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gyms
09-10-16, 10:01
" On other hand you are the one who tells others what they are and how they should feel about their sexuality. If you are heterosexsual, you want everyone to be heterosexusual,..."

You are wrong! I am not against homosexuals,I am against the massive hysteria and the aggressive political propaganda surrounding homosexuality. That's all. Easy to understand.

LeBrok
09-10-16, 18:28
" On other hand you are the one who tells others what they are and how they should feel about their sexuality. If you are heterosexsual, you want everyone to be heterosexusual,..."

You are wrong! I am not against homosexuals,I am against the massive hysteria and the aggressive political propaganda surrounding homosexuality. That's all. Easy to understand.Who are you kidding? lol. The only reason you see this "aggressive political propaganda surrounding homosexuality" is because you are scared by homosexuality or you find it disgusting. For you every gay in public place or in a movie is "aggressive political propaganda".

draj
09-10-16, 21:12
Go ahead and organize one. How difficult it can be? Does it bother you when others are organized and having fun?
Perhaps we should be bothered by cultural and religious parades too if it is not our ethnicity or our religion?

Why would I celebrate my sexuality? Don't see the point in celebrating something like that..Offcourse I like when others are having fun, but fun and sexual parades have no connection at all..Like I said, I don't think that sexuality should be matter of celebration..I'm having fun while reading a book and also while drinking coffee with my friends..Should I organize a drinking coffee parade or coffee with friends parade? Also I enjoy running, running parade anyone? My favourite color is blue, blue color parade? Get it, it's my personal thing!
Homosexual parades could do more damage to homosexuals than good in my opinion. Parades where people are almost engaged in coitus (Sheldon Cooper style) shouldn't be a matter of public parade and I'm against it like I would be against a parade of heterosexuals almost engaged in one above mentioned.
Hope it's more clear to you now..

Pravni portal (http://epravo.ba/)
Pravo i pravni pojmovi (http://www.bih-pravo.org/)

LeBrok
09-10-16, 22:24
Why would I celebrate my sexuality? Don't see the point in celebrating something like that..OffcourseGreat, your choice.


I like when others are having fun, but fun and sexual parades have no connection at all..Like I said, I don't think that sexuality should be matter of celebration.Why you are against others feeling differently about this matter?


.I'm having fun while reading a book and also while drinking coffee with my friends..Should I organize a drinking coffee parade or coffee with friends parade? Again, it is your choice, just don't be against other people choices in this matter, if they feel like organizing coffee parade. Never heard of coffee festival?
http://www.mydestinationpuertorico.com/travel-articles/celebrating-puerto-ricos-coffee-harvest


Also I enjoy running, running parade anyone? Wait, you are not very observant fellow, because running parades happen everywhere in a major cities. How come it doesn't bother you? You didn't even notice, lol. Parades of runners going through Bosnian cities every year, and everywhere on this planet. 5 km, 10k, 20k, marathons, cross country, you name it, lol, a celebration of running!
https://www.mynextrun.com/run/10k/Bosnia+and+Herzegovina
How come you let them do such disgusting thing in public. Hords of half naked men and women running through centers of our cities. Please, stop them, protest, do something!!! Many of them ending up in hospitals. Save them for their own good!


My favourite color is blue, blue color parade? Get it, it's my personal thing! Now you are just being silly. You compare importance of colour blue to sexuality of people.
Funny you mentioned Blue. There is a movie about this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct3YNVqXhgg


Homosexual parades could do more damage to homosexuals than good in my opinion. Parades where people are almost engaged in coitus (Sheldon Cooper style) shouldn't be a matter of public parade and I'm against it like I would be against a parade of heterosexuals almost engaged in one above mentioned. Are you also against pair dancing?

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/hpmbhbIn_zQ/maxresdefault.jpg

How come this doesn't bother you? Or all the parades and festivals with dancing, the imitation of pair bonding, touching and sexual acts?

So let's summed it up:
You are not against parades, you are against gays' parades.
You are not against dancing, just against dancing gays.
And not even against gays, just against gays doing gay stuff.

I hope you can see now how pathetic your stand against gay parades is. You know what is funny? I don't have anything against gay parades, but I don't care for them, don't watch them, don't go there. I don't even remember last time I saw a gay parade on TV news, though they happen every year in every bigger city in Canada. I'm sure there are not too many gay parades in Bosnia, if ever happened, but you are so strongly against them.
Think about this. Why is that? Perhaps you are afraid of a scarecrow?

Maleth
10-10-16, 20:09
What difference from the gay pride in Stockholm to that of Belgrade in 2010. and things did not change much in 6 years anyway


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znp8kTGyRx0

Maleth
10-10-16, 21:00
Both prime minister and leader of the opposition in Malta attended gaypride Malta. (they represent 98% of Maltese electorate)

Prime minister (Joseph Muscat: Labour)

Its important in a symbolic way to celebrate this day. We are proud as a small nation to have given equal rights to the gay community and our government has taken leadership and rebutted a passive stance. We have the satisfaction to see that Gay marriage is well accepted in our society and this is an natural evolution the country has to go through.

Leader of the opposition (Simon Busutil, Conservatives)

We are reminding on this day that the LGBT is a part of our society. We who are leaders have to understand and take action in the right direction. That is the reason that I am here today.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yfsUSWEx44

gyms
11-10-16, 10:26
Who are you kidding? lol. The only reason you see this "aggressive political propaganda surrounding homosexuality" is because you are scared by homosexuality or you find it disgusting. For you every gay in public place or in a movie is "aggressive political propaganda".

Stop tell me how I feel!You are not my therapist.

srdceleva
12-10-16, 14:20
lebrok im not some fanatical anti gay person, but you have to be honest a gay parade is significantly different from the vast majority of parades. Here in vienna they had a gay parade, people were literally holding dildos walking around naked with sex toys, people in chains, and everyone carrying rainbow flags. I also saw tons of people carrying signs saying blasphemous things against Christians. I went to a parade for the traditional family and the lesbian protestors threw used tampons on us. This isnt a normal movemtn and is nothing like people celebrating normal things like dancing or descent normal civil rights movments like what martin luther king jr was doing. People outside of the west are horrified at these things and unlike the past were the west was usually in the right when it came to civil rights, we have now perverted it into a distortion of reality and are equating a relationship that is completely fruitless to a relationship that is the cause for all of human existence. This isnt about being tolerant or intolerant or live and let live, its just about standing for whats true and whats not true. Homosexuality is not beneficial to society and should not be equated to heterosexuality. it makes me sound bad, but ten years ago this was a view held by the vast majority of people and no one would have claimed i was a fanatic or unreasonable for believing that. In the past five years though the homosexual agenda amped up all of its propoganda and now suddenly everyone is a big supporter. We just need to be honest with ourselves, this isnt a normal movement and eventually society will revert back to supporting the traditional family as its the most natural and proper way of continuing soceity.

gyms
12-10-16, 15:25
lebrok im not some fanatical anti gay person, but you have to be honest a gay parade is significantly different from the vast majority of parades. Here in vienna they had a gay parade, people were literally holding dildos walking around naked with sex toys, people in chains, and everyone carrying rainbow flags. I also saw tons of people carrying signs saying blasphemous things against Christians. I went to a parade for the traditional family and the lesbian protestors threw used tampons on us. This isnt a normal movemtn and is nothing like people celebrating normal things like dancing or descent normal civil rights movments like what martin luther king jr was doing. People outside of the west are horrified at these things and unlike the past were the west was usually in the right when it came to civil rights, we have now perverted it into a distortion of reality and are equating a relationship that is completely fruitless to a relationship that is the cause for all of human existence. This isnt about being tolerant or intolerant or live and let live, its just about standing for whats true and whats not true. Homosexuality is not beneficial to society and should not be equated to heterosexuality. it makes me sound bad, but ten years ago this was a view held by the vast majority of people and no one would have claimed i was a fanatic or unreasonable for believing that. In the past five years though the homosexual agenda amped up all of its propoganda and now suddenly everyone is a big supporter. We just need to be honest with ourselves, this isnt a normal movement and eventually society will revert back to supporting the traditional family as its the most natural and proper way of continuing soceity.

ascent (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ascent), rise (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rise), upswing (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/upswing)
Synonym Discussion of decadencedeterioration (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/deterioration), degeneration (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/degeneration), decadence (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadence), decline (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decline) mean the falling from a higher to a lower level in quality, character, or vitality. deterioration (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/deterioration) implies generally the impairment of value or usefulness <the deterioration of the house through neglect>. degeneration (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/degeneration) stresses physical, intellectual, or especially moral retrogression <the degeneration of their youthful idealism into cynicism>. decadence (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadence) presupposes a reaching and passing the peak of development and implies a turn downward with a consequent loss in vitality or energy <cited love of luxury as a sign of cultural decadence>. decline (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decline) differs from decadence (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadence) in suggesting a more markedly downward direction and greater momentum as well as more obvious evidence of deterioration <the meteoric decline of his career after the scandal>.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/decadence
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PW5KieBAm1c

gyms
12-10-16, 16:18
Moral RelativismFirst published Thu Feb 19, 2004; substantive revision Mon Apr 20, 2015
Moral relativism is an important topic in metaethics. It is also widely discussed outside philosophy (for example, by political and religious leaders), and it is controversial among philosophers and nonphilosophers alike. This is perhaps not surprising in view of recent evidence that people's intuitions about moral relativism vary widely. Though many philosophers are quite critical of moral relativism, there are several contemporary philosophers who defend forms of it. These include such prominent figures as Gilbert Harman, Jesse J. Prinz, J. David Velleman and David B. Wong. The term ‘moral relativism’ is understood in a variety of ways. Most often it is associated with an empirical thesis that there are deep and widespread moral disagreements and a metaethical thesis that the truth or justification of moral judgments is not absolute, but relative to the moral standard of some person or group of persons. Sometimes ‘moral relativism’ is connected with a normative position about how we ought to think about or act towards those with whom we morally disagree, most commonly that we should tolerate them.

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/moral-relativism/

Fire Haired14
12-10-16, 17:04
lebrok im not some fanatical anti gay person, but you have to be honest a gay parade is significantly different from the vast majority of parades. Here in vienna they had a gay parade, people were literally holding dildos walking around naked with sex toys, people in chains, and everyone carrying rainbow flags. I also saw tons of people carrying signs saying blasphemous things against Christians. I went to a parade for the traditional family and the lesbian protestors threw used tampons on us. This isnt a normal movemtn and is nothing like people celebrating normal things like dancing or descent normal civil rights movments like what martin luther king jr was doing. People outside of the west are horrified at these things and unlike the past were the west was usually in the right when it came to civil rights, we have now perverted it into a distortion of reality and are equating a relationship that is completely fruitless to a relationship that is the cause for all of human existence. This isnt about being tolerant or intolerant or live and let live, its just about standing for whats true and whats not true. Homosexuality is not beneficial to society and should not be equated to heterosexuality. it makes me sound bad, but ten years ago this was a view held by the vast majority of people and no one would have claimed i was a fanatic or unreasonable for believing that. In the past five years though the homosexual agenda amped up all of its propoganda and now suddenly everyone is a big supporter. We just need to be honest with ourselves, this isnt a normal movement and eventually society will revert back to supporting the traditional family as its the most natural and proper way of continuing soceity.

Amen.....................

Maleth
12-10-16, 17:13
its just about standing for whats true and whats not true.

Thats exactly what you are not doing.....being true. Homosexuality been round since time immemorial. Living in denial is not an option in 2016. It also exists in other animal species, and you are to here to lecture what is true and whats not true. I wonder if you would reason that way if you had a child that was homosexual. What do you expect? to exterminate us? or make us live a false life like the era you are talking about. You are talking of a time when homosexuals used to go to prison and were considered mentally sick. You are talking of a time when social pressures used to make homosexuals get into false marriages and bullying and persecution was the norm with blessing. Who is shocked with equal rights? someone from a third world country or fanatically religious country such as the Muslim ones.Of course you sound bad and shame on you and stop insulting me.

Sile
12-10-16, 18:47
The need to is take marriage away from religious institutes and make only civil marriages legitimate .............same as Italy has done since 1805 ( introduced by Napoleon )...........( one can have a religious marriage after the civil ceremony , if you like )

this will then change many peoples attitudes over gay marriage as time passes

If the country is a secular country, one has to have civil marriages as a must ...............anything else does not make any sense.

Angela
12-10-16, 18:50
The evidence is clear, imo; some people are just "wired" differently. There have always been homosexuals, as Maleth pointed out. It's part of the spectrum of human identity and sexual orientation. We don't yet know exactly why that's the case, but that much is clear as far as I'm concerned. Indeed, I think that human sexuality is on a continuum. In certain circumstances, at certain stages of life, adolescence, for example, the lines might get a little blurry for more people than the percentage who are actually homosexuals.

Given that, the question is, do you treat them with respect and accord them the same equal rights accorded to other human beings, or do you not? Do you make them hide who they are? For me, there's no doubt about the answer. I'm not interested in criminalizing the type of sexual behavior going on between consenting adults in the privacy of their own rooms, homosexual or heterosexual.

That's an entirely different issue than whether I find gay pride parades tasteful. I don't. I wouldn't find heterosexuals marching around like that tasteful either. No one is forcing me to go, and I don't.

In fact, given what most people over 20 look like, I would say keeping on their clothes in public places is a good aesthetic choice. Heck, I don't even like using the locker room at the gym sometimes; way too much information, if you get what I mean. Now, the tango is a totally different thing. :)

srdceleva
12-10-16, 19:28
Thats exactly what you are not doing.....being true. Homosexuality been round since time immemorial. Living in denial is not an option in 2016. It also exists in other animal species, and you are to here to lecture what is true and whats not true. I wonder if you would reason that way if you had a child that was homosexual. What do you expect? to exterminate us? or make us live a false life like the era you are talking about. You are talking of a time when homosexuals used to go to prison and were considered mentally sick. You are talking of a time when social pressures used to make homosexuals get into false marriages and bullying and persecution was the norm with blessing. Who is shocked with equal rights? someone from a third world country or fanatically religious country such as the Muslim ones.Of course you sound bad and shame on you and stop insulting me.

you didnt read my posts well I never claimed gays should be exterminated or punished in any way, actually i started off my first comment saying the exact opposite none of us are perfect and we all have mental complexes but to try and act as they are good is something i could never do. I would reason exactly the same if my child was gay. I would love him and accept him but i would never aprove of homosexuality as a good and healthy behavior just as I dont approve of my own behavior when it isnt good or healthy and ive made a lot of mistakes. Saying there have always been homosexuals is not a proof that it is a good behavior and not a mental complex. Its not only poeple from third world countries, many of us are shocked in western countries still to this day. Countries from all across the world are looking at the west from china to kenya thinking we have lost our marbles because we act like men dressing as women are totally mentally healthy people when its obviously not the case. Im not insulting anyone just stating the fact that a relationship that beirs no fruit can never be equal to a relationship that is the reason for all of human existence. Do you not have a mother and father? yes you do its the only way you could come into this world. All of us have a mother and a father even orphans, they just dont know them, but we all know the ideal situation for a child to grow up is to be with his biological mother and father and that is the natural and normal way of things, everything besides this is either a less ideal situation or a deviant form of the original one. Even in homosexual relationships very often one takes the dominate and masculine role while the other takes the submissive and feminine role, this is very common especially among lesbians, this is a plane immitation of the whats natural in our species trying to recreate the masculine and feminine energies in a relationship that cant fully do it. shame on me yes for stating the truth

bicicleur
12-10-16, 19:39
Given that, the question is, do you treat them with respect and accord them the same equal rights accorded to other human beings, or do you not? Do you make them hide who they are? For me, there's no doubt about the answer. I'm not interested in criminalizing the type of sexual behavior going on between consenting adults in the privacy of their own rooms, homosexual or heterosexual.

That's an entirely different issue than whether I find gay pride parades tasteful. I don't. I wouldn't find heterosexuals marching around like that tasteful either. No one is forcing me to go, and I don't.



a step further is whether gay people should adopt and raise children

srdceleva
12-10-16, 19:41
The evidence is clear, imo; some people are just "wired" differently. There have always been homosexuals, as Maleth pointed out. It's part of the spectrum of human identity and sexual orientation. We don't yet know exactly why that's the case, but that much is clear as far as I'm concerned. Indeed, I think that human sexuality is on a continuum. In certain circumstances, at certain stages of life, adolescence, for example, the lines might get a little blurry for more people than the percentage who are actually homosexuals.

Given that, the question is, do you treat them with respect and accord them the same equal rights accorded to other human beings, or do you not? Do you make them hide who they are? For me, there's no doubt about the answer. I'm not interested in criminalizing the type of sexual behavior going on between consenting adults in the privacy of their own rooms, homosexual or heterosexual.

That's an entirely different issue than whether I find gay pride parades tasteful. I don't. I wouldn't find heterosexuals marching around like that tasteful either. No one is forcing me to go, and I don't.

In fact, given what most people over 20 look like, I would say keeping on their clothes in public places is a good aesthetic choice. Heck, I don't even like using the locker room at the gym sometimes; way too much information, if you get what I mean. Now, the tango is a totally different thing. :)

Angela I never claimed homosexuals should be punished or criminalized for being homosexuals, I clearly said they shoudnt be. I really am not trying to be disrespectful to anyone or be intolerant to anyone, im just stating what i see as true and i think im being very reasonable. Just answer me this one question. Should an adult mother and an adult son be allowed to be married legally? If they both are adults and love eachother and give full consent who are we to stop them? incest has always been a part of the human identity and is very common in the animal kingdom. Incestual relationships have always existed so why shouldnt they be allowed to be married? also with technology these days there is no worry that they would have an unhealthy child as that can easily be prevented these days so what is the problem? the fact is most poeple would say thats not right, not natural and not a healthy relationship.

I also dont buy that argument that they are wired differently. We all are sexual creatures, as a man i dont have to tell you how strong sexual desires are and how they can be geared in many ways. Sexual experiences are also associative meaning our past sexual experiences influence our sexual attraction. Even places or objects that are involved in our sexual experiences can turn us on just from being around them. There are literally people with thousands of the strangest fettishes out there, and many of them are not dangerous or hurting anyone but still we wouldnt call them healthy or good. Its very obvious that sexual orientation isnt set in stone. Thats why there are people who are bi and have relationships with all sexes and all types of people, many people in jail for instance carry out sexual relationships with their own sex but when they get out continue to have heterosexual relationships. The fact is there is no such thing as straight and gay. These are modern terms that were foreign to the ancient greeks and romans as greeks thought both relationships should be carried out. Exclusive homosexuality is actually a very modern construct and is something that is also extrmely ever seen in the animal kingdom outside of humans as animals will have sex with anything. Why is it so hard for me to believe that maybe some people choose to be in relatioinships with members of their own sex because they feel more comfortable mentally there than they do with the opposite sex? there are many logical mental processes that could lead one to be homosexual and have nothing to do if one is born that way or not.

Also I treat all people with love and respect I dont in any way want to isolate people or make them feel they dont belong, but hurting peoples feelings shouldnt be a hindarance to me when considering what is true or not, many times the best thing for people is not want they want to hear.

bicicleur
12-10-16, 21:14
a bizarre story : a lesbian woman disguises herself as a man, even puts a fake penis, to seduce a heterosexual lady friend she fancies

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/gayle-newland-woman-jailed-tricked-friend-sex-pretending-man-court-cheshire-london-a7357891.html

or did this also happen all time in history?

Angela
12-10-16, 21:42
Well, I'm glad that you don't approve of denying homosexuals human rights or treating them with disrespect.

As to your view of homosexuality, we'll have to agree to disagree, I think. I agree there are people who, because it is increasingly accepted, might have homosexual experiences where once it might not even have occurred to them. I also agree that being who we are, people who are isolated from members of the opposite sex might turn for sexual fulfilment to someone of their own sex, even though that isn't their preference. There are also people, jaded with experiences with their own sex, who might turn to homosexual sex for titillation. In adolescence, when sexual identity is more fluid, sexualized feelings can attach themselves to a good friend or a slightly older and admired person. It passes.

I'm not talking about any of that. I'm talking about people who from the earliest awakening of sexual feeling have fantasized only about other men, have only been attracted to other men. I know men like that, have worked with them, have grown to love some as friends. It's who they are...I don't know if you've done any research into the subject, but the science seems to bear it out.

Now, you're right; if the whole world turned to homosexuality, it would be a huge problem for the human race. There's absolutely no chance of that, however; there's nothing to fear. At the most we're talking about a few percent to 10% of men. Even if it were a psychological aberration and not a matter of genetic determination, so long as they are consenting adults, how does it harm you in any way. Why does it so concern you? There's not enough love in the world. There's not enough loving, nurturing sex in the world either. Perhaps if there were, people would be happier. Let them find it where they will so long as nobody is being exploited.

Which brings me to your question about incest. That's usually what people raise, that or bestiality, and I don't think either are good analogies. I think incest has been a taboo for most of human history, and not just because many cultures realized the danger for the survival of the tribe through birth defects and recessive disease. It's also extremely destructive to the family unit, to the kind of protective relationships, relationships based on trust, not exploitation of the young, which are necessary for the survival of the family. Added to all that, I think there may be something primal, maybe hormonal about it, an aversion, an adaptation, which is increased by the amount of time spent in one another's company. There are some studies to that effect.

I recently read an article about a woman whose biological father had abandoned her as a newborn. She met him thirty-five years later for the first time, and she maintains that they fell in love. They started a physical relationship and are still in it. She had herself sterilized. This is a bizarre situation in no way comparable to homosexuality, which, as Maleth pointed out, has been a part of human life from the very beginning. Sometimes it was accepted. Just consider the Indo-European initiation ceremonies, the Greco-Roman world, tribal Afghanistan, some New World Indian societies. Sometimes it has gone into hiding. It has never gone away. If you investigate it, I'm sure you'll find that's the case.

@Bicicleur,

Well, some of the most beautiful love poetry in the world was written by Sappho, who was a Lesbian.

"You came and I was longing for you,
You cooled a heart burning with desire."

"PleaseCome back to me, Gongyla, here tonight,
You, my rose, with your Lydian lyre.
There hovers forever around you delight:
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifA beauty desired.
Even your garment plunders my eyes.
I am enchanted: I who once
Complained to the Cyprus-born goddess,
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifWhom I now beseech
Never to let this lose me grace
But rather bring you back to me:
Amongst all mortal women the one
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifI most wish to see."

Women couples have just been able to hide in plain sight.

bicicleur
12-10-16, 22:20
@Bicicleur,

Well, some of the most beautiful love poetry in the world was written by Sappho, who was a Lesbian.

"You came and I was longing for you,
You cooled a heart burning with desire."

"Please

Come back to me, Gongyla, here tonight,
You, my rose, with your Lydian lyre.
There hovers forever around you delight:
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifA beauty desired.
Even your garment plunders my eyes.
I am enchanted: I who once
Complained to the Cyprus-born goddess,
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifWhom I now beseech
Never to let this lose me grace
But rather bring you back to me:
Amongst all mortal women the one
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifI most wish to see."

Women couples have just been able to hide in plain sight.

well I guess both Sappho and Gongyla were lesbian or maybe Gongyla was bisexual

in the bizarre case I mentioned the lady seduced didn't have a clue her seducer was female, she even put op a fake ..

bicicleur
12-10-16, 22:27
Now, you're right; if the whole world turned to homosexuality, it would be a huge problem for the human race. There's absolutely no chance of that, however; there's nothing to fear. At the most we're talking about a few percent to 10% of men.

well, I don't know, is DNA in play to determin whether you'll be gay?
many will say yes, but ..

maybe, in the times of Adam, 90 % was gay, but only the 10 % straight procreated and the gay did not

wait a minute, if so there should be no gay people left today, except those very few with a coincidal DNA mutation at birth
no, your DNA doesn't tell you you should be gay
isn't it influenced by the society in which you grow up after all?

or maybe the forefathers of todays gay people were bisexual because society didn't allow them to be gay?

bicicleur
12-10-16, 22:43
oh, and while we're at it,

why not legalise a 3-way marriage, just like Manny and his 2 lovely senoritas would like ?

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/amorous-trio-who-sleep-together-9029654

Maleth
12-10-16, 23:15
I would reason exactly the same if my child was gay. I would love him and accept him but i would never aprove of homosexuality as a good and healthy behavior

Clearly you contradicting yourself. How can you accept someone if you do not approve of their sexuality? Irrelevant to wether you aprove or not homosexuality is a reality. How can you love someone and at the same time thump in their head that they are abromal. Ever cared to think of the consequences of the mental state of that person having someone telling them they are not good and dont have a healthy behavior. Why dont you think that as a human being the desires of homosexuals to love and live are similar to those of heterosexuals. And what is the problem anyway?




just as I dont approve of my own behavior when it isnt good or healthy and ive made a lot of mistakes.

For a homosexual there is nothing wrong and its neither a mistake, and they do not appreciate being told so. As Angela mentioned what two concenting adults do is not much of anyones business. Did you know that not all homosexuals go parading? Did you know that a good number of homosexual males become priests? Did you know that there are different types of homosexual characters and lifestyles. Not very different from the spectrum of behaviors you find among heterosexuals.


Saying there have always been homosexuals is not a proof that it is a good behavior and not a mental complex.

Its a natural behavior since recorded history, no point in keep saying a bad behavior and all the other adjectives you use. It is what it is and its not going to change


Its not only poeple from third world countries, many of us are shocked in western countries still to this day. Countries from all across the world are looking at the west from china to kenya thinking we have lost our marbles

Taboo countries where persecution (even execution) is still rampant are African and Islamic countries. I am not sure who has marbles missing with this kind of behavior. China as it developed has improved its attitude towards homosexuals like most first world countries do.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China



Im not insulting anyone

of course you are and you also think its ok. You stated homosexuals are not beneficial. That is a heavy statement and has lots of repercussions. Let me know how non beneficial we are please. I am the only person caring for my sick mum and I have two sisters and a brother who are very grateful for what I do, and been told if it wasnt for me she would be in a home as they could not cope with commitments. I met a friend in the mall I haven't seen in years and told me he nursed his Mother until she passed away a few months ago. Say that to Michelangelo and Leonardo da Vinci. Respect please.



just stating the fact that a relationship that beirs no fruit can never be equal to a relationship that is the reason for all of human existence.Do you not have a mother and father? yes you do its the only way you could come into this world. All of us have a mother and a father even orphans, they just dont know them, but we all know the ideal situation for a child to grow up is to be with his biological mother and father and that is the natural and normal way of things, everything besides this is either a less ideal situation or a deviant form of the original one. Even in homosexual relationships very often one takes the dominate and masculine role while the other takes the submissive and feminine role, this is very common especially among lesbians, this is a plane immitation of the whats natural in our species trying to recreate the masculine and feminine energies in a relationship that cant fully do it.

Unfortunately life is not all about ideal situations. A fact you are leaving out is that not all is Black and White. How about the shades of Gray? Why is there orphans in the world? Some children have been abounded by their parents and some have also been mistreated. Its the exception not the rule thank goodness. If they can live in orphanages why cant they live with a homosexual couple? and more focused attention for a better upbringing. Not everyone qualifies like not all hetero couple qualify for some reason or another, but who does makes a pretty good job.


shame on me yes for stating the truth

all i can read is negative remarks and generalization.....far from the truth.

Maleth
12-10-16, 23:17
oh, and while we're at it,

why not legalise a 3-way marriage, just like Manny and his 2 lovely senoritas would like ?

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/amorous-trio-who-sleep-together-9029654



a bizarre story : a lesbian woman disguises herself as a man, even puts a fake penis, to seduce a heterosexual lady friend she fancies

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7357891.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/gayle-newland-woman-jailed-tricked-friend-sex-pretending-man-court-cheshire-london-a7357891.html)

or did this also happen all time in history?




maybe you are confusing apples with oranges? you know the difference? nothing bizarre happens with Heterosexuals?

srdceleva
12-10-16, 23:23
Well, I'm glad that you don't approve of denying homosexuals human rights or treating them with disrespect.

As to your view of homosexuality, we'll have to agree to disagree, I think. I agree there are people who, because it is increasingly accepted, might have homosexual experiences where once it might not even have occurred to them. I also agree that being who we are, people who are isolated from members of the opposite sex might turn for sexual fulfilment to someone of their own sex, even though that isn't their preference. There are also people, jaded with experiences with their own sex, who might turn to homosexual sex for titillation. In adolescence, when sexual identity is more fluid, sexualized feelings can attach themselves to a good friend or a slightly older and admired person. It passes.

I'm not talking about any of that. I'm talking about people who from the earliest awakening of sexual feeling have fantasized only about other men, have only been attracted to other men. I know men like that, have worked with them, have grown to love some as friends. It's who they are...I don't know if you've done any research into the subject, but the science seems to bear it out.

Now, you're right; if the whole world turned to homosexuality, it would be a huge problem for the human race. There's absolutely no chance of that, however; there's nothing to fear. At the most we're talking about a few percent to 10% of men. Even if it were a psychological aberration and not a matter of genetic determination, so long as they are consenting adults, how does it harm you in any way. Why does it so concern you? There's not enough love in the world. There's not enough loving, nurturing sex in the world either. Perhaps if there were, people would be happier. Let them find it where they will so long as nobody is being exploited.

Which brings me to your question about incest. That's usually what people raise, that or bestiality, and I don't think either are good analogies. I think incest has been a taboo for most of human history, and not just because many cultures realized the danger for the survival of the tribe through birth defects and recessive disease. It's also extremely destructive to the family unit, to the kind of protective relationships, relationships based on trust, not exploitation of the young, which are necessary for the survival of the family. Added to all that, I think there may be something primal, maybe hormonal about it, an aversion, an adaptation, which is increased by the amount of time spent in one another's company. There are some studies to that effect.

I recently read an article about a woman whose biological father had abandoned her as a newborn. She met him thirty-five years later for the first time, and she maintains that they fell in love. They started a physical relationship and are still in it. She had herself sterilized. This is a bizarre situation in no way comparable to homosexuality, which, as Maleth pointed out, has been a part of human life from the very beginning. Sometimes it was accepted. Just consider the Indo-European initiation ceremonies, the Greco-Roman world, tribal Afghanistan, some New World Indian societies. Sometimes it has gone into hiding. It has never gone away. If you investigate it, I'm sure you'll find that's the case.

@Bicicleur,

Well, some of the most beautiful love poetry in the world was written by Sappho, who was a Lesbian.

"You came and I was longing for you,
You cooled a heart burning with desire."

"Please

Come back to me, Gongyla, here tonight,
You, my rose, with your Lydian lyre.
There hovers forever around you delight:
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifA beauty desired.
Even your garment plunders my eyes.
I am enchanted: I who once
Complained to the Cyprus-born goddess,
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifWhom I now beseech
Never to let this lose me grace
But rather bring you back to me:
Amongst all mortal women the one
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifI most wish to see."

Women couples have just been able to hide in plain sight.


Well, I'm glad that you don't approve of denying homosexuals human rights or treating them with disrespect.

As to your view of homosexuality, we'll have to agree to disagree, I think. I agree there are people who, because it is increasingly accepted, might have homosexual experiences where once it might not even have occurred to them. I also agree that being who we are, people who are isolated from members of the opposite sex might turn for sexual fulfilment to someone of their own sex, even though that isn't their preference. There are also people, jaded with experiences with their own sex, who might turn to homosexual sex for titillation. In adolescence, when sexual identity is more fluid, sexualized feelings can attach themselves to a good friend or a slightly older and admired person. It passes.

I'm not talking about any of that. I'm talking about people who from the earliest awakening of sexual feeling have fantasized only about other men, have only been attracted to other men. I know men like that, have worked with them, have grown to love some as friends. It's who they are...I don't know if you've done any research into the subject, but the science seems to bear it out.

Now, you're right; if the whole world turned to homosexuality, it would be a huge problem for the human race. There's absolutely no chance of that, however; there's nothing to fear. At the most we're talking about a few percent to 10% of men. Even if it were a psychological aberration and not a matter of genetic determination, so long as they are consenting adults, how does it harm you in any way. Why does it so concern you? There's not enough love in the world. There's not enough loving, nurturing sex in the world either. Perhaps if there were, people would be happier. Let them find it where they will so long as nobody is being exploited.

Which brings me to your question about incest. That's usually what people raise, that or bestiality, and I don't think either are good analogies. I think incest has been a taboo for most of human history, and not just because many cultures realized the danger for the survival of the tribe through birth defects and recessive disease. It's also extremely destructive to the family unit, to the kind of protective relationships, relationships based on trust, not exploitation of the young, which are necessary for the survival of the family. Added to all that, I think there may be something primal, maybe hormonal about it, an aversion, an adaptation, which is increased by the amount of time spent in one another's company. There are some studies to that effect.

I recently read an article about a woman whose biological father had abandoned her as a newborn. She met him thirty-five years later for the first time, and she maintains that they fell in love. They started a physical relationship and are still in it. She had herself sterilized. This is a bizarre situation in no way comparable to homosexuality, which, as Maleth pointed out, has been a part of human life from the very beginning. Sometimes it was accepted. Just consider the Indo-European initiation ceremonies, the Greco-Roman world, tribal Afghanistan, some New World Indian societies. Sometimes it has gone into hiding. It has never gone away. If you investigate it, I'm sure you'll find that's the case.

@Bicicleur,

Well, some of the most beautiful love poetry in the world was written by Sappho, who was a Lesbian.

"You came and I was longing for you,
You cooled a heart burning with desire."

"Please

Come back to me, Gongyla, here tonight,
You, my rose, with your Lydian lyre.
There hovers forever around you delight:
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifA beauty desired.
Even your garment plunders my eyes.
I am enchanted: I who once
Complained to the Cyprus-born goddess,
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifWhom I now beseech
Never to let this lose me grace
But rather bring you back to me:
Amongst all mortal women the one
http://www.sappho.com/images/dot_clear.gifI most wish to see."

Women couples have just been able to hide in plain sight.

Actually I really have researched the subject quite in depth at least at one time, and honestly there has never been any real scientific evidence to support the fact that they were born this way. As i mentioned before almost all have been quasi psuedoscientific studies that dont in the end prove anything. Such as the example that I believe is even given on this website claiming things like a younger son with multiple older brothers is more likely to be gay because his testosterone rate is lower..this statment doesnt prove anything in itself as lower testosterone would mean a lack of sex drive not that your attracted to members of your own sex. I know and have known plenty of gay men who were extremely masculine, essentially bodybuilders and from getting to know them and talking to them. They thought and acted just like any man, and it was quite easy for me to understand them and their way of thinking. someone can claim all he wants that he or she has been like that since the time they were born but that also isnt a proof in itself. Children arent born with sexual attraction we develople that later and sexual attraction can be and is a very maluable and can be bendable in many many directions. I know and understand those people are genuinely attracted to the same sex, im not doubting their sincerity at the same time I honestly think many many homosexuals are not happy that way and actually in a way have bought into the modern concept that you are either gay or straight and feel they have no choice they were born that way and have no say in it, and i also dont agree with this. Studies have shown that many homosexuals were molested as children (one claiming upwards of 60%) and obviously this will have massive affects on your orientation. As i mentioned before I knew someone who worked as a psychologist( the person was gay) with young teens who had been molested, and he told me one of the most common statments he gets from them after their experience is they tell him they now believe they are gay as they are having same sex attractions. Also as mentioned exclusive homosexuality is a modern construct and was not common in ancient greek and roman times were people essentially believed it was good to be both and just do whatever. Exclusive homosexuality is also extremely rare in the animal kingdom outside of humans, yes homosexual behavior is common but being exclusively homosexual is almost never seen outside of humans.

also i believe we have to be objective and just seriously think about the subject with out letting ourselves be influenced by whats popular today and what the media feeds us. Someone famous( lol i cant remember who now) said something to the extent of : theres nothing common to man that I cant comprehend. I really agree with this statment. Every man( though many wont admit it) has had sexual attractions to all sorts of stuff. If I actually did the things ive done in my dreams i would be arrested and put in a mental assylum and this is the case for every man. I can very easily see how certain situations and experiences can affect our orientation and if people are honest i believe they would agree with me. Im not saying these things to be intolerant or to make people feel bad and act like im perfect thats the last thing i would want to do, but i dont believe society is on the right track with this, and i honestly think homosexuals would be happier deep down knowing that they are normal and just like everybody else and we all could be like them and are like them regardless if we choose to live in that mindset

and yes obviously gay people can be talented and wonderful people creating beutiful music and poems. Im a big fan of a lot of gay actors and musicians and I dont think of them as bad people. George michael has always been a favorite of mine and is one of the best looking guys ive ever seen! still these are more emotional arguments and dont take away from anything ive said.

you might find this interesting angela, its from a pro gay website specifically speaking about this subject.

https://socialinqueery.com/2013/03/18/no-one-is-born-gay-or-straight-here-are-5-reasons-why/

srdceleva
12-10-16, 23:43
Clearly you contradicting yourself. How can you accept someone if you do not approve of their sexuality? Irrelevant to wether you aprove or not homosexuality is a reality. How can you love someone and at the same time thump in their head that they are abromal. Ever cared to think of the consequences of the mental state of that person having someone telling them they are not good and dont have a healthy behavior. Why dont you think that as a human being the desires of homosexuals to love and live are similar to those of heterosexuals. And what is the problem anyway?


For a homosexual there is nothing wrong and its neither a mistake, and they do not appreciate being told so. As Angela mentioned what two concenting adults do is not much of anyones business. Did you know that not all homosexuals go parading? Did you know that a good number of homosexual males become priests? Did you know that there are different types of homosexual characters and lifestyles. Not very different from the spectrum of behaviors you find among heterosexuals.



Its a natural behavior since recorded history, no point in keep saying a bad behavior and all the other adjectives you use. It is what it is and its not going to change



Taboo countries where persecution (even execution) is still rampant are African and Islamic countries. I am not sure who has marbles missing with this kind of behavior. China as it developed has improved its attitude towards homosexuals like most first world countries do.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China




of course you are and you also think its ok. You stated homosexuals are not beneficial. That is a heavy statement and has lots of repercussions. Let me know how non beneficial we are please. I am the only person caring for my sick mum and I have two sisters and a brother who are very grateful for what I do, and been told if it wasnt for me she would be in a home as they could not cope with commitments. I met a friend in the mall I haven't seen in years and told me he nursed his Mother until she passed away a few months ago. Say that to Michelangelo and Leonardo da Vinci. Respect please.




Unfortunately life is not all about ideal situations. A fact you are leaving out is that not all is Black and White. How about the shades of Gray? Why is there orphans in the world? Some children have been abounded by their parents and some have also been mistreated. Its the exception not the rule thank goodness. If they can live in orphanages why cant they live with a homosexual couple? and more focused attention for a better upbringing. Not everyone qualifies like not all hetero couple qualify for some reason or another, but who does makes a pretty good job.



all i can read is negative remarks and generalization.....far from the truth.

your arguments are all emotional ones and though you cant believe it I really am not trying to make you or any homosexual feel bad, its actually the exact opposite of what i wan to do. take that as you like but its the truth

now to your statments.

1)You are putting words in my mouth. I never would say to my child " You are not good" or "You are not normal" actually i would say the exact opposite you are totally normal and fine, everybody can have homosexual attractions some stronger than others its what kind of mindset and what kind of actions you choose to give yourself up to. Loving my child doesnt mean approving of everthing he or she does, actually good parenting means being loving but standing up for whats right even if it hurts your childs feelings at the time.

2)again never claimed heterosexuals are better than homosexuals, im very aware that there are some gays just like anybody who are kinder and better people than many many heterosexuals including myself

3) OCD has been around for ever as well so have many mental conditions, incestual relationships have been around for ever as well. Im curious do you believe an adult mother and son have the right to marry? as they are consenting adults who arent hurting anyone. I dont mean to be provocative with this question just curious about your answer.

4) Russia is not a third world country and they dont approve of homsexuality many south american countries also dont actually the vast majority of the world still does not approve of homosexuality but yes this argument isnt really important

5) I didnt say homosexuals arent beneficial, everyones life is equal we are all humans. I said homosexuality the act of it isnt beneficial and i think it speaks for itself as it doesnt lead to anything but physical pleasure. Again i realize there are many many good homosexuals

6)actually life is about trying to take less ideal situations and creating more ideal ones especially for children. Obviously if an orphaned child on the street is adopted by two homosexuals who give him a safe and good life its more ideal, however a heterosexual couple is the most ideal because it best replaces his or hers mother and father and allows the child to grow up experiencing both sexes and not just one. The fact is there are more couples trying to adopt than there are actual children up for adoption at least in the u.s and the vast majority are heterosexual couples.


7) not trying to be negative just voicing my thoughts on this subject.

Maleth
12-10-16, 23:45
Actually I really have researched the subject quite in depth at least at one time, and honestly there has never been any real scientific evidence to support the fact that they were born this way. As i mentioned before almost all have been quasi psuedoscientific studies that dont in the end prove anything. Such as the example that I believe is even given on this website claiming things like a younger son with multiple older brothers is more likely to be gay because his testosterone rate is lower..this statment doesnt prove anything in itself as lower testosterone would mean a lack of sex drive not that your attracted to members of your own sex. I know and have known plenty of gay men who were extremely masculine, essentially bodybuilders and from getting to know them and talking to them. They thought and acted just like any man, and it was quite easy for me to understand them and their way of thinking. someone can claim all he wants that he or she has been like that since the time they were born but that also isnt a proof in itself. Children arent born with sexual attraction we develople that later and sexual attraction can be and is a very maluable and can be bendable in many many directions. I know and understand those people are genuinely attracted to the same sex, im not doubting their sincerity at the same time I honestly think many many homosexuals are not happy that way and actually in a way have bought into the modern concept that you are either gay or straight and feel they have no choice they were born that way and have no say in it, and i also dont agree with this. Studies have shown that many homosexuals were molested as children (one claiming upwards of 60%) and obviously this will have massive affects on your orientation. As i mentioned before I knew someone who worked as a psychologist( the person was gay) with young teens who had been molested, and he told me one of the most common statments he gets from them after their experience is they tell him they now believe they are gay as they are having same sex attractions. Also as mentioned exclusive homosexuality is a modern construct and was not common in ancient greek and roman times were people essentially believed it was good to be both and just do whatever. Exclusive homosexuality is also extremely rare in the animal kingdom outside of humans, yes homosexual behavior is common but being exclusively homosexual is almost never seen outside of humans.

also i believe we have to be objective and just seriously think about the subject with out letting ourselves be influenced by whats popular today and what the media feeds us. Someone famous( lol i cant remember who now) said something to the extent of : theres nothing common to man that I cant comprehend. I really agree with this statment. Every man( though many wont admit it) has had sexual attractions to all sorts of stuff. If I actually did the things ive done in my dreams i would be arrested and put in a mental assylum and this is the case for every man. I can very easily see how certain situations and experiences can affect our orientation and if people are honest i believe they would agree with me. Im not saying these things to be intolerant or to make people feel bad and act like im perfect thats the last thing i would want to do, but i dont believe society is on the right track with this, and i honestly think homosexuals would be happier deep down knowing that they are normal and just like everybody else and we all could be like them and are like them regardless if we choose to live in that mindset

and yes obviously gay people can be talented and wonderful people creating beutiful music and poems. Im a big fan of a lot of gay actors and musicians and I dont think of them as bad people. George michael has always been a favorite of mine and is one of the best looking guys ive ever seen! still these are more emotional arguments and dont take away from anything ive said.

you might find this interesting angela, its from a pro gay website specifically speaking about this subject.

https://socialinqueery.com/2013/03/18/no-one-is-born-gay-or-straight-here-are-5-reasons-why/

well well. I said this many times and I say it again. I was brought up in a very conservative family. My brother is just 1 year older then me, we have same mother same enviorment. Never had porn around and never been molested and I am homosexual and always been since adolescence. There are different grades including bisexuality which is very real too. There are children that were born very feminine to the point they feel more like a women that they feel its natural to qualify for gender reassignment while most homosexuals do not fall in that category. You make it sound like its some kind of choice which is definitely not. If not I would be happy to know if you ever had to chose your sexuality, because I did not have to. I always knew what I was and most heterosexual had no issues in choosing. Sexuality is not something you choose by something you already are. I love to know how many people struggled with choosing their sexuality here. Why make it so complicated? I never came across any homosexual who just press a switch and go from homosexual to heterosexual or the other way round. Thats something that only happens in repressed societies and communities as an excuse through the insecurity of living in an unaccepting environment moving to a more accepting one. Fakeness in never really recommended and repressed societies that can be a mode of survival.

Maleth
13-10-16, 00:01
your arguments are all emotional ones and though you cant believe it I really am not trying to make you or any homosexual feel bad, its actually the exact opposite of what i wan to do. take that as you like but its the truth

now to your statments.

1)You are putting words in my mouth. I never would say to my child " You are not good" or "You are not normal" actually i would say the exact opposite you are totally normal and fine, everybody can have homosexual attractions some stronger than others its what kind of mindset and what kind of actions you choose to give yourself up to. Loving my child doesnt mean approving of everthing he or she does, actually good parenting means being loving but standing up for whats right even if it hurts your childs feelings at the time.

There are your own words srdceleva............. but to try and act as they are good is something i could never do. I would reason exactly the same if my child was gay. I would love him and accept him but i would never aprove of homosexuality as a good and healthy behavior just as I dont approve of my own behavior when it isnt good or healthy


3) OCD has been around for ever as well so have many mental conditions, incestual relationships have been around for ever as well. Im curious do you believe an adult mother and son have the right to marry? as they are consenting adults who arent hurting anyone. I dont mean to be provocative with this question just curious about your answer.

Two persons of the same sex loving each other has nothing to do with Mother and Child, has nothing to do with pedophilia, has nothing to do with 3 person marriage, has nothing to with bestiality and has nothing to do with OCD.


4) Russia is not a third world country and they dont approve of homsexuality many south american countries also dont actually the vast majority of the world still does not approve of homosexuality but yes this argument isnt really important

?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwr1W3VtpyM


5) I didnt say homosexuals arent beneficial, everyones life is equal we are all humans. I said homosexuality the act of it isnt beneficial and i think it speaks for itself as it doesnt lead to anything but physical pleasure. Again i realize there are many many good homosexuals

what is wrong with physical pleasure. Many heterosexuals do it too without procreation. Homosexuals not allowed? really?

srdceleva
13-10-16, 00:01
well well. I said this many times and I say it again. I was brought up in a very conservative family. My brother is just 1 year older then me, we have same mother same enviorment. Never had porn around and never been molested and I am homosexual and always been since adolescence. There are different grades including bisexuality which is very real too. There are children that were born very feminine to the point they feel more like a women that they feel its natural to qualify for gender reassignment while most homosexuals do not fall in that category. You make it sound like its some kind of choice which is definitely not. If not I would be happy to know if you ever had to chose your sexuality, because I did not have to. I always knew what I was and most heterosexual had no issues in choosing. Sexuality is not something you choose by something you already are. I love to know how many people struggled with choosing their sexuality here. Why make it so complicated? I never came across any homosexual who just press a switch and go from homosexual to heterosexual or the other way round. Thats something that only happens in repressed societies and communities as an excuse through the insecurity of living in an unaccepting environment moving to a more accepting one. Fakeness in never really recommended and repressed societies that can be a mode of survival.

never claimed that you and other homosexuals arent genuine and sincere in your orientation. I know and believe you are. I also dont believe you chose to be that way like flipping on a switch, we cant choose our attractions but this isnt an argument proving that you were genetically born this way and that it isnt a mental issue. Also there are many heterosexual men who have worried they were gay before, seriously worried and were in depression. I know people in my own family who are straight and genuinely straight and went through worrying they might be gay at one point and now are totally confident in being straight and not even fazed by that issue. Ive also known friends who were like this and they werent gay and still arent. Actually the question "Am I gay" is one of the most common questions psychologists get from teens and even adults and the vast majority of those people are straight. Its not such a black and white issue and as i said i dont believe in those terms gay and straight, not all of my desires have been completely straight in my life time, doesnt mean i would act on them.

Never claimed you were molested or involved with porn, you dont mention a father being around though.

srdceleva
13-10-16, 00:04
There are your own words srdceleva............. but to try and act as they are good is something i could never do. I would reason exactly the same if my child was gay. I would love him and accept him but i would never aprove of homosexuality as a good and healthy behavior just as I dont approve of my own behavior when it isnt good or healthy



Two persons of the same sex loving each other has nothing to do with Mother and Child, has nothing to do with pedophilia, has nothing to do with 3 person marriage, has nothing to with bestiality and has nothing to do with OCD.



?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwr1W3VtpyM



what is wrong with physical pleasure. Many heterosexuals do it too without procreation. Homosexuals not allowed? really?

youre not even discussing with me any more. Yes read my own words i said "Homosexuality" not "homosexuals" i clearly made that distinction but you dont want to grant me that i can be a rational and carrying human being while opposed to homosexuality

dont want to disturb your peace, if your in peace then dont read my comments, ive said what ive had to say and people can take from it what they want. all the best to you, really all the best!

Angela
13-10-16, 00:07
@Bicicleur,

Well, with women there are no performance issues really, so I don't see the problem.

The fact that a man can perform with a woman if he must doesn't mean he's not gay or should be labeled bi-sexual. Some men can't seem to perform with a woman, however, and that has indeed created problems if they were supposed to produce an heir.

I mean, you have Edward II of England and James I of Scotland and England whose conduct with their favorites was considered scandalous even then. You could argue that they were bisexual, but it seems to me as if they were just homosexual men who fulfilled their responsibilities with their wives, but otherwise were gay. There's Phillipe I, Duke of Orleans, as well, who is the ancestor of most modern royalty, but who was openly and unabashedly homosexual when not fulfilling his duty unenthusiastically by getting his two wives pregnant.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_II_of_England#Rift_with_Isabella
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippe_I,_Duke_of_Orl%C3%A9ans

Ludwig II of Bavaria doesn't seem to have been able to manage it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_II_of_Bavaria

It also has to be said that the church was a refuge for a lot of homosexual men over the centuries.

A man wanting to and actually sleeping with two women at the same time is hardly noteworthy, is it? It's just that they don't say they're "married" to both women. As for a man marrying two women, I don't know if I would call that bizarre, either. That's polygamy, and a lot of cultures think it's totally unremarkable. I guess you're not used to polygamous people in Europe. Here, we have the fundamentalist, break away Mormon sects. Now, the marriages after the first one are not legal, but the relationships exist. What I object to is the fact that the man can't support all of his children, and so the wives have a different residence and collect welfare and other benefits.

Don't misunderstand; I have no sympathy with polygamy whatsoever, and I think any woman willingly participating must be mad.

Maleth
13-10-16, 00:18
youre not even discussing with me any more. Yes read my own words i said "Homosexuality" not "homosexuals" i clearly made that distinction but you dont want to grant me that i can be a rational and carrying human being while opposed to homosexuality

dont want to disturb your peace, if your in peace then dont read my comments, ive said what ive had to say and people can take from it what they want. all the best to you, really all the best!

I am strong thanks. I could not have been. I am a homosexual happy with my homosexuality and I pay my taxes and try to do good. I have a relationship of 16 years and I dont want to marry my mother and neither have OCD. All the best to you too :)

bicicleur
13-10-16, 10:37
maybe you are confusing apples with oranges? you know the difference? nothing bizarre happens with Heterosexuals?

the lesbian women with her fake penis is bizarre

the demand for the 3-way marriage may be legitimate in this case

that is why I put them in a seperate quote

if you legalise gay marriage, why not legalise the 3-way marriage?
where do you draw the line?

are you upset that I mention this?

A. Papadimitriou
13-10-16, 11:23
T
Two persons of the same sex loving each other has nothing to do with Mother and Child, has nothing to do with pedophilia, has nothing to do with 3 person marriage, has nothing to with bestiality and has nothing to do with OCD.


Why do you have to mention pedophilia?

Why do you object to a relationship between a mother and a 'child' if they are adults? Or a 3-person (or 10-person) marriage of various sexes who 'love each other'? You will use a moral argument, I think.

Maleth
13-10-16, 11:35
the lesbian women with her fake penis is bizarre

the demand for the 3-way marriage may be legitimate in this case

that is why I put them in a seperate quote

if you legalise gay marriage, why not legalise the 3-way marriage?
where do you draw the line?

are you upset that I mention this?

:) of course I am not upset, its just we are discussing Gay marriage when a person loves another person of the same sex (not related of course in 100% of cases) and want to make a bond official. Heterosexuals do it even if they do not intend to procreate. What you state is truly not relevant to the subject. Simple no?

Maleth
13-10-16, 11:50
Why do you have to mention pedophilia?

Why do you object to a relationship between a mother and a 'child' if they are adults? Or a 3-person (or 10-person) marriage of various sexes who 'love each other'? You will use a moral argument, I think.

I mentioned pedophilia because some less informed people espesially in uneducated circles mistake it with homosexuality, and been used a pretext even on this forum. Gay marriages have nothing to do with this. Re other issue I did not approve or object in my post as you stated. I just stated when two people of the same sex want to unite has nothing to do with was has been mentioned. Most often to put a negative light on the issue.

If you want my opinion polygamy already existed and also approved by historical Moses (if there ever was such). Some Jews and Muslims do practice it. I am not in favor of it personally, but if the people involved feel fine with it, so be it, however I feel that even were its allowed it does not happen often. Same with son and Mother or other way round. This has nothing to do with people who are born attracted to the same sex falling in love and wanting to make their bond official. I have never come across yet a son who wants to marry his mother or a daughter his daddy, so the whole aspect is totally ridiculous. Whats next? A man marrying his dog? how come no one mentioned it yet. Its one of the favourites of the anti gay marriage lobby.....with the slogan god created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve...or something to that effect.... :rolleyes2:

bicicleur
13-10-16, 14:10
:) of course I am not upset, its just we are discussing Gay marriage when a person loves another person of the same sex (not related of course in 100% of cases) and want to make a bond official. Heterosexuals do it even if they do not intend to procreate. What you state is truly not relevant to the subject. Simple no?

why is it not relevant?
do you think these 3 people can't make a good and stable family?
do you think there will be no lasting love in the house? to much jealousy?

if you accept gay marriage, why not discuss this kind of families?

Maleth
14-10-16, 14:46
why is it not relevant?
do you think these 3 people can't make a good and stable family?
do you think there will be no lasting love in the house? to much jealousy?

if you accept gay marriage, why not discuss this kind of families?

You can start a new thread about group marriage. Its not very relevant to this thread.

Carlos
28-01-17, 02:22
Marriage among gays? Spanish television has recorded a documentary in Russia. There are geeks in the purest style of black novel that are dedicated to locate homosexual teachers and get the Russian government expel these teachers from their jobs destroying their lives. How stupid would you think kids are going to be gay because their teacher is gay or lesbian? The gays in Russia live in terror, hiding all day, any unfortunate can beat or kill or expel them from their jobs. I did not know that in Russia they were so far behind, I was perplexed. It is much more productive and healthy to have a happy person, who can develop his life fully and not someone frightened by going to the psychologist, getting dirty with all the damage he causes around and about himself. I expose him thus to see if these donkeys realize.

Poor gays and lesbians from Russia!!!

medic
08-03-17, 11:19
If the friends that I have that are gay get married, my freindship would not change whatsoever. All I would say is that I am against what he is doing but I would be cool with it, just so long as the my gay friend doesn't let it come between our friendship.

firetown
09-03-17, 13:05
I have always respected other people's desire to make themselves happy without impacting me negatively.

The_Lyonnist
29-03-17, 12:08
Sodomy is the wrong way.

Carlos
29-03-17, 14:36
There will be hundreds of opinions, from religious, moral, against and in favor, but the reality is that in the end everyone tries to put it in a hot hole and touch the sky for a few minutes.

tivali
13-05-17, 11:41
I oppose homosexual marriage, because this is unnature and abnormal in our bio-circle... feel bad for it.

Maleth
13-05-17, 13:09
I oppose homosexual marriage, because this is unnature and abnormal in our bio-circle... feel bad for it.

Don't be harsh on yourself Tivali.

http://www.yalescientific.org/2012/03/do-animals-exhibit-homosexuality/

Welcome to Eupida and the world of genetics :smile:

Dinarid
28-05-17, 21:39
Sodomy is the wrong way.
Pathetic one-line comments meant to be bold or 'edgy' reveal a lack of intellect.

Yetos
29-05-17, 00:05
οκ

I can respect the sexual difference,
as long as it respects me, and my prefers
but don't you think is alittle bit 'over stretched'

the 'first ladies' (wifes) of NATO countries leaders,

http://news247.gr/eidiseis/kosmos/news/article4692651.ece/ALTERNATES/w460/sis260517.jpg

why I have a feeling that something is wrong the picture?
ok maybe my eyes are still not used/familiar in such photos,
but don't you think is a little bit extraordinary and overstretched?

Dinarid
29-05-17, 02:44
οκ

I can respect the sexual difference,
as long as it respects me, and my prefers
but don't you think is alittle bit 'stretched'

the 'first ladies' (wifes) of NATO countries leaders,

http://news247.gr/eidiseis/kosmos/news/article4692651.ece/ALTERNATES/w460/sis260517.jpg

why I have a feeling that something is wrong the picture?
ok maybe my eyes are still not used/familiar in such photos,
but don't you think is a little bit extraordinary and stretched?
I think "first spouse" would be more appropriate.

Gitte
05-07-17, 10:46
I'm pansexual myself - meaning I don't give a shit who I fall in love with. It's the person that counts, not their gender or sex. And honestly, I'd like to marry in a very fancy long dress when my soulmate happens to be a woman.

Angela
28-10-17, 22:33
οκ

I can respect the sexual difference,
as long as it respects me, and my prefers
but don't you think is alittle bit 'over stretched'

the 'first ladies' (wifes) of NATO countries leaders,

http://news247.gr/eidiseis/kosmos/news/article4692651.ece/ALTERNATES/w460/sis260517.jpg

why I have a feeling that something is wrong the picture?
ok maybe my eyes are still not used/familiar in such photos,
but don't you think is a little bit extraordinary and overstretched?

OK, first spouse is more appropriate, as Dinarid said. However, the only one that looks "out of place" is the poor Muslim woman who's made to dress like an alien.

Carlos
17-03-18, 15:51
I usually watch the North American soap opera "Modern family" for years not laughing so much watching t.v. is very good and a homosexual marriage that has even adopted and homosexual marriage that is reflected in the film is no less crazy than the rest of homosexual marriages, which implies a reflection of normality and that after all are human relationships , nothing special.

Angela
17-03-18, 19:51
I usually watch the North American soap opera "Modern family" for years not laughing so much watching t.v. is very good and a homosexual marriage that has even adopted and homosexual marriage that is reflected in the film is no less crazy than the rest of homosexual marriages, which implies a reflection of normality and that after all are human relationships , nothing special.

I like that show a lot too, and you're right: it's like a heterosexual marriage. :)

Gitte
14-07-18, 17:01
All right wo are the 52 assholes who say it's bad and should be banned.

Kind regards,

A girl who likes girls.

ruskabajka
25-07-18, 14:55
I would like Gay people to support polygamy

Dr.SYSTEM
12-09-18, 21:24
(Lot's) people are very happy about this marriage idea...:cool-v:

2.7.0.0

srdceleva
20-09-18, 14:35
I usually watch the North American soap opera "Modern family" for years not laughing so much watching t.v. is very good and a homosexual marriage that has even adopted and homosexual marriage that is reflected in the film is no less crazy than the rest of homosexual marriages, which implies a reflection of normality and that after all are human relationships , nothing special.Yea because we know how accurately t.v represents real life....

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

srdceleva
20-09-18, 14:37
All right wo are the 52 assholes who say it's bad and should be banned.

Kind regards,

A girl who likes girls.I'm one of them, why should we be banned because we have a different opinion? And why so agressive obviously you don't have kind regards for people who don't support homosexuality.

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

Alexandra97
25-09-18, 19:53
I'm not religious and I'm part of the community myself so obviously I want everywhere to be a safe place for LGBT people and for everyone to have the same human rights. But even from aa religious point of view, I really doubt Jesus was an ******* and hated people for something they couldn't help.

Angela
25-09-18, 20:01
I'm not religious and I'm part of the community myself so obviously I want everywhere to be a safe place for LGBT people and for everyone to have the same human rights. But even from aa religious point of view, I really doubt Jesus was an ******* and hated people for something they couldn't help.

Exactly.

@srdceleva,
No one's banning anyone.

Personally, I don't get why they want it so badly, other than assome form of acceptance, because it's like jumping on a sinking ship.

davef
26-09-18, 13:30
I support gay/transsexual marriage 100 percent!!! 100000 percent! Infinite percent! Seriously though, i think it's wrong to deny marriage to any couple based on them being of the same sex

Farstar
26-09-18, 13:53
I think all marriages should be banned. The reason is that when a couple (either hetero or homo) gets married, immediately the individuals of the couple get "rights". These rights, at least in Europe, are the rights to get pensions in some circumstances. The problem is these pensions are funded by taxes paid by individuals who have nothing to do with that marriage. This is an externality. Since it makes no sense that I have to fund payments to a couple when, for example, this couple divorces, I do not want that official marriages exist. Of course, private contracts are OK.

srdceleva
26-09-18, 15:57
I think all marriages should be banned. The reason is that when a couple (either hetero or homo) gets married, immediately the individuals of the couple get "rights". These rights, at least in Europe, are the rights to get pensions in some circumstances. The problem is these pensions are funded by taxes paid by individuals who have nothing to do with that marriage. This is an externality. Since it makes no sense that I have to fund payments to a couple when, for example, this couple divorces, I do not want that official marriages exist. Of course, private contracts are OK.In a culture where no children are being born it's mean as an incentive for couples to come together and start families, I don't see anything wrong with that as it's necessary.

Sent from my KIW-L21 using Tapatalk

srdceleva
26-09-18, 15:58
Exactly.

@srdceleva,
No one's banning anyone.

Personally, I don't get why they want it so badly, other than assome form of acceptance, because it's like jumping on a sinking ship.Kind of true in this day and age.

Farstar
26-09-18, 17:46
Having a government paper does not increase the likelihood of having children. Government could give subsidies for having children (this is an externality, so I could agree with it), but you can have children when signing a private contract.

On the contrary, the guaranteed payments for signing an official marriage have nothing to do with having children: they are payments in case of a divorce (!) or pensions for old age. Things that people could do privately.

MaraMe
13-02-19, 12:02
In Romania, in 2018, they created a referendum to forbid gay marriages. Fortunately, people didn't bite the trap and didn't wont to vote.
I really don't understand what is with this paranoia with gays. They should have the same right like everybody else.

Héloïse
12-04-19, 13:10
I'm for the gay marriage, in France with have it

morris
16-04-19, 23:33
I support gay marriage 100%. I`m a girl and I love girls

sofitofi
07-05-19, 10:59
It's outrageous how people tend not to mind their business. Love is love, stop using lame arguments to justify your ignorance

ZAkino
14-08-19, 12:11
I'm so sorry. But I dont respect this...

Wanderer
18-08-19, 16:35
I dont care about gays getting married.

bigsnake49
01-10-19, 19:27
I think gay marriage was banned by the state and the official religion because it did not produce children. Same as the prohibition against masturbation and abortion. Always look for rational reasons of self interest behind these kind of prohibitions.

I()
01-10-19, 20:03
I think it's a disgusting psychic/psychiatric deviation. It needs more medical attention. That's all.

Krum
03-10-19, 16:57
Forbidden because it is unnatural, antimoral. Whoever he wants to go to bed with but doesn't need to occupy the whole world. Once they want to have a gay marriage, they find a way to reproduce without using a donor of the other sex. If that were normal then physiologically they would be able to reproduce. Gay marriage. Absolutely not

AlexWill1989
14-12-20, 16:30
Personally, I think this should be allowed. This is one of the variants of the norm. And who cares who is married to whom? Just give others the opportunity to be happy.