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Thread: With what ancient ethnicity do you most identify, and what has DNA told you ?

  1. #251
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2c1 PF3892+ (Swiss)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U4a (Cornish)

    Ethnic group
    3/4 Colonial American, 1/8 Cornish, 1/8 Welsh
    Country: USA - California



    Quote Originally Posted by Finbar View Post
    My apologies. There are better matches (GD 5 on 23 markers being lowest). What I should have said was that there is GD of 10 on 25 markers for a testee with the same surname and the same area of ancestral origin as me.
    That is pretty darned distant. Hard to say if that's a real relationship, or if you just happen to be the same haplogroup. I think the latter, so I wouldn't commit to it being a match. Personally, I get a GD of 0 on 37 with people who are 300 years removed. (I've also seen GD of 2 on 25 within 200 years, so it varies of course.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Finbar View Post
    Neither of us have been assigned a haplogroup by FTDNA, but we both test as I2b using the Whit Athey predictor. We are given a genetic distance of 10 by ysearch.org.
    Cullen's Predictor is quite confident that you are indeed I2-S23, AKA I2b (to use FTDNA's nomenclature, ISOGG calls it "I2a2"), and more specifically puts you as M223-. The only known I2 S23+ M223- subclade is I2-L38. I suggest you confirm that and possibly get even more specific by joining the I2-L38 Project. Cullen's Predictor is just as confident that 13909 is I2-L38, so he should join too, and you should see if you end up in the same cluster within that subclade.

  2. #252
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1a2a1a1b3
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV

    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: Italy



    1 members found this post helpful.
    I'm northern italian. According to my DNA test, I bear Y haplogroup R-u152, subclade Z-36 which is associated to central euro celts. My paternal ancestors were ligurian, that many scholars consider a celtic branch, so it should make sense. My mtdna is HV, likely neolithic. When italics came to Italy, neolithic farmers descendents were pushed into the appenninic regions: well, my maternal line comes from the deep appennine valleys of Emilia-Romagna, so a neolithic ancestry makes sense, too.
    Last edited by Mars; 23-03-14 at 11:39. Reason: tyPo

  3. #253
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    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    Quote Originally Posted by Mars View Post
    I'm northern italian. According to my DNA test, I bear Y haplogroup R-u152, subclade Z-36 which is associated to central euro celts. My paternal ancestors were ligurian, that many scholars consider a celtic branch, so it should make sense. My mtdna is HV, likely neolithic. When italics came to Italy, neolithic farmers descendents were pushed into the appenninic regions: well, my maternal line comes from the deep appennine valleys of Emilia-Romagna, so a neolithic ancestry makes sense, too.
    Where did you read, if you don't mind my asking, that Z36 specifically is associated with central European Celts?

    I certainly don't follow all the details on any yDNA, including R1b U152, and so my recollection could be faulty, but the last things I read showed that while the "modern" distribution of Z36 is certainly "Alpine", it's impossible to say where that specific mutation actually occurred.

    As for being "Celtic", I'm not sure that the "Celts" even existed at the time that the Z36 mutation occurred. (If we take the dating of the hobbyists that it occurred about 2000 B.C.E., which is a big "if", in my opinion.) However, my knowledge about the formation of central European "Celticity" is even sketchier than my detailed knowledge about specific yDNA subclades, so I would leave that for others to discuss.


    Also, just a general question...why would one choose to identify only with one's specific yDNA? What about one's mother's father's yDNA, or the other yDNAs that might actually be more numerous in one's family tree, or one's mtDNA, or one's father's mother's mtDNA, for example?


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  4. #254
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2b??

    Ethnic group
    Irish
    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by sparkey View Post
    That is pretty darned distant. Hard to say if that's a real relationship, or if you just happen to be the same haplogroup. I think the latter, so I wouldn't commit to it being a match. Personally, I get a GD of 0 on 37 with people who are 300 years removed. (I've also seen GD of 2 on 25 within 200 years, so it varies of course.)
    That's very interesting, thank you, Sparkey.
    The name shared by 13909 and I has a history going back potentially quite far, around 1000 years, perhaps more. I am not sure if the genetic distance is still too great to fit inside that time frame.
    What is/was compelling about the possibility is that it seems quite long odds that two men of uncommon name and uncommon haplogroup being unrelated. However, it is far from impossible.
    Do you know where I might find information on the frequency of I2-L38 in southern Ireland, or in the British Isles in general?

  5. #255
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2c1 PF3892+ (Swiss)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U4a (Cornish)

    Ethnic group
    3/4 Colonial American, 1/8 Cornish, 1/8 Welsh
    Country: USA - California



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Finbar View Post
    Do you know where I might find information on the frequency of I2-L38 in southern Ireland, or in the British Isles in general?
    It's rare everywhere, although supposedly there is a minor local frequency elevation of it in southern Ireland. De Beule gives:
    • Ireland: 0.32% (highest concentrations in Cork and Limerick)
    • Northern Ireland: 0.28%
    • Scotland: 0.39%
    • England: 0.48%
    • Wales: 0.39%


    I recommend De Beule's site for any information related to I2-L38. It is very thorough, and it's too bad there aren't sites like his for every haplogroup subclade.

  6. #256
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2b??

    Ethnic group
    Irish
    Country: United Kingdom



    Quote Originally Posted by sparkey View Post
    It's rare everywhere, although supposedly there is a minor local frequency elevation of it in southern Ireland.
    • Ireland: 0.32% (highest concentrations in Cork and Limerick)
    • Northern Ireland: 0.28%
    • Scotland: 0.39%
    • England: 0.48%
    • Wales: 0.39%


    I recommend De Beule's site for any information related to I2-L38. It is very thorough, and it's too bad there aren't sites like his for every haplogroup subclade.
    I am reading it right now! Thanks again.

  7. #257
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a1a2a1a L233
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c3

    Ethnic group
    English
    Country: Canada



    I identify most with monkeys.

  8. #258
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    Ethnic group
    Germanic/Celtic
    Country: United States



    I think I relate to the people the Romans called barbarians the best. I have not had a DNA test but My dads side is tall, with long heads, square jaws, brown to blonde haired, all blue eyed and between medium to fair skin. I know it means nothing due to how fast languages change but they spoke German.

  9. #259
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    L812
    MtDNA haplogroup
    T2G

    Ethnic group
    PA Dutch/Rhineland German and British
    Country: United States



    Before DNA testing I figured I was 50/50 British and German. And I mainly identified with my British side. However what i've discovered since testing is i'm 60/70% PA Dutch which is the Germans who came here from the Palatine/Rhineland area starting in the late 1600's. I've recently discovered my paternal line as well as another grandparents line have been here prior to 1776. So since i've made these discoveries i've felt more connected to the ancient German tribes of the Rhine, as well as feeling more connected to America.

  10. #260
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2c1 PF3892+ (Swiss)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U4a (Cornish)

    Ethnic group
    3/4 Colonial American, 1/8 Cornish, 1/8 Welsh
    Country: USA - California



    Quote Originally Posted by PA Dutch View Post
    Before DNA testing I figured I was 50/50 British and German. And I mainly identified with my British side. However what i've discovered since testing is i'm 60/70% PA Dutch which is the Germans who came here from the Palatine/Rhineland area starting in the late 1600's. I've recently discovered my paternal line as well as another grandparents line have been here prior to 1776. So since i've made these discoveries i've felt more connected to the ancient German tribes of the Rhine, as well as feeling more connected to America.
    60/70% PA Dutch is a very high number for anybody but the Amish, and some Mennonites and Dunkards. I take it your ancestors were plain people? Because if they were "fancy Dutch" (Lutherans and German Reformed types) I think you'd be the highest percentage "fancy Dutch" descendant I've ever heard of.

  11. #261
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a1a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV4a

    Ethnic group
    European-American, mostly Italian & Sicilian
    Country: United States



    I haven't had a DNA test yet, but even though all four grandparents came from southern Italy and Sicily, based on some limited and circumstantial evidence, I think we are actually northern European, possibly Norse/Norman. I've begun to identify as such. Hence even using an Old Norse male name as my internet handle.

  12. #262
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E-PF1975
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1a9

    Ethnic group
    Ashkenazi Jewish
    Country: Australia



    No clue. As an Ashkenazi Jew I suppose it should be Israelite? But I don't know.

  13. #263
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - Z2110
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H28a

    Ethnic group
    Greek
    Country: Greece



    From all the ancient cultures I mostly identify with the ancient Greeks, mainly because:

    - I was born, raised and currently live 1Km away from the Acropolis
    - My native language is Greek which is derived from Koine Greek, so when I look at the original ancient Greek text I immediately recognize 90% of the words, even if the grammar and systax has changed, making it difficult to interpret it 100% accurately.
    - We spend years at school reading Homer, ancient Greek history, etc.
    - Part of the ancient Greek religion survives in modern Greek folklore and superstitions (especially in rural Greece).
    - For a reason I cannot fully understand, looking at works of art from that era gives me a sense of warmth.

    From all the different eras of ancient Greece, I am particularly fascinated by the Mycenean civilisation.
    From other cultures, I am interested in the Etruscans, Assyrians, Egyptians, Celts, early Germanic Tribes, Chinese, Native Americans. I also feel total awe whenever I see the cave artwork created by paleolithic humans from anywhere in the world..

    All this is irrelevant to my DNA. I am R1b-CTS7822 which could have come to Greece througn various routes, old and new, and my distant ancestors could be Maori for all I care..

  14. #264
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1B-L21
    MtDNA haplogroup
    X

    Ethnic group
    British Isles/French/Dutch
    Country: Canada



    Celts I suppose.

  15. #265
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    Country: Ireland



    Who do you identify as your ancestors?

    Interesting question. I am, for the record, essentially half British/Scottish [some Irish] and half French/German. One side has Italian/Sicilian ancestry and the other Ashkenazi ancestry.

    Now you’d certainly think I’d relate to Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Vikings, etc. But I have only had a passing interest in these cultures. Thinking about it I don’t think there was even any serious interest in these cultures, beyond whatever may have been taught in school, when I was a child.

    Rather my interest has always been Gallo-Roman and Greco-Roman. Why? The French ancestry is widely in regions that were once inhabited by Gauls and Romans [and the passing Celt] rather than others initially. Basque influence would include Turdetani who were considered quite Greco-Roman by the Greco-Romans/Romans themselves. Southern Italy & Sicily have had more influence from the Greeks than they have had from other ancient civilizations.

    Besides, there is the rather simple fact such ancient cultures are interesting. Sure all ancient civilizations are. Indian & Japanese/Chinese civilizations have always caught my fancy but the question is who are our ancestors not who we find interesting. But unlike with the Celts, Vikings, etc. with them invoking a passing interest I still happen to read Homer & others despite the fact I have long since ceased needing to do so for a school project.


    From a DNA perspective? Via my brothers/father testing the Y-DNA haplogroup has a more Gaul/Roman [Iberian-Italo] lean than anything Celtic or Germanic. My mtDNA being Jewish is hardly surprising. Some of my closest friends happen to be Jewish for a reason [as said Ashkenazi ancestry].

  16. #266
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    Country: Ireland



    Who do you identify as your ancestors?


    Interesting question. I am, for the record, essentially half British/Scottish [some Irish] and half French/German. One side has Italian/Sicilian ancestry and the other Ashkenazi ancestry.


    Now you’d certainly think I’d relate to Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Vikings, etc. But I have only had a passing interest in these cultures. Thinking about it I don’t think there was even any serious interest in these cultures, beyond whatever may have been taught in school, when I was a child.


    Rather my interest has always been Gallo-Roman and Greco-Roman. Why? The French ancestry is widely in regions that were once inhabited by Gauls and Romans [and the passing Celt] rather than others initially. Basque influence would include Turdetani who were considered quite Greco-Roman by the Greco-Romans/Romans themselves. Southern Italy & Sicily have had more influence from the Greeks than they have had from other ancient civilizations.


    Besides there is the rather simple fact such ancient cultures are interesting. Sure all ancient civilizations are. Indian & Japanese/Chinese civilizations have always caught my fancy but the question is who are our ancestors not who we find interesting. But unlike with the Celts, Vikings, etc. with them invoking a passing interest I still happen to read Homer & others despite the fact I have long since ceased needing to do so for a school project.




    From a DNA perspective? Via my brothers/father testing the Y-DNA haplogroup has a more Gaul/Roman [Iberian-Italo] lean than anything Celtic or Germanic. My mtDNA being Jewish is hardly surprising. Some of my closest friends happen to be Jewish for a reason [as said Ashkenazi ancestry].

  17. #267
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    Country: USA - California



    Being Ashkenazi, the ancient Hebrews should be the answer. And to a high extent they are whom I identify with. But even the Torah states Abraham being Sumerian, so I am using this as the excuse why ancient Sumerians, Mesopotamians fascinate me and I definitely identify with them probably the most. Also the Basques and potentially Etruscans and Silensians. Two of my grandmothers are from Silesia. And ever since I have first met people from there and then went there, I had this strange feeling of belonging. So I know there is a significant common ancestry somewhere.

  18. #268
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J-m12
    MtDNA haplogroup
    ia1a1

    Ethnic group
    Hungarian Germanic Balkans
    Country: Hungary



    Difficult topic. As an Hungarian there is or was newer one ethnic group that defined the country's identity.I think that is the case for most of the countries in Europe, especially countries with alot of neighbors. Hungary consisted of many tribes (nomads) when settling in today's Hungary and Hungarians are fully aware of that. Some even claim that they settled in Ukraine, not Asia. The problem often arises when theorists engrave "slavic dna" and."italo celtic dna" in the haplogroups. People with similar dna can have very different cultures. The protein coding of the dna points to what region people lived and what they eat in their area (wich was similar) Not what culture they lived. There is much more research to be done in this area. But dna research can still be an interesting tool for further research

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  19. #269
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I-FGC24357
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K2a6

    Ethnic group
    Hainaut Belgium and Quebec Canada
    Country: USA - California



    Gauls. DNA has confirmed I am far more Gaulish than Germanic or Roman.

  20. #270
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    Country: Poland



    A 100% Indoeuropean here. :)

  21. #271
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    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rethel View Post
    A 100% Indoeuropean here. :)
    I guess you've never looked at any Admixture analyses. But hey, why bother with science when we can just all rely on our favorite fairy stories.

  22. #272
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    Country: Turkey



    I identify most with countries from the Ottoman Empire so Turkey and the Balkans.

  23. #273
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J-m12
    MtDNA haplogroup
    ia1a1

    Ethnic group
    Hungarian Germanic Balkans
    Country: Hungary



    In Europe the Balkans, including Hungary and parts of today's Slovakia. Some for a longer timeframe.

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  24. #274
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I1 Z63*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H5b1

    Ethnic group
    Basically British
    Country: USA - Arkansas



    I suppose I'd identify in this order and priority:

    An American
    A Southerner
    Part of the "colonial" group, the frontier folks who forged this country - "broadly British"
    Anglo-Saxon / Celtic
    European

  25. #275
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    G2a2b--PF6863
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV16

    Country: USA - New York



    Western European, vaguely and in general -- therefore, among ancient peoples, I identify most with the Romans (even though they probably conquered my ancestors)

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