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yes. but what if this additional WHG EHG admixture in northern europe might actually give these people an advantage to survive in northern europe. i see italians (me included) with body structures that i only rarely see among germans and vice versa. in the middle east it gets probably even more extreme after looking at people from there. i met german women who had to bend their necks to look down at me and they often also have broader shoulders than me. now this doesn't happen all the time but it happens way more often than it did in switzerland and especially with other italians. call me a nordicist but i think in that regard they or at least some of them really might be superior in some way. and i actually think its somehow sad that this is going to be gone like for example native americans. but its a question of perspective. and thats the thing. i just think that you can't fight racism with science since race categories and the value of differences are often just a question of perspective even in science.
racism will never be gone. even if our populations will be so mixed that there is no difference between them anymore. even then people will have ideals. and the fact that certain genes are superior to others, though often because of perspective, personal preference or also depending on the environment in which they need to survive, will never be gone, its nature, and this might play a huge role in future genetic medicine for example with things like crispr cas. "racism" might shift from a population level to an individual level.
i don't know. i don't think i'm a racist but i'm an opponent of globalization. it's like in physics. everything will go to greatest possible disorder once you let it happen. and imo that's a loss.
the days of the industrial revolution and European colonisation are long gone, and yes there are still some remnants of racismGreat insights, as always, from our members. It's extremism, in all its forms, that is the problem.
Not to be pedantic, but "farmers" weren't born farmers. They descend from hunter-gatherers too, hunter-gatherers who happened to "discover" agriculture.
I think this all goes back to the 19th century. Northern Europeans, who industrialized first, looked at themselves and at Southern Europeans, who were on average "darker", and attributed all sorts of, as Jovialis said, "mystical" and "value laden" attributes to it. With the beginnings of genetics, they also believed that these traits were the "original European" traits, which made them the "real" Europeans, and everyone else interlopers.
That's what was so ironic about the discovery that the WHG were darker than the agriculturalists who started entering Europe.
Then the identification turned to the steppe people, only to discover that the EHG, who did seem "lighter", had admixed with Basal Eurasian heavy Caucasus type people, and that most of their early "achievements" were borrowed from surrounding "farmer" type cultures. (Only shows their good sense and adaptability to me, but there you have it.)
It doesn't matter, though. If people want to blind themselves to the facts, they will.
Believe me, I'm sure all this racist nonsense still goes on among the racists in the pop gen community. It's just that given that they know many people have kept screenshots of their statements in the past, and are reading their material now, they have to communicate "honestly", if you can call it that, on the dark web.
This is why I think that the racial superiority movement is much bigger in Europe than people realize. Look at the statements coming out of Eastern Europe with absolutely no adverse consequences. Can you imagine what is said on the dark net or behind closed doors? All they've gotten out of all this genetics research is that the Germans were wrong to target them for annihilation. It's they, the Slavs, who are the real "Untermenschen". If it weren't so pathetic and frightening at the same time it would be funny.
Sorry but this does not make sense Ailchu.
First, because Germans are not the tallest in the world right now, the tallest men are in the Dinaric mountains.
Second, you are talking as if the height difference has always been like this but it hasn't. The Dutch were among the shortest Europeans in the 19th century, but are now first if you discount Dinarics for not being a country.
Third, look the WHG ancestry map: https://cache.eupedia.com/images/content/European_hunter-gatherer_admixture.png. Now look at the height map: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/91/1b/bf/911bbffbe7a960149b1fc5f271785d6b.jpg. Not exactly the same thing.
Also, I agree with Angela: intelligence matters most today.
The English, as another example, managed to create an empire that covered a good part of the globe without being particularly tall.
I can't think of much that is sillier, particularly in this day and age, than basing some sort of superiority on height.
Intelligence matters more than height, but even without being all that bright you can still thrive and be very successful (she did say other talents are important). If you have people skills, you can succeed in psychology, business and marketing, if you have culinary skills, you can work at a great restaurant, mechanical skills can get you a six figure plumbing job, and I'm just scratching the surface. There are lots of successful people who aren't all that spectacular in terms of intelligence out there.Sorry but this does not make sense Ailchu.
First, because Germans are not the tallest in the world right now, the tallest men are in the Dinaric mountains.
Second, you are talking as if the height difference has always been like this but it hasn't. The Dutch were among the shortest Europeans in the 19th century, but are now first if you discount Dinarics for not being a country.
Third, look the WHG ancestry map: https://cache.eupedia.com/images/content/European_hunter-gatherer_admixture.png. Now look at the height map: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/91/1b/bf/911bbffbe7a960149b1fc5f271785d6b.jpg. Not exactly the same thing.
Also, I agree with Angela: intelligence matters most today.
How strange for you guys to focus on racism from Northern Europeans when by far the most racist people on anthroforas are Southern Europeans. Mentioning that Italy has an West Asian shift or that Iberia is North African shifted will make most Italian and Iberian members quite angry and they will do everything contradict it. It's almost like they don't want to be associated in any way whatsoever with darker people, don't you think? And don't tell me it's not true. Everyone can see how difficult it is for various south Euro groups to accept (recent)non-European influence among their own ethnicity.
Do not Generalize !How strange for you guys to focus on racism from Northern Europeans when by far the most racist people on anthroforas are Southern Europeans. Mentioning that Italy has an West Asian shift or that Iberia is North African shifted will make most Italian and Iberian members quite angry and they will do everything contradict it. It's almost like they don't want to be associated in any way whatsoever with darker people, don't you think? And don't tell me it's not true. Everyone can see how difficult it is for various south Euro groups to accept (recent)non-European influence among their own ethnicity.
I’m not your Enemy.No, he won't, and neither will you.
That's enough. We've gone off-topic for too long.
Btw, don't ever think you're smart enough to fool me, because you're not.
You're kidding, right?
Here's a guy who is surprised to find Nordicist Italians on racist anthrofora!
Please...
Try meeting with and speaking with people from the real world, not racist losers who agonize over how much of one ancient group or another is in them, no matter their nationality.
Then tell me where you'll find actual nordicist Scandinavians/Northern Europeans in real life? I have not heard once a Swede mention that ancient Romans and Greeks were nordic looking. This is something I for the first time saw in Anthroforas.
We are all on this forum for the same reason
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