(NEW) GenePlaza K25 and K29 Modern Calculator Results

Im guessing south Slavic is a proxy for LBK or "east European farmer" ancestry

Promenade said:

Im guessing south Slavic is a proxy for LBK or "east European farmer" ancestry

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hmm, do score roughly 34-36 percent east euro farmer in the K12 one. maybe it is. idk.

Dibran said:

Maybe, maybe not. But, assuming the component is south Slavic then south slavs should at least score higher percentages than Albanians, they are not. Thats the discrepancy. If there was no Albanian Greek like component, it would make sense scoring 50-60 south slavic. It does not make sense when there is an Albanian that would score 60 percent South Slavic, and South Slavs only little or none. I am the only case where I score lower south slavic, but still more than the south slavs who have posted. There just seems to be major discrepancies.

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The reason that's happening, from that chart Jovialis posted that I just saw, is because it's picking up the North Italian/Bulgarian, Romanian similarity.

I admit it's a problem.

Maybe it's better to have clusters like Med, Northwest. I don't know.

Like I said, I don't like calculators based on modern populations. They obscure more than clarify.

Angela said:

"

Originally Posted by Jovialis Why does the sample population, "German 1" get 21.43% South Slavic (even higher than west Slavic 17.45%) 0.18% West African, and 0.11% Oceania/Papuan/Aboriginal???
Also, Greek-Anatolia is way more Caucasus than most people from the Caucasus according to this test."
I wonder if German 1 is Southern Germany. If so, what it's picking up is the more Med and Celtic alleles. If there were an Italian cluster I bet it would pick up an Italian percentage.
As to the Greek-Anatolia thing maybe it has to do with him having creating a Kurd cluster? Do the Caucasus populations have more of that?
Every decision you make on these things has a domino effect.

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Idk, the thing is, if it was Mediterranean or Celtic alleles, the "N Italian" sample looks nothing like it though.

I apologize if we're miscommunicating, but you think Papua and West African would give off that frequency in the Germans? That's what i was most surprised by.

On top of that Papua goes from Germany, and skips all the way to Pastun-Afg 1 before it comes up again.

Nevertheless, like you said this is probably from some anomaly in the algorithm from creating the Kurdish cluster. As well as the confusion cause by using modern populations.

Angela said:

The reason that's happening, from that chart Jovialis posted that I just saw, is because it's picking up the North Italian/Bulgarian, Romanian similarity.

I admit it's a problem.


Maybe it's better to have clusters like Med, Northwest. I don't know.

Like I said, I don't like calculators based on modern populations. They obscure more than clarify.

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I mean mine isnt grossly inaccurate, but I see what you mean. Maybe that would be a better bet.

Jovialis said:

Idk, the thing is, if it was Mediterranean or Celtic alleles, the "N Italian" sample looks nothing like it though.

I apologize if we're miscommunicating, but you think Papua and West African would give off that frequency in the Germans? That's what i was most surprised by. I can see how the Greek-Anatolian would have high Caucasus since they're in turkey.

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I hadn't seen the chart so I was just speculating. Sorry if I misled anyone. People are posting so quickly that if you don't scroll back you'll miss something.

Those admixtures for German 1 are very odd, unless maybe it's East Germans? I've often thought that they probably skew pretty far "east".

Those are very small percentages for Papuan. It's just "noise" I think. If that SSA percentage showed up on 23andme I'd take it seriously. Here, I don't know. There's something "off" perhaps.

As I said, this is why I don't like calculators based on modern populations. Northern Italians getting a big percentage of "South Slavic" on here, as in Bulgarian/Romanian/Montenegrin, whatever, absolutely doesn't mean that they have ancestry from people from those areas within even the last 1600 years or longer. It's just vaguely similar alleles from ancient migrations which hit both areas. It emphatically doesn't mean people from Bergamo, for example, ever got impacted by the "Slavic" migrations.

^^
That's what I chalk it up to as well.
And you haven't misled



Another issue I spotted, Romanians getting 0% Caucasus admixture. When they Do have some respectable amounts. If there's going to be a component for solely Caucasus, it should represent the amount that's in all populations that have it. Seems like it's only visible for certain groups.

Jovialis said:

^^
That's what I chalk it up to as well.
And you haven't misled

Another issue I spotted, Romanians getting 0% Caucasus admixture. When they Do have some respectable amounts. If there's going to be a component for solely Caucasus, it should represent the amount that's in all populations that have it. Seems like it's only visible for certain groups.

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Right again. In most calculators they have more than Northern Italians and Tuscans, for example.

Making Greeks/Albanians have 45% "Caucasian", but Northern Italians 5% seems a bit off too. I know they don't have much, but that kind of disparity seems extreme from the Greek/Albanian end.

Oh, dear, I hope "Kurd" isn't taking this the wrong way. He's very intelligent, capable, and honest. It's just that Southern European ancestry is really complicated.

davef said:

Yes,I used it as another way to say that southern Italians and Sicilians are extremely close genetically.

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I agree that Southern Italians and Sicilians are Genetically close.
That said, AncestryDNA separates us:

Salento said:

I agree that Southern Italians and Sicilians are Genetically close.
That said, AncestryDNA separates us:

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It looks like it's mainly the Salento that is separate, not all of Puglia, Salento. It probably makes sense.

Is there a link to Ancestry's divisions, and maybe a spreadsheet of populations?

Angela said:

It looks like it's mainly the Salento that is separate, not all of Puglia, Salento. It probably makes sense.

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Salento includes: Le Provincie di Lecce, Brindisi and some of Taranto.
Part of Salento also includes: La Grecía Salentina, some of that population have Higher Greek markers. That’s the reason that SOME of Salento is not Included in the Map.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grecìa_Salentina

Angela said:

Right again. In most calculators they have more than Northern Italians and Tuscans, for example.

Making Greeks/Albanians have 45% "Caucasian", but Northern Italians 5% seems a bit off too. I know they don't have much, but that kind of disparity seems extreme from the Greek/Albanian end.

Oh, dear, I hope "Kurd" isn't taking this the wrong way. He's very intelligent, capable, and honest. It's just that Southern European ancestry is really complicated.

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So far no Albanians are scoring Caucasian in amounts greater than 6 percent(my mother), I am 1.7 and my father 1.1. I don't think I have seen an Albanian result on this calc with 45 percent Caucasian.

Salento said:

I agree that Southern Italians and Sicilians are Genetically close.
That said, AncestryDNA separates us:

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I wonder if it has something to do mainly with some kind of shared heritage with the Oscans. In addition to mixing with those other local people.

Dibran said:

So far no Albanians are scoring Caucasian in amounts greater than 6 percent(my mother), I am 1.7 and my father 1.1. I don't think I have seen an Albanian result on this calc with 45 percent Caucasian.

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It would be subsumed in the Greek-Albanian component, since it is ubiquitous throughout the entire Mediterranean. As well as to a lesser degree in Northern Europe; both West and East. For northern countries, maybe much of it's from Yamnaya/steppe ancestry and/or an additional migration as well? Idk what that dark blue component means specifically. Yamnaya/steppe ancestry is around 40% Caucasus within and of itself.

I believe Caucasus is that salmon colored component. Since its most prevalent in the Caucasus samples in the Balkan paper chart.

Greeks look like they get about 35% in the Balkan paper chart; Albanians would have something similar. North Italians get around 1/4 and it increases as you go south.

I believe Angela meant to refer to the "Greek-Anatolian" sample population in the spread sheet that get's around 45% Caucasus.

I am not sure that by adding more components (25) the calculation becomes more reliable. By training i would say the opposite, but maybe this guy did an amazing work.
Would be nice to know the interval of confidence.

Sent from my SM-G903F using Eupedia Forum mobile app

Bergin said:

I am not sure that by adding more components (25) the calculation becomes more reliable. By training i would say the opposite, but maybe this guy did an amazing work.
Would be nice to know the interval of confidence.
Sent from my SM-G903F using Eupedia Forum mobile app

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If anything, they should all be applied the same, instead of subsuming for some, and not others. Or under-representing a particular admixture. But the biggest issue is associating particular groups that merely share some common origins from prehistoric times, and conflating it with a modern population that is since admixed with other things. For example, North Italians getting a high percent of "South Slavic" with this calculator, despite the fact they've never experienced a Slavic invasion. This is why the K12 calculator was superior to this one IMO.

(NEW) GenePlaza K25 Modern Calculator Results

Angela said:

It looks like it's mainly the Salento that is separate, not all of Puglia, Salento. It probably makes sense.

Is there a link to Ancestry's divisions, and maybe a spreadsheet of populations?

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That’s all I can find. They made me login.
AncestryDNA split Italy in 2, North and South. The South split in 8 Genetic Communities, the North doesn’t, and I can’t find Sicily and Sardinia.


Never Mind. Sardinia is with Iberia, and Sicily with Nord Africa.

Done my K25 test:

Southern European 65.6%
- Greek-Albanian 55%
- Sardinian-Sicilian 10.7%

Northern European 24.3%
- Northwestern european 23.1%
- Scandinavian 1.2 %

West Asia 10.1%
- Caucasian 6.8%
- South West Asian 3.2%

(I suppose there is some rounded decimal)

EUROPEAN 100.0%


NORTHERN EUROPEAN 86.7%
- Northwestern European 55.9%
- Scandanavian 30.8%


EASTERN EUROPEAN 13.3%
- Baltic 13.3%

Quite good!! A fine job of Kurd.

Still puzzling about the Baltic component, I guess it has something to do with a Germanic mixture (and/or Corded?).

Anyone???

Stuvanè said:

Done my K25 test:

Southern European 65.6%
- Greek-Albanian 55%
- Sardinian-Sicilian 10.7%

Northern European 24.3%
- Northwestern european 23.1%
- Scandinavian 1.2 %

West Asia 10.1%
- Caucasian 6.8%
- South West Asian 3.2%

(I suppose there is some rounded decimal)

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More Greek-Albanian than Greeks and Albanians lol. Ahh, this calculator gets weirder and weirder.