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Thread: How did Haplogroup N reach Anatolia?

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  1. #1
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    How did Haplogroup N reach Anatolia?

    Hi all,

    I am originally from Turkey and I recently participated in the "Genographic project" by the National Geographic.

    I was very surprised to find out that my y dna haplogroup is haplogroup N which only constitutes %3.7 of the Turkish male population.

    I personally made some research trying to find out how my ancestors have ended up in Anatolia but it is a very difficult question to answer as there was no direct hint on the matter.

    The map given to me by the genographic project shows a pattern of movement from central asia towards russia and finland but the migration arrows end around there.

    I need a good historical and genetic understanding of how this haplogroup could have come to Anatolia and I would really appreciate your insights on this matter.

    Thank you.

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    Ethnic group
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    Country: Belgium - Brussels



    Anatolia has experienced many invasions from the Euasian steppe and Central Asia in its history, among which some people undeniably carried haplogroup N. It's hard to know more precisely which one though.
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    Well those are 2 possibilities but is there a migration route coming down from the Balkans as well? Considering the fact that The huns and Avars once settled in the Area. They could have made it down towards to Anatolia which we will not know in most history books.

    So since we cannot be sure from which region they came from exactly, my second question is which nationality or in better terms ethnic group do you think they(haplogroup N carriers) might have belonged to? Russian invaders? Central Asian invaders?(I doubt this theory as all Turks who have the central Asian origin are mainly from Haplogroup Q and C and there has been no direct hint to how/where haplogroup N fall in to)

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    Quote Originally Posted by Boranidas View Post
    Central Asian invaders?(I doubt this theory as all Turks who have the central Asian origin are mainly from Haplogroup Q and C and there has been no direct hint to how/where haplogroup N fall in to)
    That is not really true. There are G1 - Argyn, R1b - Kipchak, R1a - Jalair, O3 - Naiman, N1, J2 - Doulat, E1 - Kozha there in Central Asian population as well. And Q is less than R1b or G1.
    Virtually every CA tribe belongs to certain Hg apart Q and N1 so far. But it might be a lack of data then.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    I believe there is no or very less information/sources in regards to this topic.

    That's why I would prefer you to speculate about which possibility you find most likely and how that is so. Haplogroup N is 10,000 years old, how and with which specific migrations it might have entered Anatolia? Considering the fact that the Central Asian theory is more valid in terms of Haplogroups Q and C.

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    Re: YHgN: there is a study , follow the link please , it has a lot information :
    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...e.0066102.t001
    Genetic Evidence of an East Asian Origin and Paleolithic Northward Migration of Y-chromosome Haplogroup N

    The Y-chromosome haplogroup N-M231 (Hg N) is distributed widely in eastern and central Asia, Siberia, as well as in eastern and northern Europe. Previous studies suggested a counterclockwise prehistoric migration of Hg N from eastern Asia to eastern and northern Europe. However, the root of this Y chromosome lineage and its detailed dispersal pattern across eastern Asia are still unclear. We analyzed haplogroup profiles and phylogeographic patterns of 1,570 Hg N individuals from 20,826 males in 359 populations across Eurasia. We first genotyped 6,371 males from 169 populations in China and Cambodia, and generated data of 360 Hg N individuals, and then combined published data on 1,210 Hg N individuals from Japanese, Southeast Asian, Siberian, European and Central Asian populations. The results showed that the sub-haplogroups of Hg N have a distinct geographical distribution. The highest Y-STR diversity of the ancestral Hg N sub-haplogroups was observed in the southern part of mainland East Asia, and further phylogeographic analyses supports an origin of Hg N in southern China. Combined with previous data, we propose that the early northward dispersal of Hg N started from southern China about 21 thousand years ago (kya), expanding into northern China 12–18 kya, and reaching further north to Siberia about 12–14 kya before a population expansion and westward migration into Central Asia and eastern/northern Europe around 8.0–10.0 kya. This northward migration of Hg N likewise coincides with retreating ice sheets after the Last Glacial Maximum (22–18 kya) in mainland East Asia.


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    Country: Croatia



    Bosnian Serbs have 7 percent of N haplogroup

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1
    MtDNA haplogroup
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    Country: Lithuania



    Hi, Why table Y-DNA per country https://www.eupedia.com/europe/europ...logroups.shtml
    indicates 1% for Bosnian Serbs and (2,5%) for Serbia (minus?)

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    That %7 is higher than the rate found in Turkey(%4) indirectly dismissing the possibility of the haplogroup entering Turkey through Central Asia. It might have been carried on through the Balkans.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
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    Country: France



    Yes Central Asia is the best idea on my opinion
    Nico

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    why you think that? and plus you seem to be N tat as well. I am curious, are you originally from Europe?

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J1-Z18271 (Kohen)
    MtDNA haplogroup
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    He's actually G, but he's just playing with your mind.

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    Country: Netherlands



    In the Netherlands, West-Germany, Belgium, UK and Denmark the haplogroup N is
    virtually absent.

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    I am from Turkey with Haplogroup N and my family goes back 6 generations to Ankara area.

    We probably came either through Balkans or as a result of wars/invasions/rape.
    Timur is another possibility since they camped around Ankara.

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    I wonder if the Janissaries could be responsible for the N. They were mostly from the Balkans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eochaidh View Post
    I wonder if the Janissaries could be responsible for the N. They were mostly from the Balkans.
    There is much less N in the Balkans than in Turkey.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    There is much less N in the Balkans than in Turkey.
    You are correct, of course. I should have checked this first: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

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    Country: Serbia



    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    There is much less N in the Balkans than in Turkey.
    Yes, and for Bosnian Serbs (about 6%) it's coincidence, it's a small sample. In Serbia is less 2%, in Upper Macedonia is about 0,5-1%, in Croatia is similar, etc. Balkans is no area where N carriers could be find in a significant number.

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    Country: Yugoslavia



    I've read somewhere that some Hunnic warriors settled round Bosnia during their invasions.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
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    Turkey is the most important mixture of haplogroups on earth !

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    what makes you say that? Interesting..

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    MtDNA haplogroup
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    Country: Kazakhstan



    Update to previous post. Edige (Noghai-Manghit) descendants have N1. R1a is common Hg among Altaians and Kirgiz.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    I am ethnic Kazakh with N1c1 and there is likely Turkic cluster of 3 Kazakhs and 1 Tatar from Volga river basin.
    So I would say N in Turkic people derived from Xiongnu and part of them later formed the core of Oghuz Turkic tribes which in turn invaded Anatolia.

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    Country: Romania



    Hi,

    I'm Romanian and got confirmed N Haplogroup so Balkanian route could be considered. At least My granparents populated an area in the SE of Romania, very close to Bulgary and in the Danube vecinity..

    Furthermore these guys here need to update their N haplogroup distribution for Romania since there are few N Y haplogroups as well. At the moment they stated "0".

    May I ask you how do u look Boranidas? Have u a tipycal turkish look?

    Cheers.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
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    Country: Kazakhstan



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by F117stealth View Post
    Hi,

    I'm Romanian and got confirmed N Haplogroup so Balkanian route could be considered. At least My granparents populated an area in the SE of Romania, very close to Bulgary and in the Danube vecinity..

    Furthermore these guys here need to update their N haplogroup distribution for Romania since there are few N Y haplogroups as well. At the moment they stated "0".

    May I ask you how do u look Boranidas? Have u a tipycal turkish look?

    Cheers.
    Physical features has nothing to do with Y chromosome only, that's the contribution of all of your ancestors, including females. You'll look as your country mates unless you are recent migrant or from very isolated community.

    What company have you done your test? If FTDNA, I'd recommend to order SNP L1034. There were a few breakthroughs over a couple years. Looks like Turkish and European N1c1 took different ways - Turkish via Central Asia and Iran and European via what is now Russia and Hungary, both groups from Siberia. I belong to L1034 branch as well as 1 Nenets, 1 Bashkir, 5 Hunagarians (2 of them from Transilvania), 1 Greek. So, I wouldn't surprised if Romanian turns out N1c1-L1034.

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