Haplogroups of European kings and queens

Nikola Tsvyatkov, according to the interview with "geneticist" Evgeni Delev, is just a man from the Strandzha region in Southeastern Bulgaria, specifically from a village called Fakiya, which is very close to the Turkish border. As Eastara helpfully pointed out, there is hardly any evidence that he descends from any Swedish king at all. Again, I do not believe that any member of the House of Wittelsbach has ever been tested (commercially or not). Such things are usually done in cases such as that of King Richard III of England, i.e. to additionally serve as confirmation that the remains are legitimate, so to speak.

Connie, you are absolutely right. Recently, I watched a documentary about Ancient Egyptian mummies. There had been some debate whether a head had belonged to a governor or to his wife. The FBI specialists simply extracted DNA from a tooth (unlikely to have been contaminated) and found a Y-Chromosome. There you go! :)
 
There is desecration at Basilica of St Denis, my direct ancestors, and burning of Notre-Dame Cathedral.

I think an effort to do DNA should be made, there and elsewhere.

I have noticed more and more archeological sites are getting DNA.
 
Interesting that you mention this. Thanks to the "efforts" of the French revolutionaries in 1793, almost nothing remains from the French kings, queens and their predecessors. I believe that the only King of the Franks, whose remains still lie in the Saint Denis Basilica, is Louis VII (l. 1120 - 1180). The reason is that he was only buried there in 1817, during the reign of his descendant King Louis XVIII, who is actually also buried there.

Personally, I believe that these remains should rest in peace and not be disturbed just for satisfying one's curiosity. But for the other cases, I think that's OK.
 
I am only related to Louis VII thru his wife, and my 27th ggf 1005-1035.

However, I read during The French Revolution bones were removed and put in a mass grave and later uncovered all jumbled together.

It seems to me the forensics and DNA tests we have, today, could sort the bones first by male and female, then, date the bones as archeological find bones are dated (carbon?) then add the DNA to this list.

For example, could 44th ggf Dagobert I 603-639 be there?

For example, is there anything about the Mergovingians mythic stories? in terms of migration?

..anything at all.

In terms of genealogy, the ancestral lines are of historical record.

I find one direct ancestor and someone else has already documented that family line.

It would be a contribution to historical record and to DNA to have the DNA found in the mass grave bones known, even if not sorted out.


PS

I saw on a Facebook group there is a density of bone in the area of the inner ear that provided ancient DNA.

The DNA migrations are worthwhile, and the kings lines help DNA work because their marriages and children are in historical record.
 
I am only related to Louis VII thru his wife, and my 27th ggf 1005-1035.

However, I read during The French Revolution bones were removed and put in a mass grave and later uncovered all jumbled together.

It seems to me the forensics and DNA tests we have, today, could sort the bones first by male and female, then, date the bones as archeological find bones are dated (carbon?) then add the DNA to this list.

For example, could 44th ggf Dagobert I 603-639 be there?

For example, is there anything about the Mergovingians mythic stories? in terms of migration?

..anything at all.

In terms of genealogy, the ancestral lines are of historical record.

I find one direct ancestor and someone else has already documented that family line.

It would be a contribution to historical record and to DNA to have the DNA found in the mass grave bones known, even if not sorted out.


PS

I saw on a Facebook group there is a density of bone in the area of the inner ear that provided ancient DNA.

The DNA migrations are worthwhile, and the kings lines help DNA work because their marriages and children are in historical record.

Here is a list of the kings and queens who had been lain to rest in the Saint-Denis Basilica. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilica_of_Saint-Denis#Burials

You write that King Dagobert I was a 44th great-grandfather of yours. While possible, it should be noted that there is absolutely no man or woman living today, who has any kind of proven descent from a Merovingian. As for the Carolingians, there are quite a lot of them, just not in the male line (possibly).

The following link details the story of what happened for the French Republic's first anniversary in 1793. https://mavcor.yale.edu/conversations/essays/revolutionary-exhumations-st-denis-1793

Here's a quote: "For the Festival of Reunion on August 10 that marked its birth, the coffins of the oldest dynasties in the upper church of St.-Denis were emptied, lead removed for recasting, and the remains moved to a trench by the demolished Valois Chapel. The Bourbon crypt was opened as a prelude to Marie-Antoinette’s execution on October 16 (Louis was beheaded the prior January 21) and the remains (including hearts and entrails) dumped in a new trench. The bodies of the preceding Valois dynasty followed into a third trench, along with any corpses still left. The transfer dismembered most cadavers before the quicklime deposited on top could corrode them. In 1817, when the restored Bourbon monarchy returned the remains to the basilica, all that survived intact were the lower portions of three corpses. The fragments of about one hundred and fifty-eight once-sacred bodies fit into two large ossuaries in the crypt."

Long story short, I don't think anything worthwhile exists from these royals anymore. But that was the whole point of it, really.

Until a few years ago, it was assumed that the head of King Henri IV (1589-1610) may have survived (kind of), but the testing carried out on three current Bourbon princes tells a different story. Or, there could have simply been a Non-Paternity Event. Which is why the whole Y-DNA business is rather tricky. King Louis XIV could have been the father of his brother's son(s), and no one today would know the difference.

I hope the above helps!
 
I would be interested in the House of Wittlesbach haplogroup, as most of my German ancestors were either from Bavaria or the Palatinate, two historic Wittlesbach properties. I1, eh? That's kind of more rare in southern Germany, it could be it's a Frankish clade.
 
I would be interested in the House of Wittlesbach haplogroup, as most of my German ancestors were either from Bavaria or the Palatinate, two historic Wittlesbach properties. I1, eh? That's kind of more rare in southern Germany, it could be it's a Frankish clade.

I wouldn't be so sure about it, Joey. Nowhere in the actual interview is it actually stated that the King of Sweden belonged to the House of Wittelsbach, it was just heavily implied. Of the three, Karl XII did visit the Bulgarian lands in the early 18th century, but he died unmarried and no illegitimate children of his are known, so it's unlikely that he had any whatsoever.

Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if the Wittelsbachs do belong to R1b instead. We'll see...
 
Venko2257, Thank you for the link.

I said I am not a genealogist.

I have documented direct ancestors that are kings, queens, saints and popes (at a time they married) and emperors. They are people of historical record.

I have looked a little at the legendary ancestors, and cousins, and others to see if we have a common ancestor. I am open-minded about it because I do not care. I look at the family tree because I look for their stories, the real and authentic history.

..that said, others keep peerages and histories and are very concerned about documentation.

I add their hard work to my family tree.

That's it.

It is my experience the descendant of Polish nobility had my Philip of Swabia and Emperors I didn't know I had.

Those tracing their Hamilton's had my direct ancestor kings in Wales and Brittany.

It is like that. Do not think only the French know the French or the English the English.

I identify as pre-Roman era Scot. I do not accept kings.

I do not accept Scots are Celts (the Germanic river people) or Picts (blue paint) because our family story speaks of their arrival.

Me? I am interested in ancient DNA and Haplogroup maps!
 
Venko2257, Thank you for the link.

I said I am not a genealogist.

I have documented direct ancestors that are kings, queens, saints and popes (at a time they married) and emperors. They are people of historical record.

I have looked a little at the legendary ancestors, and cousins, and others to see if we have a common ancestor. I am open-minded about it because I do not care. I look at the family tree because I look for their stories, the real and authentic history.

..that said, others keep peerages and histories and are very concerned about documentation.

I add their hard work to my family tree.

That's it.

It is my experience the descendant of Polish nobility had my Philip of Swabia and Emperors I didn't know I had.

Those tracing their Hamilton's had my direct ancestor kings in Wales and Brittany.

It is like that. Do not think only the French know the French or the English the English.

I identify as pre-Roman era Scot. I do not accept kings.

I do not accept Scots are Celts (the Germanic river people) or Picts (blue paint) because our family story speaks of their arrival.

Me? I am interested in ancient DNA and Haplogroup maps!

You're welcome!

It is nice to know someone who can link themselves to the so-called "World Family Tree". Unfortunately, it does not quite seem possible for a person from my country :(
 
Are people aware that many of those internet "trees" are bogus?
 
Are people aware that many of those internet "trees" are bogus?
Are you talking about those crazy trees that claim to trace e.g. a French king to an ancient royal such as King Ramses or Alexander the Great lol
 
I have seen some of those.. yikes!

Venko2257, at least you have your haplogroups and migration maps of ancient peoples.

I sent my brother his DNA test so I could have Y-DNA test results.

My first cousin (our mothers are sisters) had her mT-DNA test results.
 
I have seen some of those.. yikes!

Venko2257, at least you have your haplogroups and migration maps of ancient peoples.

I sent my brother his DNA test so I could have Y-DNA test results.

My first cousin (our mothers are sisters) had her mT-DNA test results.

Yes, at least the DNA can speak even if the person cannot. That's some relief.

But then again, Bulgarian results are very confusing, due to our... interesting history.
 
Are you talking about those crazy trees that claim to trace e.g. a French king to an ancient royal such as King Ramses or Alexander the Great lol

It’s obviously completely real for the Presidents, 23andme and NatGeo said that I’m totally 1000% related to Thomas Jefferson. LOL

Seriously :giggle: :grin:
 
It’s obviously completely real for the Presidents, 23andme and NatGeo said that I’m totally 1000% related to Thomas Jefferson. LOL

Seriously :giggle: :grin:

Well, unless you are secretly an alien or something not of this Earth, then you are indeed related to Thomas Jefferson :grin:
 
Well, unless you are secretly an alien or something not of this Earth, then you are indeed related to Thomas Jefferson :grin:

If you're right, the result will be the opposite:

Thomas Jefferson is totally 1000% related to Me (and not the other way around) :grin:

the Y chr rules :) (mtDNA rules too) :giggle:


... The y-chromosome is inherited more or less unchanged from father to son to grandson, indefinitely ...
 
You may have seen this already, but according to Brad Michael Little's website "The King's son", the Y-Chromosomal haplogroup of the House of Hesse has been found and it is R1b-L21.

Here's a link: https://www.the-kings-son.com/royal_hesse_haplogroup

Yet another R1b, eh? I wonder who was tested? One probably has to read his book to find out :rolleyes:
 
I've always assumed that if I found someone famous in my family tree it had to be a mistake. In fact, the reverse would be worse. I mean, what if I was a descendent of Thomas Jefferson, J.P. Morgan, or the King of Swabia? The only question would be, what the heck happened to you that you wound up as Joe ordinary?
 
I've always assumed that if I found someone famous in my family tree it had to be a mistake. In fact, the reverse would be worse. I mean, what if I was a descendent of Thomas Jefferson, J.P. Morgan, or the King of Swabia? The only question would be, what the heck happened to you that you wound up as Joe ordinary?
You were exchanged with another baby? Oh, it was a rhetorical question. Silly me... :grin:
P. S. I haven't actually read BML's book, but based on some implications I have arrived at the conclusion that his grandfather's father was Prince Louis of Battenberg (1854-1921). Isn't it quite brave in that case to claim that he (Louis) belonged to the House of Hesse, considering that Grand Duke Ludwig II was unlikely to have been his biological grandfather?
 
I've always assumed that if I found someone famous in my family tree it had to be a mistake. In fact, the reverse would be worse. I mean, what if I was a descendent of Thomas Jefferson, J.P. Morgan, or the King of Swabia? The only question would be, what the heck happened to you that you wound up as Joe ordinary?

It could also be someone "objectionable" according to your world view. I was raised to despise our local aristocracy. They're all blood suckers in my opinion. I have no idea why people want to be related to them.

When I looked at my mother's ancestry I saw their name littered all over. I console myself that they were probably people who worked for them and took the name.

On my father's side things are a little better. My paternal grandmother's family did found the village, with the attendant coat of arms, but everybody up there was probably fleeing from the powers that be, or were, so that makes it better. There's also a privateer from Rimini on my father's side. Another fugitive. I'm not "proud" of him, but at least he's interesting.

When you get down to it, if it's more than two hundred years ago it's extremely doubtful you share any dna with them at all.

I'm far more interested in the people of my area(s) as a whole, all of whom are probably "cousins" to one degree or another.
 

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