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Thread: How did Haplogroup N reach Anatolia?

  1. #1
    Regular Member Boranidas's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    How did Haplogroup N reach Anatolia?

    Hi all,

    I am originally from Turkey and I recently participated in the "Genographic project" by the National Geographic.

    I was very surprised to find out that my y dna haplogroup is haplogroup N which only constitutes %3.7 of the Turkish male population.

    I personally made some research trying to find out how my ancestors have ended up in Anatolia but it is a very difficult question to answer as there was no direct hint on the matter.

    The map given to me by the genographic project shows a pattern of movement from central asia towards russia and finland but the migration arrows end around there.

    I need a good historical and genetic understanding of how this haplogroup could have come to Anatolia and I would really appreciate your insights on this matter.

    Thank you.

  2. #2
    Satyavrata Maciamo's Avatar
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    Anatolia has experienced many invasions from the Euasian steppe and Central Asia in its history, among which some people undeniably carried haplogroup N. It's hard to know more precisely which one though.
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  3. #3
    Regular Member Boranidas's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    Well those are 2 possibilities but is there a migration route coming down from the Balkans as well? Considering the fact that The huns and Avars once settled in the Area. They could have made it down towards to Anatolia which we will not know in most history books.

    So since we cannot be sure from which region they came from exactly, my second question is which nationality or in better terms ethnic group do you think they(haplogroup N carriers) might have belonged to? Russian invaders? Central Asian invaders?(I doubt this theory as all Turks who have the central Asian origin are mainly from Haplogroup Q and C and there has been no direct hint to how/where haplogroup N fall in to)

  4. #4
    Regular Member Boranidas's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    I believe there is no or very less information/sources in regards to this topic.

    That's why I would prefer you to speculate about which possibility you find most likely and how that is so. Haplogroup N is 10,000 years old, how and with which specific migrations it might have entered Anatolia? Considering the fact that the Central Asian theory is more valid in terms of Haplogroups Q and C.

  5. #5
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    Bosnian Serbs have 7 percent of N haplogroup

  6. #6
    Regular Member Boranidas's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    That %7 is higher than the rate found in Turkey(%4) indirectly dismissing the possibility of the haplogroup entering Turkey through Central Asia. It might have been carried on through the Balkans.

  7. #7
    Knight willy's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
    Schwaben
    Country: France



    Yes Central Asia is the best idea on my opinion
    Nico

  8. #8
    Regular Member Boranidas's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c

    Country: Turkey



    why you think that? and plus you seem to be N tat as well. I am curious, are you originally from Europe?

  9. #9
    בלי עין הרע Semitic Duwa's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J1-Z18271 (Kohen)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c5

    Ethnic group
    Half-Jewish (paternal) & Half-British (maternal)
    Country: France



    He's actually G, but he's just playing with your mind.

  10. #10
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    Country: Netherlands



    In the Netherlands, West-Germany, Belgium, UK and Denmark the haplogroup N is
    virtually absent.

  11. #11
    Junior Member usm007's Avatar
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    I am from Turkey with Haplogroup N and my family goes back 6 generations to Ankara area.

    We probably came either through Balkans or as a result of wars/invasions/rape.
    Timur is another possibility since they camped around Ankara.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Eochaidh's Avatar
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    MtDNA haplogroup
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    I wonder if the Janissaries could be responsible for the N. They were mostly from the Balkans.

  13. #13
    Satyavrata Maciamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eochaidh View Post
    I wonder if the Janissaries could be responsible for the N. They were mostly from the Balkans.
    There is much less N in the Balkans than in Turkey.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Eochaidh's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    MtDNA haplogroup
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    Ethnic group
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo View Post
    There is much less N in the Balkans than in Turkey.
    You are correct, of course. I should have checked this first: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

  15. #15
    Knight willy's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N-Tat

    Ethnic group
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    Country: France



    Turkey is the most important mixture of haplogroups on earth !

  16. #16
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    Quote Originally Posted by Boranidas View Post
    Central Asian invaders?(I doubt this theory as all Turks who have the central Asian origin are mainly from Haplogroup Q and C and there has been no direct hint to how/where haplogroup N fall in to)
    That is not really true. There are G1 - Argyn, R1b - Kipchak, R1a - Jalair, O3 - Naiman, N1, J2 - Doulat, E1 - Kozha there in Central Asian population as well. And Q is less than R1b or G1.
    Virtually every CA tribe belongs to certain Hg apart Q and N1 so far. But it might be a lack of data then.

  17. #17
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    Update to previous post. Edige (Noghai-Manghit) descendants have N1. R1a is common Hg among Altaians and Kirgiz.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Anatolian's Avatar
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    what makes you say that? Interesting..

  19. #19
    Regular Member
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1c1-L1034
    MtDNA haplogroup
    B5a1a

    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    I am ethnic Kazakh with N1c1 and there is likely Turkic cluster of 3 Kazakhs and 1 Tatar from Volga river basin.
    So I would say N in Turkic people derived from Xiongnu and part of them later formed the core of Oghuz Turkic tribes which in turn invaded Anatolia.

  20. #20
    Regular Member F117stealth's Avatar
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    Hi,

    I'm Romanian and got confirmed N Haplogroup so Balkanian route could be considered. At least My granparents populated an area in the SE of Romania, very close to Bulgary and in the Danube vecinity..

    Furthermore these guys here need to update their N haplogroup distribution for Romania since there are few N Y haplogroups as well. At the moment they stated "0".

    May I ask you how do u look Boranidas? Have u a tipycal turkish look?

    Cheers.

  21. #21
    Regular Member
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    Ethnic group
    Kazak
    Country: Kazakhstan



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by F117stealth View Post
    Hi,

    I'm Romanian and got confirmed N Haplogroup so Balkanian route could be considered. At least My granparents populated an area in the SE of Romania, very close to Bulgary and in the Danube vecinity..

    Furthermore these guys here need to update their N haplogroup distribution for Romania since there are few N Y haplogroups as well. At the moment they stated "0".

    May I ask you how do u look Boranidas? Have u a tipycal turkish look?

    Cheers.
    Physical features has nothing to do with Y chromosome only, that's the contribution of all of your ancestors, including females. You'll look as your country mates unless you are recent migrant or from very isolated community.

    What company have you done your test? If FTDNA, I'd recommend to order SNP L1034. There were a few breakthroughs over a couple years. Looks like Turkish and European N1c1 took different ways - Turkish via Central Asia and Iran and European via what is now Russia and Hungary, both groups from Siberia. I belong to L1034 branch as well as 1 Nenets, 1 Bashkir, 5 Hunagarians (2 of them from Transilvania), 1 Greek. So, I wouldn't surprised if Romanian turns out N1c1-L1034.

  22. #22
    Regular Member zanipolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F117stealth View Post
    Hi,

    I'm Romanian and got confirmed N Haplogroup so Balkanian route could be considered. At least My granparents populated an area in the SE of Romania, very close to Bulgary and in the Danube vecinity..

    Furthermore these guys here need to update their N haplogroup distribution for Romania since there are few N Y haplogroups as well. At the moment they stated "0".

    May I ask you how do u look Boranidas? Have u a tipycal turkish look?

    Cheers.
    Bosnian Serbs have 6% of N1 (LLY22g), some of the 6% is P-189.2
    Father's Mtdna H95a1
    Grandfather Mtdna T2b24
    Great Grandfather Mtdna T1a1e
    GMother paternal side YDna R1b-S8172
    Mother's YDna R1a-Z282

  23. #23
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    Country: Turkey



    N Haplogroup might had arrived to Anatolia with Oghuzes as said in Turkey or Oghurs as said up in North now Russia among Oguric-Uralic tribes; however, both are referring to the same group of people speaking Turkic languages may be the source of the N Haplogroup.

  24. #24
    Regular Member F117stealth's Avatar
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    Country: Romania



    Quote Originally Posted by vadu View Post
    Physical features has nothing to do with Y chromosome only, that's the contribution of all of your ancestors, including females. You'll look as your country mates unless you are recent migrant or from very isolated community.

    What company have you done your test? If FTDNA, I'd recommend to order SNP L1034. There were a few breakthroughs over a couple years. Looks like Turkish and European N1c1 took different ways - Turkish via Central Asia and Iran and European via what is now Russia and Hungary, both groups from Siberia. I belong to L1034 branch as well as 1 Nenets, 1 Bashkir, 5 Hunagarians (2 of them from Transilvania), 1 Greek. So, I wouldn't surprised if Romanian turns out N1c1-L1034.
    It was genebase.com and the results pointed out N1c1d (L550+). So far I came no deeper than this. People from abroad tend to ask me if I am Polish or Russian. By Alleles means the closest match seems to be related to balts (lithuanians) so going back to what people ask me one can easily make fragile connections.. Otherwise perfectly agree with your statement. Not sure at the moment if I belong to Neuri or Varangians or to other N1c1 D (L550+) subgroups - work in progress.

  25. #25
    Junior Member Tatar's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    N1C1

    Ethnic group
    Volga Tatar
    Country: Russian Federation



    Probably North or Central Asian origin. Me too belong to N1c1.

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