Macedonians

Balkan1992 said:
The current Macedonian DNA (FYROM) is predominantly Balkan (Southern Slavic) but also with Greek influences plus small influences from other populations (Turks, Gypsies)
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Not much different than the Romanian I reckon, only that the Gypsy DNA is more present in Romanians rather than Macedonians...
 
Aspar said:
Not much different than the Romanian I reckon, only that the Gypsy DNA is more present in Romanians rather than Macedonians...
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It is true that there are more Gypsies in Romania. It sounds a little ironic, but Gypsies are a reality in both Macedonia and Romania, Serbia, Hungary, etc. I personally are not an authentic romanian, part of my origins are in Greece (Macedonia).
 
Balkan1992 said:
It is true that there are more Gypsies in Romania. It sounds a little ironic, but Gypsies are a reality in both Macedonia and Romania, Serbia, Hungary, etc. I personally are not an authentic romanian, part of my origins are in Greece (Macedonia).
Click to expand...

Interesting, I believe that your ancestors from Macedonia were either Aromanians or Meglen Vlachs.
Am I right?
 
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I've decided to count my Balkan matches at MyHeritage DNA and to compare their number with the respective size of the population in question so I can calculate a percentage!
Until now I have 812 dna matches and they keep rising day by day, which is why I appreciate MyHeritage DNA, since they have a large data base!
By Balkan matches I mean: Macedonians, Albanians, Serbs, Bosniaks, Bulgarians, Greeks, Croats and Romanians!
It's an easy job for a Balkaner to differentiate between people of the nations above because of the specific names and surnames the people from the Balkans have.
The only difficulty I had was that I can't differentiate much between Serbs and Croats so I decided to lump them together with the Muslim Bosniaks under the name "Yugoslavs", mainly because many of them didn't put place of origin or they had places of origin all over the former Yugoslavia so I couldn't really know what they really are!

This are my results:

I match strongest with ... Macedonians. Well, not really surprising since I am Macedonian myself from the south-east of the country.
I have 17 Macedonian matches with MyHeritage DNA, and compared to the size of the Macedonian population, I've got 0.850%!

Second strongest match for me, surprisingly, are the Albanians. I have 60 Albanian matches which is fascinating number although when compared to their population size, that amounts to 0.600%, which is the second best and behind the Macedonians.

The third strongest match are the Greeks. I have 67 Greek matches, which is the most of all Balkan countries, however when compared to the population size of the Greeks, that amounts to 0.432%, which is the third best result!

The fourth strongest match are the Yugoslavs(Serbs, Croats, Bosniaks). I have 51 Yugoslav match and when compared to the population size, I get 0.242. Around 5 - 10 of those were with Mulsim names, so probably Bosniaks. I guess the Croats as well are around 5 - 10, and the rest should have Serbian origin I guess!

The most surprising for me was that I have only 12 Bulgarian matches, which amounts to 0.126%! According to some logic that Macedonians and Bulgarians are considered as very close people, mainly because they speak very similar languages, I thought that the Bulgarians will come as a strong match, but that wasn't the case.

And at the last place are the Romanians with who I have 26 matches and which amounts to 0.096%!

So, my strongest matches are in this order: Macedonians, Albanians, Greeks, Yugoslavs, Bulgarians and Romanians!
One thing I've noticed about the Albanians is that although I match strongly with them, that admixture probably happened long time ago, medievals maybe, since the longest matching segment I have with an Albanian is only 10.3 cM, with an Albanian from Macedonia!
While with some Macedonians, Bulgarians, Serbs, Greeks and even Romanians I match on segments long between 20 - 30 cM!
It's also worth mentioning that I match that Albanian on two segments and the one in question(10.3 cM, Chr1), I call it the Albanian segment, because I match many other Albanians on that segment and not only from Macedonia but Albania and Kosovo as well!

My MyHeritage DNA commercial result:

South Europe - 51.2%
-Greek - 30.1%
-Italian - 21.1%

East Europe - 48.8%
-Balkan - 48.8%
 
Aspar said:
I've decided to count my Balkan matches at MyHeritage DNA and to compare their number with the respective size of the population in question so I can calculate a percentage!
Until now I have 812 dna matches and they keep rising day by day, which is why I appreciate MyHeritage DNA, since they have a large data base!
By Balkan matches I mean: Macedonians, Albanians, Serbs, Bosniaks, Bulgarians, Greeks, Croats and Romanians!
It's an easy job for a Balkaner to differentiate between people of the nations above because of the specific names and surnames the people from the Balkans have.
The only difficulty I had was that I can't differentiate much between Serbs and Croats so I decided to lump them together with the Muslim Bosniaks under the name "Yugoslavs", mainly because many of them didn't put place of origin or they had places of origin all over the former Yugoslavia so I couldn't really know what they really are!

This are my results:

I match strongest with ... Macedonians. Well, not really surprising since I am Macedonian myself from the south-east of the country.
I have 17 Macedonian matches with MyHeritage DNA, and compared to the size of the Macedonian population, I've got 0.850%!

Second strongest match for me, surprisingly, are the Albanians. I have 60 Albanian matches which is fascinating number although when compared to their population size, that amounts to 0.600%, which is the second best and behind the Macedonians.

The third strongest match are the Greeks. I have 67 Greek matches, which is the most of all Balkan countries, however when compared to the population size of the Greeks, that amounts to 0.432%, which is the third best result!

The fourth strongest match are the Yugoslavs(Serbs, Croats, Bosniaks). I have 51 Yugoslav match and when compared to the population size, I get 0.242. Around 5 - 10 of those were with Mulsim names, so probably Bosniaks. I guess the Croats as well are around 5 - 10, and the rest should have Serbian origin I guess!

The most surprising for me was that I have only 12 Bulgarian matches, which amounts to 0.126%! According to some logic that Macedonians and Bulgarians are considered as very close people, mainly because they speak very similar languages, I thought that the Bulgarians will come as a strong match, but that wasn't the case.

And at the last place are the Romanians with who I have 26 matches and which amounts to 0.096%!

So, my strongest matches are in this order: Macedonians, Albanians, Greeks, Yugoslavs, Bulgarians and Romanians!
One thing I've noticed about the Albanians is that although I match strongly with them, that admixture probably happened long time ago, medievals maybe, since the longest matching segment I have with an Albanian is only 10.3 cM, with an Albanian from Macedonia!
While with some Macedonians, Bulgarians, Serbs, Greeks and even Romanians I match on segments long between 20 - 30 cM!
It's also worth mentioning that I match that Albanian on two segments and the one in question(10.3 cM, Chr1), I call it the Albanian segment, because I match many other Albanians on that segment and not only from Macedonia but Albania and Kosovo as well!

My MyHeritage DNA commercial result:

South Europe - 51.2%
-Greek - 30.1%
-Italian - 21.1%

East Europe - 48.8%
-Balkan - 48.8%
Click to expand...

What are you considering "population" here? The numbers seem quite off if you are referring to total population of each nation.
 
Mals said:
What are you considering "population" here? The numbers seem quite off if you are referring to total population of each nation.
Click to expand...
By population size I mean the overall number of a population in question in the world!
I got the numbers from Wikipedia which cites the official numbers of the populations in question from several sources!
For example, there are around 2 milion ethnic Macedonians in the world, not just the country.
So, for calcupating percentage, 17 : 2000 * 100 = 0.850
Notice that I converted 2000000 to 2000 for a better resolution.

Than there are around 10 milion Albanians in this world.
So we got, 60 : 10000 * 100 = 0.600
And so on.
 
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Because we apparently have a remnant of ancient Macedonians that have remained relatively isolated (in the Kalash), and because these people recently tested as relatives of modern Austrians and Germans, am I wrong in seeing this as a serious and somewhat definitive hint of their background?
 
jmedlin81 said:
Because we apparently have a remnant of ancient Macedonians that have remained relatively isolated (in the Kalash), and because these people recently tested as relatives of modern Austrians and Germans, am I wrong in seeing this as a serious and somewhat definitive hint of their background?
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This thread is about the ethnic Macedonians not about the ancient ones.
But now since you've mentioned it, can we have a look of the DNA of these 'isolated' Kalash and compare it?
I mean, can you back up what you are saying with a proof(dna study, ancient Macedonian sample etc.)?
Otherwise, I will consider your contribution as nothing but a pure science fiction derived from the infamous Apricity circle!
 
Aspar said:
This thread is about the ethnic Macedonians not about the ancient ones.
But now since you've mentioned it, can we have a look of the DNA of these 'isolated' Kalash and compare it?
I mean, can you back up what you are saying with a proof(dna study, ancient Macedonian sample etc.)?
Otherwise, I will consider your contribution as nothing but a pure science fiction derived from the infamous Apricity circle!
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which ethnic?

the begore the Soros treaty?
or the ones after?
 
Aspar said:
There is nothing Serbian in today's Macedonians and stop spreading your Serbian propaganda around...
I am a Macedonian with e-v13 y-dna haplogroup and my matches are mostly English, Bulgarian, Italian...
It's suggested that id descend from the native people who lived here before the arrival of the Slavs.

Also my autosomal dna ged match eurogenes k13 and k15 result suggests similarity with Greek Thessaly and Bulgaria.

Here is the haplogroup diversity in modern Macedonans:

I1 I2*/I2a I2b R1a R1b G J2 J*/J1 E1b1b T Q N
3 23 1.5 13.5 12.5 4 14 2 21.5 1.5 0.5 0.5

As we can see, it's much different distribution than in the Serbs where J2 and R1b are poor, and I2a is much more than in Macedonians.

Once again stop spreading lies about the Macedonians, we have nothing to do with you.
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Thanks for the post. I see a ruined person from Macedonia here. I was very tired of reading Serbian fantasies.
 
In Bulgaria, we say that when a lie is repeated a hundred times, it becomes the truth. I am very surprised that the proud citizens of the Democratic People's Republic of Macedonia (that's the new name, right?) have not invented a new Origin Story for themselves.
In the end, though, it's not going to matter much: they will awaken one morning and find that their haplogroups have suddenly become Albanian... and they are going to deserve it :(
 
Why is it that both the Albanians and the current "north Macedonians" want to claim reflected glory? It's like me even though I am a Greek claiming the glory of the ancient Athenians. My folks came from Eastern Thrace they were farmers from time immemorial. Our only accomplishments were that we survived all those invaders that invaded our land. The "Northern Macedonians" and Albanians were shepherds and subsistence farmers. What can they lay claim too? Nothing! At least the Albanians/Arvanites can claim that if it wasn't for them our War of Independence might not have even started. At least they can claim that they are fierce warriors and were hired by the Genovese and the Catalans and the other great pirates of the Mediterranean to guard their castles and farm the areas around the castles in Greece. They kept the peace before the Ottomans arrived. At least they can claim that they helped build the Selimiye Mosque of Edirne (Adrianople). What have the "Northern Macedonians" done?
 
bigsnake49 said:
Why is it that both the Albanians and the current "north Macedonians" want to claim reflected glory? It's like me even though I am a Greek claiming the glory of the ancient Athenians. My folks came from Eastern Thrace they were farmers from time immemorial. Our only accomplishments were that we survived all those invaders that invaded our land. The "Northern Macedonians" and Albanians were shepherds and subsistence farmers. What can they lay claim too? Nothing! At least the Albanians/Arvanites can claim that if it wasn't for them our War of Independence might not have even started. At least they can claim that they are fierce warriors and were hired by the Genovese and the Catalans and the other great pirates of the Mediterranean to guard their castles and farm the areas around the castles in Greece. They kept the peace before the Ottomans arrived. At least they can claim that they helped build the Selimiye Mosque of Edirne (Adrianople). What have the "Northern Macedonians" done?
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its not the way to judge people! If Greeks did what they have done its not they did it because they were smarter than others. They did it because geographical conditions dictated them to build ships and explore the seas. Greeks were living in islands and needed to connect. Greece is almost an archipelago. On the other hand Albanians, N Macedonia's were mostly continental and mountaineers so remained isolated and exchanged little ideas with outside world. You can see from the DNA tests Albanians have a combination of Greek+Ballkan Dna, which shows isolation.
When Greeks, Albanians, N Macedonians are in equal footing, like when they study in USA schools they are equally capable of doing things. Exception so far are only the Jewish who excel in larger numbers.
 
Tutkun Arnaut said:
its not the way to judge people! If Greeks did what they have done its not they did it because they were smarter than others. They did it because geographical conditions dictated them to build ships and explore the seas. Greeks were living in islands and needed to connect. Greece is almost an archipelago. On the other hand Albanians, N Macedonia's were mostly continental and mountaineers so remained isolated and exchanged little ideas with outside world. You can see from the DNA tests Albanians have a combination of Greek+Ballkan Dna, which shows isolation.
When Greeks, Albanians, N Macedonians are in equal footing, like when they study in USA schools they are equally capable of doing things. Exception so far are only the Jewish who excel in larger numbers.
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There were many places with similar conditions as ancient Greece, but few (IMO none) of them developed as distinctive a civilization.
 
Most of the so-called history posted in this thread from the beginning is false. The actual ancient Macedonians mixed with the other Greeks during Hellenistic times. So no "Macedonians" separate from Greeks existed after that. That is indisputable so all the rest is false.
 
markod said:
There were many places with similar conditions as ancient Greece, but few (IMO none) of them developed as distinctive a civilization.
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up to 400 a.d they spoke their language together with Greek. Their language was related to Illyrian and Thracian. There are documents for that. Probably Slavic invasions stopped them from using their language. Even Greek Macedonians today are genetically majority slav
 
Tutkun Arnaut said:
up to 400 a.d they spoke their language together with Greek. Their language was related to Illyrian and Thracian. There are documents for that. Probably Slavic invasions stopped them from using their language. Even Greek Macedonians today are genetically majority slav
Click to expand...

what documents and what proves?
all evidences are clear and to one direction.

the rest are in the mind of ..... people
 
(Nicholas Hammond, British scholar and expert on Macedon, "A History of Macedonia" Vol. ii, 550-336 BC)“
 
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