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View Full Version : New MyHeritage update (groups)



Variel
24-12-20, 09:18
It seems that MyHeritage has updated their results. The regions are still the same and will be updated in 2021, but they added new ancestral groups (based on DNA matches and family trees).

Here are my results:
84% NW-Europe
* Lower Saxony, Westphalia, Overijssel, Limburg
* Holland, Utrecht, Gelderland
* Northern Germany, Poland, Czech
* (Lower Saxony)
* (NW-Germany)
16% Scandinavia

Krum
24-12-20, 11:32
Here are my

EUROPE
Balkan - 62.6%
Bulgaria
Bulgaria, Romania and Turkey
Serbia, Croatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina
North and West European - 9.9%
Greek and South Italian - 7.8%
Italian - 6.0%
Ashkenazi Jewish - 1.0%
ASIA
West Asian - 12.7%

Carlos
24-12-20, 15:01
Ibérico


91,2%



Sur de España, Francia y Argelia


España


Este de España y suroeste de Francia

Balcánico

5,1%

Irlandés, escocés y gales

3,7%



Irlanda (Cavan y Leitrim)


GRUPOS GENÉTICOS ADICIONALES



El Salvador
Holanda (Flevoland)
​Colombia


The Lady of Baza an The Lady of Elche should be proud of me. I'm going to see what Cavan Leitrim or Flevolan is that I've never heard in my life.

torzio
24-12-20, 15:13
They have stated that the ethnicity has not been done and only the 1st part the new groupings
Ethnicty will be done in the next few days

here is mine ...............the % has not changed yet ...........I have had these for 4 years
https://i.postimg.cc/htvqdb35/new-my-heritage.png (https://postimg.cc/bs7MXbPx)

Dibran
24-12-20, 16:37
My Father:(From Okshtuni Vogel, Dibra, Albania




https://i.postimg.cc/50mLgF0C/father.png


df





My Mother:(From Megulle, Malzi, Kukes, Albania(Tribally affiliated with Puka)

https://i.postimg.cc/CKSKNrfc/mom.png

Dibran
24-12-20, 16:52
Me:

https://i.postimg.cc/9fbQNPdC/me.png

Duarte
24-12-20, 17:36
MyHeritage, based on their data base (user kits), try to detail the ethnicities brought by European immigrants to Brazil (at least in my specific case), trying to link them to regions of the country.

It may seem that you are a little “without defined ethnicity”, but I think it's cool, considering that I am a descendant of Portuguese settlers (arrived about 1750) who received an additional genetic pool of new Iberian immigrants who entered Brazil in the late 19th and early 20th centuries.

https://i.imgur.com/66coVUD.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Yb9OpGV.png
https://i.imgur.com/YT0cCsB.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/fi1KeYG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/NEDoanC.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/IYfaADO.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eM1sVxe.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ABCqyW4.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7x4m0LA.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/1D7Csyp.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/qFnPBsn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/l7tsqTO.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/9vdBdi2.jpg

Carlos
24-12-20, 17:36
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Q584OC1crCg/X-Szu6qtdKI/AAAAAAAAFSA/gcN-Pdi-xwc4NGhnP1CzwmJtL0b9J7QiwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1309/Estimaci%25C3%25B3n%25C3%25A9tnica.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5HPGd5fnBHk/X-SyT9cTDoI/AAAAAAAAFRk/0shAsXQERIoy6HPUfDYpxhIjvWfB3RxggCLcBGAsYHQ/s341/Mapemyheritage.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eGKtDQZM_Zo/X-SyXHI5rhI/AAAAAAAAFRo/W96gY0c71fMXV4R7CDwdBq0mHcnm2wDVwCLcBGAsYHQ/s483/MapemyheritageAmerica.jpeg

Location where my genetic matches live

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ziLY5Hbd1y4/X-SyZ1OAN7I/AAAAAAAAFRs/PythJaZaC6Y98Un2KHz6rQuS-BFjIOfCACLcBGAsYHQ/s831/MapeCoincidencias%25C3%25A9tnicas.jpeg

italouruguayan
24-12-20, 18:14
My results seem pretty consistent...1248512486

Sent from my SM-G9600 using Eupedia Forum mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=89698)

HYGILI4K
24-12-20, 18:35
Mine are pretty consistent too

12487

peloponnesian
24-12-20, 18:51
The confidence levels seem like... they're not working yet? I have a 1,7% "English" component which I assume is noise but it stays the same even with confidence level set to high.

kingjohn
24-12-20, 19:42
looks damn good :cool-v:
thank for people here who shared there results :good_job:
to bad for me that it is a israeli company
and i can't upload dna to there site ......:thinking:

p.s
unless to cheat by changing the vpn not my style:laughing:

matty74
24-12-20, 21:41
Mine:

https://i.ibb.co/6gtPJYz/4-F4-BAA41-66-AF-4-D01-807-E-F08-AD3-F3-E7-CE.jpg

matty74
24-12-20, 21:48
Mother:

https://i.ibb.co/RHX9t3F/DFCE88-D7-8845-49-ED-ADA5-022-C449-DA44-B.jpg

Carlos
25-12-20, 15:35
-Eastern Spain and Southwest France
Common surnames


(Two surnames that match)

-Southern Spain, France and Algeria

Common surnames

(1 matching last name)

Common ethnicities

Iberian

-France and Spain (Catalonia)

Common surnames

1 Spanish surname that matches and in the list there are two French surnames

Common ethnicities

Iberian
Northwest European



Spain (Alicante), Algeria and France

Common surnames

1 surname that matches and the list contains an Aragonese and a Catalan surname

Common ethnicities

Iberian Italian

In these sections are surnames of my autosomal


Irish, Scottish and Welsh

I have this unique clue by mitochondrial dna that can give sense to this resulthttps://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5arSCwqVXQE/XpBaITHgjCI/AAAAAAAADaU/unNLKfzoSK8RQIznkJAHM9_-g40mPUSFgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMATCHfullsecuence.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-x9yPiUavLjo/XpBaXRUQmeI/AAAAAAAADaY/XONdihvWB2ggH4PVisO8r3qQeE_Fm1jSwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR1.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-GvFoAzZTA/XpBabWWiFOI/AAAAAAAADag/wMOkL2v0aZckGnHO6OjsRVc3EzA1WJ1DQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR2.jpeg


-Balkan

I don't have any clues or references here

Holanda (Flevoland)

Common surnames

All the surnames are Dutch, it says that they are ancestral from the area

Common ethnicities

Northwest European
English
Scandinavian

At least I have this clue and it's for dna Y

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YKFiQybWiB8/XyMiBBzHyuI/AAAAAAAAEXA/Yo9mbEXayr4cvV8XvkdxMCDxqslHaQTIwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/YfullJULIO2020.jpg




https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3TXf7DwQZEc/XzrUtucuroI/AAAAAAAAEZ0/3R5WV1f1YhIr0nhxl1U4EyTs5JaeJg5_QCLcBGAsYHQ/s841/MAPEphilogociMasintensidad2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GT8PAS2BlQc/XzrUjblrQmI/AAAAAAAAEZw/f3EiMQUeh5Mp5i-EBZn-Hod-QAMMVbUMwCLcBGAsYHQ/s897/mapePhilogicmasINTENSIDAD.JPEG

El Salvador

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean

I have no data or clues about this result only some snp in Y full whose explanation was that they were very strange and did not know much about the bug it is possible that they were in other areas besides Central America. I saw a video of the results of a Basque couple who are youtubers and also obtained these results are large family and yet all their children were 100% Iberian and only the parents obtained these results in Central America so ?


Colombia

Common surnames

3 matching autosomal surnames including my maternal grandfather's

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean ?



Iberian



How do you see it?

Duarte
25-12-20, 16:55
-Eastern Spain and Southwest France
Common surnames


(Two surnames that match)

-Southern Spain, France and Algeria

Common surnames

(1 matching last name)

Common ethnicities

Iberian

-France and Spain (Catalonia)

Common surnames

1 Spanish surname that matches and in the list there are two French surnames

Common ethnicities

Iberian
Northwest European



Spain (Alicante), Algeria and France

Common surnames

1 surname that matches and the list contains an Aragonese and a Catalan surname

Common ethnicities

Iberian Italian

In these sections are surnames of my autosomal


Irish, Scottish and Welsh

I have this unique clue by mitochondrial dna that can give sense to this resulthttps://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5arSCwqVXQE/XpBaITHgjCI/AAAAAAAADaU/unNLKfzoSK8RQIznkJAHM9_-g40mPUSFgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMATCHfullsecuence.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-x9yPiUavLjo/XpBaXRUQmeI/AAAAAAAADaY/XONdihvWB2ggH4PVisO8r3qQeE_Fm1jSwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR1.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-GvFoAzZTA/XpBabWWiFOI/AAAAAAAADag/wMOkL2v0aZckGnHO6OjsRVc3EzA1WJ1DQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR2.jpeg


-Balkan

I don't have any clues or references here

Holanda (Flevoland)

Common surnames

All the surnames are Dutch, it says that they are ancestral from the area

Common ethnicities

Northwest European
English
Scandinavian

At least I have this clue and it's for dna Y

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YKFiQybWiB8/XyMiBBzHyuI/AAAAAAAAEXA/Yo9mbEXayr4cvV8XvkdxMCDxqslHaQTIwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/YfullJULIO2020.jpg




https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3TXf7DwQZEc/XzrUtucuroI/AAAAAAAAEZ0/3R5WV1f1YhIr0nhxl1U4EyTs5JaeJg5_QCLcBGAsYHQ/s841/MAPEphilogociMasintensidad2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GT8PAS2BlQc/XzrUjblrQmI/AAAAAAAAEZw/f3EiMQUeh5Mp5i-EBZn-Hod-QAMMVbUMwCLcBGAsYHQ/s897/mapePhilogicmasINTENSIDAD.JPEG

El Salvador

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean

I have no data or clues about this result only some snp in Y full whose explanation was that they were very strange and did not know much about the bug it is possible that they were in other areas besides Central America. I saw a video of the results of a Basque couple who are youtubers and also obtained these results are large family and yet all their children were 100% Iberian and only the parents obtained these results in Central America so ?


Colombia

Common surnames

3 matching autosomal surnames including my maternal grandfather's

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean ?



Iberian



How do you see it?

Hi Carlos

You must to click in the tab “Ethnicity Estimate”. After show up the new window in app you must to click in the tab “View Full Estimate”. Then, in next window that will be opened will show up all your ethnicities. Click in the ethnicity of your interest and wil be displayed the following dada, for example for one of my ethnicities (Portugal, Group ID: 5176):

https://i.imgur.com/fCTnBFg.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eUggFxM.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LgpPwE1.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7nfjAmW.jpg

torzio
25-12-20, 17:31
drilling down the map in my new myheritage ...I get this below

seren del grappa , Belluno province , veneto is correct .......I have many in my BDM records

https://i.postimg.cc/L8DMccjW/seren.png (https://postimg.cc/jDD9Nkg6)


in my 1600 groups I have

Top places 1600 - 1650




Fontane, Veneto, Italy ...................a suburb of Villorba where I still have relatives living there


Zernez, Grisons, Switzerland

Babenhausen, Hesse, Germany

Canizzano, Veneto, Italy


I will check the other places


so far from what I gather myheritage is accurate ...we await the ethnic numbers to change in late Jan 2021

Carlos
25-12-20, 17:42
@Duarte

That's just what I did, but I didn't feel like taking screenshots, so I'll take them later.

Carlos
25-12-20, 19:37
-Eastern Spain and Southwest France
Common surnames


(Two surnames that match)

-Southern Spain, France and Algeria

Common surnames

(1 matching last name)

Common ethnicities

Iberian

-France and Spain (Catalonia)

Common surnames

1 Spanish surname that matches and in the list there are two French surnames

Common ethnicities

Iberian
Northwest European



Spain (Alicante), Algeria and France

Common surnames

1 surname that matches and the list contains an Aragonese and a Catalan surname

Common ethnicities

Iberian Italian

In these sections are surnames of my autosomal


Irish, Scottish and Welsh

I have this unique clue by mitochondrial dna that can give sense to this resulthttps://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5arSCwqVXQE/XpBaITHgjCI/AAAAAAAADaU/unNLKfzoSK8RQIznkJAHM9_-g40mPUSFgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMATCHfullsecuence.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-x9yPiUavLjo/XpBaXRUQmeI/AAAAAAAADaY/XONdihvWB2ggH4PVisO8r3qQeE_Fm1jSwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR1.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-GvFoAzZTA/XpBabWWiFOI/AAAAAAAADag/wMOkL2v0aZckGnHO6OjsRVc3EzA1WJ1DQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR2.jpeg


-Balkan

I don't have any clues or references here

Holanda (Flevoland)

Common surnames

All the surnames are Dutch, it says that they are ancestral from the area

Common ethnicities

Northwest European
English
Scandinavian

At least I have this clue and it's for dna Y

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YKFiQybWiB8/XyMiBBzHyuI/AAAAAAAAEXA/Yo9mbEXayr4cvV8XvkdxMCDxqslHaQTIwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/YfullJULIO2020.jpg




https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3TXf7DwQZEc/XzrUtucuroI/AAAAAAAAEZ0/3R5WV1f1YhIr0nhxl1U4EyTs5JaeJg5_QCLcBGAsYHQ/s841/MAPEphilogociMasintensidad2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GT8PAS2BlQc/XzrUjblrQmI/AAAAAAAAEZw/f3EiMQUeh5Mp5i-EBZn-Hod-QAMMVbUMwCLcBGAsYHQ/s897/mapePhilogicmasINTENSIDAD.JPEG

El Salvador

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean

I have no data or clues about this result only some snp in Y full whose explanation was that they were very strange and did not know much about the bug it is possible that they were in other areas besides Central America. I saw a video of the results of a Basque couple who are youtubers and also obtained these results are large family and yet all their children were 100% Iberian and only the parents obtained these results in Central America so ?


Colombia

Common surnames

3 matching autosomal surnames including my maternal grandfather's

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean ?
Iberian

How do you see it?


Southern Spain, France and Algeria
Spaniards in southern Spain and some in France and Algeria

Spain
Spaniards in Spain

Eastern Spain and Southwest France
Spaniards in eastern Spain and some in southwestern France

Spain (Alicante), Algeria and France
Spaniards in Spain (Alicante), Algeria and some in France

Common ethnicities
Iberian
Italian

France and Spain (Catalonia)
French and Spanish in France and Spain (Catalonia)

Netherlands (Flevoland)
Dutch in Holland (Flevoland)

Irlanda (Cavan y Leitrim)
Irish in Ireland (County Cavan and some in County Leitrim) and some of their descendants in the United States (New York)


Centrifuging

New Englander
26-12-20, 01:30
Mine stayed exactly the same.

Greek/ South Italian: 41%
NW European: 28%
Ashkenazi: 17.4%
Italian: 3%
West Asia: 9%
Middle East: 1.7%

Comparison with my Great Aunt.

italouruguayan
26-12-20, 18:32
-Eastern Spain and Southwest France
Common surnames


(Two surnames that match)

-Southern Spain, France and Algeria

Common surnames

(1 matching last name)

Common ethnicities

Iberian

-France and Spain (Catalonia)

Common surnames

1 Spanish surname that matches and in the list there are two French surnames

Common ethnicities

Iberian
Northwest European



Spain (Alicante), Algeria and France

Common surnames

1 surname that matches and the list contains an Aragonese and a Catalan surname

Common ethnicities

Iberian Italian

In these sections are surnames of my autosomal


Irish, Scottish and Welsh

I have this unique clue by mitochondrial dna that can give sense to this resulthttps://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5arSCwqVXQE/XpBaITHgjCI/AAAAAAAADaU/unNLKfzoSK8RQIznkJAHM9_-g40mPUSFgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMATCHfullsecuence.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-x9yPiUavLjo/XpBaXRUQmeI/AAAAAAAADaY/XONdihvWB2ggH4PVisO8r3qQeE_Fm1jSwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR1.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-GvFoAzZTA/XpBabWWiFOI/AAAAAAAADag/wMOkL2v0aZckGnHO6OjsRVc3EzA1WJ1DQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/mtcMatchHVR2.jpeg


-Balkan

I don't have any clues or references here

Holanda (Flevoland)

Common surnames

All the surnames are Dutch, it says that they are ancestral from the area

Common ethnicities

Northwest European
English
Scandinavian

At least I have this clue and it's for dna Y

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YKFiQybWiB8/XyMiBBzHyuI/AAAAAAAAEXA/Yo9mbEXayr4cvV8XvkdxMCDxqslHaQTIwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/YfullJULIO2020.jpg




https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3TXf7DwQZEc/XzrUtucuroI/AAAAAAAAEZ0/3R5WV1f1YhIr0nhxl1U4EyTs5JaeJg5_QCLcBGAsYHQ/s841/MAPEphilogociMasintensidad2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GT8PAS2BlQc/XzrUjblrQmI/AAAAAAAAEZw/f3EiMQUeh5Mp5i-EBZn-Hod-QAMMVbUMwCLcBGAsYHQ/s897/mapePhilogicmasINTENSIDAD.JPEG

El Salvador

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean

I have no data or clues about this result only some snp in Y full whose explanation was that they were very strange and did not know much about the bug it is possible that they were in other areas besides Central America. I saw a video of the results of a Basque couple who are youtubers and also obtained these results are large family and yet all their children were 100% Iberian and only the parents obtained these results in Central America so ?


Colombia

Common surnames

3 matching autosomal surnames including my maternal grandfather's

Common ethnicities

Mesoamerican and Andean ?



Iberian



How do you see it?



I think it is one of the inconsistencies of My Heritage: to include a mestizo (Mesoamerican) population. It corresponds to the usual "Latin American mix": Native American + European + Sub Saharan African, with a predominance of the native component and small percentages of the other two. Surely your coincidence is with the European component (almost always Iberian) ...

Carlos
26-12-20, 21:42
I think it is one of the inconsistencies of My Heritage: to include a mestizo (Mesoamerican) population. It corresponds to the usual "Latin American mix": Native American + European + Sub Saharan African, with a predominance of the native component and small percentages of the other two. Surely your coincidence is with the European component (almost always Iberian) ...

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-4SNdccOgDPk/X-eBmsnorrI/AAAAAAAAFSM/RKcGRlmi21MarPjYRQARx2G67s3ci94dwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/AdicionalGroupColombia.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Eg16EHXYVBM/X-eBrNvwmiI/AAAAAAAAFSQ/vLW0PUAOiF0MfvZynRzQx6vvcny44CMzwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1310/AdicionalGroupSalvador.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-egJZWqtkYq8/X-eG2z6MySI/AAAAAAAAFSg/nhI6AuQQVYArGPCSdg4MA92_b5fxuSqOQCLcBGAsYHQ/s341/AdicionalGroupSalvador2.jpeg

Maybe for modern periods they should use modern terms, spaniard, I don't know if French users call them Gauls.

On the map of Colombia I mark Iberian in common ethnicities but it is taking a large part of Europe, I think it would be more appropriate to spaniard


In the case of Colombia it covers more European continent, Iberian and Native American brand.


El Salvador is a Native American brand and is strictly from the center of the Iberian Peninsula.

Maybe I can get a connection with Native Americans around here:


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/--l9-1O5pp1E/X2pIv3eUMaI/AAAAAAAAElY/ILGI2biUbDEfRf8uOW6tdDkDraTYGrGYwCLcBGAsYHQ/s561/AllOriginsEasternEuropePercentages2020.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eZ5SA8jqw9o/X2pIygQ0VdI/AAAAAAAAElc/fUDjkPMFEFsOuTJF8U0q9OIzMXNMSi3VgCLcBGAsYHQ/s591/AllOriginsFinishPercentages2020.jpg



Because something not at such high levels but it would be too novel perhaps:

He would bond with Spaniards up to three times, having with them a total of six legitimate children of both sexes and one more that he did not recognize, Leonor Cortés Moctezuma, who he fathered with Hernán Cortés himself.


He was not the only Moctezuma with a title in Spain. The offspring of Tlacahuepantzin Yohualicahuacatzin, baptized as Pedro de Moctezuma, The Prince, exerted great influence among the Spanish aristocracy. His son Diego Luis de Moctezuma married the Andalusian noblewoman Francisca de la Cueva y Valenzuela and brought the dynasty to Spain. After his death in Valladolid in 1606, the Crown named his son Pedro Tesifón Conde de Moctezuma, later Duchy of Moctezuma by the grace of Queen Isabel II, whose title still exists today.

https://static1.abc.es/media/historia/2019/03/28/[email protected]
Portrait of Francisco Javier Giron Ezpeleta

They are descendants of Spanish nobles and Aztec princesses, I have dined with the current one, well I was at the next table.




The blood of Moctezuma thus runs through some very outstanding military heroes of the Spanish aristocracy.

More complicated to reconstruct is the life of another of the Emperor's daughters, Princess Xipaguazin Moctezuma, who according to tradition would have lived until her death in Toloríu, in the current municipality of El Pont de Bar (Lérida).

If the rest of the Spaniards have obtained the same results, it should be the first option.


https://www.abc.es/historia/abci-hija-catalana-moctezuma-fundador-guardia-civil-destaco-prole-azteca-espana-201903280144_noticia.html

torzio
26-12-20, 22:23
Mine are pretty consistent too

12487


I am surprised that since you are DNA related to my wife....you do not have any FVG

her results
Europe
Italian



53.4%





Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #2


Italy (Veneto and Lombardy)


Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #1




Balkan



19.9%




Iberian



18.4%




North and West European



8.3%


.................................................. .......

Top places 1750 - 1800
Italy

Veneto, Italy

Treviso, Veneto, Italy

Belluno, Veneto, Italy

Fontanelle, Veneto, Italy


............................................

Top places 1650 - 1700
Carbonera, Veneto, Italy

Fontane, Veneto, Italy

Fontanelle, Veneto, Italy

Grasciano, Abruzzo, Italy

Lancenigo, Veneto, Italy

christa
26-12-20, 23:40
My genetic groups are better than regional estimates.
Genetic groups are :
Italy (Bari)
Italy (Campania)
Italy (Trentino) and Austria
Basques in Spain and France
Romania
Georgia, Florida and Alabama (British and some Irish and German in United States)
12495
12496

Regio X
27-12-20, 03:18
Mine - FTDNA data
https://i.imgur.com/b9oEHGA.jpg


Mine - 23andMe data
https://i.imgur.com/lSBXeyW.jpg


Father's - 23andMe
https://i.imgur.com/RtBuDeH.jpg


Mother's - 23andMe data
https://i.imgur.com/QH1hGFO.jpg


Maternal uncle's - FTDNA data
https://i.imgur.com/k3I5gTa.jpg

HYGILI4K
27-12-20, 14:34
I am surprised that since you are DNA related to my wife....you do not have any FVG

her results
Europe
Italian



53.4%





Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #2


Italy (Veneto and Lombardy)


Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #1




Balkan



19.9%




Iberian



18.4%




North and West European



8.3%


.................................................. .......

Top places 1750 - 1800
Italy

Veneto, Italy

Treviso, Veneto, Italy

Belluno, Veneto, Italy

Fontanelle, Veneto, Italy


............................................

Top places 1650 - 1700
Carbonera, Veneto, Italy

Fontane, Veneto, Italy

Fontanelle, Veneto, Italy

Grasciano, Abruzzo, Italy

Lancenigo, Veneto, Italy

We both have Italy (Veneto and Lombardy), it must be our link; I have only one 5th great-grandfather from FVG, from Premariacco, so little DNA from there.

I'm surprised Tuscany didn't show up, since I have one great-grandmother whose parents were from Livorno and Siena.

Carlos
27-12-20, 15:17
And this is another of the additional genetic groups that I get.


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-D9-5MK8ZMsE/X-iITZTAqFI/AAAAAAAAFTY/tyO3cV1zCUMi-PgDaqebQ3RwfTiinCXwQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/AdicionalGroupHoland.jpeg

Duarte
27-12-20, 16:36
Hi Carlos

You must to click in the tab “Ethnicity Estimate”. After show up the new window in app you must to click in the tab “View Full Estimate”. Then, in next window that will be opened will show up all your ethnicities. Click in the ethnicity of your interest and wil be displayed the following dada, for example for one of my ethnicities (Portugal, Group ID: 5176):

https://i.imgur.com/fCTnBFg.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eUggFxM.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LgpPwE1.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7nfjAmW.jpg

Timelipse of Group ID: 5176 (Portuguese) between 1600 - 2000

https://i.imgur.com/hvjQKii.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/UpPey6c.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/5MNu5oq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/wpFbUWm.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hKirIWr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MxCJiL9.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/E7k2FrI.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zYcwBBr.jpg

torzio
27-12-20, 16:45
We both have Italy (Veneto and Lombardy), it must be our link; I have only one 5th great-grandfather from FVG, from Premariacco, so little DNA from there.

I'm surprised Tuscany didn't show up, since I have one great-grandmother whose parents were from Livorno and Siena.

Then you are really Friulan ...........your area, cividale, Udine, Cormons etc are really from Friuli in the FVG ( Friuli -Venezia-Giulia ) ....................my wife come from many towns along the current border of veneto and Friuli, the Livenza river ...from San Stino di Livenza ( in the south ) up to Vittorio Veneto ( was named Ceneda originally prior WW1)

my Wife has no Tuscan, or even Lombard some Villach Austria yes , carnian alps yes, ......that's all I know for her line.



FVG - borders reset by Austria in period ( 1820-1870 )
F = Friuli ......Udine province , speak Furlan
V = Venezia.....Pordenone area, speak Venetian
G = Giulian mountains area, speak Furlan........but since they added Trieste and they spoke Venetian even though they never ever where under the Venetian republic , then it must incorporate even some sloveans

torzio
27-12-20, 16:51
And this is another of the additional genetic groups that I get.


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-D9-5MK8ZMsE/X-iITZTAqFI/AAAAAAAAFTY/tyO3cV1zCUMi-PgDaqebQ3RwfTiinCXwQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/AdicionalGroupHoland.jpeg


Spanish Netherlands ............did your ancestors fight for the Spanish which ruled the area or the dutch that revolted for independence

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Netherlands

Carlos
27-12-20, 18:44
Spanish Netherlands ............did your ancestors fight for the Spanish which ruled the area or the dutch that revolted for independence

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Netherlands


That's what you can think of in the first place. I do not see myself capable of inseminating such a large expanse of land in such a short time.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-D9-5MK8ZMsE/X-iITZTAqFI/AAAAAAAAFTY/tyO3cV1zCUMi-PgDaqebQ3RwfTiinCXwQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/AdicionalGroupHoland.jpeg


I am the one who gets the result.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-0B_0qIdpb_g/X-i1MFk-jxI/AAAAAAAAFTk/GyCqkEqClboxePN2vsIvy7WLJqe0000zQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/flevoland2jpeg.jpg


Does not appear coloured Spain



There is another historical period and another history that seems more in line with these results.


In my paternal family they say that we are descended from a French legionnaire who had deserted from Napoleon's troops when they occupied Spain 1808-1814 and had changed his surname. I heard this story personally from my paternal grandfather's brother and my father's sister. The nationality by oral tradition could have been kept confused by oral tradition since the everything for the memory of that time at a popular level would be French; although their troops were multinational to some degree.


And the time period of my 1900-1950 result on this map is more in keeping with the Napoleonic period than with the Spanish in Holland.


I see Wikipedia that Louis Bonaparte is proclaimed king in Holland in 1806 and I thought I saw the French recruiting troops in Holland.

And in my multidisciplinary compilation I have these results of my situation.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YKFiQybWiB8/XyMiBBzHyuI/AAAAAAAAEXA/Yo9mbEXayr4cvV8XvkdxMCDxqslHaQTIwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/YfullJULIO2020.jpg

Y HEAT MAPE
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3TXf7DwQZEc/XzrUtucuroI/AAAAAAAAEZ0/3R5WV1f1YhIr0nhxl1U4EyTs5JaeJg5_QCLcBGAsYHQ/s841/MAPEphilogociMasintensidad2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GT8PAS2BlQc/XzrUjblrQmI/AAAAAAAAEZw/f3EiMQUeh5Mp5i-EBZn-Hod-QAMMVbUMwCLcBGAsYHQ/s897/mapePhilogicmasINTENSIDAD.JPEG

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-0B_0qIdpb_g/X-i1MFk-jxI/AAAAAAAAFTk/GyCqkEqClboxePN2vsIvy7WLJqe0000zQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/flevoland2jpeg.jpg




https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Q8zfIMX6LYY/X-kXDvK0TUI/AAAAAAAAFUE/-tMPwOhtE4c1gd1Hec-Mp7wtOKmclRKNACLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/Flevoland5.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-AAML_NGZ2NI/X-kSWTNH-PI/AAAAAAAAFT4/HEoffjJ10kAH05Z9eFcTAuI6_LoS0BL_gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/Flevoland4.jpeg


Between 1700 and 1800, it already made its mark in Paris.




My great-grandfather second man from the right with his 6 brothers. They would be even closer to that ancestor who would have been a deserter from Napoleon's troops according to family legend.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-vhLnVWwVi-8/X-i1jz_m5WI/AAAAAAAAFTs/f3DkzRVNHEYwUejzZuRw45J0WlWVfMAoQCLcBGAsYHQ/s960/familyHN.jpg


Other ancestors are fitting me better on other maps. To date for this ancestor that matches my dna Y and the data I handle seems to me the most plausible possibility.

Carlos
28-12-20, 22:30
Me (ESP-MA)
Overijssel

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg

Outstanding places are cities or countries where members of a genetic group lived during a certain period of time, as well as the geographical distribution of the genetic group at that time



https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-MHHR0459XM8/X-o4rAcZDPI/AAAAAAAAFUQ/kYQO5crLJWU2qMoOyFSpHHFBmc_8qv1JwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/HolandaFlevoland5.jpeg

This region appears


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TUzDdxLVRXE/X-o-AKHbrjI/AAAAAAAAFU8/aFMiqgDnN3UTVIYQXZrStiw4qmhMfRMQwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1362/FlevolandOverjssel5.jpeg

From 1800 to 1850 it no longer appears



https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-o_ldNml3mog/X-ptlLsNitI/AAAAAAAAFVI/43zuYPXjEsM5HsI2kaplGxjZ9tbY6BVwQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/FlevolandOverjsseletniascomunes6.jpg



https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Jc_Edi6XQY8/X-pwZdQfnjI/AAAAAAAAFVg/g3-3uLWEA80SD2_dwDwLV0ydGv1p4ti-QCLcBGAsYHQ/s479/HolandaFlevoland3.jpeg

Common group ethnicities

Salento
29-12-20, 02:59
... not MH original, ... from months old upload,
... they did get Bari and Lecce (Salento), ... Rome in the images
... though they’re still bundling as one easy to spot distinctive population.

https://i.imgur.com/Lfzwnez.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/IBhmLJW.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/OGCpMdL.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/5IL7i4D.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9nHDv1b.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/AMaAeKh.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/qepHsZN.jpg

Salento
29-12-20, 04:00
... though I’m Leccese (Salento), the highest Confidence Level is Bari,

I’m writing in Italian for a second:

@Christa
... penso che sarebbe meglio se non ci unissero con i Greci, ci confondono un po’ con gli Ebrei ed altri.
Ancestry, 23andme e LivingDNA ci sanno distinguere un po’ meglio.

christa
29-12-20, 05:18
I think so. Maybe new regions will be update according to genetic groups.

Salento
29-12-20, 07:39
I think so. Maybe new regions will be update according to genetic groups.

It seems that, at least at the regional or local level, the main DNA testing companies are slowly consolidating,

and I think they're generally correct because a lot of us know where we're from.

https://i.imgur.com/OpSZdZ0.jpg

Salento
29-12-20, 09:29
... if true, in the 1600s, Apulians were very popular in the UK, ... unless it’s Ancient Roman shared ancestry, ... or Normans related? Maybe both?

... or something else must have happened that I’m not aware of :)

https://i.imgur.com/dOps9Gu.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/GIICjNR.png

christa
29-12-20, 11:13
Someone used for this group is American of Italian origin.The group is "italians in Bari Apulia and someone of their descendents in United States".So in their genealogy there is some British ancestors.
12503

Salento
29-12-20, 18:12
Someone used for this group is American of Italian origin.The group is "italians in Bari Apulia and someone of their descendents in United States".So in their genealogy there is some British ancestors.
12503

I can’t see your attachment, ... but are you saying that some of them cheated pretending to be unmixed though they’re mixed ?

christa
29-12-20, 20:17
For someone is indicated only a regions under the genetic groups. Instead, in the case of Bari is indicated ""italians in Bari Apulia and someone of their descendents in United States",so it's possible that in their genealogies there are some British ancestors.
I don't know well. It's only an hypothesis. I could be wrong.

Salento
29-12-20, 20:49
For someone is indicated only a regions under the genetic groups. Instead, in the case of Bari is indicated ""italians in Bari Apulia and someone of their descendents in United States",so it's possible that in their genealogies there are some British ancestors.
I don't know well. It's only an hypothesis. I could be wrong.

OK, thanks,
... and now I can see your image too,
... showing the same genetic group code as mine :)

Carlos
30-12-20, 05:20
I am British


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRw17BdX2Ug/X-uikWRbwCI/AAAAAAAAFWc/dSvAfro_WGcGafYFO2ZyFXaxGPZJmnU2gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/irlanda1600dos.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Dru3-sj9bX0/X-p1MTHMFEI/AAAAAAAAFWA/sPqJDbseqEcIcksfbU17KDjRYSDbKkXxwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1362/IrlandaIrlandesesEtniascomunes.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Nbqzo_lD4r8/X-uiFP-J0VI/AAAAAAAAFWU/JjsKYjBollU7S6lZpZJ7zH0k7pmMBMf0gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1361/IrlandaIrlandeses1800MapaGrande.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IAB_CvssSHw/X-uh1bXredI/AAAAAAAAFWM/DVTW7lp8j-UEINqbKQL8zFzG2ZYnjgplgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/IrlandaIrlandesesAzerbayy%25C3%25A1n1800.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-WkQwDzz0hQo/X-ui5UIIQ1I/AAAAAAAAFWk/MSy879W2YZkDlZH8vbogvesyCK1smfQpACLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/IrlandaEuropa.jpeg


I don't know if it's related to the other maps of Flevoland since I don't see colored Spain in any time either.

In the more modern era, Italy and even Azerbaijan appeared, as mentioned above, perhaps due to the mixing of Italian and Irish marriages in the United States.


In Mexico it also appears, I had heard that a small number of French emigrated to Mexico.

Salento
30-12-20, 17:58
@Jovialis
@Christa

Top Places 1700 - 1750 / Confidence Level: High

https://i.imgur.com/8JpqkPq.jpg

Carlos
30-12-20, 19:51
I had forgotten Google Earth but I saw a guy playing with this application and I thought about mixing coordinates related to my results and this is what happened based on and having as only objective my dna Y

I mixed the coordinates of my dna Y (ESP-MA) with those of my partner's origin in Y full Overijssen

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-DjiURIRvv9I/X-ymRjGoX-I/AAAAAAAAFXw/XHy1QLDp2o4rQkQ3WiPKebxlUjEo_0ofQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1312/provinciajijel.jpeg

https://whereismap.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Where-is-Jijel-Located-What-Country-is-Jijel-in-Jijel-Map-800x348.jpg

I obtained the region of Jijel in Algeria.

Towards the 10th century a. C., the Phoenicians, sailors and merchants, settled in the area in search of bases where to guarantee the security of their trade. In the first century B.C. it was the Romans who invaded the place. It was elevated to the rank of Roman Colony in the year 33 by Caesar Augustus, being administered by a senator.


With the arrival of the Germanic peoples, the Vandals crossed Spain and travelled through North Africa. They destroyed Igilgili in the year 429.


From here I mix the coordinates of Jijel with some of Spain, I think I used Gerona. From here I mix the coordinates of Jijel with some of Spain, I think I used Gerona, I tried some other and the result was the same, the sea

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Zip4QPjd2qo/X-yl1s05mnI/AAAAAAAAFW4/oPXENufzm885cuhZV3ySdxBNLOQXFxu1gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1308/Jijel2.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XJ10dnkRWYY/X-ymEl3eUdI/AAAAAAAAFXQ/O35Luo4pejYizvhcOA5-KVARYAapnI6DQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1308/jijel2a.jpeg

It coincides with this result where it ends up in the sea

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-EylGuU8qxGI/X8-fywaO2YI/AAAAAAAAFJI/rka4wbTMrrsgs3pRc3nlyfTIp2g8RFrbACLcBGAsYHQ/s2048/Mapemiouncertain.jpeg

I remember the saying that All roads lead to Rome, so mix those coordinates with those of Rome

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-AEMbAjh5Ltc/X-yl-dbTGpI/AAAAAAAAFXE/Coq2ItxzJL4xGQEl0mmcPEMphiV9V0W3gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1310/Roma2.jpeg

It's funny that mound with that little forest planted there, in my land trees are planted in those areas when there are stones underneath to prevent the harvesting machines from colliding with the stones underneath. Maybe there's Nero's body down there or something...

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-laAjEvBxxEs/X-yl9-LtuUI/AAAAAAAAFXA/IfZgs430rTIZ_GhtUqVLyiM2FwqNHQjXQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1313/Roma.jpeg

If you look very closely, there is the tomb of Nero, so I give myself a margin of 100 years from the death of Nero and I get these results

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-FsfphHl6-XU/X-ywRybbraI/AAAAAAAAFYc/zkVn6aHDpHsPeRU5lv2YT5tNMrSjaiJeQCLcBGAsYHQ/s2048/MapePostNer%25C3%25B3n.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-7l6rBhyG9xU/X-ywZJFXdJI/AAAAAAAAFYg/Qggh5aPG2q0bhcK0XwYjKkqY1Q0w9hqVACLcBGAsYHQ/s2048/MapePostNer%25C3%25B3n2.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-P4PPTP1wh8Y/X-ywfowbjBI/AAAAAAAAFYk/ZfE9vrGzOr4q8GyiY1yJ9YKQVlkojShmACLcBGAsYHQ/s2048/MapePostNer%25C3%25B3n3.jpeg
Now I mix the coordinates of Rome with Listrim one of my results in MyHeritage

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-_1iDDJkPshw/X-ymwXCoVdI/AAAAAAAAFYQ/ezlipq5wxIEQBz1aarulxZBeGcbDo0Z8ACLcBGAsYHQ/s1308/dinamarca.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-48BZZbRGPCI/X-y6Euf5oXI/AAAAAAAAFY4/ikCXO4Tl6EM-OGWfSNwVjcp3TqoDr5G1gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1287/mapeVikingAge.jpeg
This oracle has really surprised me

Salento
31-12-20, 01:36
@Jovialis
@Christa

Top Places 1700 - 1750 / Confidence Level: High

https://i.imgur.com/8JpqkPq.jpg

... I speculate that in the 1750s some of my relatives must have been the Mayor of Altamura :grin:

https://i.imgur.com/XI2LFiQ.jpg

... interesting: one of the ancient names of Altamura is Lupatia, ... Lecce was Lupiae ​:)

christa
31-12-20, 08:26
Do you have ancestors of Altamura?

Salento
31-12-20, 09:04
Do you have ancestors of Altamura?

none that I’m aware of, ... but it showed up in my genetic group, ... so I mentioned it, just so you two guys would know :)

... meno male che mi hanno dato anche il gruppo genetico di Lecce, ... altrimenti sarebbe stata una tragedia per un Salentino come me, ... lol

Jovialis
31-12-20, 15:01
https://i.imgur.com/ylhgzOz.png

This is mine.

Salento
31-12-20, 17:38
https://i.imgur.com/ylhgzOz.png

This is mine.

That’s great Jovialis :)

... I've been assigned the Bari and Chieti (Abruzzo) confidence level higher than Lecce (Salento), but I’m happy that at least I got my Ancestral area.

https://i.imgur.com/7wftu3D.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/UShEZjA.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ddgONgM.jpg

... 1650 Chieti shows Calabria and Liguria too, ... nice, :smile:

Angela
31-12-20, 21:14
I wish I had some results to share but I never bought it. All I know is that they use Ashkenazim as part of the "Middle East" reference group, an ethnicity which by conservative estimates is at least 40-60% European. I'd never heard of anything so stupid by a testing company. That would vastly inflate the "Middle Eastern" in Europeans, and also inflate Ashkenazi in Southern Europeans.

It's almost as bad as Eurogenes "J" test.

If you're Southern European and want to know if you have Ashkenazi ancestry to any meaningful degree, go to 23andme. If you have it, the genes will show up.

Regio X
31-12-20, 22:46
I wish I had some results to share but I never bought it. All I know is that they use Ashkenazim as part of the "Middle East" reference group, an ethnicity which by conservative estimates is at least 40-60% European. I'd never heard of anything so stupid by a testing company. That would vastly inflate the "Middle Eastern" in Europeans, and also inflate Ashkenazi in Southern Europeans.
It's almost as bad as Eurogenes "J" test.
If you're Southern European and want to know if you have Ashkenazi ancestry to any meaningful degree, go to 23andme. If you have it, the genes will show up.Angela, I've never bought them either, and they're there.
When I uploaded my uncle's data, his results were blocked, but for some reason they were unblocked after a while.
Matching tool is free, IIRC.

torzio
31-12-20, 23:19
my sister match areas


I can confirm these with BDM records


Top places 1600 - 1650
Ferrara, Emilia-Romagna, Italy ..................nil..........but Rovigo , just north of Ferrara is a match


Fontane, Veneto, Italy ................correct


Zernez, Grisons, Switzerland ................correct


Babenhausen, Hesse, Germany ................no idea


Canizzano, Veneto, Italy ..................correct


Fontanelle, Veneto, Italy ................correct


Gross-Umstadt, Hesse, Germany ...............unsure


Karbach, Rhineland-Palatinate, Germany .............correct


Loria, Veneto, Italy .........................correct


Polcenigo, Friuli-Venezia Giulia, Italy ...................correct


San Zenone Deghi Ezzelini .....just north of Loria is missing and so is Asolo, Fonte and Monfumo ..........as per BDM records



.................................................. ............................................

advance 100 years

Top places 1700 - 1750
Veneto, Italy

Italy

Noventa di Piave, Veneto, Italy ...........................yes


Treviso, Veneto, Italy ........................................yes


Grasciano, Abruzzo, Italy ......................................no idea


Lancenigo, Veneto, Italy ..............................correct, town under Villorba


Mareno di Piave, Veneto, Italy ........................yes


Pasiano di Pordenone, Friuli-Venezia Giulia, Italy ..........................no idea, I thought it was Porcia di Pordenone


Prata di Pordenone, Friuli-Venezia Giulia, Italy ...........................no.......but cousins come from here


Rovaré, Veneto, Italy ............................yes

torzio
31-12-20, 23:26
1st cousin .................from sister of my grandfather paternal side

Top places 1600 - 1650
Italy

Sossano, Veneto, Italy

United Kingdom ................................no idea


Adelange, Grand Est, France................................no idea


Altrippe, Grand Est, France................................no idea


Anzeling, Grand Est, France................................no idea


Badia, South Tyrol, South Tyrol, Italy .....................need to check ............Tres in Val di Non is the right place




surnames

Rossi .................should be Ros


Ferrari ...............no


Zanella .................yes


Bianchi ................yes


Carraro .................yes


Moro ........................yes


Zanon ...................yes


Barbieri ...................no


Fontana ..................no


Marin .....................yes

Duarte
31-12-20, 23:39
MH considers the Askenazi an European ethnicity and the Sefardi an ethnic group from North Africa. MH addresses the Askenazi in the following way.

https://i.imgur.com/FuEinvK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LxWh4Wt.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/yBXAnG0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/iFODVaQ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/4mZSswP.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/R5TA2v1.jpg

Angela
01-01-21, 04:52
Then they changed it I guess. Regardless, the Ashkenazim have no IBD sharing with either Spaniards or Italians.

christa
01-01-21, 07:19
https://i.imgur.com/ylhgzOz.png

This is mine.

what genetic groups do you get at low confidence level?

Jovialis
01-01-21, 13:14
I don't see how a low confidence level result would be of much value or interest, but here is mine:

https://i.imgur.com/5dRJ4bz.png

Romania probably has some connection with Bronze Age Hungarian DNA, and Louisiana & Mississippi are from Italian diaspora that went there in the 1800s. I don't have any family that went there, the only group which makes sense is the Bari one.

Sicily and Sardinia? That's a pretty massive range.

Riverman
01-01-21, 14:10
Romania probably has some connection with Bronze Age Hungarian DNA

Romanians have strong Balkan and Roman influences, also strong Slavic ones and minor, but significant, more recent ones from various steppe people, Hungarians, Germans, Serbs and Bulgarians among others. Its in any case about more recent common ancestry than the Bronze Age with this feature, so admixture within historical times. The question is just in which direction it was going, from Romania or to Romania. Could be the general Vlach/Balkan cluster via Albanian ancestry?

I get French in Northern America on low confidence because some German-French relatives of ancestors moved to these communities.

Duarte
01-01-21, 15:09
The Sephardic ethnicity, according to MyHeritage

https://i.imgur.com/i9FgIKo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/GgByeRb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YsRyrOQ.jpg

Angela
01-01-21, 15:19
^^I don't understand how that makes much sense. They are a few percent Berber. The rest of their ancestry is like that of Ashkenazi Jews. That's just a geographical description of where they lived, not their "origin".

Angela
01-01-21, 15:24
Does anyone have a link to their "white paper", where they explain their reference groups and process?

Carlos
01-01-21, 15:45
Perhaps in all this period they have already become Maghrebi Jews, otherwise they would have had to exercise a strong inbreeding and would have presented multiple diseases like the Jews of Mallorca. Perhaps the Muslim power has been permissive in the transit of Berber marriages to Sephardic Jews.

Duarte
01-01-21, 16:01
Then they changed it I guess. Regardless, the Ashkenazim have no IBD sharing with either Spaniards or Italians.

Hi Angela. Happy New Year

MH's proposal is to establish clusters with modern populations. The Sephardim arrived in Iberia from North Africa and when they were expelled in the late 1400s, they returned mostly there. The Ashkenazins had a strong presence in Central and Eastern Europe until the Holocaust. Before the war, the Ashkenazi corresponded to more than 10,000,000 people. This is more than the current population of Portugal. Israel is a state that emerged in 1945. IMO, it makes no sense to associate the Jews Asquenaze and Sephardi with such a new state, but with their last known origins, which is Central Europe and North Africa, respectively. The Sefardi community in Iberia is numerically insignificant today and many of those who are there today are Sephardic cultural people from Latim America who used complicated bureaucratic intricacies to receive Portuguese or Spanish citizenship and settle in those countries. Concretely, these individuals are neither. They are not ethnic Iberians, nor are they ethnic Jews. The attribution of nationality does not mean attribution of ethnicity and in this sense it is not worthwhile that they participate in statistics or references of ethnicity, mainly in Portugal and Spain, under the risk of distorting the statistical data of the modern Jewish population.

Cheers.

Jovialis
01-01-21, 16:23
Romanians have strong Balkan and Roman influences, also strong Slavic ones and minor, but significant, more recent ones from various steppe people, Hungarians, Germans, Serbs and Bulgarians among others. Its in any case about more recent common ancestry than the Bronze Age with this feature, so admixture within historical times. The question is just in which direction it was going, from Romania or to Romania. Could be the general Vlach/Balkan cluster via Albanian ancestry?

I get French in Northern America on low confidence because some German-French relatives of ancestors moved to these communities.

I think it may be far fetched that this is an indication, but some speculate that the Apuli may have originated in Dacia.

Jovialis
01-01-21, 16:26
The Apuli or Biefi were a Dacian tribe centered at the Dacian town Apulon (Latin Apulum) near what is now Alba Iulia in Transylvania, Romania.


Apuli has clear resemblance to Apulia, the ancient southeastern Italy region, which is believed to have been settled by Illyrian tribes (also named Apuli or Iapyges).


Linguists use it as an example for the similarities between Illyrian and Dacian language.[1]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apuli

https://i.imgur.com/Dkduwqq.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacia#/media/File:Dacia_82_BC.png

Jovialis
01-01-21, 16:35
I think it may be far fetched that this is an indication, but some speculate that the Apuli may have originated in Dacia.

Though perhaps not too far fetched. I don't know of any Apuli samples, but I am fairly close to the Iron Age Bulgarian sample:



Distance to:
Jovialis


8.92001682
Balkans_IronAge:I5769_Bulgaria_IA

Angela
01-01-21, 19:27
Perhaps in all this period they have already become Maghrebi Jews, otherwise they would have had to exercise a strong inbreeding and would have presented multiple diseases like the Jews of Mallorca. Perhaps the Muslim power has been permissive in the transit of Berber marriages to Sephardic Jews.

We have their autosomal analysis, Carlos.


http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Atzmon.jpg

You'll find a lot of nonsense on the net from the pre-genetic analysis days, but we now know a lot more.

"The study carried out by Behar et al. that analysed small samples of North African Jews (Libya (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libya) (83); Morocco (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morocco) (149); Tunisia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunisia) (37)) indicates that Jews from North Africa lack typically North African Hg M1 and U6 mtDNAs.[13] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews#cite_note-Behar_2008_e2062-13) Hence, according to the authors, the lack of U6 and M1 haplogroups among the North Africans renders the possibility of significant admixture, as between the local Arab and Berber populations with Jews, unlikely. The genetic evidence shows them to be distinct from Berber populations, but more similar to Ashkenazi Jewish populations.[13] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews#cite_note-Behar_2008_e2062-13)"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews


Most of their ancestry is from the expelled Jews of Spain.

"Analysis of mitochondrial DNA of the Jewish populations of North Africa (Morocco, Tunisia, Libya) was the subject of further detailed study in 2008 by Doron Behar et al.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40) The analysis concludes that Jews from this region do not share the haplogroups (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup) of the mitochondrial DNA haplogroups (M1 and U6) that are typical of the North African Berber and Arab populations. Similarly, while the frequency of haplogroups L, associated with sub-Saharan Africa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub-Saharan_Africa), are present in approximately 20–25% at the Berber populations studied, these haplogroups are only present in 1.3%, 2.7% and 3.6% respectively of Jews from Morocco, Tunisia and Libya.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40)Behar et al. conclude that it is unlikely that North African Jews have significant Arab, or Berber admixture, "consistent with social restrictions imposed by religious restrictions," or endogamy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endogamy). This study also found genetic similarities between the Ashkenazi and North African Jews of European mitochondrial DNA pools, but differences between both of these of the diaspora and Jews from the Middle East.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40)

Salento
01-01-21, 20:27
Though perhaps not too far fetched. I don't know of any Apuli samples, but I am fairly close to the Iron Age Bulgarian sample:




Distance to:
Jovialis


8.92001682
Balkans_IronAge:I5769_Bulgaria_IA



... mine



Distance to:
S_23v5_dod13




9.50521436
_Bulgaria_IA_:I5769



https://i.imgur.com/vqs5up4.jpg



Distance to:
S_Comb_dodK13




9.56978579
_Bulgaria_IA_:I5769

Salento
01-01-21, 20:47
... they assigned Ashkenazi knowing the lack of DNA Matches, ... same thing with West Asia.

https://i.imgur.com/o8QoaIk.jpg

Jovialis
01-01-21, 20:57
Here is my distance to the Dodecad G13 version:



Distance to:
Jovialis


8.34441130
Bulgaria_IA:Mathieson_et_al_2018:I5769




https://i.imgur.com/8FeEOql.png

https://i.imgur.com/gd0Qj5f.png

https://i.imgur.com/AEb49wQ.png

Carlos
01-01-21, 21:34
We have their autosomal analysis, Carlos.


http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Atzmon.jpg

You'll find a lot of nonsense on the net from the pre-genetic analysis days, but we now know a lot more.

"The study carried out by Behar et al. that analysed small samples of North African Jews (Libya (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libya) (83); Morocco (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morocco) (149); Tunisia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunisia) (37)) indicates that Jews from North Africa lack typically North African Hg M1 and U6 mtDNAs.[13] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews#cite_note-Behar_2008_e2062-13) Hence, according to the authors, the lack of U6 and M1 haplogroups among the North Africans renders the possibility of significant admixture, as between the local Arab and Berber populations with Jews, unlikely. The genetic evidence shows them to be distinct from Berber populations, but more similar to Ashkenazi Jewish populations.[13] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews#cite_note-Behar_2008_e2062-13)"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berber_Jews


Most of their ancestry is from the expelled Jews of Spain.

"Analysis of mitochondrial DNA of the Jewish populations of North Africa (Morocco, Tunisia, Libya) was the subject of further detailed study in 2008 by Doron Behar et al.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40) The analysis concludes that Jews from this region do not share the haplogroups (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup) of the mitochondrial DNA haplogroups (M1 and U6) that are typical of the North African Berber and Arab populations. Similarly, while the frequency of haplogroups L, associated with sub-Saharan Africa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub-Saharan_Africa), are present in approximately 20–25% at the Berber populations studied, these haplogroups are only present in 1.3%, 2.7% and 3.6% respectively of Jews from Morocco, Tunisia and Libya.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40)Behar et al. conclude that it is unlikely that North African Jews have significant Arab, or Berber admixture, "consistent with social restrictions imposed by religious restrictions," or endogamy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endogamy). This study also found genetic similarities between the Ashkenazi and North African Jews of European mitochondrial DNA pools, but differences between both of these of the diaspora and Jews from the Middle East.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroccan_Jews#cite_note-Behar2008b-40)




Since 1990, several genetic studies of Jewish populations have been conducted

https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jud%C3%ADos_bereberes

We see other studies from 2008, 2013 and until 2021 it has rained.


I understand that it may be hard to let go of what was taken for granted based on studies from 10 or 20 years ago or maybe more, but these days we are seeing how other genetic studies for other subjects from 10, 20 years ago are turning into wet paper.

torzio
01-01-21, 21:41
https://i.imgur.com/Dkduwqq.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacia#/media/File:Dacia_82_BC.png


If you check all italian papers , be them old or newer ones....they all state the Apuli are the same as the Liburnians ....either a sub branch or related

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=TGhF4AsGwykC&pg=PA38&lpg=PA38&dq=apuli+e+liburni&source=bl&ots=J3QFPHJPdC&sig=ACfU3U1oONu6NxgnHR1o5pLYNBMVFd-Mng&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjSj5XUvfvtAhUwyDgGHbuqAiAQ6AEwDHoECAEQA g#v=onepage&q=apuli%20e%20liburni&f=false

it comes to being , when the Liburnians landed in Picene ( marche ) in circa 1000BC, the Iapygian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iapygians) tribes that inhabited Apulia during the first millennium BC – the Daunians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daunians) in the North, the Peucetians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peucetians) in the Centre, as well as the Messapians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapians) in the South.[7] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulia#cite_note-8)[8]
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulia#cite_note-9)at the same time


.................................................. ........

III Veneti, Piceni e Apuli: una “Magna Illyria”? pag. 14 3 ... La Krka li divideva dai Liburni che originariamente abitavano la Dalmazia settentrionale, a settentrione ...

from a new author /scholar

POPOLI, PAESI E CITTA’ DEL MEDITERRANEO di EMILIO BENVENUTO (https://en.calameo.com/read/0000000012ca0ed594e4a?authid=I2gqrk9RAWwc) by rosaria.pullo (https://en.calameo.com/accounts/150262)


https://en.calameo.com/read/000150262f61a760a117a

Salento
02-01-21, 04:13
If you check all italian papers , be them old or newer ones....they all state the Apuli are the same as the Liburnians ....either a sub branch or related

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=TGhF4AsGwykC&pg=PA38&lpg=PA38&dq=apuli+e+liburni&source=bl&ots=J3QFPHJPdC&sig=ACfU3U1oONu6NxgnHR1o5pLYNBMVFd-Mng&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjSj5XUvfvtAhUwyDgGHbuqAiAQ6AEwDHoECAEQA g#v=onepage&q=apuli%20e%20liburni&f=false

it comes to being , when the Liburnians landed in Picene ( marche ) in circa 1000BC, the Iapygian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iapygians) tribes that inhabited Apulia during the first millennium BC – the Daunians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daunians) in the North, the Peucetians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peucetians) in the Centre, as well as the Messapians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapians) in the South.[7] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulia#cite_note-8)[8]
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulia#cite_note-9)at the same time


.................................................. ........

III Veneti, Piceni e Apuli: una “Magna Illyria”? pag. 14 3 ... La Krka li divideva dai Liburni che originariamente abitavano la Dalmazia settentrionale, a settentrione ...

from a new author /scholar

POPOLI, PAESI E CITTA’ DEL MEDITERRANEO di EMILIO BENVENUTO

by rosaria.pullo (https://en.calameo.com/accounts/150262)


https://en.calameo.com/read/000150262f61a760a117a

... as of now only 3 MTA members get this, ...
... I posted an older lower deep dive rank before, but went up and has been steady for a while, ... :

https://i.imgur.com/u1HR9aP.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/BHfx6sB.jpg

and I3313 could be related to I5769

https://i.imgur.com/9WYWdgb.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jIzNt4O.jpg

torzio
02-01-21, 07:22
... as of now only 3 MTA members get this, ...
... I posted an older lower deep dive rank before, but went up and has been steady for a while, ... :

https://i.imgur.com/u1HR9aP.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/BHfx6sB.jpg

and I3313 could be related to I5769

https://i.imgur.com/9WYWdgb.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jIzNt4O.jpg


Do I win ?!


5. Illyrian / Dalmatian
1200 BC - Genetic Distance: 8.937 - I3313
Top 99 % match vs all users


..........................................

i am waiting for the 32 samples to be analyzed from this site
http://isaw.nyu.edu:8080/isaw/library/blog/croatian-excavation-loewen

torzio
02-01-21, 07:48
@ salento

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxw5l6-1GOE


An Umbrian-Sabellic people born from the fusion of different elements, including the mysterious Liburnian people of the eastern shore of the Adriatic, the Picenians for a long time played a fundamental role in the development of the cultures of Central Italy,

Salento
02-01-21, 08:19
deleted, double post.. :)

Salento
02-01-21, 08:21
@ salento

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxw5l6-1GOE


An Umbrian-Sabellic people born from the fusion of different elements, including the mysterious Liburnian people of the eastern shore of the Adriatic, the Picenians for a long time played a fundamental role in the development of the cultures of Central Italy,

1600s Marche (Picenians area) and Rome are also part of Lecce (Salento) genetic group:


https://i.imgur.com/UShEZjA.jpg

... you win the “Matching Samples”, but I win the Deep Dive :grin:

kingjohn
02-01-21, 15:22
The Sephardic ethnicity, according to MyHeritage

https://i.imgur.com/i9FgIKo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/GgByeRb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YsRyrOQ.jpg


nice :cool-v:
contrary to ftdna my origins 3.0
where the sefhardic refernce is based on turkish sefhardi and greek sefhardi

Carlos
02-01-21, 18:17
Carlos' multidisciplinary studies


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-aXA1bmSL98w/X_COqqgSywI/AAAAAAAAFZ0/d9-4icc_lj4CDDG1Lt9UXBnChp4UEqlpgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/FRANCIAyEspa%25C3%25B1a1600.jpeg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-o_ldNml3mog/X-ptlLsNitI/AAAAAAAAFVI/43zuYPXjEsM5HsI2kaplGxjZ9tbY6BVwQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/FlevolandOverjsseletniascomunes6.jpg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nvLb9onmBQI/X_COwLfscqI/AAAAAAAAFZ4/DWYv41ZFhrcDYV_57ghzPqdeeUiAXGEXwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/FRANCIAyEspa%25C3%25B1a1850.jpeg

In these two maps are the ones that give me Northwest European In these two maps are the ones that give me Northwest European in common ethnicities

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg

With my situation in Y full

The distribution of the surname in Malaga province where my most remote ancestor would have originated

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-a-dG2jRWBy4/X_CUy82z4QI/AAAAAAAAFaM/H1R67a7teSArOKt1gXwq6eLvBPOvnJCsACLcBGAsYHQ/s982/DistribucionRacialmiApellido2.jpeg

Only 18 inhabitants have it as their first surname and 26 as their second surname

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-s5IME6EHS_w/X_CUwf0l4CI/AAAAAAAAFaI/ew_sufv-m4sHUrd9sqOzUO-P27oYwQwNACLcBGAsYHQ/s631/DistribucionRacialmiApellido.jpeg

The surname is held by 2% of whites and 97% of Hispanics referring to Hispanic Americans.


These percentages in the surname for the dna Y speak to me of a non-native of Spain, a native would have the highest percentage


Genetic results with photographic input which is something you rarely get the chance to do. Although I'm not too good at sorting

DNA lineage and from great-grandfather to father:


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wLBaXzMHdG8/X_CW-H1BXaI/AAAAAAAAFac/ni1G8v3BnKArkzhkOJ05xokK6RexcMV0wCLcBGAsYHQ/s80/bisabuelo.jpg
Paternal great-grandfather

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-qqpD_0owEPA/X_CXes5W7GI/AAAAAAAAFao/guig3cpvIO0dy2-2S49JjA_x9pFMW3PHgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1280/Imagen0061-Colorized.jpg
Paternal grandfather

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GG1KT36YDCE/X_CZ1P8DHWI/AAAAAAAAFa4/diTr6I-OFlYCL2d_dJaFFJ1dxaG5kN0oQCLcBGAsYHQ/s587/Pap%25C3%25A1.jpeg
Parent

christa
02-01-21, 21:59
Romanians have strong Balkan and Roman influences, also strong Slavic ones and minor, but significant, more recent ones from various steppe people, Hungarians, Germans, Serbs and Bulgarians among others. Its in any case about more recent common ancestry than the Bronze Age with this feature, so admixture within historical times. The question is just in which direction it was going, from Romania or to Romania. Could be the general Vlach/Balkan cluster via Albanian ancestry?

Maybe genetic groups are not ancient but are based on recent times, as they are based on our matches.
I think the correct genetic groups for Apulians is another balkan population, perhaps the Dalmatian coast or the interior. On Ftdna, 23andme and Myheritage I have many balkan matches of Croatia, Bosnia Herzegovnia, Serbia.. I have some documented ancestors from 1500/1600s of Dubrovnik.

torzio
02-01-21, 22:13
Maybe genetic groups are not ancient but are based on recent times, as they are based on our matches.
I think the correct genetic groups for Apulians is another balkan population, perhaps the Dalmatian coast or the interior. On Ftdna, 23andme and Myheritage I have many balkan matches of Croatia, Bosnia Herzegovnia, Serbia.. I have some documented ancestors from 1500/1600s of Dubrovnik.

Apuli come from ancient Liburnians ( or 1st cousins of Liburnians ) circa 1000Bc

There are many italian papers/documents on this ................see my previous posts on this thread

christa
02-01-21, 22:28
I know this.
Apulians were Illyrian.My city was founded by the Iapygians.

christa
02-01-21, 22:46
There is a genetic study on Iron Age Botromagno in Apulia, a city founded by Iapygians that support the origin of Iapygians from eastern Balkan:
"These findings support previous hypotheses that the ancestors of the Iapygians may have originated in the eastern Balkan region, or derive shared ancestry with a common source population from eastern Europe."


https://indo-european.eu/2018/05/pre-roman-and-roman-mitogenomes-from-southern-italy/

Salento
03-01-21, 00:35
Apuli come from ancient Liburnians ( or ist cousins of Liburnians ) circa 1000Bc

There are many italian papers/documents on this ................see my previous posts on this thread

your video on Post #75 mentions the Picenians into Abruzzo, ...towns like Pescara, but also Borgorose in Lazio (Temple of Mars of the Sabini) and others

some of those towns are also part of my Chieti (Abruzzo) genetic group (Borgorose Lazio included):

https://i.imgur.com/w5Kq2vj.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/KXHkmsU.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/sM2V7B2.jpg

torzio
03-01-21, 01:04
There is a genetic study on Iron Age Botromagno in Apulia, a city founded by Iapygians that support the origin of Iapygians from eastern Balkan:
"These findings support previous hypotheses that the ancestors of the Iapygians may have originated in the eastern Balkan region, or derive shared ancestry with a common source population from eastern Europe."
https://indo-european.eu/2018/05/pre-roman-and-roman-mitogenomes-from-southern-italy/


Seen this article....but the map is 100% wrong .............the apuli/Iapygians came from northern Adriatic area , next to Liburnia ( croatia ) .

in Apulia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulia) by the three Iapygian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iapyges) tribes of the region: the Messapians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapii), the Peucetians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peucetians) and the Daunians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daunians).

The messapic language has to be a Liburnian or North Dalmatian one mixing with the locals they conquered circa 1000BC

torzio
03-01-21, 01:07
I know this.
Apulians were Illyrian.My city was founded by the Iapygians.


What city, is your city ?

christa
03-01-21, 01:24
What city, is your city ?
Gravina in Puglia, the ancient Iapygians city of Silvium, founded by Peucetii. Botromagno (the city if the genetic study) is in our territory.

Northener
03-01-21, 10:56
Mine:
https://i.ibb.co/6gtPJYz/4-F4-BAA41-66-AF-4-D01-807-E-F08-AD3-F3-E7-CE.jpg

@Matty didn't you have a link with East-Frisia?
These are my results, we share my number one....

12511

PS I saw in my father's result a group that is most probably more accurate!

Description:

Germans in Germany (Lower Saxony) and some in the Netherlands (Groningen), and some of their descendants in the United States (Iowa, Illinois and some in Minnesota and Nebraska)

Carlos
03-01-21, 12:36
What a head! I had forgotten to publish the common last names of my group in Flevoland (Netherlands)



https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3tZifZ1xrKM/X_GcmrnbKKI/AAAAAAAAFkE/E5hIccyE01cOxwd3a6xyJLnz64Cur4CsgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1361/ApellidosHolanda.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg

Northener
03-01-21, 13:42
What a head! I had forgotten to publish the common last names of my group in Flevoland (Netherlands)


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3tZifZ1xrKM/X_GcmrnbKKI/AAAAAAAAFkE/E5hIccyE01cOxwd3a6xyJLnz64Cur4CsgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1361/ApellidosHolanda.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg

Well Carlos that's one of a kind!

Flevoland is fully land made out of sea, inhabited since about 1942.....
It was a kind of 'social experiment' because people were selected to go there, you had to apply. And there was a commission that selected so much protestant, catholics etc.

The result is indeed middle ground Netherlands as you can see on the map!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flevoland

I don't really know what you relationship could be with flevoland, fully enigmatic! How did you get the "flevoland segments"?

The E-V22 YF172235, is from a family from de Lutte, Ducth/German border, I correspond with him ;) (it's a small world Carlos!).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Lutte

So far I can see it as an abbreviation of some kind....Interesting tough!

Carlos
03-01-21, 14:28
Well Carlos that's one of a kind!

Flevoland is fully land made out of sea, inhabited since about 1942.....
It was a kind of 'social experiment' because people were selected to go there, you had to apply. And there was a commission that selected so much protestant, catholics etc.

The result is indeed middle ground Netherlands as you can see on the map!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flevoland

I don't really know what you relationship could be with flevoland, fully enigmatic! How did you get the "flevoland segments"?

The E-V22 YF172235, is from a family from de Lutte, Ducth/German border, I correspond with him ;) (it's a small world Carlos!).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Lutte

So far I can see it as an abbreviation of some kind....Interesting tough!


Amazon......

Regio X
03-01-21, 15:24
Mine (...)I just realized that the default for my uncle is a medium confidence; probably because he doesn't get any group when I set high confidence.

With medium confidence, currently I get more three groups with FTDNA Raw Data: Italy (Treviso) below the Italian %, and then, as additional genetic groups, "Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey" and Brazil (São Paulo). No more groups with 23andMe Raw Data.
Father, also three more: Italy (Veneto and Lombardy) below the Italian %, then as additional "Germany, Poland, Czechia, Austria and Hungary" and Southern Austria (Steiermark, Carinthia and Styria).
Mother gets none in addition.

Duarte
03-01-21, 17:06
None of the surnames listed by MH is among my current or ancient surnames.....(I have a compound name).....plus these family surnames (I take two of them): Pessoa de Faria Gonçalves Dias Duarte Souza Guerra Viegas

https://i.imgur.com/bOqpRS1.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/j811KRB.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/1IiqalY.jpg

Salento
03-01-21, 18:06
I didn't build a family tree, ... but they nailed it :)

... got Rizzo close relatives, ... see the variation of the same Surname in different areas assigned to me,

obviously these people originated from the same Ancient Clan:

https://i.imgur.com/x1cZxuE.jpg

Salento
03-01-21, 19:02
the Greece genetic group is more French and French Riviera than Greek,

... I don’t know, but I think it could be ancient shared ancestry with the Ancient Greeks (Mycenaeans?) that colonized those areas, and myheritage mistakenly thinks it is recent.

https://i.imgur.com/aauJSMM.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9g4k59X.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/aelbIxy.jpg

... most Ancient Greeks in Puglia were eliminated by the Messapi according to Herodotus,
which is why Puglia doesn’t show up much, ... I think.

Salento
03-01-21, 20:00
imho the post above could indicates a more Medieval origin of the Grikos of Grecìa-Salentina than a Magna-Grecia one.

... it seems that the Grikos must have a different Greece genetic group than mine.
... in the Greek group I get, there aren’t any Greek in Salento.

Duarte
03-01-21, 20:20
Hi dear friend Salento.
I think that the standard display for Greece Group ID: 5081 is Greece #2, 1900 - 1950. See:

https://i.imgur.com/yywYizL.jpg

Salento
03-01-21, 20:52
Hi dear friend Salento.
I think that the standard display for Greece Group ID: 5081 is Greece #2, 1900 - 1950. See:

https://i.imgur.com/yywYizL.jpg

Notice the lack of that particular Greek genetic group in Puglia, besides Taranto, ... that according to Herodotus, Taranto was the only place near Salento that eventually the Ancient Greeks were able to retake after the elimination of the Spartan Colonies by the Messapi.

... ma subirono una sconfitta così terribile, che si ebbe allora il più grave massacro di Greci di tutti quelli che noi conosciamo; ... “Herodotus”
https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapi


https://i.imgur.com/b0ePIKl.jpg

... the rest is just older shared ancestry, imo

... a lot of people know the story of the 300 Spartans, almost nobody knows what was happening to the Spartans in Puglia and Calabria around that same timeline.

christa
03-01-21, 21:03
I think so too.
Many kits used for genetic groups are of Americans. In this case they have greeks and others origins (France, Italy and other nations).
The map of 1650-1700 indicated the areas of people on the genealogies. For Greece #2, 3051 kits are used to form this group, but only 1043 have family trees. These trees are used for the maps of different periods.
Maybe someone know better their franch ancestors in genealogies and they know only few generations of greeks ancestors.For this reason the map of 1650-1700 is more colorful in France.

Duarte
03-01-21, 21:08
Notice the lack of that particular Greek genetic group in Puglia, besides Taranto, ... that according to Herodotus, Taranto was the only place near Salento that eventually the Ancient Greeks were able to retake after the elimination of the Spartan Colonies by the Messapi.

... ma subirono una sconfitta così terribile, che si ebbe allora il più grave massacro di Greci di tutti quelli che noi conosciamo; ... “Herodotus”


https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapi

https://i.imgur.com/b0ePIKl.jpg

... the rest is just older shared ancestry, imo

... a lot of people know the story of the 300 Spartans, almost nobody knows what was happening to the Spartans in Puglia and Calabria around that same timeline.

Molto interessante: l'origine dei Messapi, in italiano.

https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapi :good_job:

Salento
03-01-21, 21:14
Molto interessante: l'origine dei Messapi, in italiano.

https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapi :good_job:

... that’s probably one of the extra reasons that drove Alexander to go East instead of West :)

Duarte
03-01-21, 21:31
... that’s probably one of the extra reasons that drove Alexander to go East instead of West :)

lol. It is the same reason why the Incas, after some incurations in the eastern region of South America, preferred to be quiet in the altitude of the Andes.

torzio
03-01-21, 23:05
Notice the lack of that particular Greek genetic group in Puglia, besides Taranto, ... that according to Herodotus, Taranto was the only place near Salento that eventually the Ancient Greeks were able to retake after the elimination of the Spartan Colonies by the Messapi.

... ma subirono una sconfitta così terribile, che si ebbe allora il più grave massacro di Greci di tutti quelli che noi conosciamo; ... “Herodotus”
https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messapi


https://i.imgur.com/b0ePIKl.jpg

... the rest is just older shared ancestry, imo

... a lot of people know the story of the 300 Spartans, almost nobody knows what was happening to the Spartans in Puglia and Calabria around that same timeline.


from an old strabo map ............migration to Italy circa 1000BC for picene and Apuli

https://i.postimg.cc/CLXbfcHQ/liburni-apuli-map.png


Note Iapodes sit next to Liburni on map
(https://postimg.cc/BX5jrczT)

Salento
03-01-21, 23:32
good one Duarte :laughing:

thanks Christa and Torzio.

... I can’t vote for now :)

Salento
03-01-21, 23:55
my Lecce genetic group is full Leccese, ... not from mixed Americans or ... ,

... the Grikos and Grecìa-Salentina are part of the Province of Lecce,

... there's no sign of Greece in any of the maps and places.

I guess my Lecce genetic group is not related to the Grikos and the modern Greeks.

... 1600 to 2000 and between:

https://i.imgur.com/R5Uz6zQ.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jvoGcKy.jpg


https://i.imgur.com/7KBALZu.jpg

Carlos
04-01-21, 01:47
Common names of my results with Flevoland (Netherlands)

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XchgtoN0zR0/X_JVGcGWG_I/AAAAAAAAFks/6y3jp_miWlI-sKT9QeT3-vqE5Jh9QP3ugCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/FlevolandPresbiteriano.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg

This is science, I'm the one who got Flevoland and there's my full Y status.


And since I was a child I've felt Presbyterian or something like that, that's something you know.


So, the Phoenician of Andalusia is out of the question, because if there were Phoenicians here until 2021, my last name has only 16 people in the place, it doesn't seem to fit. And headbutting against a wall is not going to happen, I'm sorry it doesn't suit me.


And then the oral tradition of my family about the deserter from Napoleon's troops is another fact. So, at least I have taken a big step forward if I look at it from the perspective of the time I started until today.



That's right and that's how I tell it

Salento
04-01-21, 02:42
... Salentini in general don’t label each other differently, we integrated our customs and cultures,

... very few Griko speakers remain,

... though many of the Griko towns still proudly display their ancient connections and background, ... bet you that by now their genetics are not that close to their ancestors.

Same people, ... from Salento, but:

Leccese:

https://youtu.be/QpVCzLQ56yM

Griko:

https://youtu.be/UssmrM_uSxY

christa
04-01-21, 02:54
Common names of my results with Flevoland (Netherlands)
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XchgtoN0zR0/X_JVGcGWG_I/AAAAAAAAFks/6y3jp_miWlI-sKT9QeT3-vqE5Jh9QP3ugCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/FlevolandPresbiteriano.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3GXRobGh0fE/X-o8qUIcjzI/AAAAAAAAFUw/d9RZdc8xq2MOa6XMSBBZYZDJB-CZMROsACLcBGAsYHQ/s808/BY7452.jpg
This is science, I'm the one who got Flevoland and there's my full Y status.
And since I was a child I've felt Presbyterian or something like that, that's something you know.
So, the Phoenician of Andalusia is out of the question, because if there were Phoenicians here until 2021, my last name has only 16 people in the place, it doesn't seem to fit. And headbutting against a wall is not going to happen, I'm sorry it doesn't suit me.
And then the oral tradition of my family about the deserter from Napoleon's troops is another fact. So, at least I have taken a big step forward if I look at it from the perspective of the time I started until today.
That's right and that's how I tell it
If your ancestor moved to Spain in the early 1800s with Napoleon's troops, you can easily find out the exact origin of your family. They are a few generations. You can consult the birth registers in your municipality or the registers of your parish to build your family tree. Find out everything in 1 or 2 days of research.
through the registers you can get to 1500.

torzio
04-01-21, 04:44
from an old strabo map ............migration to Italy circa 1000BC for picene and Apuli

https://i.postimg.cc/CLXbfcHQ/liburni-apuli-map.png


Note Iapodes sit next to Liburni on map
(https://postimg.cc/BX5jrczT)

Better map on this site
https://gohvarblog.com/2016/06/12/the-walls-of-asseria-ancient-liburnian-settlement-and-roman-town/

Salento
04-01-21, 06:40
I am very easy to find using Google.

I wish for more Salentini to share their results, from Grecìa-Salentina too.

I keep posting my results, but I’m not able to compare them with others from Salento.

Perhaps it is not necessary for them to Post their results because they can compare them directly with mine.

I should stop posting my results for a while, ...

... e se non parli Inglese, usa Google Translate, ... il messaggio è più importante della grammatica, ... sbaglio spesso pure io :)

Carlos
04-01-21, 17:16
If your ancestor moved to Spain in the early 1800s with Napoleon's troops, you can easily find out the exact origin of your family. They are a few generations. You can consult the birth registers in your municipality or the registers of your parish to build your family tree. Find out everything in 1 or 2 days of research.
through the registers you can get to 1500.


My ancestor was from Montejaque (Málaga) and in the preambles of the Spanish Civil War the communists set fire to churches and Town Halls so that the baptismal, matrimonial e.t.c. and civil registry archives of the Town Halls were burned and for more inri the archives of Montejaque were the most damaged in all Andalusia.

Then my ancestor moved to the neighboring province of Cadiz. Currently there is no one in Montejaque with my last name.


I have the oral tradition and the fact that in Montejaque it is known that there were desertions from Napoleon's army.

Dozens of Romantics had traveled to Andalusia before the Napoleonic invasion and had invented many stories about our origins and identity just by seeing the Alambr but they did not know that those neighbors, farmers, merchants and people of the village centuries earlier had been colonists of the territories conquered from the Muslims and in addition to trying to lead a normal life and raise their families with the enemy a few miles away had the duty to defend the conquered territory so Napoleon was unaware that he was going to face a civil society with much military experience behind him.


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ABm_r3QfXrg/X_MqB0fEJkI/AAAAAAAAFk8/1aQxlA5pxjEwTZjNGizOrrq9ymRoe9mgQCLcBGAsYHQ/s569/desertores5.jpeg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-q_LwY8T8fCM/X_MqBtSYnxI/AAAAAAAAFk4/kqrf0Fu2vwIlgeANpvBgNLKkW0M_Drt0gCLcBGAsYHQ/s601/desertores%2Bfranceses1.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XnsQtdMp3Qw/X_MqBaj86hI/AAAAAAAAFk0/6lC3xFIM_ychmJwKcMBrNSZTnH2Id0uGwCLcBGAsYHQ/s600/desertores%2Bfranceses3.jpeg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YVp1sVxZ1gA/X_MqC8eRaOI/AAAAAAAAFlE/MkN3gAQmG74lTOHlTYymbznn3nvRTrLgACLcBGAsYHQ/s604/desertoresapuertosingleses.jpeg
https://books.google.es/books?id=TjxOH9wDkFwC&pg=PA930&lpg=PA930&dq=Montejaque+franceses+desertores&source=bl&ots=S4BL8M1iE5&sig=ACfU3U3lyytlTDU-dS5iDYoKGPNvbU57jQ&hl=es&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj_y-iorILuAhUUoVwKHQ4jDNEQ6AEwAnoECAEQAg#v=onepage&q=desertor%20frances%20montejaque&f=false

These writings speak of French deserters in the latter 6000 French deserters are taken to the ports of England.

I think this is a good development for my research. Flevoland is one more point of intersection, evidently this intermediate history is the most complicated I can almost imagine better the oldest part, but good that history I will tell it later.

christa
04-01-21, 18:10
My ancestor was from Montejaque (Málaga) and in the preambles of the Spanish Civil War the communists set fire to churches and Town Halls so that the baptismal, matrimonial e.t.c. and civil registry archives of the Town Halls were burned and for more inri the archives of Montejaque were the most damaged in all Andalusia.
Then my ancestor moved to the neighboring province of Cadiz. Currently there is no one in Montejaque with my last name.
I have the oral tradition and the fact that in Montejaque it is known that there were desertions from Napoleon's army.
Good.
Then you can find in the municipality of Cadiz, where He lived, the death certificate of your ancestor, He will have died in the mid 1800s. In the
death certificate could be noted where he was born , so you can find out the nationality and perhaps the city of origin and the name of his parents.

Carlos
04-01-21, 18:32
Good.
Then you can find in the municipality of Cadiz, where He lived, the death certificate of your ancestor, He will have died in the mid 1800s. In the
death certificate could be noted where he was born , so you can find out the nationality and perhaps the city of origin and the name of his parents.

There, too, the church and its archives and the Town Hall were burned.


Anyway I will do some research and I am already in contact with a professional now with all the Covid is all stopped.

bigsnake49
04-01-21, 19:54
As far as the Greek Group is concerned, I guess there was a lot of emigration to Europe during the Ottoman occupation. As far as my own results are concerned there was only detailed time related info for the Greek group (59%) and not the others (Balkan 33%, Scandinavian 5.1% and Askenazi Jews 2.9%). I have a question though. All this time stamped info, is it from genealogical trees or DNA?

christa
04-01-21, 20:58
As far as the Greek Group is concerned, I guess there was a lot of emigration to Europe during the Ottoman occupation. As far as my own results are concerned there was only detailed time related info for the Greek group (59%) and not the others (Balkan 33%, Scandinavian 5.1% and Askenazi Jews 2.9%). I have a question though. All this time stamped info, is it from genealogical trees or DNA?

Family trees of kits used to form a genetic group.

Carlos
04-01-21, 22:01
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-dZlVIULy2sg/X_DXtHW9qfI/AAAAAAAAFbE/pO7s4sDSi20fOV5simxqXFFJfc9jpFtSACLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a1600.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-a0UAEqZePAs/X_DX6NOapQI/AAAAAAAAFbI/XBP4s7RUfHoT-Enm1ssrbZaXGZ4NUI9fgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a1700.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-esJz1aCNqi0/X_DYAnJ19ZI/AAAAAAAAFbQ/fhF3dYYuBBYr2LZEAFNPWcmU8rk-U4v0ACLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a1800.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/--vq8LmF-sW0/X_DYKizLobI/AAAAAAAAFbU/25Tg920DJAkTdbcogLszrUdeAwmohQNcQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1362/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a1850.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-jtPN43fDE2A/X_DYVvgLDUI/AAAAAAAAFbY/ovOJ6a9scDwumD6GikCIdBXDd8Dme9z9QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1362/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a1950.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-peKD79PfeYs/X_DYjbjTV_I/AAAAAAAAFbc/ME3Fm6YIKaAffaNmN3uTINzPK_fYsxkvwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/SURdeEspa%25C3%25B1a2000.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HQFv25GRrvY/X_NxXTK3RxI/AAAAAAAAFlg/Zb1x1EM_c88zi9lWUYzILmcevY2Io0tuACLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/SurdeEspa%25C3%25B1a%252CFranciaArgelia1A.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-EsnGwDoDUuc/X_Nxz_J4EZI/AAAAAAAAFlo/Zh1wEMZ89uU74-z2x72MrO2_UVnSmCoLgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1364/surdeespa%25C3%25B1a1950apellidos.jpg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-qNVL44ppU2U/X_Ny8dpNDxI/AAAAAAAAFlw/tDTB23rX8N0jxwXBUsBGQ4nbaA2P6jIFACLcBGAsYHQ/s783/TatarabueloFern%25C3%25A1ndez.jpeg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rIJm7eHibAI/X_NzLTZBf4I/AAAAAAAAFl0/Z1a82IRghNAO3iZuwNTeVOMlXym9Hy2gwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1280/Imagen0059-Colorized.jpg

By surname it leads me to them. They are my great-great-grandfather (father of my maternal great-grandmother dna mt) and his son.

What a luxury by God, genetic studies with photographic archive, this is not seen every day.

Salento
05-01-21, 04:55
Family trees of kits used to form a genetic group.

if I stretched it, I might understand how Greece got in the picture, ...

but you, me and J get Romania too, and if we get it, bet you that many other paesani nostri get it too.

What’s the recent connection ???

... I think they’re also using some of our ancient shared ancestries to match us with these populations through their Family Trees.

Many Romans moved to Romania, though could be Bronze Age or earlier.

christa
05-01-21, 20:31
if I stretched it, I might understand how Greece got in the picture, ...

but you, me and J get Romania too, and if we get it, bet you that many other paesani nostri get it too.

What’s the recent connection ???

... I think they’re also using some of our ancient shared ancestries to match us with these populations through their Family Trees.

Many Romans moved to Romania, though could be Bronze Age or earlier.


I don't know connection with Romania. I know the connection with the merchants of Dalmatia in Apulia during the centuries in Middle Ages. I have read of Slavic presence in Apulia in 1500s, but I think more of Adriatic coast of the Balkan.

bigsnake49
05-01-21, 23:30
I don't know connection with Romania. I know the connection with the merchants of Dalmatia in Apulia during the centuries in Middle Ages. I have read of Slavic presence in Apulia in 1500s, but I think more of Adriatic coast of the Balkan.

When we went to Italy in 2019, we stayed at a B&B that was a a working olive estate outside of Rossano in Calabria (doing a bit of agroturismo). The family that owned it, their surname was Greco. With that surname you would expect they were Greek but actually they were Serbian and had owned the estate since the 1200s. I would think that in the Middle Ages there might have been some population movement to Italy from the Balkans.

Stuvanè
06-01-21, 00:11
When we went to Italy in 2019, we stayed at a B&B that was a a working olive estate outside of Rossano in Calabria (doing a bit of agroturismo). The family that owned it, their surname was Greco. With that surname you would expect they were Greek but actually they were Serbian and had owned the estate since the 1200s. I would think that in the Middle Ages there might have been some population movement to Italy from the Balkans.


"Greco" is a surname that more broadly indicates a Balkan origin, beyond the fact that the groups arrived were actually ethnic Greeks, Albanians or Southern Slavs...

https://ganino.com/cognomi_italiani_g


The major cause was the Ottoman advance, but even earlier there were movements and arrivals of those people along the Adriatic coast, mostly employed then as workers, artisans, shepherds and farmers. For some of them we know almost names and surnames (I'm sorry: the contribution is a scan of an old paper in Italian)

http://rsa.storiaagricoltura.it/pdfsito/59_3.pdf

christa
06-01-21, 00:25
In my town in 1500s there was a street called Via dei Greci (Street of Greek) for the albanians and slaves who lived there.

christa
06-01-21, 00:33
The major cause was the Ottoman advance, but even earlier there were movements and arrivals of those people along the Adriatic coast, mostly employed then as workers, artisans, shepherds and farmers. For some of them we know almost names and surnames (I'm sorry: the contribution is a scan of an old paper in Italian)

http://rsa.storiaagricoltura.it/pdfsito/59_3.pdf
Someone of these Balkan families were also noble or knights who fled for the Ottoman invasion of the Balkan.

Salento
06-01-21, 00:34
that surname originated in Florence, was a nickname for Clever and knowledgeable.
It is one of the most common surnames in Italy.

christa
06-01-21, 00:46
Greco surname could have different origin. It could indicate in same cases the origin from the Balkan, or a nickname or other reasons. Only with a family tree it's possibile to discover the origin of the name.

Salento
06-01-21, 00:50
Edit ..... ....

christa
06-01-21, 00:54
Exact. It can be due to several reasons.

torzio
06-01-21, 01:05
that surname originated in Florence, was a nickname for Clever and knowledgeable.
It is one of the most common surnames in Italy.

deleted as irrelevant

torzio
06-01-21, 01:09
deleted as irrelevant

torzio
06-01-21, 01:12
When we went to Italy in 2019, we stayed at a B&B that was a a working olive estate outside of Rossano in Calabria (doing a bit of agroturismo). The family that owned it, their surname was Greco. With that surname you would expect they were Greek but actually they were Serbian and had owned the estate since the 1200s. I would think that in the Middle Ages there might have been some population movement to Italy from the Balkans.

deleted as irrelevant

torzio
06-01-21, 01:23
"Greco" is a surname that more broadly indicates a Balkan origin, beyond the fact that the groups arrived were actually ethnic Greeks, Albanians or Southern Slavs...

https://ganino.com/cognomi_italiani_g


The major cause was the Ottoman advance, but even earlier there were movements and arrivals of those people along the Adriatic coast, mostly employed then as workers, artisans, shepherds and farmers. For some of them we know almost names and surnames (I'm sorry: the contribution is a scan of an old paper in Italian)

http://rsa.storiaagricoltura.it/pdfsito/59_3.pdf

The article seems to be about

La riva degli Schiavoni

La riva prende il suo nome dai mercanti provenienti dalla Dalmazia

Place where Dalmatian merchants resided ............it is to the left of the Doge palace over the first bridge

Riva = Foreshore
Schiavoni does not initially mean slavs, but the term was initially applied to Dalmatians.......and not Croats , as Croats where termed differently

The Doge personnel guards where always 100% from Dalmatia, most taken from excess sons of the merchants at Riva Degli Schiavoni
(https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalmazia)

Salento
06-01-21, 01:36
Though there are so many families, people hire professionals to figure it out. They pay a lot of money.

torzio
06-01-21, 01:51
Though there are so many families, people hire professionals to figure it out. They pay a lot of money.


deleted as irrelevant

christa
06-01-21, 02:00
Though there are so many families, people hire professionals to figure it out. They pay a lot of money.
Could you done your family tree yourself without professionals. I have help friends in the pass.

Stuvanè
06-01-21, 02:07
The article seems to be about

La riva degli Schiavoni

La riva prende il suo nome dai mercanti provenienti dalla Dalmazia

Place where Dalmatian merchants resided ............it is to the left of the Doge palace over the first bridge

Riva = Foreshore
Schiavoni does not initially mean slavs, but the term was initially applied to Dalmatians.......and not Croats , as Croats where termed differently

The Doge personnel guards where always 100% from Dalmatia, most taken from excess sons of the merchants at Riva Degli Schiavoni
(https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalmazia)

The article comes from this magazine

http://rsa.storiaagricoltura.it/scheda.asp?IDF=59&IDS=3

It specifically concerns the migrations of groups of Albanians and Slavs in the Marche at the end of the Middle Ages and in the early modern age, based on archival evidence.
As for the "Schiavoni" mentioned here, the author refers not only to Dalmatians and the inhabitants of the coast, but also to people from the interior: in Senigallia, at the beginning of the 15th century, individuals originating from Zagreb and Bosnians are reported (see page 9 of the article)

In any case, even if it is starting to be a fairly dated publication, this is one of the texts that has best debated the issue (unfortunately I don't think it is more commercially available, if not used, but it should be available in a good university library)

https://books.google.it/books/about/Italia_felix.html?id=CX0nAQAAMAAJ&redir_esc=y

Salento
06-01-21, 02:17
Could you done your family tree yourself without professionals. I have had friends in the pass.

it depends on how many Bastard sons there are in a family.

surnames could be relatives, ... or not.

Salento
06-01-21, 02:29
Bari genetic group common surnames:

https://i.imgur.com/lqFq91X.jpg

Salento
06-01-21, 03:02
Russo means Russian, Lorusso - the Russian, Franco - french related or a Franco (Frank barbarian)

christa
06-01-21, 03:19
I also thought so in the past , but then, in all ancient register that I have consulted Russo and Lorusso were the dialect form in South Italy of Rosso (red) , maybe for people of red hair. Indeed Rossi is the main surname for all Italy and in South is Russo and Lorusso ( Lo Russo = Il Rosso= the Red).
The same person was called with the surname Rosso and Russo in different document, in 1500s and 1600s.
Many surnames change with the dialect of different regions.

Maybe someone could be or Russian origin, but most Russo are simply the variant of Rosso/i.

Salento
06-01-21, 03:33
then we’ll agree that people with surnames that evoke a place do not necessarily originate from that place.

torzio
06-01-21, 05:30
The article comes from this magazine

http://rsa.storiaagricoltura.it/scheda.asp?IDF=59&IDS=3

It specifically concerns the migrations of groups of Albanians and Slavs in the Marche at the end of the Middle Ages and in the early modern age, based on archival evidence.
As for the "Schiavoni" mentioned here, the author refers not only to Dalmatians and the inhabitants of the coast, but also to people from the interior: in Senigallia, at the beginning of the 15th century, individuals originating from Zagreb and Bosnians are reported (see page 9 of the article)

In any case, even if it is starting to be a fairly dated publication, this is one of the texts that has best debated the issue (unfortunately I don't think it is more commercially available, if not used, but it should be available in a good university library)

https://books.google.it/books/about/Italia_felix.html?id=CX0nAQAAMAAJ&redir_esc=y


Far enough .............Schiavoni in the early days meant the non-slavic Dalmatians that spoke the Vegliot Dalmatian dialect became extinct in the 19th century. A mix of Roman Latin and old Venetian .


Croatians where always called Croati and never anything else..........every croatian men when hired as horsemen for venetian land forces where noted as croati

Bosnians had another term or Venice never mentioned them or stated them as a mix of Avars and Slavs

IMO.........old Dalmatians was the main branch of many "Illyrian" tribes, who later mixed with italic people coming from italy under the Roman empire , to create a mixed language ........then fell under Hungaria and after a 400 years of an on-off war between Venice and Hungary, fell to Venice............, Venice took ownership in 1430ish to 1797 .......its this period the Vegliot took hold

Stuvanè
06-01-21, 13:06
Far enough .............Schiavoni in the early days meant the non-slavic Dalmatians that spoke the Vegliot Dalmatian dialect became extinct in the 19th century. A mix of Roman Latin and old Venetian .


Croatians where always called Croati and never anything else..........every croatian men when hired as horsemen for venetian land forces where noted as croati

Bosnians had another term or Venice never mentioned them or stated them as a mix of Avars and Slavs

IMO.........old Dalmatians was the main branch of many "Illyrian" tribes, who later mixed with italic people coming from italy under the Roman empire , to create a mixed language ........then fell under Hungaria and after a 400 years of an on-off war between Venice and Hungary, fell to Venice............, Venice took ownership in 1430ish to 1797 .......its this period the Vegliot took hold


@Torzio,


I find it hard to understand the turn this speech is taking: does anyone have the exclusive monopoly on the use of the term "Schiavoni"?


Nobody is disputing what happened in Venice and its surroundings. The Venetians may have also used more precise terminologies since they had more assiduous relations with those peoples and could afford to distinguish them. Good for them.


Elsewhere - I cited a search for documents relating to the Marches - "Schiavoni" was used in a broader sense and could concern both Dalmatians more or less Latinized as well as the Slavs of the Balkan hinterland. In the examples cited we speak of individuals coming from Zara ("Giara" / "Jadra" or "Segna" = Senj) as from Zagreb. Evidently in the Marche they did not need to split the hair with the immigrant registry, but only to have work arms. See this PhD thesis, pp. 129-130 http://amsdottorato.unibo.it/7989/1/spallacci_giulia_tesi.pdf


I didn't make up this thing. It's a terminology found in archival documents studied by researchers. If anyone wants to contest it, you have to contact the researchers and make the necessary objections, always with documents in hand

Duarte
06-01-21, 16:49
Γρηγόριος (Gregorios) -> Gregorius -> Gregory -> Gregor -> Mac Griogair -> MacGregor -> McGregor :thinking:

torzio
06-01-21, 17:19
@Torzio,


I find it hard to understand the turn this speech is taking: does anyone have the exclusive monopoly on the use of the term "Schiavoni"?


Nobody is disputing what happened in Venice and its surroundings. The Venetians may have also used more precise terminologies since they had more assiduous relations with those peoples and could afford to distinguish them. Good for them.


Elsewhere - I cited a search for documents relating to the Marches - "Schiavoni" was used in a broader sense and could concern both Dalmatians more or less Latinized as well as the Slavs of the Balkan hinterland. In the examples cited we speak of individuals coming from Zara ("Giara" / "Jadra" or "Segna" = Senj) as from Zagreb. Evidently in the Marche they did not need to split the hair with the immigrant registry, but only to have work arms. See this PhD thesis, pp. 129-130 http://amsdottorato.unibo.it/7989/1/spallacci_giulia_tesi.pdf


I didn't make up this thing. It's a terminology found in archival documents studied by researchers. If anyone wants to contest it, you have to contact the researchers and make the necessary objections, always with documents in hand

The terminology grew over time by Italian scholars outside of NorthEast Italy ( usually done by the papal states scholars ) to try to link the italian word for slav and the term Schiavoni
as being the same. They tried to say that Dalmatians where also Slavs ( even though Dalmatians where there hundreds of years before the slavs arrived in the 6th/7th centuries )...........Initially the first slavs that arrived on the coast was along modern montenegro the duchies of Zeta and Hum being 2 that I recall ( they where a mix of mainly croats and serbs with some very small % of bosnians )


It all depends on the period in question...............different people arrived at certain places in time from different areas of the world.........If we want to talk about the marche ( picene lands ) from late bronze age, then all italian studies will tell you that the area was colonised by the Liburnians .............If you want a different period in time, then it could be another group of people.

In regards to Zara , a main Venetian port , which was the only port any slav could come to Venice, while Dalmatians could come to venice from other ports............there is a very clear distinction of Dalmatians and slavs in Venetian texts ( I checked some venetian archives in 2006 )...........If you have read something else from another period of time , then I am willing to check it out

I don't recall any Marche ports under Venice for any period...........Rimini and Ravenna yes, some apulian ports in 1480 ish yes ............Marche iirc was papal lands

I will read your very interesting attachment ...........but it seems purely a paper of trading in the adriatic from a quick view..........

Carlos
06-01-21, 19:16
I was observing the evolution of these results and at one point I said to myself, this map looks familiar, I've seen it before, but I couldn't remember where, how or when, since history is sometimes as boring to me as religion. Then I realized the similarities with the map of the Spanish Empire; even the Philippines and Japan, the four Sicilies, we go all the way; although I also observe in detail that it is marked in Australia and the results with Brazil and Pakistan Afghanistan, it seems as if there is also a bit of the Portuguese and British Empire.


Soft version having chained, gagged and ego-bound







https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-47feZQsfDEo/X_XojNyPi6I/AAAAAAAAFn0/cP4uWA-t4hUq-80RYC-ovLi_uLFRF9kXwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol1.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-K4aGZyt7a_M/X_XojkVd4cI/AAAAAAAAFn4/64FZGULsvQo1rTraUQij0fRpsyGWlY-kgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol2.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ZPSpqUgYLUg/X_XolnZux2I/AAAAAAAAFoA/1KSs1nqP82gToCmDXGUROgow-fpYu7BKgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol3.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Fr7SdUiKri8/X_XonFvl6cI/AAAAAAAAFoE/ghEMaD0c3FoP6qSEnDIRKY27KOc2Wvb_wCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol4.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3YI-3NFE8gY/X_XonSOwAzI/AAAAAAAAFoI/cN2hKOCBwdc7OxfseIRFHKLWWcl02W35QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol5.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iCEzhB5FuVY/X_XooEWL72I/AAAAAAAAFoM/8CcS9Bty5-wQ_3VHfjss0xkla_HeCzQoACLcBGAsYHQ/s1360/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol6.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-QBoLUv6rKlE/X_XopgSFsJI/AAAAAAAAFoQ/ejChqvJCVMM4ZLJ3CntG41x2TW2fIlPqgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol7.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xgw3llrMotM/X_XojqgPCBI/AAAAAAAAFn8/65BkCnvIqgg3uBn-B0mC4DAWZR2onZhXACLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/ImperioEsa%25C3%25B1ol8.jpeg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HH6DCltcAu4/X_Xq0DUWIEI/AAAAAAAAFos/AghZUNG7g7UU0BtnvBISGHmxsrtyhZb8gCLcBGAsYHQ/s500/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1olMapa.jpeg

Duarte
06-01-21, 22:26
I was observing the evolution of these results and at one point I said to myself, this map looks familiar, I've seen it before, but I couldn't remember where, how or when, since history is sometimes as boring to me as religion. Then I realized the similarities with the map of the Spanish Empire; even the Philippines and Japan, the four Sicilies, we go all the way; although I also observe in detail that it is marked in Australia and the results with Brazil and Pakistan Afghanistan, it seems as if there is also a bit of the Portuguese and British Empire.


Soft version having chained, gagged and ego-bound







https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-47feZQsfDEo/X_XojNyPi6I/AAAAAAAAFn0/cP4uWA-t4hUq-80RYC-ovLi_uLFRF9kXwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol1.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-K4aGZyt7a_M/X_XojkVd4cI/AAAAAAAAFn4/64FZGULsvQo1rTraUQij0fRpsyGWlY-kgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1365/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol2.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ZPSpqUgYLUg/X_XolnZux2I/AAAAAAAAFoA/1KSs1nqP82gToCmDXGUROgow-fpYu7BKgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol3.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Fr7SdUiKri8/X_XonFvl6cI/AAAAAAAAFoE/ghEMaD0c3FoP6qSEnDIRKY27KOc2Wvb_wCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol4.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3YI-3NFE8gY/X_XonSOwAzI/AAAAAAAAFoI/cN2hKOCBwdc7OxfseIRFHKLWWcl02W35QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol5.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iCEzhB5FuVY/X_XooEWL72I/AAAAAAAAFoM/8CcS9Bty5-wQ_3VHfjss0xkla_HeCzQoACLcBGAsYHQ/s1360/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol6.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-QBoLUv6rKlE/X_XopgSFsJI/AAAAAAAAFoQ/ejChqvJCVMM4ZLJ3CntG41x2TW2fIlPqgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1363/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1ol7.jpeg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xgw3llrMotM/X_XojqgPCBI/AAAAAAAAFn8/65BkCnvIqgg3uBn-B0mC4DAWZR2onZhXACLcBGAsYHQ/s1366/ImperioEsa%25C3%25B1ol8.jpeg


https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HH6DCltcAu4/X_Xq0DUWIEI/AAAAAAAAFos/AghZUNG7g7UU0BtnvBISGHmxsrtyhZb8gCLcBGAsYHQ/s500/ImperioEspa%25C3%25B1olMapa.jpeg

Although MH qualifies the ethnic group Brazil ID 5294 as Iberian, it is also attributed some North Italian ancestry to this ethnicity. Looking at this ethnicity on the world map, we can identify also some coincidences with the Portuguese Empire, mainly between 1900-1950.

https://i.imgur.com/Qwkz1Jj.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/UYImZHN.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/VxNRmBJ.jpg

Carlos
07-01-21, 02:25
^^
It is curious that I do not name the Spaniards because on my map Brazil 1850-1900 begins to appear, it is possible that the agorithm has not distinguished them lol

What does happen to me is that every time I compare last names the agorithm is still questioned with a question mark over Guatemala, I even have a death in Guatemala.


Is it known if Monteczuma's wife was Mayan or if the Mayans came to the Aztec elite? because I have a Spanish nobility with royal Aztec blood very close to the towns where I am originally from

Duarte
07-01-21, 02:57
^^
It is curious that I do not name the Spaniards because on my map Brazil 1850-1900 begins to appear, it is possible that the agorithm has not distinguished them lol

What does happen to me is that every time I compare last names the agorithm is still questioned with a question mark over Guatemala, I even have a death in Guatemala.


Is it known if Monteczuma's wife was Mayan or if the Mayans came to the Aztec elite? because I have a Spanish nobility with royal Aztec blood very close to the towns where I am originally from

The history of ‘Ducado de Moctezuma de Tultengo’ and the hereditary title of Spanish nobility ‘Duque de Moctezuma de Tultengo’ is very interesting.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duke_of_Moctezuma_de_Tultengo
https://i.imgur.com/NiKxQ5e.jpg

Carlos
07-01-21, 15:30
The lineage of the Mexica Emperor Moctezuma has spread over the centuries and these days it is still possible to find some of his many descendants.

Among Moctezuma's daughters, the most important was Tecuichpo Ixcaxochitzin, who would later be called Isabel de Moctezuma by Hernán Cortés and the Spaniards. Princess Mexica, after being "stolen" by Cortés and taken to Spain, married Spanish men three times and had six children in total. She also had one more daughter whom she did not want to recognize and whose father was none other than Hernán Cortés. Isabella was considered the legitimate descendant of Montezuma and this was a determining factor in the Spanish Crown's awarding the title of Count of Miravalle to her offspring.

It is also worth mentioning, as a curious fact, that after her marriage to the Spaniard Alonso de Grado, the "Visitor of the Indians", Isabel received as a wedding gift the commission from Tacuba, which years later would become the Hacienda de los Morales and behind which there is a peculiar history.


After receiving the Spanish noble title of Miravalle County, the descendants of Isabel de Moctezuma have remained in Spain as part of the nobility. In terms of the recent history of this lineage, María del Carmen Enríquez de Luna y del Mazo remained as Countess of Miravalle until her death in November 2014. The vacancy will be filled by her firstborn daughter, named after her mother, who, after applying for the title that rightfully belongs to her, is waiting to become the 13th Countess of Miravalle.

https://mxcity.mx/2016/05/quienes-donde-estan-los-descendientes-moctezuma/


https://mxcity.mx/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Descendientes-Moctezuma.jpg
Carmen Ruiz Enríquez de Luna; Countess of Miravalle



José Miguel Carrillo de Albornoz y Muñoz de San Pedro, Viscount of Torre Hidalgo, arrives impeccably to the appointment. In the Palace of Toledo-Moctezuma, in Cáceres, they know him. It is now the seat of the Provincial Historical Archive, but for centuries it belonged to his ancestors and he has been visiting it since he was a child.

The family history of this Moctezuma from Cáceres is fascinating. It begins, at some point, with Moctezuma Xocoyotzin, who governed the Mexicas when in 1519 Hernán Cortés' men arrived on the beaches of present-day Veracruz. Powerful, superstitious and much feared, Moctezuma -whose first biography the viscount published- believes himself to be a demigod.

https://e00-elmundo.uecdn.es/assets/multimedia/imagenes/2019/04/01/15541360033829.jpg

Carrillo de Albornoz (Cáceres, 1959) with the family tree that connects him to the Aztec emperor, in his house, the Palacio de Las Seguras

https://www.elmundo.es/cronica/2019/04/03/5c9e6d8621efa043068b457d.html

Duarte
08-01-21, 17:45
@Salento @Carlos
Who are they? :thinking:I prefer not to know.:shocked: What does your oracle say, Carlos? :indifferent:

https://i.imgur.com/Z4DShhU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/34d4TRB.jpg

Salento
08-01-21, 22:19
those are the Ancestral places of origin of the Italian Diasporas in Brasile,

... don’t tell Duarte, ... he doesn’t want to know :)

Duarte
08-01-21, 22:24
those are the Ancestral places of origin of the Italian Diasporas in Brasile,

... don’t tell Duarte, ... he doesn’t want to know :)

:petrified::startled::embarassed::laughing:

Carlos
08-01-21, 22:32
@Salento @Carlos
Who are they? :thinking:I prefer not to know.:shocked: What does your oracle say, Carlos? :indifferent:

https://i.imgur.com/Z4DShhU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/34d4TRB.jpg

The oracle has spoken:

The oracle shows an image just like this one and it was also in Google images.


People whose origin is there where the sun goes down and who carry the sword but not the destruction cause human displacements from south to north and settle down where the emptiness is, arriving later to the beehive from which they will drink the honey as one of them.


https://www.venezuelatuya.com/wallpapers/imagenes/atardecermar3.jpg

Duarte
08-01-21, 23:17
The oracle has spoken:

The oracle shows an image just like this one and it was also in Google images.


People whose origin is there where the sun goes down and who carry the sword but not the destruction cause human displacements from south to north and settle down where the emptiness is, arriving later to the beehive from which they will drink the honey as one of them.


https://www.venezuelatuya.com/wallpapers/imagenes/atardecermar3.jpg

Beautiful :good_job::smile:

Salento
30-01-21, 03:04
... how about that! ... now I’m twice the Leccese, cool :grin:

https://i.imgur.com/WMuENzu.jpg

torzio
30-01-21, 03:11
no change for me in regards to % , except places


Top places, 1600 - 1650

Italy
Treviso
Ferrara
Pordenone
Trentino-South Tyrol

Germany
Darmstadt Region
Karbach

Switzerland
Zernez



funny thing is I was just checking a link to the reddick family ( a dna match , zero distance ) who are from Darmstadt

Salento
30-01-21, 03:46
no change for me in regards to % , except places


Top places, 1600 - 1650

Italy
Treviso
Ferrara
Pordenone
Trentino-South Tyrol

Germany
Darmstadt Region
Karbach

Switzerland
Zernez

funny thing is I was just checking a link to the reddick family ( a dna match , zero distance ) who are from Darmstadt

I get a T-M70 called Redlich ...

if I change the timeline I get France and Germany too (+ others), though it’s obviously exported Salento’s DNA :) I think.

I also get Bari (Puglia), Chieti (Abruzzo) and Lecce (Puglia) as part of my Italian Genetic Groups.

https://i.imgur.com/ArF21vG.jpg

torzio
01-02-21, 01:52
I get a T-M70 called Redlich ...

if I change the timeline I get France and Germany too (+ others), though it’s obviously exported Salento’s DNA :) I think.

I also get Bari (Puglia), Chieti (Abruzzo) and Lecce (Puglia) as part of my Italian Genetic Groups.

https://i.imgur.com/ArF21vG.jpg


what distance is he from you in ftdna?

Salento
01-02-21, 02:29
what distance is he from you in ftdna?

y Chr. distance: 1

torzio
01-02-21, 04:53
y Chr. distance: 1


I am zero

The pole from Pomerania who matches me in yfull is also zero to reddich/redlich

the Pole is also closer in snp to the Brooks line than what I am in yfull

Salento
01-02-21, 09:48
no change for me in regards to % , except places

Top places, 1600 - 1650

Italy
Treviso
Ferrara
Pordenone
Trentino-South Tyrol

Germany
Darmstadt Region
Karbach

Switzerland
Zernez

funny thing is I was just checking a link to the reddick family ( a dna match , zero distance ) who are from Darmstadt

... same as you, I get Trentino-South Tyrol too.
I included the surnames, just in case some sounds familiar to you.

https://i.imgur.com/uQfr0Sy.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/7S3vnow.jpg

Riverman
01-02-21, 11:23
I get a T-M70 called Redlich ...

if I change the timeline I get France and Germany too (+ others), though it’s obviously exported Salento’s DNA :) I think.

Do you know whether he is German or Ashkenazi Jewish? Its a fairly common normal name in Germany, but appears also quite frequently among Jewish people:
https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich

(https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich)

Salento
01-02-21, 16:37
Do you know whether he is German or Ashkenazi Jewish? Its a fairly common normal name in Germany, but appears also quite frequently among Jewish people:
https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich

(https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich)
... distant Y clade from mine,
he has Polish roots, ... no ethnic or religious informations.

torzio
01-02-21, 18:01
Do you know whether he is German or Ashkenazi Jewish? Its a fairly common normal name in Germany, but appears also quite frequently among Jewish people:
https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich

(https://forebears.io/surnames/redlich)


he is


Reddicks are German in origin, having had the surname recorded as Radick upon arrival in Savannah, GA in 1737. Back in the Odenwald region of southwest Germany the name had been Rettich / Rettig and a century earlier the family was named Retgen. Rettich is German for the vegetable radish. My suspicion is that the surname changed with circumstances - either a move to where there were already Rettich / Rettig folks residing or else when my Retgen ancestors perhaps took up radish farming........info from Reddick site owner

new news, associated with the above.............
Johannes Rettich was born in Gadernheim, Reichenbach Parish, in 1701. He married Maria Barbara Wolff circa January, 1724.

other family members live in Erbach-Schonberg Hesse Germany


As far as I know the Pole has never mentioned the Rettig/Reddick line , he only mentions the Brooks and Curtiss line .....................maybe I should ask................I will also recheck the year long chit-chat via messenger and let u know


He states his family circa 16th century is a mix of German, Dutch and Scottish......moving from old "east Frisia " to Poland ............that all I have relevant in old messenger texts

I did ask him about Reddick, Neuman and Poe ..............Neuman ended up being my 3rd cousin once removed, from 1905 line ( thats when it split off ) , Poe is related to Neuman and I will ask him where Reddick fits on his ftdna tree

torzio
01-02-21, 18:08
... distant Y clade from mine,
he has Polish roots, ... no ethnic or religious informations.


I am in constant contact with the Pole in messenger ............he was born in Pomerania Poland and was raised in Lublin Poland...........still lives in Poland , but also in Norway ( being an engineer on tankers must be highly paid )

He claims no polish ancestors except that he was born in Poland

He has far more snp matches than I with the Brooks line ..............which also has the Curtiss line....which leads into the Frush line ....................everyone mentioned here is ydna of T1a2

Is religion an issue, if so, let me know and I will ask him

torzio
01-02-21, 18:22
... same as you, I get Trentino-South Tyrol too.
I included the surnames, just in case some sounds familiar to you.

https://i.imgur.com/uQfr0Sy.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/7S3vnow.jpg


I get for surnames

Common surnames
Rossi

Ferrari

Zanella

Bianchi

Carraro

Moro

Zanon

Barbieri

Fontana

Marin

Trentin


and for
Related groups in 1600-1650 ...................I don't know from 1604 when the family arrived in veneto if if was via Schio in Vicenza side or the Fonzaso ( south Belluno proivince ) side .......as 2 brothers married 2 sisters , but they split

Italy (Vicenza)



Italy (Vicenza and Verona)



Italy (Rivamonte Agordino)



Italy (Treviso)



Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #2



Austria (Tyrol) and Italy (Trentino-South Tyrol)



Italy (Trentino)



Italy (Trentino) and Austria (Tyrol) #2



Italy (Trentino) and Austria



Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #1

Salento
01-02-21, 18:36
Lecce (Salento) Timeline, 1600 - 2000:

... yep :grin:

https://i.imgur.com/SngTjYW.jpg

Salento
01-02-21, 18:45
@Torzio
you get Marin and I get Marino.

you get Moro, ... Aldo Moro was from Maglie (Lecce).
he was the former Italian Prime Minister kidnapped and then killed by the Brigate Rosse.

torzio
01-02-21, 19:01
@Torzio
you get Marin and I get Marino.

you get Moro, ... Aldo Moro was from Maglie (Lecce).
he was the former Italian Prime Minister kidnapped and then killed by the Brigate Rosse.

see T posts as I forgot I had some links with your region ...........it is 2012 conversation with administrator of Ysearch ( ftdna closed this site down , very bad , as it was a wonderful site )

torzio
03-02-21, 00:15
@Torzio
you get Marin and I get Marino.

you get Moro, ... Aldo Moro was from Maglie (Lecce).
he was the former Italian Prime Minister kidnapped and then killed by the Brigate Rosse.


it is a north Italian surname

It comes from the word for Brown hair, Moron .............

https://www.cognomix.it/mappe-dei-cognomi-italiani/MORO

torzio
03-02-21, 00:21
I get for surnames

Common surnames
Rossi

Ferrari

Zanella

Bianchi

Carraro

Moro

Zanon

Barbieri

Fontana

Marin

Trentin






Zanon ................meaning Big John ....as coming from the word Zane meaning Giovanni

Marin ................from the word Mar ( the Sea )

Zanella ............coming from Giovanna ( Joanne )

Pax Augusta
09-02-21, 17:00
Marin ................from the word Mar ( the Sea )

Marino and Marina are common given names in Italy (same roots of the word "Mare").

torzio
09-02-21, 20:07
Marino and Marina are common given names in Italy (same roots of the word "Mare").

Of course , what are you trying to say

a lot of Christian names became surnames in the veneto and I assume other regions

Santolin ..........from santo
Bortolin ..........from bortolo ( meo )
Michielin ..........from Michiel ( michele )
Guidolin ........from Guido

others went down the surname endings with either, ato, otto, igo, acco, er, in, and a few others

Mare and Pare is mother and father in venetian

or the less formal , mama and papa are used for parents

Madre and Padre are used solely for the religious side as in nuns and priests

i ending surnames do not originally exist in the Veneto ...........they are either due to other italian migrating or later in the 18th century being used to replace the term detto ( some say ) ...........so you would have a town with very many of the same surnames , so originally detto used
eg ......Zaia detto stival ...........Stival ( boot maker ).......this Zaia family was the ones known as boot makers ..................or you could have Zen detto Ros , either this Zen family had red hair or married with the Ros family
the i came into effect to represent many or another form to replace detto

Pax Augusta
09-02-21, 20:10
Of course , what are you trying to say

Nothing more, Torzio.

torzio
09-02-21, 20:30
I get for surnames

Common surnames
Rossi

Ferrari

Zanella

Bianchi

Carraro

Moro

Zanon

Barbieri

Fontana

Marin

Trentin


and for
Related groups in 1600-1650 ...................I don't know from 1604 when the family arrived in veneto if if was via Schio in Vicenza side or the Fonzaso ( south Belluno proivince ) side .......as 2 brothers married 2 sisters , but they split

Italy (Vicenza)





Italy (Vicenza and Verona)





Italy (Rivamonte Agordino)





Italy (Treviso)





Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #2





Austria (Tyrol) and Italy (Trentino-South Tyrol)





Italy (Trentino)





Italy (Trentino) and Austria (Tyrol) #2





Italy (Trentino) and Austria





Italy (Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia) #1






I am not sure how accurate the surnames are above .................in the DNA myheritage matches for me and my father, I confirmed via birth, death and marriage records the following surnames , Bolzan, Marcon, Rostirolla, Pavan, Karlin, Bacchion, Benetton, Trevisiol, Steiner, Rocco and Contarin as linked with my paternal line ..................maybe the surname above might be my maternal line

Riverman
09-02-21, 21:47
I am not sure how accurate the surnames are above .................in the DNA myheritage matches for me and my father, I confirmed via birth, death and marriage records the following surnames , Bolzan, Marcon, Rostirolla, Pavan, Karlin, Bacchion, Benetton, Trevisiol, Steiner, Rocco and Contarin as linked with my paternal line ..................maybe the surname above might be my maternal line

In the groups relevant for me the surnames are just representatives of the regional ethnic group, not necessarily my family tree. The names listed are just the most common names of the whole cluster, so if the cluster is a geographical region, of this geographical region. That's all. It might be a hit, by chance, by probability, because if Schmidt and Wagner are frequent, chances you got it, somewhere in your tree. If a name in a village appears over and over again in the church book, and I know my ancestors lived in that village for many hundreds of years more, chances are just extremely high that this surname will appear, sooner or later, in my tree too. For many names that was indeed the case, first I read them in a church book for other entries again and again, and after some generations one of this family appeared, was the husband or wife.
So don't give too much to the few names they list, these are just the common names for your cluster, whether you have them proven in your record or not.

torzio
17-02-21, 04:51
new cities added in myheritage for myself in the past 24 hours

https://i.postimg.cc/P5vNgGFW/1700.png (https://postimages.org/)

Salento
17-02-21, 06:39
I think mine hasn't changed.

... Chieti (Abruzzo) goes from the Dolomites to Etna :)

https://i.imgur.com/KQWTHi4.jpg

Lecce timeline:

https://i.imgur.com/SngTjYW.jpg

Salento
21-02-21, 07:49
... update:

Lecce (Salento) x 5 :satisfied:

... (it makes sense, ... it's my birthplace)

https://i.imgur.com/bsO4D9i.jpg

bigsnake49
08-06-21, 17:53
My genetic groups are Greeks, Romanians, Bulgarians and Eastern Europeans (Ukranians, Belarussians), with confidence levels of High, medium, low and low which is surprising to me since I expected people from Bulgaria to be closer than people from Romania. Now my mtdna u51b is prevalent in Siberia, Romania, Bulgaria (6.4%) and surprisingly in Greece (3.1%) and Italy (3.1%). I just found out that a rare BRCA1 mutation (exon 20 deletion that is shared by my two sisters and my mother is almost exclusively found amongst West Germans closest to the Netherlands and the Dutch themselves. Amazing but what is the connection? U5a1b is 2% of German mtdna. Is the mutation farther back in time or is it in historical time? Ostrogoths? Germanic mercenaries? Germanic palace guards?

Vallicanus
08-06-21, 18:47
Of course , what are you trying to say

a lot of Christian names became surnames in the veneto and I assume other regions

Santolin ..........from santo
Bortolin ..........from bortolo ( meo )
Michielin ..........from Michiel ( michele )
Guidolin ........from Guido

others went down the surname endings with either, ato, otto, igo, acco, er, in, and a few others

Mare and Pare is mother and father in venetian

or the less formal , mama and papa are used for parents

Madre and Padre are used solely for the religious side as in nuns and priests

i ending surnames do not originally exist in the Veneto ...........they are either due to other italian migrating or later in the 18th century being used to replace the term detto ( some say ) ...........so you would have a town with very many of the same surnames , so originally detto used
eg ......Zaia detto stival ...........Stival ( boot maker ).......this Zaia family was the ones known as boot makers ..................or you could have Zen detto Ros , either this Zen family had red hair or married with the Ros family
the i came into effect to represent many or another form to replace detto


Are names ending in -OTTI from the Veneto, eg CHELOTTI?

torzio
08-06-21, 19:46
Are names ending in -OTTI from the Veneto, eg CHELOTTI?


Otti endings are lombard

Otto endings are Veneto and Pordenone ( friuli ) who was always Veneto until between 1820-1870 when the border was moved.