Politics Will Russia Attack Ukraine?

The party's (FvD and PVV) who are at stake in the Netherlands and who support Putin have together 22 of the 150 seats. The PVV is the third party in our country. How much seats has the fare left (in casu the Belgian PVDA) in the Belgian senate?

5 out of 60.
But in Belgium the senate has no power at all - neither the parliament.
Belgium is a particraty. Dissidents in the parliament are not tolerated by the parties.
The parties are the bodies in power and they are overfunded with taxpayers money.

Both the far left and the far right are - and never have been part of the Belgian government.
There is a 'cordon sanitair' around the far right, which means that the far right gets more and more support from dissatified voters.
The traditional parties get less and less votes but cling together to form a government that can't govern any more because of their ideological differences.
It's a spiral that creates more and more dissatified voters.

It took some 500 days to form todays federal government of Belgium, it is a coallition of 7 small parties who's main objective is to maintain the status quo.
I don't think it's going to end well.

The Belgian economy should perform more or less like the Dutch or the German economy.
But it doesn't, and the main reason is the malfunctioning government.
I'm sure the Dutch are also dissatisfied by their government, but then they haven't seen the Belgian situation yet.
 
Ethnic Russians were only between 1/2 - 2/3 of the Soviet Red Army's soldiers during WW2.


(depending on period; by the end of the war due to huge attrition ethnic Russians were 1/2)


The Soviet Union does not equal Russia in a modern sense. It included much more nations.


Red Army's victory against Nazi Germany was not just a Russian victory, also Ukrainian etc.
 
Both extremes of the political spectrum in the U.S. are no fans of Ukraine, and tend to excuse Putin.

As for someone claiming they supported the wall street protests, and whose posts never miss an opportunity to trash the U.S. stating that he's going to move to a Red State, well, words almost fail me.

Anyone constantly criticizing the U.S. who supports the Wall Street crowd wanting to live in a Red State and thinking that's going to work out for him, especially as a lawyer, is either really a European pretending to be American, or has a completely disorganized and incoherent set of beliefs, and is moreover delusional.

It is so bizarre that it makes me wonder who precisely the person behind this sock could be...
 
On a Polish forum someone posted a conspiracy theory, that the current Putin might be a doppelganger of the original Putin, while the original Putin is already dead. He behaves differently and looks a bit different. Back in Cold War times, all Communist rulers supposedly had doppelgangers.


A user on yet another forum, who is a surgeon, wrote:


"I just lost thirty minutes of my life watching Putin's speech, I can now safely confirm he is a sociopath, with a good taste in plastic surgeons though. That blepharoplasty is on point!"


^^^
What if it is not plastic surgery, but a doppelganger?


=====


BTW has anyone seen this movie? - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sI_cAvLNFM

 
Well if WW3 goes down and you're a true American patriot you should volunteer to save Europe, me I'm a bit old now and suffer from bouts of sciatica, but Scotland if you decide to break away, I'm there for yah! don't bother sending a boat I'll swim! :D
 
So why are the "Russian civilians of Kharkiv" resisting the "Russian peace enforcing operation" you may ask?

Well, the census of 1897 enumerated 81% Ukrainians and only 18% ethnic Russians in Kharkov Governorate:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kharkov_Governorate#1897_Russian_Census

Further censuses returned similar results, including the census of 1926. And recent Ukrainian census of 2001.
 
Both extremes of the political spectrum in the U.S. are no fans of Ukraine, and tend to excuse Putin.

As for someone claiming they supported the wall street protests, and whose posts never miss an opportunity to trash the U.S. stating that he's going to move to a Red State, well, words almost fail me.

Anyone constantly criticizing the U.S. who supports the Wall Street crowd wanting to live in a Red State and thinking that's going to work out for him, especially as a lawyer, is either really a European pretending to be American, or has a completely disorganized and incoherent set of beliefs, and is moreover delusional.

It is so bizarre that it makes me wonder who precisely the person behind this sock could be...

I'll add to that he's supposedly based in Missouri (already made your move to a Red state have you?) and never posts after 4:00 PM east coast time, which is midnight Moscow time.

Draw your own conclusions, and then decide whether you want to engage with such a person.

Btw, the last presidential election saw many, many posts by people claiming to be American who would eventually "slip up" and show a lack of understanding of American culture.
 
Both extremes of the political spectrum in the U.S. are no fans of Ukraine, and tend to excuse Putin.

As for someone claiming they supported the wall street protests, and whose posts never miss an opportunity to trash the U.S. stating that he's going to move to a Red State, well, words almost fail me.

Anyone constantly criticizing the U.S. who supports the Wall Street crowd wanting to live in a Red State and thinking that's going to work out for him, especially as a lawyer, is either really a European pretending to be American, or has a completely disorganized and incoherent set of beliefs, and is moreover delusional.

It is so bizarre that it makes me wonder who precisely the person behind this sock could be...

Angela: You are correct here. My armchair analysis is

1) The Right wing who seem to not want to call out Putin are largely from the Fundamentalist Protestant camps that embrace the American fire and brimstone eschatological doctrines espoused by Darby, the American 19th century Fundamentalist Johnathan Darby and commentary in the Schofield Protestant Bible Commentary. You only have to look at Pat Robertson, now in his 90's that actually said God is using Putin to fulfil some passages in the Book of Revelation. I want get into the theological differences on interpretation but it is a difference between some traditions that hold to 100% biblical literalism, vs others that see literal and allegorical (which is the camp I fall in). In the literalist worldview, the world is 6K years old and Neanderthals are the giants in the Bible, ect, evolution is evil, etc, etc. Now for the record, I think Robertson and all like him are NUTTS.

https://www.newsweek.com/retired-ev...ys-putin-fulfilling-biblical-prophecy-1683497

2) On the far left wing, the Democratic Socialist of America, AOC and her Squad's group, the USA should get out of NATO, and it is American Imperialism that caused Putin to invade Russia. Interestingly, at tonight's state of the Union address, after Biden gives his speech, the Squad will offer a rebuttal to the President's state of the Union speech. I am in my 50's and have never in my life seen a group from the same party as the sitting President offer a rebuttal. Does AOC and the squad get called out for being a Putin apologist? This is also the group Bernie Sanders is tied to.

https://nypost.com/2022/02/28/democ...-imperialism-for-russian-invasion-of-ukraine/

Some crazy sh..t going on in this country.
 
Angela: You are correct here. My armchair analysis is

1) The Right wing who seem to not want to call out Putin are largely from the Fundamentalist Protestant camps that embrace the American fire and brimstone eschatological doctrines espoused by Darby, the American 19th century Fundamentalist Johnathan Darby and commentary in the Schofield Protestant Bible Commentary. You only have to look at Pat Robertson, now in his 90's that actually said God is using Putin to fulfil some passages in the Book of Revelation. I want get into the theological differences on interpretation but it is a difference between some traditions that hold to 100% biblical literalism, vs others that see literal and allegorical (which is the camp I fall in). In the literalist worldview, the world is 6K years old and Neanderthals are the giants in the Bible, ect, evolution is evil, etc, etc. Now for the record, I think Robertson and all like him are NUTTS.

https://www.newsweek.com/retired-ev...ys-putin-fulfilling-biblical-prophecy-1683497

2) On the far left wing, the Democratic Socialist of America, AOC and her Squad's group, the USA should get out of NATO, and it is American Imperialism that caused Putin to invade Russia. Interestingly, at tonight's state of the Union address, after Biden gives his speech, the Squad will offer a rebuttal to the President's state of the Union speech. I am in my 50's and have never in my life seen a group from the same party as the sitting President offer a rebuttal. Does AOC and the squad get called out for being a Putin apologist? This is also the group Bernie Sanders is tied to.

https://nypost.com/2022/02/28/democ...-imperialism-for-russian-invasion-of-ukraine/

Some crazy sh..t going on in this country.

As for the right wing, it's more than just some fundamentalists. It's also some Trump supporters who see Ukraine as just another corrupt Eastern European country, this one tightly tied to Hunter and Joe Biden, and while not supporting Russia, are going to look askance at supporting Ukraine. These people also often have a streak of isolationism.

I do get the latter part, but I think it can be dangerous.

Turning to the insane Marxist fringe, I expect to hear something to the effect that why should we care if some white folx get invaded and killed, while nobody cares about the Palestinians or the Yemenis. Even Razib Khan made a bow to that. Sometimes I wonder about him.

I feel for the plight of the Yemenis, and the Palestinians as well, but those situations just don't have the geopolitical importance of a potential nuclear war with Russia, and, to be brutally honest, what democratic values are the Yemenis and Palestinians upholding, or values about gender equality, for that matter? Ukraine may not be perfect, but there's hope for it. At least they're not hunting Jews anymore. I think the last years have shown us that, on the other hand, Muslim majority countries are not yet ready for democracy, or equal rights for women. It gives me no pleasure to say it. Of course, maybe you could say Russia isn't ready for democracy either, but there's some hope for Ukraine, especially if it maintains close ties with the west.
 
I'll add to that he's supposedly based in Missouri (already made your move to a Red state have you?) and never posts after 4:00 PM east coast time, which is midnight Moscow time.

Draw your own conclusions, and then decide whether you want to engage with such a person.

I left NYC in September, when the mandate came down.
 
Although I typically would not post anything from Fox tv , T Carlson's interview with Colonel Macgregor earlier this evening was on point:

 
As for someone claiming they supported the wall street protests, and whose posts never miss an opportunity to trash the U.S. stating that he's going to move to a Red State, well, words almost fail me.

Anyone constantly criticizing the U.S. who supports the Wall Street crowd wanting to live in a Red State and thinking that's going to work out for him, especially as a lawyer, is either really a European pretending to be American, or has a completely disorganized and incoherent set of beliefs, and is moreover delusional.

It is so bizarre that it makes me wonder who precisely the person behind this sock could be...

Ever hear of William Jennings Bryan? True political hero of the Midwest.
 
What, did one of your "team" give you a call?

Do you not realize you contradicted yourself? You said you were moving to a red state, not that you HAD moved to a red state. See, this is what happens; if what you're saying isn't true, you tend to forget exactly what you said. Trust me, I've interviewed and cross examined so many suspects and witnesses that I can always catch them.

Nobody who wants to live in a red state would have supported the Wall Street protestors, PERIOD!

I live on Long Island, now in an admittedly more "reddish" town than previously, but still a northeastern town, and if you walked around the streets of our downtown center spouting the anti-American trash that you've posted on this site, well, God help you. Every third house in this town sports a HUGE American flag on their property; I'm sure the percentages are higher in Missouri. They don't like that sort of thing.

Nobody with your political views on America would be caught dead in a real Red State.

Stop pretending.

Or if you're not pretending, you're an extremely confused man; cognitive dissonance doesn't begin to cover it. Also, get used to having no clients as soon as your views become known.

It's one thing to not want to get into a European conflict; it's another to trash talk America constantly. Go to Vermont if you want to get away with that crap.

Oh, and by the way, Missouri is as much Southern as it is midwestern, and way more "RED" than a lot of Midwestern states.
 
Although I typically would not post anything from Fox tv , T Carlson's interview with Colonel Macgregor earlier this evening was on point:


Indeed, T. Carlson great as (almost) always, compared to the usual American propaganda.

I am not trash talking America. I am criticizing its foreign policy establishment, whose record over the past 30 years is lamentable.

Ever hear of George Kennan? http://https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/05/opinion/a-fateful-error.html

That link doesn't work.
 
Angela: You are correct here. My armchair analysis is

1) The Right wing who seem to not want to call out Putin are largely from the Fundamentalist Protestant camps that embrace the American fire and brimstone eschatological doctrines espoused by Darby, the American 19th century Fundamentalist Johnathan Darby and commentary in the Schofield Protestant Bible Commentary. You only have to look at Pat Robertson, now in his 90's that actually said God is using Putin to fulfil some passages in the Book of Revelation. I want get into the theological differences on interpretation but it is a difference between some traditions that hold to 100% biblical literalism, vs others that see literal and allegorical (which is the camp I fall in). In the literalist worldview, the world is 6K years old and Neanderthals are the giants in the Bible, ect, evolution is evil, etc, etc. Now for the record, I think Robertson and all like him are NUTTS.

https://www.newsweek.com/retired-ev...ys-putin-fulfilling-biblical-prophecy-1683497

2) On the far left wing, the Democratic Socialist of America, AOC and her Squad's group, the USA should get out of NATO, and it is American Imperialism that caused Putin to invade Russia. Interestingly, at tonight's state of the Union address, after Biden gives his speech, the Squad will offer a rebuttal to the President's state of the Union speech. I am in my 50's and have never in my life seen a group from the same party as the sitting President offer a rebuttal. Does AOC and the squad get called out for being a Putin apologist? This is also the group Bernie Sanders is tied to.

https://nypost.com/2022/02/28/democ...-imperialism-for-russian-invasion-of-ukraine/

Some crazy sh..t going on in this country.

I guess it's even more complicated and the crossovers are even more weird, they escape left/right, protestant/catholic etc

It's more like a horseshoe, with extremist either left or right, then are resembling each other very close and crossovers are not an exception.

Benito Mussolini from extreme socialist to fascist, or Irving Kristol from socialist youth to neocon.....are examples which first come to my mind.
 
I guess it's even more complicated and the crossovers are even more weird, they escape left/right, protestant/catholic etc

It's more like a horseshoe, with extremist either left or right, then are resembling each other very close and crossovers are not an exception.

The reason is also that Russia has or now had many good contacts to the general left from the time of the Soviet Union. We have a lot of German and Austrian, as well as other European politicians, also from the moderate left and essentially from the whole political spectrum, which ended up in Russian companies, having excellent relationships with Putin. Take the most prominent example of Gerhard Schroeder:
https://www.politico.eu/article/gerhard-schroders-office-staff-quit-over-putin-russia-ukraine-war/

He's not by any means a radical left or right, but was a rather opportunistic and Neoliberal oriented (Hartz IV etc.) Social Democrat and is now, up to this point, an opportunistic friend of Putin.

Also, a lot of people, left and right, those more critical of the current "elite" and its policy in the West, even if its from different positions, know how overblown, how overwhelming the power and propaganda of the establishment in the USA and UK has become. They are fighting against windmills, reasonable and rational debates became nearly impossible under this social and economic, more and more judicial pressure and persecution. Regardless of what anyone thinks about Covid otherwise, the Pandemic very clearly accelerated that trend towards a more totalitarian and suppressive stand in the West also.
So they reach out for alternatives and allies which might help them, since their own leaders and "elites", their whole system are clearly against them. And Russia was kind of smart to appeal to both sides of the more classical European political flanks, left and right. Russia had the mentioned good ties to the Left from the past and present, as well as having a more conservative and clearly "anti-woke" stance appealing to the right. Putin never really positioned himself, up to this point, clearly against one of these two classical European political positions and everything in between. He is only clearly positioned against Libertarians and Liberals, as well as the New Left, the Chimaera from the American universitites, sponsored, guided and supported by the American big capital.

Because of his careful positioning in this respect, he could appeal to both oppositions in the West and he actually directly and indirectly supported various of these groups and positions in the West.

However, he now split with his recent actions both the right and the left, moderate and extreme alike. Simply because of the brutal consequences his actions have and the massive pressure built up against him, which forces even many critical voices to shut up for the moment or being crucified by the media mafia instantly. However, he was kind of trapped into this, also. I recently heard that he had kind of contacts, practically a team in Ukraine, standing ready to be politically more active for him. But the recent propaganda efforts and covert-ops of the Ukrainian government, with support of the Western secret services and propaganda machine, were extremely successful.
Probably his actions would have been more successful if he had started already in 2014, but now it seems to late. I wonder if people get shot in Kiev by the Ukrainians if the Russians really move forward, similar to what happened to the Tsar once the "Whites" came closer in the war with the Reds. Many pro-Russian Ukrainian politicians being now under arrest as far as I know and the suppression of any pro-Russian voices in the Ukraine is massive and brutal.

The Selenski-regime really got the upper hand ideologically and in popular support, after all those years in charge and with billions being spent in the propaganda efforts, which means, if this is true and lasting, that only the most brutal measures can keep the Ukraine down for the time being. And that is obviously against the will of most Russians, to fight a war like in Chechnya or Syria against the Ukrainians. This is where it gets really nasty and dangerous, because Putin is now almost completely isolated, only China keeps him up. He made a decision which can't be taken back, as bad as it might have been. The Western interference really cornered Russia and Putin, giving him no way out of the strategical crisis, not even a solution for Crimea and the threat of a NATO membership of Ukraine in its current borders.

Now he is in this mess, and even though a lot of people want to see him going down, I think they should also consider that Putin and Russia as a whole need a way out of this. If there is no reasonable peace offer, they are likely to go in as brutally as necessary, until either the Ukrainian resistance being completely broken or the Russian people revolt, or even worse, it escalates to an international war with a potential nuclear crisis and even war. Even those which want to see Putin going down, should open up some sort of exit for him, because to corner a political leader with that kind of arsenal, especially of that arsenal of ABC weapons, might not be the best choice we got.
And its also not exactly helpful for the Ukrainians, because the maximal escalation is not in the interest of the common Ukrainian people, not at all, even if they could win this war.
 
The reason is also that Russia has or now had many good contacts to the general left from the time of the Soviet Union. We have a lot of German and Austrian, as well as other politicians, also from the moderate left, which ended up in Russian companies, having excellent relationships with Putin. Take the most prominent example of Gerhard Schroeder:
https://www.politico.eu/article/gerhard-schroders-office-staff-quit-over-putin-russia-ukraine-war/

He's not by any means a radical left or right, but was a rather opportunistic and Neoliberal oriented (Hartz IV etc.) Social Democrat.

Also, a lot of people, left and right, those more critical of the current "elite" and its policy in the West, even if its from different positions, know how overblown, how overwhelming the power and propaganda of the establishment in the USA and UK has become. They fighting against windmills, reasonable and rational debates became nearly impossible under this social and economic, more and more judicial pressure and persecution. Regardless of what anyone thinks about Covid otherwise, the Pandemic very clearly accelerated that trend towards a more totalitarian and suppressive stands in the West also.
So they reach out for alternatives and allies which might help them, since their own leaders and "elites" are clearly against them. And Russia was kind of smart to appeal to both sides of the more classical European political flanks, left and right. Russia had the mentioned good ties to the Left from the past and present, as well as having a more conservative and clearly "anti-woke" stance appealing to the right. Putin never really positioned himself, up to this point, clearly against one of these two classical European political positions and everything in between. He is only clearly positioned against Libertarians and Liberals, as well as the New Left, the Chimaera from the American universitites, sponsored, guided and supported by the American big capital.

Because of his careful positioning in this respect, he could appeal to both oppositions in the West and he actually directly and indirectly supported various of these groups and positions in the West.

However, he now split with his recent actions both the right and the left, moderate and extreme alike. Simply because of the brutal consequences his actions have and the massive pressure built up against him, which forces even many critical voices to shut up for the moment or being crucified by the media mafia instantly. However, he was kind of trapped into this, also. I recently heard that he had kind of contacts, practically a team in Ukraine, standing ready to be politically more active for him. But the recent propaganda efforts and covert-ops of the Ukrainian government, with support of the Western secret services and propaganda machine, were extremely successful.
Probably his actions would have been more successful if he had started already in 2014, but now it seems to late. I wonder if people get shot in Kiev by the Ukrainians if the Russians really move forward, similar to what happened to the Tsar once the "Whites" came closer in the war with the Reds. Many pro-Russian Ukrainian politicians being now under arrest as far as I know and the suppression of any pro-Russian voices in the Ukraine is massive and brutal.

They really got the upper hand ideologically and in popular support, after all those years in charge and with billions being spent in the propaganda efforts, which means, if this is true and lasting, that only the most brutal measures can keep the Ukraine down for the time being. And that is obviously against the will of most Russians, to fight a war like in Chechnya or Syria against the Ukrainians. This is where it gets really nasty and dangerous, because Putin is now almost completely isolated, only China keeps him up, he made a decision which can't be taken back, as bad as it might have been. The Western interference really cornered Russia and Putin, by no way out of the crisis, not even a solution for Crimea and the threat of a NATO membership of Ukraine in its current borders.

Now he is in this mess, and even though a lot of people want to see him going down, I think they should also consider that Putin and Russia as a whole need a way out of this. If there is no reasonable peace offer, they are likely to go in as brutally as necessary, until either the Ukrainian resistance being completely broken or the Russian people revolt, or even worse, it escalates to an international war with a potential nuclear crisis and even war. Even those which want to see Putin going down, should open up some sort of exit for him, because to corner a political leader with that kind of arsenal, especially of that arsenal of ABC weapons, might not be the best choice we got.
And its also not exactly helpful for the Ukrainians, because the maximal escalation is not in the interest of the common Ukrainian people, not at all.

I see that the moderate right and left in Europa standing up against Putin. The extremist right is talking in Putin frames and are even partly financed by it. The 'extreme left overs' are indeed taking a position as bicicleur described, but they are very marginal compared to the extremist right.
 
I see that the moderate right and left in Europa standing up against Putin. The extremist right is talking in Putin frames and are even partly financed by it. The 'extreme left overs' are indeed taking a potion as bicilceur described, but they are very marginal compared to the extremist right.

The extreme right is very much split on the issue, as you can see in the support of the Ukrainian resistance by some of the most extreme groups we still have in Europe. By now most of the extreme right is actually on the Ukrainian side. Its rather the populist right, which got more support from Putin, which was in favour of his Russia, but even that being no more, at least not as unified as it probably was before the invasion.

The left is not necessarily the most "extreme left", but those which still stand to the classical European left positions, being more interested in social justice and the control of the capital and big corporations, the prevention of violence, than brainwashing the population with identity politics while keeping them as obedient sheeple for the "elites". Much of the "left" in Europe is now nothing more than a copy of the American crap which spills over from the other side of the Atlantic. They care more for identity politics and the next big thing the US media and think tanks push forward than their old ideals and promises to the people ("working class").
This is not about being more or less extreme, on the left, but about the focus, like "traditional left" (social politics, strong state, focus on human needs, control of the big corporations and capital, anti-war and peace orientation) vs. "woke left" (identity politics, anti-male and anti-white, ecological and anti-anthropocentric ideas, social engineering, totalitarian state and surveillance, cooperation with the big capital, more likely to be pro-war if it suits them).
 

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