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View Full Version : Car maker gender: which cars are more masculine or feminine?



Maciamo
19-02-20, 14:36
I was mentioning to someone that Mini Coopers are almost always owned by (usually stylish, middle-aged) women. I looked it up online and indeed Minis are possibly the most women-oriented cars out there. That made me want to reflect about how feminine or masculine an imagine various car makers had. Impressions can vary between people, so I'd like to have your opinion. Here is how I would classify car makers, without delving into specific models as that would be too tedious and time consuming.

- Very feminine: Mini Cooper, Fiat, Lancia, Citroën, Renault, Dacia

- Slightly feminine: Volvo, Toyota, Suzuki

- Neutral: Volkswagen (+ SEAT & Skoda), Mercedes-Benz, Opel, Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Kia, Jaguar, Maserati, Tesla

- Slightly masculine: BMW, Mazda, Subaru, Hyundai, Chrysler, Range Rover, DS

- Very masculine: Audi, Peugeot, Ford, Jeep, Aston Martin, Lamborghini


Some makers are hard to classify as it highly depends on the model. That includes Porsche, Chevrolet, Ferrari and Alpha Romeo, which make both very feminine and very masculine cars.


EDIT: for the purpose of this thread please only take into consideration modern cars. Older cars cannot be easily compared with modern ones. For example, cars from the 1970's and 80's were very angular, which made them more masculine whatever the brand.

Farstar
19-02-20, 14:41
I disagree completely with this classification.

Peugeot, Citroën and Renault are basically identical type of cars.

The Lancia Delta Integrale is probably the most masculine car ever.

bicicleur
19-02-20, 16:17
and what about the colours?
very important IMO

Angela
19-02-20, 17:33
Fun topic, Maciamo. :)

There's a big difference for me between the cars I think are beautiful and the ones I would or have bought for myself.

My favorites based on sheer aesthetics.
Lamborghini:
http://s3.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/17-Lamborghini-Phillip-Island-March-007.jpg


A red Ferrari:
https://www.carid.com/images/inspiration/ferrari/california/4/1.jpg

Porsche
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/mGekhek56ZI/maxresdefault.jpg

I don't know what it means. One of my old bosses, a car maniac who had about four restored vintage cars, told me it meant I liked brutal men. I objected to the adjective. :)

My first grown up car was an Audi.

What I drove when I was a busy mom driving a bunch of kids to sporting events was an Acura sort of like this below. I hated the look, but it was practical.
http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2016/10/2017-Acura-MDX-SH-AWD-rear-three-quarter.jpg

Lately I've been driving an Acura TLX.
http://images.newcars.com/images/car-pictures/original/2018-Acura-TLX-Sedan-Base-4dr-Front-wheel-Drive-Sedan-Exterior-2.png

Volvos are better now, but they used to be so ugly that nothing would have induced me to buy one. I don't even know where you could buy an Aston Martin. The ones I see may be vintage; they're tiny and look like death traps.

Farstar
19-02-20, 18:50
My car is like this:

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2005-maserati-coupe-gt/

There are many different Maseratis. I think the coupe is a very manly one, since it has the traditional distribution of weights of sports cars (front engine and rear transmission), and it is sportive, but not aggressively so. In fact, I do not think that 2-seater sports cars are very manly. In fact, they tend to be feminine, since men usually buy them to impress women. Instead, a Maserati coupe will never be bought to impress a woman. But it will be bought by a man, to enjoy driving it.

But as said, the most manly car ever is:

https://www.motor.es/noticias/lancia-delta-historia-201962722.html

19-02-20, 19:21
I think it's interesting how our ideas of feminine and masculine have changed. The original Jaguar XKE was and is considered one of the most beautiful cars ever designed. It was brought back in around 2000, in a larger format, but was considered too feminine in appearance (sold poorly?) and was "uglied up" to make it more masculine.

1182611825

The Maxda MX-6 coupe was also considered to be too pretty, too feminine to sell well.

Jovialis
19-02-20, 19:52
I love my SUV

https://i.imgur.com/ZGIHhe7.png

Maciamo
19-02-20, 20:36
I think it's interesting how our ideas of feminine and masculine have changed. The original Jaguar XKE was and is considered one of the most beautiful cars ever designed. It was brought back in around 2000, in a larger format, but was considered too feminine in appearance (sold poorly?) and was "uglied up" to make it more masculine.

1182611825

The Maxda MX-6 coupe was also considered to be too pretty, too feminine to sell well.

I am talking about current models still on the road, so mostly cars from the last 10 years.

Maciamo
19-02-20, 20:41
It's also important to take into consideration that Japanese car models vary a lot between North America, Europe and Japan. American-only models are the largest. Japan has a market for very small reactangular cars called Kei cars (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kei_car), which aren't found in Europe (or North America I guess) and have different car plates in Japan (yellow written in black instead of white written in green).

Toyota Pixis

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/96/Toyota_Pixis_2.jpg/800px-Toyota_Pixis_2.jpg

Honda N Box

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7a/HONDA_N_BOX_JF1_01.jpg/1024px-HONDA_N_BOX_JF1_01.jpg

There are very few American cars in Europe except for Ford. GM, Cadillac, Buick and Chevrolet are almost unheard of. Jeep and Chrysler are present by rare.

Maciamo
19-02-20, 20:42
and what about the colours?
very important IMO

Of course, but that really depend on the model too. So let's keep it simple and just discuss the overall "feel" of the brand.

Maciamo
19-02-20, 20:56
I disagree completely with this classification.

Peugeot, Citroën and Renault are basically identical type of cars.

Absolutely not.

This is Peugeot (aggressive, masculine look, popular with the armed forces in Belgium and France).

https://img.gocar.be/v7/storage_news/2019/02/peugeot_508_se_20-1.jpg?width=1200&optipress=3


https://sf2.viepratique.fr/wp-content/uploads/sites/9/2019/09/home-peugeot-5008-restyle-750x410.jpg


Now here are the rounded, feminine Renaults and Citröen:

Renault Zoe

https://images.caradisiac.com/logos-ref/modele/modele--renault-zoe/S0-modele--renault-zoe.jpg

Renault Clio

https://images.caradisiac.com/images/8/8/5/4/178854/S0-barometre-des-ventes-septembre-2019-la-clio-5-prend-enfin-les-commandes-605003.jpg


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Citroën C1
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https://i.pinimg.com/originals/59/05/3a/59053a80ba0a64b590ccc29069d210d5.jpg

Citroën C3

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcQpoEkItrz1BFGIXRCuGExrdQUzeT-YU8P0b2AOPgh6S7PwlUGN





The Lancia Delta Integrale is probably the most masculine car ever.

That's a vintage car. Never seen it. Not sold anymore. So irrelevant for this thread. Modern Lancia look like this (the Ypsillon is the only one that is still sold):


https://autofans.be/sites/default/files/styles/artikel_intro/public/media/2019/Lancia/anderefotos/lancia-ypsilon.jpg?itok=KrsamMJK

Salento
19-02-20, 21:04
I love my SUV

https://i.imgur.com/ZGIHhe7.png

I have the 2016 model :)

... also a fast boy ATS Caddy, and last year I sold an old Lesbian Subaru Outback. LoL

https://i.imgur.com/EDKpFOB.jpg

Angela
19-02-20, 21:55
Well, all anybody seems to be buying here are SUVs, and I'd classify them as "masculine" looking, I guess.

Maybe the most masculine car I can think of: Jeep Wrangler.
https://assets.newcars.com/images/car-pictures/original/2019-Jeep-Wrangler-SUV-Sport-2dr-4x4-Exterior-1.png

I've been thinking about a summer retirement place in the Berkshires. If I stayed over for winter I'd consider that car or at least a Jeep Cherokee.

I don't think of femininity as diminutive necessarily, so those Peugeots don't look "feminine" to me, really.

That old classic Jaguar look is a bit feminine, I guess, or neutral? if you define graceful lines as feminine. If something currently available looked like that I'd buy it in a heartbeat when it's time to turn this one in. I was thinking about a LIncoln Continental, which my husband used to drive. I really like its lines, and it doesn't scream "male" I guess.

http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2016/11/2017-Lincoln-Continental-lead.jpg

torzio
19-02-20, 21:58
I disagree completely with this classification.

Peugeot, Citroën and Renault are basically identical type of cars.

The Lancia Delta Integrale is probably the most masculine car ever.

Agree, also masculine are alfa-romeo and ferrari.....while fiats are fem..

Vw are fem.
Porcshe, bmw are man.

Volvo are fem
Skoda are man

Toyota and most others japanese vehicles are gender neutral

Angela
19-02-20, 22:19
Volvos aren't as ugly anymore. I just looked them up. Interesting that my image of them from the past is so stuck in my mind that I've never looked into them at all.

I don't know if I'd say "feminine", but a more graceful design than they used to have, yes, although I really don't like that "boxy" front.

https://assets.volvocars.com/au/~/media/australia/images/stwg/slider-s90-2.jpg

Duarte
19-02-20, 23:28
This is the car of my wife. The SUV Honda HRV. She loves it a lot. It’s a comfortable car. It has a beautiful design:

https://i.imgur.com/YVpOvJj.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/10ublvm.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/3OYNv3s.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/njU4L9o.jpg

Salento
20-02-20, 01:27
Well, all anybody seems to be buying here are SUVs, and I'd classify them as "masculine" looking, I guess.

Maybe the most masculine car I can think of: Jeep Wrangler.
https://assets.newcars.com/images/car-pictures/original/2019-Jeep-Wrangler-SUV-Sport-2dr-4x4-Exterior-1.png

I've been thinking about a summer retirement place in the Berkshires. If I stayed over for winter I'd consider that car or at least a Jeep Cherokee.

I don't think of femininity as diminutive necessarily, so those Peugeots don't look "feminine" to me, really.

That old classic Jaguar look is a bit feminine, I guess, or neutral? if you define graceful lines as feminine. If something currently available looked like that I'd buy it in a heartbeat when it's time to turn this one in. I was thinking about a LIncoln Continental, which my husband used to drive. I really like its lines, and it doesn't scream "male" I guess.

http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2016/11/2017-Lincoln-Continental-lead.jpg

If you get a Jeep, don’t forget to do the Jeep Wave around other Jeeps, especially if they wave at you first.

It’s a Jeep thing. lol

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/5d/47/65/5d4765fb246d7ef4cdcc5bc4e3485d57.png

Duarte
20-02-20, 01:59
I have the 2016 model :)

... also a fast boy ATS Caddy, and last year I sold an old Lesbian Subaru Outback. LoL

https://i.imgur.com/EDKpFOB.jpg

@Salento:
The Subaru are out of Brazil. The name not help much. Subaru reminds “Suruba” that in vulgar Brazilian Portuguese means bacchanal, LOL.

Options in the market are many.
Americans: Chevrolet, Ford, Chrysler, Jeep.
Germans: VW, Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche.
British: Land-Rover, Jaguar, Cooper.
Italians: FIAT, Ferrari, Alfa-Romeo, Lamborghini.
French: Peugeot, Citröen, Renault.
Japanese: Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Lexus, Suzuki.
Chinese: JAC, Chevy, Lifan.
Korean: Hyundai, Kia.
Sweden: Volvo.
Spain: SEAT.
Various models for all tastes.
The Chinese, although new in the market, have a very aggressive political of prices. Low prices and 5 years of guarantee. If they gain the consumer confidence, which is still suspicious of the quality of Chinese cars, they will become unbeatable.
All Hyundai, Kia, JAC, Chevy and Lifan models are produced under license by the Brazilian automaker CAOA in his factories, which also, under license, produces all models of FORD trucks in Brazil.
The others are produced in Brazil by the factories of the respective automakers in the country, which also import to Brazil some models from the countries of origin.
The Chinese are taking advantage of CAOA's expertise and distribution network in Brazil to try to win consumer confidence.
I personally prefer cars produced by Honda and Toyota, and I only buy cars manufactured by these two automakers.
Good Night and cheers to all :)

20-02-20, 02:00
In the past, if I may, feminine was defined by how the body contours of the car matched those of a woman. Thus a Jaguar XKE was feminine because its quarter panels mimicked the curve of a woman's breasts and posterior. I hope no one thinks that's sexist . . .

The sharp creases in current Japanese designs seem to negate femininity by obliterating the curve.

The fascias of the most current Toyota SUVs, Highlander and RAV4, actually seem to scowl at you, exhibiting some kind of not very well hidden anger. That seems to be on the macho end of the spectrum.

BMWs scowl as well, though less comically. With them its the headlights which appear hooded, and somewhat ominous (my wife has an M3, very ominous, and very loud).

I agree that Audi is masculine, but more in the way the design looks, to me at least, like a Brooks Brothers suit. Well tailored, not ostentatious.

20-02-20, 02:11
Volvos aren't as ugly anymore.

It's interesting that Volvos, when they were ugly, were the favorite rides of college professors and social radicals. When they got pretty Volvo lost this audience, who now prefer Subarus (they're funky, you know).

Salento
20-02-20, 03:24
@Salento:
The Subaru are out of Brazil. The name not help much. Subaru reminds “Suruba” that in vulgar Brazilian Portuguese means bacchanal, LOL.

Options in the market are many.
Americans: Chevrolet, Ford, Chrysler, Jeep.
Germans: VW, Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche.
British: Land-Rover, Jaguar, Cooper.
Italians: FIAT, Ferrari, Alfa-Romeo, Lamborghini.
French: Peugeot, Citröen, Renault.
Japanese: Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Lexus, Suzuki.
Chinese: JAC, Chevy, Lifan.
Korean: Hyundai, Kia.
Sweden: Volvo.
Spain: SEAT.
Various models for all tastes.
The Chinese, although new in the market, have a very aggressive political of prices. Low prices and 5 years of guarantee. If they gain the consumer confidence, which is still suspicious of the quality of Chinese cars, they will become unbeatable.
All Hyundai, Kia, JAC, Chevy and Lifan models are produced under license by the Brazilian automaker CAOA in his factories, which also, under license, produces all models of FORD trucks in Brazil.
The others are produced in Brazil by the factories of the respective automakers in the country, which also import to Brazil some models from the countries of origin.
The Chinese are taking advantage of CAOA's expertise and distribution network in Brazil to try to win consumer confidence.
I personally prefer cars produced by Honda and Toyota, and I only buy cars manufactured by these two automakers.
Good Night and cheers to all :)

I don’t remember the last time I saw a French car in the United States (I don’t think I ever did)

I wonder why!

Duarte
20-02-20, 03:35
I don’t remember the last time I saw a French car in the United States (I don’t think I ever did)

I wonder why!

Currently, PSA Peugeot Citroen manufactures the Peugeot 208 and Peugeot 2008 models in Porto Real in State of Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, as well as its brothers Citroën C3 and Citroen Aircross. This is the current car of my son, the Peugeot 3008. It’s beautiful:

https://i.imgur.com/6ttSP6K.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/I8qYvPo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/32i2GKs.jpg

Angela
20-02-20, 04:00
In the past, if I may, feminine was defined by how the body contours of the car matched those of a woman. Thus a Jaguar XKE was feminine because its quarter panels mimicked the curve of a woman's breasts and posterior. I hope no one thinks that's sexist . . .

The sharp creases in current Japanese designs seem to negate femininity by obliterating the curve.

The fascias of the most current Toyota SUVs, Highlander and RAV4, actually seem to scowl at you, exhibiting some kind of not very well hidden anger. That seems to be on the macho end of the spectrum.

BMWs scowl as well, though less comically. With them its the headlights which appear hooded, and somewhat ominous (my wife has an M3, very ominous, and very loud).

I agree that Audi is masculine, but more in the way the design looks, to me at least, like a Brooks Brothers suit. Well tailored, not ostentatious.

Is there anything currently around which has those more "feminine" lines? I don't like the RAV4 look at all.

Not offended at all, for what it's worth, but then I'm not that kind of "feminist". :) You have a very poetic way of expressing yourself.

20-02-20, 05:23
Is there anything currently around which has those more "feminine" lines? I don't like the RAV4 look at all.

Not offended at all, for what it's worth, but then I'm not that kind of "feminist". :) You have a very poetic way of expressing yourself.

Stop, you'll make me blush . . .

As far as why there are no more feminine lines in auto designs, per what I tried to say above, somehow we consumers changed. What we used to accept as simply beautiful (the XKE) is now rejected as not masculine enough. The circa 2000 Jaguar sold poorly as did the Mazda MX-6 because they looked like chick-cars. Apparently women are willing to buy masculine cars but men won't buy the feminine. Maybe modern men have issues with their own masculinity . . .

I am personally put-off by what I think of as the faux macho look of the RAV4; all hard creases and scowling face. It's comical because the RAV4 is really just a family station wagon with a lift kit. BTW, I own a 2011 RAV4, the previous variant, and I have no problem with family station wagons (but then my wife lets me drive her M3).

20-02-20, 05:28
I don’t remember the last time I saw a French car in the United States (I don’t think I ever did)

I wonder why!

The French burned a lot of bridges (is that the right metaphor?) with the truly awful cars they exported to the US during the early VW Bug craze. The Renault Dauphine is a prime example. Those kind of cars did not survive contact with American highways. The French automakers have never really tried to come back.

Farstar
20-02-20, 09:45
Absolutely not.

This is Peugeot (aggressive, masculine look, popular with the armed forces in Belgium and France).

https://img.gocar.be/v7/storage_news/2019/02/peugeot_508_se_20-1.jpg?width=1200&optipress=3


https://sf2.viepratique.fr/wp-content/uploads/sites/9/2019/09/home-peugeot-5008-restyle-750x410.jpg


Now here are the rounded, feminine Renaults and Citröen:

Renault Zoe

https://images.caradisiac.com/logos-ref/modele/modele--renault-zoe/S0-modele--renault-zoe.jpg

Renault Clio

https://images.caradisiac.com/images/8/8/5/4/178854/S0-barometre-des-ventes-septembre-2019-la-clio-5-prend-enfin-les-commandes-605003.jpg


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Citroën C1
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https://i.pinimg.com/originals/59/05/3a/59053a80ba0a64b590ccc29069d210d5.jpg

Citroën C3

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcQpoEkItrz1BFGIXRCuGExrdQUzeT-YU8P0b2AOPgh6S7PwlUGN





That's a vintage car. Never seen it. Not sold anymore. So irrelevant for this thread. Modern Lancia look like this (the Ypsillon is the only one that is still sold):


https://autofans.be/sites/default/files/styles/artikel_intro/public/media/2019/Lancia/anderefotos/lancia-ypsilon.jpg?itok=KrsamMJK

Your comment is inconsistent. In the OP, there is nothing stating that it refers to current cars, you speak about brands, and brands are not only current cars, but also old cars. In fact, I would say the most content of a brand is the old cars, not the new ones.

I see you have added this as an edit. By the edit is later than my post. So, criticizing me for doing something that was perfectly included in the original post, is absurd. In addition to this, we all have time restrictions, and criticizing people for using their time to contribute positively to a post is somewhat surreal.

Maciamo
20-02-20, 18:08
Your comment is inconsistent. In the OP, there is nothing stating that it refers to current cars, you speak about brands, and brands are not only current cars, but also old cars. In fact, I would say the most content of a brand is the old cars, not the new ones.

I see you have added this as an edit. By the edit is later than my post. So, criticizing me for doing something that was perfectly included in the original post, is absurd. In addition to this, we all have time restrictions, and criticizing people for using their time to contribute positively to a post is somewhat surreal.

Regarding your comment about French cars all being the same, I could give you examples of older models that are just as divergent.

As for your mention of the Lancia Delta Integrale, I don't understand why you brought it up at all since this kind of car cannot drive in most European cities anymore due to the low-emission zone (LEZ) regulations. In Belgium diesel cars that are not at least Euro 4 compliant (meaning made from 2005 onwards) cannot enter big cities anymore. From 2022 it will be Euro 5 (cars made from 2009). In other words most cars on the road in the country at less than 15 years old as hardly anybody who has a car decide never to enter cities (almost all Belgium is within one hour drive from Brussels). I don't know where you live in Catalonia, but Barcelona also has a minimum of Euro 4 for diesel cars and Euro 3 for petrol cars (https://urbanaccessregulations.eu/countries-mainmenu-147/spain/barcelona).

It is difficult enough to assess if a whole brand is more feminine or masculine using only current cars. It would be madness to try to include all the car models that have ever existed (not to mention completely irrelevant to most people). It's true that I did not explicitly mention it in the OP originally, but that there things that are tacitly implied because it just makes sense. When someone ask what is the best city to live in or which country has the strongest economy, it is normally unnecessary to mention that we are talking about the current situation, not 30 and 100 years ago!

Salento
20-02-20, 18:15
Agree, also masculine are alfa-romeo and ferrari.....while fiats are fem..
Vw are fem.
Porcshe, bmw are man.
Volvo are fem
Skoda are man
Toyota and most others japanese vehicles are gender neutral
I say that the Giulia is a Girl.

Alfa Romeo agrees (I think), That's why she has a female name.
https://www.alfaromeousa.com/mediaserver/iris?COSY-EU-100-1713uLDEMTV1r9s%25WBXaBKFmfKSLC9gIQALMc6UhVk%25GBf M9IW2VRkr72kR1d9pejwXGXQpMTV1rU7Dg6OQCckPquBhS1U%2 5DzbTllxA0StelnaQFmwF8kpd2AHBoM&&pov=position1&width=1600&height=867&bkgrnd=white&resp=jpg&cut=

torzio
20-02-20, 19:10
I say that the Giulia is a Girl.

Alfa Romeo agrees (I think), That's why she has a female name.
https://www.alfaromeousa.com/mediaserver/iris?COSY-EU-100-1713uLDEMTV1r9s%25WBXaBKFmfKSLC9gIQALMc6UhVk%25GBf M9IW2VRkr72kR1d9pejwXGXQpMTV1rU7Dg6OQCckPquBhS1U%2 5DzbTllxA0StelnaQFmwF8kpd2AHBoM&&pov=position1&width=1600&height=867&bkgrnd=white&resp=jpg&cut=

my first car

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfa_Romeo_105/115_Series_Coup%C3%A9s

Alfa-Romeo GTV 1750 ........................a male or female ?

white colour

real timber finish inside including the steering wheel

.................................................. .

my best car to drive when I was young.................zippy, smooth, comfortable

Lancia Beta


2000
1975-84
I4 DOHC
1995 cc
119 PS (88 kW; 117 hp)

Angela
20-02-20, 19:10
I say that the Giulia is a Girl.

Alfa Romeo agrees (I think), That's why she has a female name.
https://www.alfaromeousa.com/mediaserver/iris?COSY-EU-100-1713uLDEMTV1r9s%25WBXaBKFmfKSLC9gIQALMc6UhVk%25GBf M9IW2VRkr72kR1d9pejwXGXQpMTV1rU7Dg6OQCckPquBhS1U%2 5DzbTllxA0StelnaQFmwF8kpd2AHBoM&&pov=position1&width=1600&height=867&bkgrnd=white&resp=jpg&cut=

Now that, I think, is beautiful. :)

I used to like Porsches because they had what is perhaps, by these definitions, more "feminine" lines, but no more; they're like all the rest.

Which current cars available widely in America have lines like this?

Salento
20-02-20, 19:31
They sell the Giulia in the US, the AWD sedan too.

... from about $ 38.000 / 45.000 and up.

22-02-20, 22:50
I have to admit being disappointed that no one wanted to talk about why a particular car might be seen as male or female. Is there a feature that makes you think that way, or is it performance, or is it function? My take is that there are at least four categories of cars, male, female, infant and none of the above.

My example of the infant is the Fiat 500. It has the large, open eyes (headlights) of a small child. The car looks, somehow, quietly inquisitive, but not judging, perhaps even in awe of what it sees. The line of the grill is straight and thin, like a somber child, just looking at you blandly. The small curves of the body and the tiny wheels reinforce its unthreatening nature. And yes, it's cute. A lot of Japanese vehicles (at least in the home market) are infants.
11835

I've said before that I think the female aspect of a car is in the curve of its fenders, like the breasts and posterior of a woman, i.e. Jaguar XKE. However, if that was the case the Porsche Turbo would be female . . . it's got some big hips! But in this case I think the performance aspect makes it more male (as unfair as that proposition is to women).
11836

I think that function also plays a part in defining the gender of a vehicle, again with a cultural overtone. That is, a mini-van normally gets tagged as female because its function is to haul around a passel of children. That is, after all, why the SUV became popular; it will haul around a passel of kids yet looks like a backwoods busting, rough-road driving he-man of a vehicle.

Angela
23-02-20, 00:08
Excellent analysis. I can't disagree with any of it, and there's not much I can add.

I never thought of SUVs in that way, but you're right, and that might be part of the reason for their huge share of the market, along with the fact that people feel safer in them. I've heard women say that more than men, and I don't think it's just their bigger size and sturdier look. Women tell me they like being "higher" in comparison to the road and a lot of other cars.

As I said before, I think they're ugly, nor do I need them in my pretty moderate climate, suburban world, so I was done with SUVs once the "kids" left home. However, we still have my husband's SUV for carting big things around. If I were alone, I'd have to reconsider again.

As beautiful as cars like the Lamborghinis etc. look, I have no desire to drive at really fast speeds, so it was a strictly aesthetic judgment. I would never, ever buy one.

23-02-20, 01:51
Exotics are, of course, not practical (why would they be?). I remember a Top Gear show where, after filming a Ferrari, Lambo and McLaren in the Louvre courtyard, to avoid scraping off the cars' low-hanging front bumpers, the team had to build ramps to get the cars out on to the street. My wife's BMW M3 has a similar problem and we avoid certain parking lots due to their steep entry/exits. My SUV does not share this problem (we also bought ours for large loads).

Jovialis
23-02-20, 05:12
https://i.imgur.com/6SFx9az.jpg

I rented the GMC Acadia Denali for a business trip. This car is 100% masculine, and has a lot of power in the engine.

Dagne
23-02-20, 20:11
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What about new Tesla cybertruck?
In a style for children?

I somehow like it, though there is really little sophistication in terms of form.

Angela
23-02-20, 22:00
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What about new Tesla cybertruck?
In a style for children?

I somehow like it, though there is really little sophistication in terms of form.

Dagne, we're going to have to agree to disagree. :)

I think it's hideous. Not male like or female like or child like. Maybe "alien like" or "machine like"? :)

Dagne
23-02-20, 22:57
I wish I could see this cybertruck on a read road, among other cars. i suppose against a background of things when the space is filled with colours and forms, its simplicity might have something appealing. But yes, I agree, that by itself it is not the most attractive car, it is more of a kind of provocation to our sense of easthetics...

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24-02-20, 03:37
I think the Tesla truck may be another category, the cartoon vehicle. You might imagine drawing it (if you drew badly), but seeing it in real life seems absurd.

I remember the first time I saw a Chrysler 300, its massive, over-muscled body topped by a tiny, squashed roof/windows, looked like something out of a Batman movie, not a real car. The sports car that Dodge built for a while, the Viper, would be in the same category; a wild fantasy rather than a real car.

Farstar
24-02-20, 08:55
Not a brand, but a manly characteristic in a car: manual transmission. Of course, many men drive automatic transmissions. Maybe myself, one day I will be forced to drive one. But a manual transmission is one of those irrational things that connect men to a car.

24-02-20, 19:13
Irrational? I've always liked a manual transmission because it makes the driver a more integral part of the driving experience. I admit it is possible that I am irrational, ask my wife, ;).

I am also leery of the multiple automatic features being added to cars: lane minders, attention alerts, automatic braking, etc. I want to drive the car, not have the car drive me. I understand the safety aspects, but I'm enough of a Luddite to wonder what will happen if/when the 'minders' break or go bonkers.

Angela
24-02-20, 20:23
Irrational? I've always liked a manual transmission because it makes the driver a more integral part of the driving experience. I admit it is possible that I am irrational, ask my wife, ;).

I am also leery of the multiple automatic features being added to cars: lane minders, attention alerts, automatic braking, etc. I want to drive the car, not have the car drive me. I understand the safety aspects, but I'm enough of a Luddite to wonder what will happen if/when the 'minders' break or go bonkers.

A lot of the 2020 models are offering these features; some more, some less.

I'm not sure I trust them either.

Traveling to Italy so often, and automatic transmission cars still being less available, I've had to keep up my manual transmission skills, but I have to admit I like being a bit more on "auto-pilot" with the automatic transmission.

Learning to drive manual was one of the worst experiences of my dating period with my husband. His first car was an ancient, used VW bug with manual transmission. He thought it was a good idea to do our first lesson on a busy street with red lights every couple of blocks. I predictably stalled the car, he predictably yelled, and I predictably put the car in park, got out and walked away. The next lesson was on a country road that looked like it was going up Everest. Needless to say he had no future as an instructor. It was a month before we went on another date. I got my father to teach me, on a manual transmission car he borrowed from a friend.

That damn car was a death trap in more ways than one. We regularly would get one to two feet of snow where we lived. It would regularly get stuck in a rut or snow bank. The good news was that it was so light the two of us could just lift it out of ruts. :) It was so small I have no idea how old people drove them. My husband, then boyfriend was six feet tall and a football player. He had to practically scrunch up into a ball.

The good old days. :)

Yetos
24-02-20, 21:36
The French burned a lot of bridges (is that the right metaphor?) with the truly awful cars they exported to the US during the early VW Bug craze. The Renault Dauphine is a prime example. Those kind of cars did not survive contact with American highways. The French automakers have never really tried to come back.

I think it has to do with taxation and factories in continent more, than with car abilities,

Yetos
24-02-20, 21:40
How about my favorite DS7

https://www.autotriti.gr/jpg/AUTOTRITI/1600/NEWS/ds7_crossback_1_2822017.jpg


https://www.autotriti.gr/jpg/AUTOTRITI/1600/NEWS/16-6DS7.jpg



or

https://www.gazzetta.gr/sites/default/files/ds7-crossback-makes-debut-4.jpg


what is it?



BTW

I tend to believe that all modern cars are feminine,
Automatic gears,
electric,
hydraulics,
turn here turn there,
camera for Parking,
sounds for Parking,
auto-locks
15 inch polyurethan,
auto-cruiser
anti-freeze
warm 'bucket' for .....
ABS
ESP
.....
auto-P%T^
[email protected]#8!
para-P&y6
etc
etc,
THEY ARE ALL DESIGNED TO BE DRIVEN BY WOMEN.

I think today the only thing that makes a car mesculine is the mechanical gear box, and the (today is considered old fashion) handbrake
hey I don't even keep in my hands the keys, the power of owning a car

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d9/de/44/d9de4414a5cd41827ff9264e4e8fa40e.jpg



the last things in car, that made a man feel the power of the engine of HIS car
1. the sound or rpm every time HE change the gear (manual mechanic gear box)
2. and start of trip / end of trip (manual handbreak)

https://icdn9.digitaltrends.com/image/driving-stick-shiter-hand-720x720.jpg

25-02-20, 00:14
I think it has to do with taxation and factories in continent more, than with car abilities,

Yet other European car companies have made it here (in Southern California it seems every other car is a BMW or Mercedes). I think it's interesting that so many car companies have managed to sell a lot of cars in the US; Japan, Korea, Germany, England, and Italy, though the last two are not strong players here anymore. Why did the French only make that one attempt circa 1960? I may be wrong, but I don't know of any other attempt to create a French presence in the US car market.

I wonder too when Chinese and Indian cars will make their attempt?

Farstar
25-02-20, 09:25
Irrational? I've always liked a manual transmission because it makes the driver a more integral part of the driving experience. I admit it is possible that I am irrational, ask my wife, ;).

I am also leery of the multiple automatic features being added to cars: lane minders, attention alerts, automatic braking, etc. I want to drive the car, not have the car drive me. I understand the safety aspects, but I'm enough of a Luddite to wonder what will happen if/when the 'minders' break or go bonkers.

The best cars to buy now are good cars of the era in which still we had manual transmission everywhere, etc. These cars have still most of the necessary amenities, e.g. air conditioning etc and they are fun to drive. Instead, current cars are unavoidably bland, including supposed supercars.

The only drawback is pollution restrictions. In my case, I am lucky because my car is still in the pollution limits, but it was produced without all these robocontrols which take out the pleasure to drive. But maybe in 5 years, they will ban my car.

Dagne
25-02-20, 10:56
And I want a car which will drive by itself (absolutely no need for being in control for me, not to say anything about having a transmission)https://cached.imagescaler.hbpl.co.uk/resize/scaleWidth/743/cached.offlinehbpl.hbpl.co.uk/news/OMC/dvlc-20180815073535509.jpg
https://tabletroma.it/wp-content/uploads/autonomous-car.jpg

Maciamo
25-02-20, 13:13
BTW

I tend to believe that all modern cars are feminine,
Automatic gears,
electric,
hydraulics,
turn here turn there,
camera for Parking,
sounds for Parking,
auto-locks
15 inch polyurethan,
auto-cruiser
anti-freeze
warm 'bucket' for .....
ABS
ESP
.....
auto-P%T^
[email protected]#8!
para-P&y6
etc
etc,
THEY ARE ALL DESIGNED TO BE DRIVEN BY WOMEN.

I think today the only thing that makes a car mesculine is the mechanical gear box, and the (today is considered old fashion) handbrake
hey I don't even keep in my hands the keys, the power of owning a car

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d9/de/44/d9de4414a5cd41827ff9264e4e8fa40e.jpg



the last things in car, that made a man feel the power of the engine of HIS car
1. the sound or rpm every time HE change the gear (manual mechanic gear box)
2. and start of trip / end of trip (manual handbreak)

https://icdn9.digitaltrends.com/image/driving-stick-shiter-hand-720x720.jpg

I was talking about looks, not options. Then I disagree that safety features are designed for women. Statistically men get into more fatal accidents than women because they drive more aggressively. That being said, I know more women who have had minor accidents or scratches while manoeuvring... (less good 3D skills in average)

Maciamo
25-02-20, 13:22
Not a brand, but a manly characteristic in a car: manual transmission. Of course, many men drive automatic transmissions. Maybe myself, one day I will be forced to drive one. But a manual transmission is one of those irrational things that connect men to a car.

I always thought that manual transmissions were better until I tried the new automatic models two years ago. The new automatic gears are so smooth and well designed that they accelerate just as fast as a manual one and we can't feel the change of gear. German cars like BMW, Mercedes and VW (among those I have tried) have different modes for automatic gear (eco, normal, sport), with different gear ratios. BMW has 8 gears on its automatic box. It's also possible to shift gears manually on these new automatic models, but with the added benefit of not having to push the clutch. Driving in a city without clutch does really avoid leg cramps, especially in traffic jams. So there is really no benefit to a manual car anymore. That being said, not all car makers have good automatic gear boxes, especially among cheaper cars.

Yetos
25-02-20, 15:14
I was talking about looks, not options. Then I disagree that safety features are designed for women. Statistically men get into more fatal accidents than women because they drive more aggressively. That being said, I know more women who have had minor accidents or scratches while manoeuvring... (less good 3D skills in average)

Indeed.
but as a man I like to feel and have control of my 'motor-girl'.

Carlos
25-02-20, 22:13
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41slUqUcU9L._SX355_.jpg

I had one for 1 or 2 years I think I met my goals in the short distances: Speed, ease of parking, go unnoticed and have no concerns about theft, scratches, broken glass to be in the street.


For me there is no car, my goal is the destination and where I want to go If I get it and I have been invisible along the way I don't need more.

26-02-20, 02:00
I think I get where you're coming from. I have two cars, my wife's car, a BMW M3 for when I want to DRIVE!!, and my car, a Toyota RAV4, when I just want to get from here to there, and haul and few things. There's nothing wrong with either pick and, to be honest, we spend most of the time in the RAV4.

But, if we go back to the original point of Maciamo's post, what gender is your vehicle (and why)?

For my vehicles, each is, I think, a combination. The M3 performance is very much a bad-boy vibe (Top Gear said the only people who drive them are D**ks, which my wife embraces), but the body is very feminine in its curves. The RAV4 (a 2011, so not the current iteration) is, as an SUV, somewhat male, but its 'face' is on the cute scale, so a little on the 'baby' scale.

And no, I don't any of this seriously.

Duarte
13-07-20, 02:03
Smaller than a RAV4, simpler than the brother sedan: what to expect from the Corolla Cross SUVToyota's new SUV uses recipe to please in markets like Brazil, but it should sell horrors nonethelesshttps://i.imgur.com/kpuVNI8.jpg

There was a time that to discover a future launch in Brazil it was enough to look at Europe. Today, however, the "future" is further away and in countries with which we have little cultural relationship, such as India, China and Thailand. Despite this, we Brazilians are seen by most automakers as the same customer as the Indian, Mexican, Romanian or Thai and reason is not the most pleasant.Although anyone in their right mind wants to have a Mercedes-Benz, BMW or Audi in the garage, the fact is that Brazil's economic reality unites us with these nations. For this audience, brands have to offer little by much in order to make a profit. Translation of this reasoning? Corolla Cross (https://www.autoo.com.br/cotado-para-o-brasil-toyota-corolla-cross-e-revelado-na-tailandia/) .
Due to the symbolism of creating an SUV version of the best-selling sedan in the world, it was expected that the unprecedented model would appear in Japan or even in the USA, but Thailand was chosen as the stage for the global launch of the model. Not that it means you will not end up crossing a Corolla Cross in some developed market, but they are not priorities after all they consume another type of product, more sophisticated and expensive like the RAV4 .
But why couldn't it be like that in Brazil? The rival CR-V, for example, once became a popular model and Toyota could also occupy that position above compact SUVs (which the Japanese brand does not yet have a representative, by the way). But the reality is different from this hypothetical scenario and one of the reasons is that the RAV4 has grown and become more sophisticated, making room for a new model.
Would the Corolla Cross be a direct rival to HR-V, then? Neither. The SUV is slightly larger and heavier, not by chance finding more similarities with the Jeep Compass , a "medium" more in price than in size.
The Japanese strategy, as we commented here on Autoo , is well thought out. It avoids the problem that Honda went through when it launched the HR-V. The compact SUV costs the same as a Civic despite the much simpler and cheaper platform. On the one hand, the brand won by selling a car with a higher profit margin, but paid the price to cannibalize sales of the sedan that since then has been unable to fight with the Corolla.

https://i.imgur.com/kQtrNyr.png


Toyota, in turn, devised the Corolla Cross precisely to be a more expensive brother to the sedan. Roughly speaking, there are no major mechanical differences between them: 1.8 engine with 140 hp (compared to the American Corolla), TNGA platform, CVT gearbox and simpler hybrid option. In other words, it is the same cake recipe, but in a taller car and with the characteristic look of an SUV.
But only that "last item" is capable of allowing Toyota to charge more for the Corolla Cross. If the XEi version of the sedan cost R $ 120 thousand in July 2020, certainly an equivalent Corolla Cross could cost R $ 140 thousand or up to R $ 150 thousand, price range of the intermediate versions of the Jeep Compass 2.0 flex. Hence it is understood why Toyota can make the cat jump over Honda. An HR-V with a 1.5 engine only cost R $ 116,000 in the EXL version, slightly less than the equivalent Civic.
Tête-à-tête
Rather than elucidating reasons for Toyota's balcony with the Corolla Cross is to compare it to the RAV4 and the Corolla, the sedan. And so understand why the new SUV is expected to have a major impact on the market in 2021.
- The Corolla Cross is smaller and lighter than the Corolla Sedan: the SUV only gains in width and height, which was expected. But it loses in the distance between wheels, which is also 5 cm smaller than the RAV4 .
- Corolla's SUV is lighter: see here one of the miracles of simplification, the Corolla Cross manages to weigh less than the sedan is more than 300 kg lighter than the RAV4 .
- Lower weight / power ratio, but don't count on more performance: by using the same mechanical assembly as the sedan, the SUV has a better weight / power ratio, but because it is a taller and wider vehicle this advantage can be minimal. The ideal would be to have an index closer to the RAV4, which has only 7.7 kg per hp, but then a more powerful, worn and heavy engine would be needed .
- Simpler suspension: the Corolla took decades to gain Multilink rear suspension, but in the Corolla Cross Toyota returned to the old and worse recipe .
- Front - wheel drive and zero off-road characteristics: as a good "crossover", the Corolla Cross has no aptitude for off-road, not even all-wheel drive like the brother RAV4 .

https://i.imgur.com/ZkmgOyK.png


Opera summary
The Corolla Cross is a reinterpretation of the Corolla platform to prevent Toyota from losing customers to other brands full of SUVs in its portfolios. Its style is even more timid and conventional compared to the current RAV4 and even sedan, revealing that the brand does not want to take risks. That is, it is a great idea for the Japanese automaker's pocket because it is a lower cost product and a higher profit margin.


Technical Data
Corolla Sedan
Corolla Cross
RAV4


Version
Altis Hybrid 2.0
Hybrid Smart 1.8
S Connect Hybrid 2.5


Length (m)
4.63
4.46
4.6


Width (m)
1.78
1.825
1,855


Height (m)
1,455
1.62
1,685


Inter-axis (m)
2.7
2.64
2.69


Weight in running order (kg)
1440
1385
1703


Power (hp)
122
122
222


Torque (kgfm)
14.5 + 16.6
14.5 + 16.6
22.5 + 20.6


Weight / power ratio (kg / hp)
11.8
11.4
7.7


Trunk (liters)
470

580


Streaming
CVT
CVT
CVT


Suspension
MacPherson + Multilink
MacPherson + Torsion shaft
MacPherson + Multilink


Brakes
Ventilated discs + solid discs
Ventilated discs + solid discs
Ventilated discs + solid discs


Traction
Forward
Forward
Integral


Price
R $ 137,890.00
?
R $ 217,990.00


* Source: Toyota Brasil and Thailand.
Source: https://www.autoo.com.br/menor-rav4-mais-simples-sedan-o-que-esperar-do-suv-corolla-cross/