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Golgo_13
12-03-04, 03:03
Why are Americans (of all races) so fat?

Don't tell me it's the carbs. Oriental people eat mostly rice and noodles and you rarely see any obese people in China or Japan. There are good carbs and bad carbs. Cakes, pies, cookies, etc. are bad carbs.

Same thing in Europe. Very few really fat people.

I have my own ideas but it might offend some people so I want to hear your thoughts first.

One thing I will say is this, if the Japanese continue to Americanize their diet, and kids play with computers all day instead of being active outside, they WILL have the same problem.

Winter
12-03-04, 03:19
I'd say a big factor is time.

There are no annual vacations in this country, the US, like there is say, in France. So because of that, and the retarded 'American Dream', people are pressured into working constantly, and long hours, and for foodstuffs are forced to resort to whatever is convinient; which is fast foods evidently.

Hachiko
12-03-04, 05:54
America sucks as a nation, doesn't it? :(
*longs for the day when he is freed from the burdens, the shackles, the slavery of the American dream*

mad pierrot
12-03-04, 06:00
Consumerism is aimed at making life easier for people. America is, in my opinion, the forefront of rampant consumerism. Hence the fat get fatter. That being said, there are lots of other things that aren't helping, too. When ever I return to the U.S. after being away for an extended period of time, I'm always suprised just how fat people can be back home.

Winter
12-03-04, 06:08
I dont think America sucks at all Hachiko. Its our choice if we want to succumb to the false ideology of materialism. I choose to defy it. I also choose to defy the norm of what our society says.

Thats why America doesnt suck to me. I can defy, freely. More or less, anyway.

Golgo_13
12-03-04, 06:59
America doesn't suck.

But its people are very lazy, selfish and irresponsible. If a person gets fat by eating 5 Big Macs a day, it's his own damn fault. Why should McDonald's be sued by him? Lack of time is always the convenient excuse for not getting enough exercise. Bicylce sales are way down in the U.S. because kids won't even ride bikes anymore. When I was a kid, I came home from school and went out the door to play and wouldn't come home until dinner time.

With all this material wealth in the U.S. many people are still very unhappy emotionally, and they find comfort in food because it's instantly gratifying. People will do more of what makes them feel good, and eating is a major source of pleasure and leisure for Americans. What if sex were instantly and widely available, we'd all be screwing like rabbits. Donuts and cakes ARE widely available.

Even fast food isn't so bad if you only eat a little of it, but most people eat far too much. And where is it etched in stone that you have to have dessert with every meal?

One thing that no one ever mentions is, we have to be honest with ourselves and STOP using word "weight" and start using the word "FAT". Bodyweight is not the problem; it's bodyfat that's the problem. Most people are in denial and refuse to accept the fact that they're fat. So they say "I need to lose WEIGHT" which doesn't sound as bad. You could cut off your arm and lose 20 lbs. "OverFAT" instead of "overweight." I'm 5'10" and 215 lbs. Even though I would be considered "overweight" because I weigh a bit more than the norm at my height, but I'm not over-fat.

:ramen:

mad pierrot
12-03-04, 07:14
Is it just Americans who seek instant gratification? Would other people do the same if they had the option? Is it human nature, or something else?

On a side note, I'm bothered that we even let fat people sue Mc Donalds for something like that.

budd
13-03-04, 02:32
”and you rarely see any obese people in China or Japan"
i saw them last time... more mcdonalds too
and the word is asian, i heard

Maciamo
13-03-04, 03:22
Why are Americans (of all races) so fat?


It might be due to overeating, too much junk food, poor dietary balance (too much sugar or sauce) or possibly GM food for which the US is so famous (and so different from Europe and Asia in this regard). Inactivity might be another reason. Watching too much TV all day long. Even without doing sport, not moving all day, but reading studying or using the internet is more active and indeed consumes energy.




Same thing in Europe. Very few really fat people.


The really fat people I've seen where all from English-speaking countries. The UK fares best, but there are also some fat people there. Australia has some very American-like cases. :emblaugh: Germans can be sturdy, but not obese with very soft jelly-like lard around the waist and jumping at every step, like I've seen among Americans.



One thing I will say is this, if the Japanese continue to Americanize their diet, and kids play with computers all day instead of being active outside, they WILL have the same problem.

Don't think so, because Japanese already do much less sport than Americans. Lot's of Japanese teenagers stay all day at home, either studying, playing video games, reading or sulking. :sorry: They don't seem to be getting fatter. It's so exceptional to see overweight people in Japan that it surprises you when you see one. But again, even if McDonald and other burger restaurant are legions in Japan, they serve tea, coffee, water or juice instead of coke and other soft drinks. Then people don't order 5 big mac for their lunch. 1 or 2 is enough.

kirei_na_me
13-03-04, 03:31
I still say it's mostly genetics. The Japanese are just naturally small and thin. I think they must have a very high metabolism. My husband eats like a PIG, never--and I mean never--exercises. He used to have a fit if I even suggested he go walking with me, as a matter of fact. Yet, he still remains very thin. It's like that with all the Japanese people I know.

Frank D. White
13-03-04, 03:42
my Japanese exchange student friend who ate extrodinary amounts of food & never gained a pound in her 4 years here. She ate all the wrong foods, no weight gain!

Frank
:note: :ramen:

Frank D. White
13-03-04, 04:01
take the heat for killing Americans for a change, in place of guns. The NRA members are pigging out on junk food in celebration of all the distraction!!

Frank

:blush:

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 04:12
Is it just Americans who seek instant gratification? Would other people do the same if they had the option? Is it human nature, or something else?


All humans do, except not everyone let's it turn into a national health crisis in other countries.

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 04:22
”and you rarely see any obese people in China or Japan"
i saw them last time...
and the word is asian, i heard

As many as you do in the States? Oh come on!

Asian? What kind of word is that? A racial category?

Could you have an "American race"? No, because people of different races live in America. Asia starts from Turkey and extends out to the northeastern end of Siberia. People of different races live in Asia as well. My co-worker from Afghanistan has just as much right to call himself an "Asian," even though he is not Oriental.

If Orientals have to be "Asians", why aren't blacks simply called "Africans" and whites "Europeans"?

When that happens, maybe I'll consider calling myself an "Asian".

Until then, sorry for insulting myself. I'll call myself whatever I want.

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 04:26
I still say it's mostly genetics. The Japanese are just naturally small and thin. I think they must have a very high metabolism. My husband eats like a PIG, never--and I mean never--exercises. He used to have a fit if I even suggested he go walking with me, as a matter of fact. Yet, he still remains very thin. It's like that with all the Japanese people I know.

But most Europeans are not obese. White Americans share a common ancestry with them and therefore similar genes and DNA.

As diet and lifestyles change (as is what's happening in Japan), genetic makeup and metabolism will likely be affected over generations.

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 04:32
my Japanese exchange student friend who ate extrodinary amounts of food & never gained a pound in her 4 years here. She ate all the wrong foods, no weight gain!

Frank
:note: :ramen:

All those people who used to compete in eating contests in Japan were pretty slim. The guy who used to eat 50+ hotdogs in 10 minutes in Coney Island, NY was a small guy.

That's all very well, but . . . if you are the type who get heavy by eating only a few donuts, you have to accept it and try to do something about it.

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 04:35
take the heat for killing Americans for a change, in place of guns. The NRA members are pigging out on junk food in celebration of all the distraction!!

Frank

:blush:

What's your favorite piece of weapon?

I like a Colt Woodsman .22 because when I was a kid there was a Japanese comic book series called "Wild Seven", about 7 renegade cops. The main character packed a Woodsman.

Satori
13-03-04, 06:03
The French Diet
By Sandra Gordon
WebMD Medical News

Oct. 30, 2000 -- Flaky croissants, plump snails and frogs' legs swimming in butter, triple-fat cheese, melt-in-your mouth foie gras (goose or duck liver), and clouds of chocolate mousse: For centuries, the French living in north and central France have feasted on such hedonistic pleasures. Yet, on the streets of Paris, most women appear enviably slim.

In fact, despite their rich diet, the French generally are slimmer than Americans. According to the Institut National de la Sante et la Recherche Medicale in Paris (the equivalent to the National Institutes of Health), just 8% of the French qualify as obese, compared to 33% of Americans. How do the French do it? It's more than good genes -- and Americans may well want to follow their lead. How? The French tend to snack less and savor their meals more slowly -- which could lead to eating less food overall.

How They Do It

The eating patterns of the French offer significant clues to their healthfulness. For one, they traditionally don't take lunch lightly. In a study that tracked the eating habits of 50 blue-collar workers in Paris and Boston, the French participants consumed 60% of their day's calories before 2 p.m., followed later by a small dinner, so they were less likely to sleep on a major calorie cushion. Second, the study found that the French participants didn't snack, generally defined as consuming one to two between-meal foods, such as a handful of peanuts and a glass of orange juice. "The French ate less than one snack a day. Here in the U.S., we have about three snacks a day," says R. Curtis Ellison, MD, professor of preventive medicine and epidemiology at Boston University School of Medicine and the study's lead researcher.

Like Americans, the French traditionally consume three meals a day. But that's where the similarity ends. For the French, lunch and dinner are the most structured meals, consisting of a starter, such as crudite (raw vegetables), followed by a main course, a salad, the cheese course, and perhaps dessert. Their substantial lunch and dinner often usurps the need for a snack. As a result, "snacking is simply not part of the culture," says Annie Jacquet-Bentley, a Parisian restaurant consultant currently based in Birchrunville, Pa. Her eating habits remain fiercely snack-free despite having lived in the snack-filled U.S. for more than 20 years.

Meals in France traditionally are regarded as experiences to be savored -- sanctimonious time-outs that a snack can otherwise spoil. "Even if the French don't have a lot of time, they will sit down and have a two- or three-course meal," Jacquet-Bentley says. "Food is a life pleasure, and it's meant to be enjoyed. For both lunch and dinner, people tend not to rush if they can help it."

Granted, snacking in French cities like Paris is gaining ground -- the Paris Metro, for example, recently installed vending machines in several stations. Still, many French find the practice distasteful. According to the European Snack Food Association, 81% of French consumers surveyed think that eating between meals can be a problem or is clearly unhealthy.

Snack-Attack Nation

On the other hand, in the U.S., snacking is a $30 billion industry that has increased 33% since 1988, according to the U.S. Snack Food Association, with high-fat, high-calorie options, such as pork rinds, cheese, and corn snacks, leading sales. It seems downright un-American not to snack. Still, according to a 1998 survey conducted by the Calorie Control Council in Atlanta, 43% of adult Americans blame snacking as the reason they can't maintain their desired weight.

"Snacking can be detrimental to weight loss because you're confronting food more often," says Karen Miller-Kovach, MS, RD, chief scientist at Weight Watchers International, in which case, it's often harder to stop eating once you've started. Snacking also can be fattening because it contributes to total calorie consumption. According to a 1993 study published in Appetite, which managed to find 273 obese French women, those in the study who snacked (60%) ate more at meals and between meals than those who didn't.

"The less often you eat, the fewer calories you consume," says David Levitsky, PhD, professor of nutritional sciences at Cornell University in Ithaca, N.Y., who has conducted numerous studies on snacking. According to Levitsky, when people are allowed snacks, they may eat as much at their next meal as if they didn't snack. All told, snackers tend to consume more total calories than nonsnackers, Levitsky says.

Taming the Snacking Tiger

On the other hand, snacking doesn't have to be all bad. It may even help you lose weight if you snack judiciously or have frequent, smaller meals throughout the day -- as long as they're nutritious. "Having a regular pattern of snacks can be an effective strategy to keep hunger at bay so you don't overeat at the next meal," Miller-Kovach says. However, snacking is a dieting strategy that works for some people and not for others. "If you're going to snack, you need to be a planner," Miller-Kovach says. She offers some tips to fit snacking into your diet without blowing your calorie budget:

* Be prepared: Don't let a snack attack take you by surprise. To resist calorie-laden vending machine fare, for example, have healthy, satisfying snack foods on hand, such as nonfat yogurt, fresh fruit (apples, oranges, or bananas), dried fruit (raisins), rice cakes, animal crackers, packets of unflavored instant oatmeal, and low-cal beverages (herbal tea, flavored seltzers, or diet hot chocolate). In general, foods rich in calcium, such as low-fat or nonfat yogurt; iron, such as lentil soup; or fiber, such as whole-grain crackers, are good snacking choices because they contain nutrients lacking in many American women's diets. If you have trouble stopping at one serving, buy single-serving containers, says Fran Grossman, MS, RD, a nutritionist at Mount Sinai Medical Center in New York City.

* Get it write: Snacks have a way of working themselves into your day. To avoid snacking amnesia (did I eat that?), write down the snacks you eat in a food diary. Even better, try reverse journaling, suggests Miller-Kovach. Record the snacks you plan to consume, then check off each after you've eaten it. (You can use this weight loss strategy for meals, too.)

* Personalize your snacking choices: To make sure your snack hits the spot, "find your personal preference in terms of what satisfies you," Miller-Kovach says. For example, if you tend to like crunchy snacks, stock your desk drawer with an apple or a tiny box of animal crackers. If you crave creaminess, try fat-free or low-fat yogurt or low-fat vanilla or chocolate pudding. Seeking something salty? Opt for fat-free pretzels. Something sweet? Go for sorbet or a frozen yogurt pop.

If you'd rather do like the French and avoid snacking, eat more at meals and have something to drink -- water or a diet beverage -- should a snack attack hit. If that doesn't work, and the chocolate bar or corn chips still call your name, go ahead and press that vending machine button. But whatever you do, don't gobble guiltily. Instead, do like the French when it comes to eating in general: For maximum satisfaction, savor that snack very slowly.

Sandra Gordon, a health/nutrition writer in Weston, Conn., is the co-author of The 30 Secrets of the World's Healthiest Cuisines.

Golgo_13
13-03-04, 06:05
Satori,

How ya bin? We haven't seen you here lately. Hope you found a good job.

Satori
13-03-04, 06:19
Satori,

How ya bin? We haven't seen you here lately. Hope you found a good job.

Hi Golgo! I haven't found a job yet, but I did just move into a new home last week, which is nice. Hopefully, I'll find a new job soon! Thanks for your kind thoughts. How are things with you?

Satori

Maciamo
13-03-04, 07:38
I still say it's mostly genetics. The Japanese are just naturally small and thin.

It's certainly not only genetics. That wouldn't explain the disparity between Europeans and white Americans.

I also eat a lot (3 times more than my parents or other relative, or any most Japanese), but I stay slim as well. Exercice is not the only factor. I know I use a lot of intellectual energy. Sometimes weather has an influence too. Winters in Tokyo aren't so cold, but the temperature inside a house and outside is usually the same, around 5 degree the evening or night (even with heating, once you turn it off, 5 min later it's freezing again). Consequently, I have been eating more and losing weight this winter !

I suppose that a balanced diet helps a lot not gain weight. There are periods when I eat pasta too often, and immediately put on a few kilos.

Luc
13-03-04, 20:12
"I still say it's mostly genetics. The Japanese are just naturally small and thin. "

So how do the sumo's get so fat?

kirei_na_me
13-03-04, 23:15
Because they eat a tremendous amount of food and then go to sleep. How many sumo wrestlers are in all of Japan? I don't think you can base anything on not even a handful of the population. Especially when they have a specialized diet and most started out taller than average and pretty husky anyway.

By the way, I thought this was a pretty interesting article on the diet of the sumo:

http://www.gastronomica.org/gastro/pages/sample4.1.html

Frank D. White
13-03-04, 23:51
What's your favorite piece of weapon?

I like a Colt Woodsman .22 because when I was a kid there was a Japanese comic book series called "Wild Seven", about 7 renegade cops. The main character packed a Woodsman.

the first made, very old model! I carry a 45ACP, cocked&locked, 8 in the clip, 1 chambered in the small of my back. 2 stainless spare clips of 8 RDS each in the back pocket. Concealed carry since 1973. The shape is imprinted in my back!!

Frank

PS One round is very filling but the person loses a great deal of fluid weight; tough way to diet!!

mdchachi
15-03-04, 17:33
I think if you look at the ratio of total calories consumed to total calories expended you'll find that Americans probably come up with the worst number of just about anywhere. Overeating is the norm (as is over-snacking as that article mentions). Just go to any restaurant and order a typical entree; you will get enough food for two people. On top of that Americans as a whole lead a very sedentary lifestyle. So I think the answer is overeating + inactivity = FAT. A secondary factor is the contents of the diet itself (fatty foods vs carbs & proteins) but I think the overall number of calories is the main problem.

den4
16-03-04, 07:28
I don't think it's genetics...I've seen Mexican folks living on their diet and never get fat...but get them into the US, and they become blimps (pardon the imagery). I think it's the massive sugar intake...nearly every foreigner that enters American complains about how overly sweet things are in the US...Krispy Kreme Anyone? And you don't just get a 150 ml of coke to down them donuts, you get your 2 gallon jug of your favorite sweet drink at 7-11, and don't forget to super size it at McDees, or get one pizza free when you buy two extra large size....the pattern I see is over consumption...not satisfied with Japanese portions of food....you gotta supersize everything :D

Mandylion
18-03-04, 02:00
Posted for EscaFlowne

:o
Actually in a sense its both of those what your talking about. America dose have this lovely thing with sugar and supersizing. But also genetics as well. There was an article on the news where they believe that some people are destined to turn into "Blimps" as you so lovely said it while others are not. I believe America's need to supersize and add an large amount of sugar to everything just dosen't help the average person stay thin.
:o
but i'm just speaking...eep!...i mean meep!

Hachiko
18-03-04, 02:40
Lot of factors:

Our Lifestyle
Our Work Habit
Our Genetics
Our Diet
Our Attitude towards life (which has plenty of stress.)

etc. etc. etc.

Golgo_13
18-03-04, 03:35
One last factor:

Making excuses

kirei_na_me
18-03-04, 04:11
One last factor:

Making excuses

True.

I think I was lucky in that I was pushed into running by a mom who was and still is a P.E. teacher and track coach for 30 years. I used to run an average of 5 miles per day. I don't do that now, but I do have to have at least 1 hour's worth of exercise(walking now) every single day. If I don't, I feel like a blob.

I wish people could realize it's not that painful. I put on the mp3 player, volume up as loud as it'll go, and get going. Either on the treadmill or out on the town. It does a body good. Good for you emotionally as well as physically.

Hachiko
18-03-04, 04:13
One last factor:

Making excuses

Whoops, I forgot that one. :p

Kirei, I agree, walking is pretty good. I do it every day. It makes you feel better, and it boosts your libido (indirectly). But that's just me, I don't know about you guys...although I do know it benefits you, in one way or another.... :blush:

(500th post.)

kirei_na_me
18-03-04, 04:15
Yes, does good things for the libido. Not that I need it for that, though... :blush:

(congrats on post 500!)

Hachiko
18-03-04, 04:20
Yes, does good things for the libido. Not that I need it for that, though... :blush:

(congrats on post 500!)

[shameless plug]
*pouts, tousles hair* Well I do! I'm a virgin, out of love, and out of time for anything that has to do with. *pouts again, smiles like Tomo-chan*
[/shameless plug]

(Thanks for the compliment.)

Satori
18-03-04, 04:21
Speaking of posts, I wonder what happened to all of mine. I used to have about 650, but now only have about 180. Anyone know?

Hachiko
18-03-04, 04:22
Speaking of posts, I wonder what happened to all of mine. I used to have about 650, but now only have about 180. Anyone know?

Not to play devil's advocate, Satori, but have you been posting on the Chit-Chat/Humour sections? :clueless:

Satori
18-03-04, 04:25
Not to play devil's advocate, Satori, but have you been posting on the Chit-Chat/Humour sections? :clueless:

Do you mean a long time ago? If so, yes. But if you are referring to since the site was changed (which is also when my number of posts decreased), then no. Did the policy change or something while I was gone??

kirei_na_me
18-03-04, 04:43
Satori, posts made or that were made in the Chit Chat/Humour sections don't count anymore.

Here's the little discussion we had about it:

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7159

Maciamo
18-03-04, 04:52
I don't think it's genetics...I've seen Mexican folks living on their diet and never get fat...but get them into the US, and they become blimps (pardon the imagery). I think it's the massive sugar intake...nearly every foreigner that enters American complains about how overly sweet things are in the US...Krispy Kreme Anyone? And you don't just get a 150 ml of coke to down them donuts, you get your 2 gallon jug of your favorite sweet drink at 7-11, and don't forget to super size it at McDees, or get one pizza free when you buy two extra large size....the pattern I see is over consumption...not satisfied with Japanese portions of food....you gotta supersize everything :D

Good point ! :cool: It's surely related to the excess of sugar and big size everything.

Golgo_13
18-03-04, 05:21
[shameless plug]
I'm a virgin, out of love, and out of time for anything that has to do with.


Me too!

"Like a virgin, touched for the very first time, like a virrrrrgin, when your heart beats, next to mine . . . . "

:D :p :sorry: :cool: :shock: :D :p :sorry: :cool: :shock:
:D :p :sorry: :cool: :shock: :D :p :sorry: :cool: :shock:

Satori
18-03-04, 05:35
Satori, posts made or that were made in the Chit Chat/Humour sections don't count anymore.

Here's the little discussion we had about it:

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7159

Thanks! That definitely solves the mystery.

m477
18-03-04, 06:49
I think it's just simply that Americans in general consume more calories and are less active. I mean, what other reasonable explanation is there, considering the number of fat Asian-Americans and skinny white Europeans. Sure there are some Japanese big eaters, but after observing people in Japan, that doesn't seem like the norm here. The portions at most resturants in Japan are pretty modest by American standards. And Americans take their cars everywhere. In Japan, even in suburban areas, far more people walk, bike, or take public transportation (taking the train might not seem like a major fat-burner, but subways usually involve lots of stairs, and trying not to fall down during rush hour probably burns more calories than sitting in a car).

Also, you can observe the same phenomenon just within the US. Compare how many fat people there are in the Midwest to NYC, where people walk more and there aren't as many of the typical American franchise resutants with supersize portions.

den4
22-03-04, 21:34
I guess what I should have said was "I don't think it's just genetics..." :D But then, what do I know? :D

Minty
01-06-06, 02:20
I think it's just simply that Americans in general consume more calories and are less active. I mean, what other reasonable explanation is there, considering the number of fat Asian-Americans and skinny white Europeans. Sure there are some Japanese big eaters, but after observing people in Japan, that doesn't seem like the norm here. The portions at most resturants in Japan are pretty modest by American standards. And Americans take their cars everywhere. In Japan, even in suburban areas, far more people walk, bike, or take public transportation (taking the train might not seem like a major fat-burner, but subways usually involve lots of stairs, and trying not to fall down during rush hour probably burns more calories than sitting in a car).
Also, you can observe the same phenomenon just within the US. Compare how many fat people there are in the Midwest to NYC, where people walk more and there aren't as many of the typical American franchise resutants with supersize portions.

Yes, the Japanese walk a lot and they are very active like people in HK, Taiwan, SG...etc. Japanese food is also very light in calories and oil. People in Asia sleep very little and work for long hours so they burn off more calories just from daily work of life without doing much sport, but after they work they still go out and do activities at night and that burn more calories.

No, it's not genetics, maybe so for some Asian within the nation but certainly not the entire nation.