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TopLobster
27-08-17, 06:24
Hello, I would appreciate some help interpreting my brother's results. I have done a significant amount of genealogy and found that we have predominately English ancestry, followed by Scottish, Irish, and possibly Channel Islander.
He was tested with 23andMe. The 23andMe results are below followed by Eurogenes results.


23andMe "Speculative"


European
100%


Northwestern European
98.1%


British & Irish
61.0%


French & German
13.8%


Scandinavian
1.9%


Finnish
<0.1%


Broadly Northwestern European
21.4%


Ashkenazi Jewish
0.4%


Southern Europe
0.2%


Iberian
<0.1%


Broadly Southern European
0.1%


Broadly European
1.3%



Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15


North Sea
36.12


Atlantic
26.61


Baltic
11.57


Eastern Euro
6.95


West_Med
10.05


Red_Sea
0.55


South Asian
2.78


Southeast Asian
-


Siberian
-


Amerindian
0.47


Oceanian
-


Northeast_African
0.37


Sub-Saharan
-



Eurogenes Jtest


SOUTH_BALTIC
14.64


EAST_EURO
9.72


NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO
28.88


ATLLANTIC
25.76


WEST_MED
11.51


ASHKENAZI
3.10


EAST_MED
-


WEST_ASIAN
4.52


MIDDLE_EASTERN
-


SOUTH_ASIAN
1.88


EAST_AFRICAN
-


EAST_ASIAN
-


SIBERIAN
-


WEST_AFRICAN
-




Both Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 and Jtest show a higher than average level of South Asian ancestry. Is it possible to figure out if this is indicative of Indian ancestry? I have found through genealogy that one of our 3rd great grandmothers was born in what was Bengal, India to an English/British family.

I am also curious about the Ashkenazi admixture. If the average Ashkenazi admixture for English people is 3.52, then he is below the average, and there must be a statistical error with the analyzer if a large amount of people without any Ashkenazi ancestry have those components categorized as Ashkenazi.

Thanks in advance.

Maciamo
27-08-17, 10:01
Calculators like Eurogenes or Dodecad report very ancient ancestry (over 5000 years old). In contrast 23andMe reports more recent ancestry (they claim 500 years, but it's more like 2000 years). Since you are 100% European at 23andMe, the South Asian can only be very ancient. Low percentages of South Asian are regularly found all over Europe. Have you tried HarappaWorld K16? This calculator tends to me more reliable for (ancient) South Asian ancestry.

TopLobster
27-08-17, 13:12
Thanks for your reply.
Here are the HarappaWorld K16 results.



Population



S-Indian
0.68


Baloch
11.21


Caucasian
5.49


NE-Euro
50.17


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
0.07


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.39


American
0.35


Beringian
0.07


Mediterranean
31.26


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
0.31


Pygmy
-


W-African
-




Do you have data on the typical ranges for different admixtures? Are most people very close to the averages or can one person score say 0.05 and another score 2.5 without having recent ancestry from that population.

LeBrok
27-08-17, 17:03
Thanks for your reply.
Here are the HarappaWorld K16 results.



Population



S-Indian
0.68


Baloch
11.21


Caucasian
5.49


NE-Euro
50.17


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
0.07


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.39


American
0.35


Beringian
0.07


Mediterranean
31.26


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
0.31


Pygmy
-


W-African
-




Do you have data on the typical ranges for different admixtures? Are most people very close to the averages or can one person score say 0.05 and another score 2.5 without having recent ancestry from that population.Your numbers are very typical for GB.
http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/32877-HarappaWorld-Gedmatch-post-and-compare-your-admixtures-to-ancient-and-contemporary

TopLobster
28-08-17, 15:40
Thanks for the reply Maciamo. Do you think the Ashkenazi Jewish showing up is just European DNA that Ashkenenazi Jews also have, since he has 0 East Med and 0 Middle Eastern? Also, what is the typical range that people can be from the average for ancient foreign admixture? Does the population become more homogeneous with regards to the percentage each generation?

Sile
28-08-17, 19:27
Thanks for the reply Maciamo. Do you think the Ashkenazi Jewish showing up is just European DNA that Ashkenenazi Jews also have, since he has 0 East Med and 0 Middle Eastern? Also, what is the typical range that people can be from the average for ancient foreign admixture? Does the population become more homogeneous with regards to the percentage each generation?
The Jtest from Eurogenes is a very old calculator and has what is called "calculator effect", basically anything under 4% is an error. More modern tests from eurogenes has zero calculator effect ......so your jTest should read zero% ashkenazi
BTW, EUtest also has calculator effect

the Eutest V2 K15 has fixed the calculator test , give that a try

mine below

Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Atlantic 24.78
2 West_Med 18.81
3 East_Med 13.91
4 North_Sea 13.36
5 Baltic 9.59
6 West_Asian 8.42
7 Eastern_Euro 7.71
8 Red_Sea 2.27
9 South_Asian 0.77
10 Sub-Saharan 0.26
11 Oceanian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Italian 6.25
2 Tuscan 9.1
3 Spanish_Andalucia 10.11

spruithean
28-08-17, 20:05
Calculators like Eurogenes or Dodecad report very ancient ancestry (over 5000 years old). In contrast 23andMe reports more recent ancestry (they claim 500 years, but it's more like 2000 years). Since you are 100% European at 23andMe, the South Asian can only be very ancient. Low percentages of South Asian are regularly found all over Europe. Have you tried HarappaWorld K16? This calculator tends to me more reliable for (ancient) South Asian ancestry.

I have a similar situation to TopLobster, mostly Continental+Isles ancestry with a surprising level of South Asian on the Eurogenes calculator. So it is merely an ancient link?

TopLobster
29-08-17, 02:55
The Jtest from Eurogenes is a very old calculator and has what is called "calculator effect", basically anything under 4% is an error. More modern tests from eurogenes has zero calculator effect ......so your jTest should read zero% ashkenazi
BTW, EUtest also has calculator effect

the Eutest V2 K15 has fixed the calculator test , give that a try

mine below

Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

#PopulationPercent
1 Atlantic 24.78
2 West_Med 18.81
3 East_Med 13.91
4 North_Sea 13.36
5 Baltic 9.59
6 West_Asian 8.42
7 Eastern_Euro 7.71
8 Red_Sea 2.27
9 South_Asian 0.77
10 Sub-Saharan 0.26
11 Oceanian 0.12

Single Population Sharing:

#Population (source)Distance
1 North_Italian 6.25
2 Tuscan 9.1
3 Spanish_Andalucia 10.11
I posted the results of Eurogenes K15 V2 already.

TopLobster
29-08-17, 03:22
I already posted the Eurogenes EUtest K15 V2, so here is EUtest V1 to compare:



SOUTH_BALTIC
14.69


EAST_EURO
9.87


NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO
29.16


ATLANTIC
26.25


WEST_MED
12.00


EAST_MED
0.74


WEST_ASIAN
5.16


MIDDLE_EASTERN
-


SOUTH_ASIAN
1.84


EAST_AFRICAN
0.26


EAST_ASIAN
-


SIBERIAN
-


WEST_AFRICAN
-

Joey D
29-08-17, 09:41
My EU V2 K15



East Med
30.31







West Med
17.77







West Asian
17.34







Atlantic
12.77







North Sea
9.65







Baltic
4.01







Eastern Euro
3.49







Red Sea
1.73
















Using 1 population approximation:






1 South_Italian @ 5.661479







2 Central_Greek @ 6.268047







3 East_Sicilian @ 7.335024







4 Italian_Abruzzo @ 8.734882







5 Italian_Jewish @ 9.777426







6 Ashkenazi @ 9.933926

TopLobster
29-08-17, 17:48
HarappaWorld Results





Population



S-Indian
0.68


Baloch
11.21


Caucasian
5.49


NE-Euro
50.17


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
0.07


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.39


American
0.35


Beringian
0.07


Mediterranean
31.26


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
0.31


Pygmy
-


W-African
-

LeBrok
30-08-17, 18:57
HarappaWorld Results





Population



S-Indian
0.68


Baloch
11.21


Caucasian
5.49


NE-Euro
50.17


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
0.07


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.39


American
0.35


Beringian
0.07


Mediterranean
31.26


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
0.31


Pygmy
-


W-African
-









Check my post #4. Somehow it didn't display before and needed approval for... who knows why.

spruithean
30-08-17, 22:42
HarappaWorld Results





Population



S-Indian
0.68


Baloch
11.21


Caucasian
5.49


NE-Euro
50.17


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
0.07


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.39


American
0.35


Beringian
0.07


Mediterranean
31.26


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
0.31


Pygmy
-


W-African
-










Our results are fairly similar with that calculator. Though I score 1.38 S-Indian. My known ancestry is mosty Isles and North Sea European. On Eurogenes K15 I score 2.39 South Asian, I would say these values are within range.

TopLobster
31-08-17, 15:27
Check my post #4. Somehow it didn't display before and needed approval for... who knows why.

I see it now.

TopLobster
31-08-17, 16:02
Your numbers are very typical for GB.

Was the Baloch component brought by the Indo-Europeans, who inherited it from the Caucasus Hunter-Gatherers?

LeBrok
31-08-17, 17:51
Was the Baloch component brought by the Indo-Europeans, who inherited it from the Caucasus Hunter-Gatherers?Baloch already existed in EHG and got increased during Yamnaya period from mixing with Iranian Farmer. In Northern Europe Baloch is mostly from Yamnaya source. In South mostly from Iran/Armenia which accumulated in Anatolia Chalcolithic, then moved into Balkans and South Europe during Chalcolithic/Bronze Age period. It seems that in Paleolithic/Mesolithic periods the source of Baloch was located around modern Iran area, then "radiated" to close by populations.

Arnaud
31-08-17, 18:55
I don't understand why they put France and Germany in the same group.

Do you have an explanation Maciamo?

I1a3_Young
05-09-17, 14:31
I don't understand why they put France and Germany in the same group.

Do you have an explanation Maciamo?

There are multiple factors for that decision. First, DNA testing is illegal in France so getting modern samples is difficult. Second, the Franks and other tribes had a large genetic influence on both places so they are difficult to differentiate.

If you pull the Basque out and call it Basque (high influence in Gascony/Aquitaine), pull out the Italian (Roman influence around Paris), pull out the Scandinavian in Normandy, and account for Bretons in Brittany....compare that to Germany with the Scandinavian or eastern Slavic influence removed....it won't seem so different. You're left with a similar celto-germanic mix in France, Switzerland, Belgium, Germany (more West and South) and south Netherlands.

TopLobster
16-02-18, 03:09
HarappaWorld K16


Population
Me
Brother
England Average


S-Indian
0.50
0.68
0


Baloch
11.90
11.21
10


Caucasian
8.11
5.49
7


NE-Euro
47.36
50.17
50


SE-Asian
-
-
0


Siberian
-
0.07
0


NE-Asian
-
-
0


Papuan
0.28
0.39
0


American
-
0.35
0


Beringian
1.45
0.07
0


Mediterranean
30.37
31.26
32


SW-Asian
-
-
0


San
-
-
0


E-African
-
0.31
0


Pygmy
-
-
0


W-African
-
-
0

TopLobster
18-02-18, 03:01
HarappaWorld K16 for me



Population



S-Indian
0.50


Baloch
11.90


Caucasian
8.11


NE-Euro
47.36


SE-Asian
-


Siberian
-


NE-Asian
-


Papuan
0.28


American
-


Beringian
1.45


Mediterranean
30.37


SW-Asian
-


San
-


E-African
-


Pygmy
-


W-African
-

TopLobster
18-02-18, 18:36
Eurogenes K15

Admix Results (sorted):



#
Population
Percent


1
North_Sea
34.24


2
Atlantic
26.45


3
Eastern_Euro
11.45


4
West_Med
9.38


5
Baltic
9.08


6
West_Asian
4.94


7
South_Asian
2.01


8
East_Med
1.62


9
Oceanian
0.36


10
Siberian
0.29


11
Northeast_African
0.18



Mixed Mode Population Sharing:



#

Primary Population (source)
Secondary Population (source)
Distance


1

91.8%
Southwest_English
+
8.2%
Chuvash
@
2.85


2

93%
Southwest_English
+
7%
Mari
@
3


3

94.3%
Southwest_English
+
5.7%
MA-1
@
3.06


4

77.2%
Orcadian
+
22.8%
Serbian
@
3.1


5

94.2%
Southwest_English
+
5.8%
Kalash
@
3.11


6

94.4%
Southwest_English
+
5.6%
Burusho
@
3.14


7

93.5%
Southwest_English
+
6.5%
Afghan_Pashtun
@
3.16


8

90.2%
Southwest_English
+
9.8%
Tatar
@
3.16


9

79.5%
Orcadian
+
20.5%
Moldavian
@
3.19


10

93.9%
Southeast_English
+
6.1%
Kalash
@
3.2


11

92.9%
Danish
+
7.1%
Sardinian
@
3.21


12

91.9%
Southeast_English
+
8.1%
Chuvash
@
3.21


13

94.1%
Southeast_English
+
5.9%
Burusho
@
3.22


14

92.9%
Southwest_English
+
7.1%
Tadjik
@
3.23


15

56.9%
Danish
+
43.1%
South_Dutch
@
3.25


16

87.6%
Southwest_English
+
12.4%
East_Finnish
@
3.25


17

90.9%
Southwest_English
+
9.1%
Erzya
@
3.26


18

94.5%
Southwest_English
+
5.5%
Pathan
@
3.28


19

54.2%
South_Dutch
+
45.8%
Orcadian
@
3.29


20

89.8%
Southwest_English
+
10.2%
Kargopol_Russian
@
3.29



Are these predictions due to higher than average South Asian admixture?