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Tomenable
28-06-19, 12:03
DNA of ancient Greek settler from Empuries colony, similarity map:

https://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/similitude.htm

https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/ancient-human-dna_41837#10/42.1370/3.1761

https://i.imgur.com/AhtJlQ7.png

Gallic slave (probably, could also be a trader etc.) from Empuries:

https://i.imgur.com/KjuNcPR.png

This Gaul has high "French" and "North Atlantic" in Eurogenes K36.

Y-DNA haplogroup of I8206 (Gaul in Empuries) was R1b-U152>L2.

Tomenable
28-06-19, 12:18
I8215 Empuries Greek settler - kit number FM5677291

I8206 South Gaul R1b-U152 - kit number LR7149284

That Gaul was very "northern", which gives support to my hypothesis that modern Central French people have Roman/Italian admixture.

Tomenable
28-06-19, 15:08
Eurogenes K15 of this Gaul from Empuries - I8206 - is a bit noisy (or maybe it is DNA damage?):

Population
North_Sea 36.88 Pct
Atlantic 22.88 Pct
Baltic 10.42 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.77 Pct
West_Med 11.55 Pct
West_Asian 2.82 Pct
East_Med 0.86 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian 4.66 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian 0.34 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.21 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 0.61 Pct

But after removing South Asian, Oceanian and SSA noise and extrapolating to 100%, we get this:

Population
North_Sea 39.44
Atlantic 24.47
Baltic 11.14
Eastern_Euro 8.31
West_Med 12.35
West_Asian 3.02
East_Med 0.92
Red_Sea 0
South_Asian 0
Southeast_Asian 0
Siberian 0.36
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

Basically like modern Scottish and Irish: https://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/K15.htm

https://i.imgur.com/g9NcgI4.png

Well, maybe it was some Insular Celt captured by Pytheas of Massalia? Who knows...

Check: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pytheas#Voyage_to_Britain

But his Y-DNA is R1b-U152 (not Insular R1b-L21) which suggests a continental Celt.

=====

Check also this map: https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/7y2is8/i_drew_a_map_of_the_preroman_peoples_of_western/

"Volcae Tectosages" and "Volcae Arecomici" were Gauls?:

https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

kingjohn
30-06-19, 17:48
the Gaulish dude don't score italian in eurogenes k36 as opposed to modern french people
i wonder from where in gaul he was brought to empuries
i will try to figure out .....

petreski do you know from where this gaulish came ?

p.s
thanks for sharing those kits

torzio
02-07-19, 12:01
Eurogenes K15 of this Gaul from Empuries - I8206 - is a bit noisy (or maybe it is DNA damage?):

Population
North_Sea 36.88 Pct
Atlantic 22.88 Pct
Baltic 10.42 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.77 Pct
West_Med 11.55 Pct
West_Asian 2.82 Pct
East_Med 0.86 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian 4.66 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian 0.34 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.21 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 0.61 Pct

But after removing South Asian, Oceanian and SSA noise and extrapolating to 100%, we get this:

Population
North_Sea 39.44
Atlantic 24.47
Baltic 11.14
Eastern_Euro 8.31
West_Med 12.35
West_Asian 3.02
East_Med 0.92
Red_Sea 0
South_Asian 0
Southeast_Asian 0
Siberian 0.36
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

Basically like modern Scottish and Irish: https://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/K15.htm

https://i.imgur.com/g9NcgI4.png

Well, maybe it was some Insular Celt captured by Pytheas of Massalia? Who knows...

Check: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pytheas#Voyage_to_Britain

But his Y-DNA is R1b-U152 (not Insular R1b-L21) which suggests a continental Celt.

=====

Check also this map: https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/7y2is8/i_drew_a_map_of_the_preroman_peoples_of_western/

"Volcae Tectosages" and "Volcae Arecomici" were Gauls?:

https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

Do you have the easter europe...balkan part of the bottom map ?

MOESAN
05-07-19, 23:11
Eurogenes K15 of this Gaul from Empuries - I8206 - is a bit noisy (or maybe it is DNA damage?):

Population
North_Sea 36.88 Pct
Atlantic 22.88 Pct
Baltic 10.42 Pct
Eastern_Euro 7.77 Pct
West_Med 11.55 Pct
West_Asian 2.82 Pct
East_Med 0.86 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian 4.66 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian 0.34 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 1.21 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 0.61 Pct

But after removing South Asian, Oceanian and SSA noise and extrapolating to 100%, we get this:

Population
North_Sea 39.44
Atlantic 24.47
Baltic 11.14
Eastern_Euro 8.31
West_Med 12.35
West_Asian 3.02
East_Med 0.92
Red_Sea 0
South_Asian 0
Southeast_Asian 0
Siberian 0.36
Amerindian 0
Oceanian 0
Northeast_African 0
Sub-Saharan 0

Basically like modern Scottish and Irish: https://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/K15.htm

https://i.imgur.com/g9NcgI4.png

Well, maybe it was some Insular Celt captured by Pytheas of Massalia? Who knows...

Check: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pytheas#Voyage_to_Britain

But his Y-DNA is R1b-U152 (not Insular R1b-L21) which suggests a continental Celt.

=====

Check also this map: https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/7y2is8/i_drew_a_map_of_the_preroman_peoples_of_western/

"Volcae Tectosages" and "Volcae Arecomici" were Gauls?:

https://i.redd.it/y3akpsjso6gz.jpg

I think Nemeti were Celts, and not Germanics: it's only an administrative Roman consideration.
like in Aquitania, some tribes were Aquitanians or Vascones, otehrs were Celts - administrative namings.
just a point.

MOESAN
05-07-19, 23:13
BTW, where can we find the archeologic considerations leading to the ethnic identification of these two persons? Greek and Gaul?

Ralphie Boy
08-07-19, 22:16
DNA of ancient Greek settler from Empuries colony, similarity map:
https://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/similitude.htm
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/ancient-human-dna_41837#10/42.1370/3.1761
https://i.imgur.com/AhtJlQ7.png

The ancient Greek in the similarity map accords well with the Mycenaean study and another study that shows Aegean Greek islanders are closer to Sicilians and southern Italians than mainland Greeks, who are part of the same “Mediterranean continuum” but shifted more toward the Balkans. But mainland Greeks also appear to be relatively close to the ancient Greek in the map. Archaic and classical Greeks may not have been much different than Mycenaeans, as there probably were no invasions that changed Greeks’ genetic makeup in any significant way.

Angela
09-07-19, 18:21
BTW, where can we find the archeologic considerations leading to the ethnic identification of these two persons? Greek and Gaul?

I’m not home so it’s difficult for me to post a link right now but it’s in the supplement to the last Olalde et al paper, the March 2019 one.

MOESAN
15-07-19, 19:19
I'm late, but thanks, Angela

bigsnake49
16-07-19, 12:45
Lots of trade between the Celts and Massaliotes. Massalia coins have been found in England and also served as the inspiration for Celtic coins. Celtic coins also carried Greek inscriptions.

MOESAN
27-07-19, 12:00
It appears that this "Gaul" is rather a Celtiberian; whatever his Y-haplo he's very close to modern Celts and N-W Germanics!

@Tomenable: concerning modern Central and Southern France, the seemingly less 'celtic' input is caused as well by post-Gaul Roman input (plus some N-E Germanics input like Burgundians) as by pre-Celtic substrata populations -