Cephalic index of ancient populations and reconstructions

The cephalic index or cranial index is the ratio of the maximum width of the head of an organism (human or animal) multiplied by 100 divided by its maximum length (i.e., in the horizontal plane, or front to back). The index is also used to categorize animals, especially dogs and cats.

Hunters of Sri Lanka - the Vedda people - whose native language is neither Indo-European nor Dravidian - also have these features:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vedda_language#Substratum_influence_in_Sinhalese









This first old guy has blue eyes, it seems:

Do these Veddas from Sri Lanka - or other forager groups from South India - score any CHG autosomal DNA ???:

Krefter said:

I suspect most "Caucasoid" features come from Paleolithic West Asia with "ENF" people.

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Mesolithic European hunters were Caucasoid as well.

Morphologically they were not much different from modern Europeans.

Pigmentation has changed much more than morphology.

Fire Haired14 said:

We're going to need formal stats, not just ADMIXTURE, to back up the idea of CHG-like ancestry in West Asia. F3(not drift) shows that Assyrian/Lezgin/Turkish fit as a mixture of CHG+EEF(best proxy of Neolithic Near East?).

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has he gone insane lol? (or did you add this part) Why should CHG+EEF be the best proxy for Neolithic Near Easterners because modern heavily admixed and post Bronze and Iron Age populations such as Turks/Assyrians/Lezgians appear like EEF+CHG? I thought the conensus was that a EEF like group mixed into the Caucasus over time this is visible from one of the CHG samples who shows first signs of EEF.

Or did you mean by Neolithic times the Near East was dominated by two components CHG (in the East and Caucasus) and EEF in the West. Than I agree. In fact I go further and say ancient Near East beginning with Neolithic was dominated by three groups, EEF in West, CHG in East and something like "Southern Farmers" in South.

In Anatolia obviously those CHG like groups pushed from the Caucasus and likely Iranian Plateau into Anatolia and the Levant. Why should the Neolithic Near Easterners(by that I assume you mean Neolithic farmers?) be EEF+CHG if Neolithic West and Central Anatolians appear EEF?

Fire Heard said:

I suspect most "Caucasoid" features come from Paleolithic West Asia with "ENF" people.

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Fire there was never an "ENF" people. Thats at least what we should know from now. But if you replace ENF with EEF and CHG (sidenote both are heavy in something "Basal Eurasian like" ) that makes sense and I agree.


I wrote month ago what I think people of different components looked like. And I wrote that EEF would be the archetype of those what former anthropologists called Nordics and Mediterranids.

"Teal " or now CHG would be very akine to EEF with the difference of signs of "dinarization" aka "mtebidization" and slightly more broad faced.

WHG would be like broad or rounder faced Europeans. And ANE like something Kalash like who have Native American vibes on them.

EHG would be a cross of WHG and ANE look.

Yamna people can be modelled genetically as a mix of EHG and either "Teal" or CHG. This also applies already to Khvalynsk people, even though in slightly different proportions. In anthropological terms I'm not sure how things looked like in Yamna culture (maybe the population was already so intermixed that it comprised a single anthropological type), but a morphological duality of Khvalynsk population can be observed.

Let's quote Mathieson's study:

"The unusually large cemetery at Khvalynsk contained southern Europeoid and northern Europeoid cranio-facial types, consistent with the possibility that people from the northern and southern steppes mingled and were buried here."

I guess that originally (before they merged into one population) EHG = northern types and "Teal" or CHG = southern types.

I wonder which cranio-facial type or types can be attributed to males SVP35 with R1b (grave 12) and SVP46 with R1a (grave 1) ???

Were both of them of northern Europeoid cranio-facial type, or was one or both of them of southern Europeoid type?

Alan,

Here are some reconstructions of WHGs:

1) Loschbour male:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUnh_X3jH0w





2) Loschbour female:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cmlovynSh4



3) La Brana male:

Alan said:

In fact I go further and say ancient Near East beginning with Neolithic was dominated by three groups, EEF in West, CHG in East and something like "Southern Farmers" in South.

As seen on Jones et al the Levant looks like a mix of EEF and something "East African" shifted. That "East African" shift must have come with those "Southern/Southwestern farmers who probably gave later birth to Proto Afro_Asiatic speakers.

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The only haplogroups in East Africa to create this "something EEF and East african " was either ancient F or E

Tomenable said:

Yamna people can be modelled genetically as a mix of EHG and either "Teal" or CHG. This also applies already to Khvalynsk people, even though in slightly different proportions. In anthropological terms I'm not sure how things looked like in Yamna culture (maybe the population was already so intermixed that it comprised a single anthropological type), but a morphological duality of Khvalynsk population can be observed.

Let's quote Mathieson's study:

"The unusually large cemetery at Khvalynsk contained southern Europeoid and northern Europeoid cranio-facial types, consistent with the possibility that people from the northern and southern steppes mingled and were buried here."

I guess that originally (before they merged into one population) EHG = northern types and "Teal" or CHG = southern types.

I wonder which cranio-facial type or types can be attributed to males SVP35 with R1b (grave 12) and SVP46 with R1a (grave 1) ???

Were both of them of northern Europeoid cranio-facial type, or was one or both of them of southern Europeoid type?

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Reconstructions of Khvalynsk people:





















Source:

http://www.forumbiodiversity.com/sh...do-Europeans?p=1025629&viewfull=1#post1025629

^ Continued (due to the limit of 20 images per post):

Angela said:

I believe, as I said at the time, that the people who helped to form Corded Ware, in particular, could have been a "related" population to Yamna and not a descendent of Yamna, and therefore an "Indo-Europeanized" population. In either case, however, they were heavier in EHG, and with some EEF, and therefore carrying less "CHG". Further north, some of the Indo-Europeanized groups might have been very heavily EHG. Further south the Indo-European groups might have been more heavily CHG.

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I'm not sure why do you consider Yamnaya as the "original Indoeuropeans". That culture was not the first stage of PIE, but the last one:

According to linguist Robert Stephen Paul Beekes: "There seems to be no doubt that the Yamnaya culture represents the LAST phase of an Indo-European linguistic unity, although there were probably already significant dialectal differences within it."

Marija Gimbutas who was the original author of the Kurgan Hypothesis also didn't consider Yamna as the earliest PIE, but a later stage.

Gimbutas saw early stages of PIE in Chalcolithic steppe cultures which preceded Yamna - Samara and Khvalynsk cultures.

According to Mayu's blog, Corded Ware was descended from PIE groups which emigrated from the steppe during Early Yamna phase:

http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/p/blog-page.html

AFAIK, all Yamna samples collected so far are from later phases of Yamna culture, so they are people who stayed in that part of the steppe after several other groups had already emigrated in various directions before. Which may be the reason why all that we can see there is ht35.

All Yamna samples tested so far, are from period called by Mayu "Indoeuropean stage 3", not from "stage 2":

Stage 2:



Stage 3:



By the time of Stage 3 some haplogroups and subclades - such as R1b-L51 - could already be outside of the steppe zone.

Maybe R1b-L51 - which is absent from Yamna samples known to date - was in Coţofeni culture or in Ezero culture ???

Tomenable said:

Alan,

Here are some reconstructions of WHGs:

1) Loschbour male:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUnh_X3jH0w

2) Loschbour female:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cmlovynSh4

3) La Brana male:

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predominantly broad or round faced. Of course there will be exception but in German we say, "exceptions prove the rule".

Some modern "WHG" type. Of course less depigmented. No one said WHG or ANE looked "non Caucasoid", just that the majority would have been more similar to the significantly broader or rounder faced types.

Alan, are you writing about face shape (height : breadth) or skull shape (length : width ratio, level of roundness)?

In case of Mesolithic WHGs they were dolichocephalic (long-skulled), it can be seen when you look at Loschbour skull's profile.

In Europe a trend of brachycephalization (skulls becoming rounder over time) has been observed since Neolithic times until recently.

This is being discussed for example in this paper: http://oregonstate.edu/instruct/anth/smith/TimeMach1984.pdf

Tomenable said:

Alan, are you writing about face shape (height : breadth) or skull shape (length : width ratio, level of roundness)?

In case of Mesolithic WHGs they were dolichocephalic (long-skulled), it can be seen when you look at Loschbour skull's profile.

In Europe a trend of brachycephalization (skulls becoming rounder over time) has been observed since Neolithic times until recently.

This is being discussed for example in this paper: http://oregonstate.edu/instruct/anth/smith/TimeMach1984.pdf

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I am talking about head broudness, the loshbour Guy is also broad headed even though he is slightly longer headed than average.
Loshbours headshape is rather Dolichocephalic and broad and he is an exception since he seems to be the only one out of the the males who is very longheaded, We can't conclude that WHG are long headed based on Loshbour if the two other male reconstructions are rather brachycephalic.

As I said in one of my posts month ago. I never claimed WHG were all brachycephalic.

Based on what I have seen from the cranial material found and reconstructions. WHG and EHG are predominantly Meso- to Brachycephalic. That means there are many WHG samples who are middle longheaded and many who are short headed. And they were also very broad faced on average. But also characteristics of WHG and EHG are strong browridges and sloping forhead.

While found EEF skeletons were Dolicho- to Mesocephalic and Robust (medium broad) or sometimes long faced.

CHG samples from what I have seen in people who are very heavy in this component are like EEF but with a slight dinarization process and some characterstics of EHG. Basically like many of the Yamna reconstructions. They would be meso-to dolichocephalic.



I have seen other mesolithic H&G reconstructions from Germany they are pretty round or broad headed.

Here are some more mesolithic WHG reconstructions. pred. meso- to brachycephalic. Often broader/rounder faced



EEF reconstructions on the other hand are pred. Dolicho- to Mesocephalic and mostly Robust.

Alan,

You claim that they are brachycephalic and to support this claim, you then post pictures showing their faces from the front.

This indicates, that you are one of many people who confuse Head Shape with Face Shape. You can't tell if someone is brachycephalic, mesocephalic or dolichocephalic by looking at his head just frontally - you must take a look from either left or right profile. Long-headedness is about the length of skull as measured from forehead to occiput (the back of your head). It is not about the height of face measured from chin to the top of head. Someone can be "broad-faced + long-headed" or "long-faced + short-headed" as well.

Loschbour is obviously dolichocephalic (long-headed).

Mesolithic HGs in Europe used to be more dolichocephalic than modern Europeans (see: the trend toward brachycephalization).

By the way - the last of your picture shows Ötzi, who was a Neolithic EEF farmer.

Ötzi was indeed brachycephalic or mesocephalic (this is the only profile picture you posted).

Of course there will be allot of overlap, since EEF is virtually made up of 50% pre WHG like ancestry.

The point is just to show the average. On Average EEF types are longer headed(dolicho- to mesocephalic) and Robust while WHG types shorter headed (meso- to brachycephalic) and broad/rounder faced.

@Tomenable

I don't know if you even red what I write. I wrote WHG were pred. meso- to brachycephalic. Means some samples were mesocephalic(middle longheaded) other were brachycephalic(short headed).

If you have knowledge about this stuff you should know that someone with this kind of facial structure can no way be anything else but brachycephalic.
http://www.revolution-jungsteinzeit...etterhoehlenfrau_Halbprofil_links__440pix.jpg



On the other hand this guy looks pred. mesocephalic
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/07/91/3f/07913f4a549daf8cbfc2646b3cc75cd2.jpg

Posting some random pictures is un-scientific.

Why don't you check numerical data from some anthropological publication? I remember reading that from Paleolithic to Mesolithic the trend in Europe was generally toward dolichocephalization, but then from Neolithic to the 19th century the trend was toward brachycephalization. So Mesolithic Europeans were apparently more dolichocephalic, on average, than modern Europeans.

What is behind these processes is still largely unknown (maybe it's just random drift).

But according to this publication, brachycephalic skulls are more "cost-effective" in terms of volume vs. staying warm:

http://oregonstate.edu/instruct/anth/smith/TimeMach1984.pdf

In general populations around the equator tend to be more dolichocephalic so maybe relationship with climate exists. But there are some exceptions (e.g. brachycephalic Native Americans near the equator, dolichocephalic Scandinavians near the Arctic Circle).

That said, Scandinavia has seen the trend of brachycephalization as well (they used to be more dolicho- in the past than now).

Also you need to see it in this perspective. There are some people in Northeast Europe mostly who have this kind of extreme broad,round heads which are not so relevant in other regions of the continent and therefore can only be traced to WHG or EHG ancestry, while there are some kind of facial features in South Europe or Western Asia (especially among some Bedouin tribes which are rare in Northeast Europe and can only be traced to EEF ancestry.

Just to give two extreme examples.

Tomenable said:

Today North Africans and Middle Easterners are indeed more dolichocephalic - on average - than Europeans. But the most dolichocephalic populations (CI 73-75) are Sub-Saharan Africans, South Indians, Eskimos, Inuits, and Australo-Melanesians.

According to this map: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/PSM_V50_D602_World_cephalic_index_map.jpg



I still don't know if you are talking about face shape or skull shape.

Ötzi looks rather medium- or short-headed (meso- or brachycephalic), and he was EEF.

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disagree, Todays West Asians are not more or not less meso-Dolichocephalic than South or Central Europeans.
Going from what we know about the skeletons the ancient West Asians were more Longheaded dolicho-mesocephalic than modern West Asians who have undergone a shortening process. That was even mentioned by old school anthropologists.

That is exactly the reason why I say the EEF were the most dolicho-mesocephalic types of West Eurasia by that time, because virtually all Neolithic skeletons from Anatolia and the Levant were Robust Dolichocephalic types.

Sub Saharan Africans, South Indians, Eskimos, Inuits or whatever are not West Eurasians so they don't play any role.

Though Sub Saharan Africans and South Indians are not more Dolichocephalic. South Indian tribals are meso- or brachycephalic. There is also huge variation in Sub Saharan Africans. In fact the most Dolichocephalic Sub Saharan Africans are the West Eurasian (EEF) mixed East Africans like Ethopians and Eritreans. And in West Africa the Mali and Mauritanians(Afro_Asiatic admixed).

And Eskimos, Inuits Dolichocephalic? The Eskimos I have seen were average Mesocephalic (middle longheaded) and Inuits mostly brachycephalic round faced.

But than again. They don't play any role in our discussion about West Eurasian types and the differences between WHG and EEF.