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Thread: To Zi Germans!

  1. #1
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    To Zi Germans!



    Hello German JREF readers, I was watching a History channel program today about the German occupation of Norway during WWII and I am curious:

    Are German children taught about the atrocities commited by the Germans during WWII? I know in American history textbooks much is left out about American treatment of Native Americans, which I find rather disturbing since the after shocks are still being felt today throughout Native American communities. Would appreciate an answer, thank you.
    "A single death is a tradgedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Stalin

  2. #2
    Regular Member bossel's Avatar
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    When I was at school we got hammered it into our heads: Guilty! Guilty! Guilty!
    So much so that some pupils as an adverse reaction showed/used Nazi symbols & greetings (though usually not by heart, just to provoke the teachers).

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    Hentai Koutaishi Lina Inverse's Avatar
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    Yes, there's nothing left out here, the teaching about it was quite extensive.

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    Germans

    Well, the German guy could probably tell you better than me. I'm sure they are tought in school about it, but Germany as a country is not "PROUD" of it. I have noticed over my last 2 years in Germany. They really don't have the patriotic side that a lot of Americans have. (ex, in America you see the flag on and around peoples' houses) Not in Germany. But, They are proud of Soccer (futbal to some.)

  5. #5
    Mike Cash
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timsan
    Hello German JREF readers, I was watching a History channel program today about the German occupation of Norway during WWII and I am curious:

    Are German children taught about the atrocities commited by the Germans during WWII? I know in American history textbooks much is left out about American treatment of Native Americans, which I find rather disturbing since the after shocks are still being felt today throughout Native American communities. Would appreciate an answer, thank you.
    Are you aware of how your sig
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim's Sig
    "A single death is a tradgedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Stalin
    clashes with the sentiments expressed in your post? The victims of Nazi atrocities and the American Indian victims of European/American activities are just "statistics".

  6. #6
    花は咲く場所を選びはしな 「んだ CorDarei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikecash
    Are you aware of how your sig clashes with the sentiments expressed in your post? The victims of Nazi atrocities and the American Indian victims of European/American activities are just "statistics".
    But they're "tradgic" statistics.

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    Anjin
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    Well it's good that German schools don't hide the truth from students. I get the impression that Japanese schools give their students a watered down version of what happened in WWII.
    For information on the pros and cons of teaching at Nova English schools in Japan, check out

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    They dont know anything about it, which is the main problem.

    Now, do American school kiddies get taught about how eugenics (the science behind the nazi genocide movement) was an American invention that inspired the Germans?

  9. #9
    Mike Cash
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ewok85
    They dont know anything about it, which is the main problem.

    Now, do American school kiddies get taught about how eugenics (the science behind the nazi genocide movement) was an American invention that inspired the Germans?
    This American kiddie must have missed school that day if they do.

    Elaborate, please.

  10. #10
    カメハメ波! Glenn's Avatar
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    So did this one. I've never heard about who started eugenics; I'd never even heard of eugenics until I started posting here, and that was in the "xenophobia/racism" thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikecash
    This American kiddie must have missed school that day if they do.

    Elaborate, please.
    "Society has no business to permit degenerates to reproduce their kind.... Some day we will realize that the prime duty, the inescapable duty of the good citizen of the right type is to leave his blood behind him in the world, and that we have no business to perpetuate citizens of the wrong type." Most students would identify the author of this quotation as Josef Goebbels or some other Nazi ideologue. Actually, the author was Theodore Roosevelt who reflected the views of many American intellectuals in 1913 when these words were penned. Few textbooks for United States history survey courses note that eugenics, or "race science," was a branch of scientific thinking that began in the United States at the end of the nineteenth century and one that influenced Nazi racial theoreticians in subsequent decades."


    see the whole article at http://www.historycooperative.org/jo...36.3/br_7.html
    [up]Lacan,
    Abel,
    Fei,
    Kim,
    Grahf,
    Id[/up]

    I had so many names...

  12. #12
    Mike Cash
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    I don't find the idea that such thinking existed, even among (otherwise) very intelligent peeople, in the United States to be surprising.

    What needs elaboration, though, is the jump from U.S. invention to Nazi inspiration.

  13. #13
    Regular Member bossel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lacan
    Actually, the author was Theodore Roosevelt who reflected the views of many American intellectuals in 1913 when these words were penned. Few textbooks for United States history survey courses note that eugenics, or "race science," was a branch of scientific thinking that began in the United States at the end of the nineteenth century and one that influenced Nazi racial theoreticians in subsequent decades."
    Yeah, but that doesn't mean that it started in the US. For what I know, it was a Briton - Galton - who first used the word eugenics. In most, if not all, developed countries of that time some people were busy developing similar ideas. But ideas like that date back much much further, Plato was one of the proponents of controlled human procreation.

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    Jacques Rocks! Jungle Boy's Avatar
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    Do they teach the Russian children about the atrocities that Stalin commited during WWII? Namely killing over 20 million of his own people in his purges. He was worse that Hitler IMO, way worse.

  15. #15
    Mike Cash
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jungle Boy
    Do they teach the Russian children about the atrocities that Stalin commited during WWII? Namely killing over 20 million of his own people in his purges. He was worse that Hitler IMO, way worse.
    They weren't 20 million people. They were 20 statistics. Didn't you read Timsan's sig?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikecash
    They weren't 20 million people. They were 20 statistics. Didn't you read Timsan's sig?
    I think Timsan was just showing what Stalin had said, not actually giving his own take on things. Just guessing.

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    There are many things that we don't teach US high school kids that have to be left for college professors to fix. What we mis-teach and what we leave out fills volumes.

  18. #18
    Mike Cash
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brooker
    I think Timsan was just showing what Stalin had said, not actually giving his own take on things. Just guessing.
    I realize that. Give me a little credit. <smiley goes here>

  19. #19
    Regular Member sgt. Pepper's Avatar
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    It's pretty funny when you think about it...here in Sweden, the germans atrocities during the war are fully portrayed in schoolbooks, and the swastika is really tabu. But if you read about what the russians did...well, they're basicly portrayed as heroes. :) Most schoolbooks write very nicely about the russians and how they fought against the nazis, and they just briefly mentioned how many people Stalin killed. And the commie-symbol (i don't know what it's called in english, is it the hammer and sickle?) is not very taboo at all. :)

    Is it like that for you people in other countries too?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timsan View Post
    Hello German JREF readers, I was watching a History channel program today about the German occupation of Norway during WWII and I am curious:

    Are German children taught about the atrocities commited by the Germans during WWII? I know in American history textbooks much is left out about American treatment of Native Americans, which I find rather disturbing since the after shocks are still being felt today throughout Native American communities. Would appreciate an answer, thank you.
    Timsan -

    Sorry to act as a know-it-all but not sure where you went to school but I was continually reminded throughout my education of the mess Europeans made by exploiting this continent from the earliest explorers through the Spanish Conquistadors, Catholic church in Central and South America to the Colonies of France and GB ad nauseum. I recall coming home when I was perhaps 6 after learning about the interaction of the Pilgrims and their native American hosts. As for Germany , I have had many German friends and acquaintances throughout the years and it was always plainly stated that their were well versed in the horrific events of the 1930's through 45. This was quite often mandatory education.

    As for Stalin - nearly 33% of those poled in a recent nationwide vote claimed Stalin as one of the most admired figures in Russian history. Interesting considering deaths directly attributed to his rule have been quoted between 25/30 million and as high as 70 million over the span of 25 years of rule. Most historians seem to agree on the figure of approx 20-25 million. As for the quotation of "1 death is a tragedy, 20 million a statistic" it is attributed erroneously to Stalin but a Germany writer is believed to have coined the term Erich M Remarque

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgt. Pepper View Post
    It's pretty funny when you think about it...here in Sweden, the germans atrocities during the war are fully portrayed in schoolbooks, and the swastika is really tabu. But if you read about what the russians did...well, they're basicly portrayed as heroes. :) Most schoolbooks write very nicely about the russians and how they fought against the nazis, and they just briefly mentioned how many people Stalin killed. And the commie-symbol (i don't know what it's called in english, is it the hammer and sickle?) is not very taboo at all. :)

    Is it like that for you people in other countries too?
    Both Russian and German crimes are remembered in Poland. But mostly by older generations. When young people hear about WW2, they switch off or walk away to more interesting activities.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chriscorbine View Post
    I have noticed over my last 2 years in Germany. They really don't have the patriotic side that a lot of Americans have. (ex, in America you see the flag on and around peoples' houses) Not in Germany. But, They are proud of Soccer (futbal to some.)
    I lived the the States for 10 years during my teens, and notice that the English and Europeans don't fly the flag as much as Americans as a sign of national pride. It doesn't mean the pride isn't there - it just manifests in different ways, e.g. sport.

    Chris

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