Debate Q3: In your opinion, what is love?

Doc said:
Are you mocking me? :eek:kashii: (Just kidding. :cool: )

I wasn't mocking you at all, just using your point of view as an example.
 
Whatever you want. However we also have to consider the human body from a neurpsycholgical point of view to understand most human behaviours.

I agree, but it seems like you are taking only that into consideration.

Honour is an emotion based on self-esteem and acceptance with a social group with determined values. Behave in an honourable way depends on this set of (moral) values, and people do it to "look good" within the group. It is a form of self-reassurance that we do not "break the rules of the group, and therefore will always be welcome as a good member".

Honour and duty are not emotions but ideas. Both honour and duty have different interpretations cross-culturally, whereas the basic emotions you mention are quites consistent across cultures.

The way it works in terms of biochemical process is too complicated to describe here, but you should know that each lobe of the brain becomes specialised in some activities (language, rlogical reasoning. primal emotions, complex emotions, values, self-esteem, imagination, etc.) and that each of these communicate with each others via electrical impulse between neurons.

Furthermore, despite there being localization amongst different areas of the brain, it has also been shown that there is activity in all areas of the brain when we perform any activity. I don't see your point. By anology, what you are saying is like trying to explain how a carpenter uses an electrical drill by utilizing the physics of electricity.

I think you haven't understood yet that the mechanism in our brain that allow us to control our primal emotions (fear, anger, excitement...) are as scientifically demonstrable as the basic emotions themselves

Basic emotions have been identifed (though I haven't heard of the primal emotions as a separate category) and they have consistencey across cultures and individuals, and furthermore some consistency between individuals when reacting to stimuli in laboratory tests. A lot of these tests were done by Eckman in relation to facial expressions. I wouldn't go so far as to say that specific areas of the brain have been identified with specific emotions, and that by zapping certain parts of the brain with electricity you can cause emotive reactions though. Going back to localization of brain function; while it exists, it is not consistent between individuals. In other words, everyone's brain has a part that deals with language, reasoning, etc., but these these areas are different across people. This does not make it likely that you would be able to concretely identify areas responsible for varying emotions.
 
mad pierrot said:
Hmmm....

A one shot definition: Love is the willingness to sacrifice everything for something. People love their country, people love their kids, people love themselves, people love money, and people love heroin.

Sacrifice everything ? No way, that's my definition of hell. No more free time, no more work, no more money, no more hobbies, no more friends, no more fun, no more family... You said everything, right ?
 
Maciamo said:
Sacrifice everything ? No way, that's my definition of hell. No more free time, no more work, no more money, no more hobbies, no more friends, no more fun, no more family... You said everything, right ?
Given MP's definition, and my own...well, yeah.

I've seen people sell everything that they have for a "pearl of great price." This is particularly true when the pearl is someone that tweaks their fancy.

The part about the chemical substance of love is not without foundation..."the same thing as eating large amounts of chocolate." I admit that I take a more romantic view of love than that, but I am incurable. *grin* I am not certain that it is a weakness.

Amore, more, ore, re
 
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Love is ...
Mad Pierrot said:
(to) sacrifice everything for something
Sacrifice is a pretty strong word there. It is synonymous with 'offer' or 'devote' which implies transfering the goods or/and life of one to the temple. For example Abraham thought he had heard, "Kill me a son." That's kind of scary. :evil:
Maciamo said:
Sacrifice everything ? No way, that's my definition of hell.
A life without devotion can be considered empty and futile. But luckily you are passionate about the forum, travel, teaching, Japan's woes, interacting with other members of the earthly community, and a little free time. I'm not trying to pull the nominalism argument here, but you may be more devoted than you wish you picture yourself. You're just evenly devoted, that's all. :bikkuri:

Maciamo said:
But when you create a website or make some pottery, can yo really claim these are your children ?
In a way yes. They are your brain-children, and often there exist a love-hate relationship between the poet and the poem. Without considering whether the poem can think on its own, the poet has certain emotional attachments to the works of art. We can make fun of it, but it's there nevertheless.
Maciamo said:
I think that some varieties of Protestant Christians do not believe in Mary at all.
I left the o in the lower case to make it generic; so we have no problem. The majority of followers of the Roman, the Coptic, the Abyssinian, and The Nestorian Churches would be included in the class orthodox, but as for later developments, there must have been believers who were uncomfortable with the Credo.
Maciamo said:
I hope you didn't take me seriously. By now I suppose you have realised that I am totally atheistic. But that's always fun to try thinking as a Christian who first wonders at the hows and whys of his supreme deity.
I was only excercising some vivid imagination which I am sure you enjoyed yourself. I'm genuinely glad you find this amusing.
 
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lexico said:
A life without devotion can be considered empty and futile. But luckily you are passionate about the forum, travel, teaching, Japan's woes, interacting with other members of the earthly community, and a little free time. I'm not trying to pull the nominalism argument here, but you may be more devoted than you wish you picture yourself. You're just evenly devoted, that's all.

Yes, devoted and passionated I am. That's why I wouldn't like to sacrifice (=abandon forever) all my interests for one thing or person. I am not the kind of person that can be satisfied by concetrating on one thing. That is also why I am faithful to each of the category of my interests, love or devotion.
 
Duo said:
I agree with Maciamo. Why do people have to romantacize things and make love appear like this suberb divine feeling that is out of this world?

Because atleast at first, it makes you high! :) Well, falling in love with someone atleast - maybe not so much when you think about your siblings, friends or family :relief:

There's always several ways of looking at something: you can look it from a scientifical or some other kind of point of view. I don't think that if you give a "scientifical definition" for love, it somehow makes love a sterile thing. When you fall head over heels for someone or cry because someone broke your heart, you really don't think which chemicals are reacting in your brain! You think about how you feel.

If everything would be just about giving somewhat accurate, technical definitions for things would anyone ever have the need to be depressed or devastated over something? It'd be so much easier to accept a given formula for something and then not wonder why you feel the way you do but unfortunately atleast my mind doesn't quite work like that :bluush:

It's so curious how you can love someone despite all kinds of obsticles (e.g. the person doesn't like you ) and not really even be able to explain why you're in love - you know it won't work so why waste your time? At the same time, someone might love you but you don't love that person even though s/he's nice and you know s/he'd be so good for you. :souka:

I don't think I could ever give love a clear definition because it always depends on the person you love - you love everyone in a different way because they're all different people... But one thing I can say: when you love someone, you automatically make compromises in situations you would never ever have budged an inch before.
 
Love is the opposite to hate. Now define hate :D
I find the love of something is a need, a want, almost like an addiction. You need that object, person to be near you. You like feeling good and this makes you feel good. When it isn't there you feel bad, down, but as soon as this object, person comes back you feel great. In some cases it can get to be a serious psychological problem, same as drug addiction, as the case of stalkers, or people that kill their children to prevent someone else getting in the way of their addiction. Sometimes it's a beaitiful thing, at others a dangerous feeling that can be as damaging as hate. :)
 
Maciamo said:
Here is my opinion about love. I am warning you, it's scientific, rational and cynical, but can't help it.

Real, romantic "love" is the result of biochemical reactions in our brain, mainly due to hormones, combined with the impression given by the object of our love ("the loved one") on our set of values. Somebody that fits our values (the cortex) and our biochemistry has high chances of making you fall in love if the conditions are good (you are psychologically receptive to "love", meet the potential loved one in a "positive" context, etc.).

Regarding love between family members or very good friends, this is mostly a sentimental bond based on one's (positive) common experiences and a sentiment of gratitude or "comfort" (reassurance, peace-of-mind, well-being...) we feel toward them.
Who says romance isn't dead? :)
If chocolate make me feel good in a chemical reaction way, then I LOVE chocolate. :homer: Who says women should only love chocolate?
 
Mycernius said:
Who says romance isn't dead? :)
If chocolate make me feel good in a chemical reaction way, then I LOVE chocolate. :homer: Who says women should only love chocolate?
Not me! Chocolate is God's own sweet stuff! Despite what your Mom might've told you, it will NOT rot your teeth. Chocolate has a chemical enzyme (or somethin' like that) that prevents the growth of bacteria that harms teeth and gums! I heard that on NPR, so it must be true, right? *rolls eyes*

Actually, I have heard that from many sources, so if bossel or Maciamo or somebody has time to do the research, more power to ya!

It certainly makes me feel good!
 
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there are sorts of form off love, yes you can love your friends and familie on a differnt way...

the ultimated love for me:

when you think about each other.
when you can spend days together, without feeling bored.
to give up things for the other person.
being honest and open to each other.
waiting for each other
dont cheat.
life together because you want to be with each other, not because of fair of being lonely.
feel pain together.
trust.

i think this is what i feel about my girl that is on the other side of the world now, and i speak to a couple of days a week, for me its real love, and we decided to get married next year, even im still young, i feel like she is the love of my life. and i feel good with her when she is here with me, or when she is in japan thinking of her can make a smile on my face.


please let me answer completely on this qeustion in 30-60 years when im wise and old ( at least i hope to be haha) :blush:

greetings Baka dutch
 
Wow, am I late in replying to this thread!

Yes, devoted and passionated I am. That's why I wouldn't like to sacrifice (=abandon forever) all my interests for one thing or person. I am not the kind of person that can be satisfied by concetrating on one thing. That is also why I am faithful to each of the category of my interests, love or devotion.

Yeah, love doesn't have to be for one person or thing, but it can be. Like it was said, you have equal love for many different things, but there are somethings you love more than others, right? Things you'd be willing to sacrifice for other things....? That's the key, "willing." Not being forced to, but the complete opposite, doing because you'd rather be with that anything else for eternity, a.k.a heaven. Heh, being forced to be with something you don't like would definately be hell.
 
Mycernius said:
Love is the opposite to hate. Now define hate :D

Hate:

1.

a. To feel hostility or animosity toward.
b. To detest.

2.

To feel dislike or distaste for.

BTW you hate anything before you can ever learn to love it.

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
Love should take precedence in all of our decisions if we want to be our best as a species, but maybe the instinct to survive whether acquiring resources for ourselves or our immediate family, that causes us to be driven by fear which as Yoda say leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to Yoda, Yoda, Yoda...
 

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