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Thread: Genetic history of Sicily : Greeks, Arabs, Normans and others

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wilhelm View Post
    ACtually, it's not true that J1 or J2 was carried by Arabs or Phoenicians.
    Arabs did not have any signifant impact in Sicily, since they were a ultra-minority.
    The Y-dna J in Sicily comes mostly from Greeks and from Neolithic migrations, as in the rest of Europe

    "Another Y-chromosome marker that may have been spread to Europe by Phoenicians and Arabs is the subclade of haplogroup J labeled J*(xJ2) or Eu10. It originated in the southern part of the Fertile Crescent and is very common in Arabia and Palestine (Neolithic J2 or Eu9 is from the northern Fertile Crescent). Its frequencies are 0.9% in Northern Italy, 7.1% in Central Italy and 5.3% in Southern Italy (for a total of between 0.5% and 3.6% admixture). It's important to note that while Phoenician and Arab colonists undoubtedly carried Eu10, its expansion is dated to ~9000-6400 YBP and generally attributed to Neolithic migrations (Nebel et al. 2001). Therefore, levels of recent admixture may be even lower."
    I am pleasantly surprised at the level of education at this forum. The Italians have no problem accepting the origin of certain haplogroups from beyond Europe. Nothing to do with my countrymen (I'm Spaniard). In fact the only one who does not accept the scientific reality is this spanish man. I am not surprised!

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    Very well said Ferreira... most spaniards have problems dealing with their african roots. I'm glad that we finally find a spaniard who is not delusional.

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    My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
    Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nino1949 View Post
    My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
    Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?
    Both were Germanic people so it is hard to differentiate between the two. I don't know if Lombards have been definitively associated with I1, but certainly some Normans were I1.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nino1949 View Post
    My father was born in Trapani/Marsala, Sicily. We are as Y-paternal on Haplogroup I1-M253+ (I1EE)
    Can someone shed some more lights on this haplogroup? Am I of Norman origins or Longbards?
    I1-EE has a youthful TMRCA (only about 1,500 years) but connects to the I1-Z58 tree as a whole over 3000 years ago (see Nordtvedt). That is to say, it's a little bit of an outlier, so it's a bit difficult to trace its exact migration route during the Migration Period. Its modern center of frequency looks to be in Germany, maybe somewhere around Munich considering its extent into Italy, Switzerland, and the Czech Republic. I think that distribution looks like a good match with the Lombards, but the sample size is a bit low for me to be really confident.

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the difference between Sicilians and mainland Italians is that Sicilians have sub-Saharan African Ancestry of at least 1% whereas the mainland has little to none. Not even the Calabrese have it.

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    DNA Cousins

    I recently tested on 23andme and I found a 4th cousin with the Ventimiglia last name from Italy. I don't know if 4th cousins are considered closely related but am searching for info from family I'm not in contact with.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackMack View Post
    Sicily is such a beautiful island! I recently visited there and I found the people, the food (loved the Sicilian wines) and the scenery to be wonderful- all of which has been influenced by their "DNA history." Some of my family is from there (from the NW of the island Mother's side-Palermo/ Monreale and Father's side-Castelbuono/ Ventimiglia line originally from Liguria and a branch in Sicily) and most Sicilians we met seemed to think Norman influence in us but my Y-DNA is J2a4b and my MtDNA is H. I happen to be fair-haired with green eyes, like my mother but I can tan well if I spend time in the sun -going for the California blond look! My father has brown hair/ eyes but his brother is blond/ blue- go figure....I think it shows that we really cannot get all of who we are from just our Y and MtDNA- after all, there are other people in our genetic line with different Y and MtDNA Haplotypes but gave us many other characteristics from their autosomal genes and X chromosome which we are currently not taking into consideration.

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    So sad nobody talk about mtn dna of Sicilians.... am J1c1... and find little or nothing about.
    only traces in Northern Europe, Ireland, wales, Iceland...? How my maternal ancester get so south?
    or she was already there, since.... ever? I'm frustrated of the lack of studies about. Someone.....?

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    Quote Originally Posted by wormhole View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the difference between Sicilians and mainland Italians is that Sicilians have sub-Saharan African Ancestry of at least 1% whereas the mainland has little to none. Not even the Calabrese have it.
    Likely you're wrong.

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