal line traces back to south-east Kazakhstan where haplogroup R1a is very frequent. What I don't understand is how P-M45 can be ancestral to P* and QR, when you are actually saying that P-M45 is P1 in reality?


if so, next question would be where did your ancestors survive the ice ages ?
According to dr. Spencer Wells they just stayed in central asia like Niyazov's family did. What do you think?

Salmon
29-06-15, 18:06
There was a population with a high concentration of P haplogroup y-chromosomes that was one of the first to domesticate wolves, ungulates, and plants.


The P haplogroup spread to the North Atlantic Islands and the Southern tip of Chile. They spread in 2 directions. They probably did it with the help of dogs, as dogs were found in Meso-America.

Some P haplogroup clan started playing with dogs. They bred them. They started using them to hunt. They went north into the snow. They spread East and West from central Asia.

Salmon
29-06-15, 19:09
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ulb_puMKRYQ

why does that video have pictures of females? Females don't have y-chromosomes.

xiaodragon
09-12-18, 07:15
I estimate P1 split from P* more than 45000 years ago in northern India
P1 crossed the Hindu Kush and moved toward the Altaï Mts some 38000 years ago, around the time Q and R were born.
Is it possible that P*moved to northeast Asia from the south and east of China along the coast ,all the way to the tip of eastern most of Asia?

xiaodragon
09-12-18, 07:20
through the corridor between Hindu Kush and Altaï Mts, 

xiaodragon
09-12-18, 07:28
Still the distance from Siberia to Southeast Asia is problematic. It is problematic no matter which way it is looked at. If follows the south coast to move up to the east , and from Shandong(山東) up to Liaoning(遼寧), then to the Northern provinces, Jilin,and Heilongjiang (吉林,黑龍江), there you are in East Siberia.

xiaodragon
09-12-18, 08:28
尼阿底出土的4~3万年前人类在海拔4600 地区生存的证据:The earliest human occupation of the high-altitude Tibetan Plateau 40-30 thousand years ago,
published by Science. recently.

the Nwya Devu site is dated to 40,000 to 30,000years, it is the earliest human presence in Tibetan Plateau , and the highest spot , this might point to a route through the Himalayas and through the Sichua(四川) and Qinghai(青海) corridor to Gansu (甘肅) and from there to the Baikal lake and south of Siberia, and to the east ,and to the north . this route might started from India to Gulf of Tonkin ,into Guangxi(廣西) , and into Yunnan(雲南),sichuan (四川)。

Ataneojr1
11-01-19, 22:51
my haplogroup has been updated in the YFULL Ytree to P*

Sile
12-01-19, 18:35
my haplogroup has been updated in the YFULL Ytree to P*

Karafet 2 papers of 2014 and 2015 places origin of P in south-east Asia