Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 51 to 63 of 63

Thread: new ancient DNA study in LBK

  1. #51
    Junior Member Achievements:
    7 days registered
    Selim's Avatar
    Join Date
    29-09-11
    Posts
    6


    Country: Turkey



    We can't directly correlate haplogroups and phisical appearance,because evolution is faster than we thought.
    Take a Pygme with hg B to Scandinavia,wait just 2-3 thousand years,he'll turn into a blond.
    Just look at Albanians,they don't look like a North African,or Finns-as mentioned above-do not look like a Samoyet or Sibiryan.
    Climate is the key of this matter.

  2. #52
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsRecommendation First Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,329
    Points
    110,111
    Level
    100
    Points: 110,111, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Sorry Selim, the human kind (and the world) is not 5,000 years old. Try 100 years from Pygmy to Scandinavia. On top of it, most likely, blond color was helped by Neanderthals.

  3. #53
    Junior Member Achievements:
    7 days registered
    Selim's Avatar
    Join Date
    29-09-11
    Posts
    6


    Country: Turkey



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Sorry Selim, the human kind (and the world) is not 5,000 years old. Try 100 years from Pygmy to Scandinavia. On top of it, most likely, blond color was helped by Neanderthals.
    I don't understand why you ''try'' to be sarcastic,but non-Africans including Europans are just % 4 Neanderthal,blondism seems as a result of evolution of Sapiens;not Neanderthals or something.

    For the beginers,human variations are shaped by some factors such as climate,enviroment and naturel selection.

  4. #54
    Regular Member Achievements:
    OverdriveThree Friends5000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Knovas's Avatar
    Join Date
    14-05-11
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    1,444
    Points
    9,065
    Level
    28
    Points: 9,065, Level: 28
    Level completed: 53%, Points required for next Level: 285
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1b1a

    Ethnic group
    Catalan
    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    Quote Originally Posted by Wilhelm View Post
    So, Iberians were haplogroups I2 ? It is rarely found in Catalonia, about 4%
    I followed this discussion and it's interesting that perhaps Maciamo was quite right, in the sense that, at least, the last Dodecad Calculator gave me almost 60% Southwestern (very likely Paleolithic and dominant). However, it's just one case for the moment, and having around 35% Northwest + Northeast it is also significant (not far from the Spanish average, wich has more Southeastern instead of the huge Southwestern).

    In next weeks/months, I think some things would become more clear.

  5. #55
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsRecommendation First Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,329
    Points
    110,111
    Level
    100
    Points: 110,111, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Quote Originally Posted by Selim View Post
    I don't understand why you ''try'' to be sarcastic,but non-Africans including Europans are just % 4 Neanderthal,blondism seems as a result of evolution of Sapiens;not Neanderthals or something.

    For the beginers,human variations are shaped by some factors such as climate,enviroment and naturel selection.
    Tell me one thing Selim. Why do you think Neanderthals were protected from evolutionary forces? As hominids living in Europe and Asia, it is quite logical that they developed light skin. Often forms of blondism come with it.
    When black people from Africa mated with Neanderthals, it is very logical to assume that, they picked up lighter color of skin from Neanderthals. It's much faster way to adopt to environment than waiting maybe a million years for a right mutation to happen randomly.

    For beginners, to your list of human variations add "mating with other hominids".

  6. #56
    Junior Member Achievements:
    7 days registered
    Selim's Avatar
    Join Date
    29-09-11
    Posts
    6


    Country: Turkey



    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Tell me one thing Selim. Why do you think Neanderthals were protected from evolutionary forces?
    İs that really what you understood from my post?I wonder how you concluded my post with the phrase I bolded.Please read carefully.

    It's much faster way to adopt to environment than waiting maybe a million years for a right mutation to happen randomly
    ''maybe a million years'',this is a common mistake that I'm trying to tell.One more time;evolution is much more faster than we used to assume.
    Simple phisical mutations do not require millions of years;but thousands of years.Pigmentation,colour of hair or eyes,features of nose,face,etc.they all can change within 3-5 thousands of years,not millions.İt didn't took ''millions of years'' to have a white skin or all the different races didn't formed within ''millions of years''.

    And bed news for you;Sapiens is not a million year old.

    You can't explain everthing with non-Sapiens contrubitions;both Neanderthal and Denisova inputs are very limited.
    Otherwise we can not explain hundreds of different phisical features of races of Sapiens,your magic wand,Neanderthal,is not enough to solve every problems.

    When black people from Africa mated with Neanderthals,
    They were probably not ''black'' anymore when they come to Europa,within a couple of thousands of years their pigmentation must have changed.
    Just like Chadic speakers of Africa changed and become black in a few thousands of years.You can find hundreds of similar examples in human variations.

    Just look at Russians,Kırgızs and Tadjiks;they all descend from the same paternal ansestors,but within thousands of years (not million) they completely changed as a result of different enviroment,climate etc.
    You know how old R1a1 is,don't you?

  7. #57
    Advisor Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteranTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsRecommendation First Class
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    LeBrok's Avatar
    Join Date
    18-11-09
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    10,329
    Points
    110,111
    Level
    100
    Points: 110,111, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b Z2109
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H1c

    Ethnic group
    Citizen of the world
    Country: Canada-Alberta



    Quote Originally Posted by Selim View Post
    İs that really what you understood from my post?I wonder how you concluded my post with the phrase I bolded.Please read carefully.
    This is why:
    Quote Originally Posted by Selim View Post
    blondism seems as a result of evolution of Sapiens;not Neanderthals or something.



    One more time;evolution is much more faster than we used to assume.
    How do you know?


    And bed news for you;Sapiens is not a million year old.
    How old do you think Sapiens is?



    You can't explain everything with non-Sapiens contrubitions;both Neanderthal and Denisova inputs are very limited.
    How much of Neanderthal genome you need for a white skin? Is 4% enough?

    Otherwise we can not explain hundreds of different phisical features of races of Sapiens,your magic wand,Neanderthal,is not enough to solve every problems.
    What every problem???



    They were probably not ''black'' anymore when they come to Europa,within a couple of thousands of years their pigmentation must have changed.
    Just like Chadic speakers of Africa changed and become black in a few thousands of years.You can find hundreds of similar examples in human variations.
    How do you know that Chadic didn't mate with black Africans to get black skin faster?
    Why would you want to wait few thousand years for mutation to happen if the mutation for black skin is already in black Africans living in next village? Just have sex, it's so easy..., and your kids have this beneficial mutation right away.



    Just look at Russians,Kırgızs and Tadjiks;they all descend from the same paternal ansestors,but within thousands of years (not million) they completely changed as a result of different enviroment,climate etc.
    You know how old R1a1 is,don't you?
    Why are you so afraid against people mating? What are you saying, groups of different people never mixed together?
    Paternal HG and all chromosome Y doesn't have much to do with how people look. How people look is scattered all over the rest of DNA, it's called autosomal DNA. Obviously Kirghiz have lot's of Mongolian autosomal DNA. It doesn't mean they mutated this way. It means that R1a1 men mated with Mongolian women.


    PS. Try not to exaggerate and keep it in lighter tone next time.

  8. #58
    Regular Member Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsVeteran

    Join Date
    12-09-11
    Posts
    20
    Points
    3,956
    Level
    18
    Points: 3,956, Level: 18
    Level completed: 27%, Points required for next Level: 294
    Overall activity: 33.0%


    Country: Australia



    Doesn't that large frequency of R1b in Catalonia or Ireland or among the Basques rings bells? It is not normal for any people to have a near unity of one haplogroup. It either means a recent invasion, strange mating practices and severe founder effects. The Yemeni men are over 70% J1! It is not natural, like every having the surname Smith. Surnames are handed down from men to their male children in a hereditary fashion.

    Only the today's Iberians think they are pre I.E or Paleolithic. Something to do with Rh negative? Everyone else just thinks them to be rather an strange and inbred group of isolates.

  9. #59
    Regular Member Achievements:
    OverdriveThree Friends5000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Knovas's Avatar
    Join Date
    14-05-11
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    1,444
    Points
    9,065
    Level
    28
    Points: 9,065, Level: 28
    Level completed: 53%, Points required for next Level: 285
    Overall activity: 4.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I2a1a*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    K1b1a

    Ethnic group
    Catalan
    Country: Spain - Catalonia



    R1b is certantly significant in Iberia autosomally speaking, but the very high Southwestern as I said in other posts, makes me think Iberians, and specially ethnic Catalans (if my results weren't wrong or exclusive), have very strong Paleolithic element.

  10. #60
    Elite member Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    70
    Posts
    4,362
    Points
    36,508
    Level
    58
    Points: 36,508, Level: 58
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 142
    Overall activity: 16.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by willy View Post
    Yes this is the same thing about the R1b found at high % in Central Africa notice this Y-DNA lineage lake also diversity anyway they are not white cause their African mtDNA ! Same thing about the Y-DNA R1a in India .Other cases of mixture are the French - Spanish - Italians I do agree. I am often surprise to see some dark skin peoples in Brittany with North African features for a high level of Y-DNA R1b1b2 who seems also lake diversity ? anyway I always wondering if these North African features found in Brittany , I mean : black skin brown eyes etc .. were really correlated to these paleolithic mtDNA or from a more recent mixture but I do agree with you . Anyway the Indo european blood is more representative in Germanic and Nordic countries include Poland and Baltic eras no doubt .

    very funny
    dark skinned Bretons? a lot even?
    Genuine Bretons are known to have lighter eyes and lighter skin than lighter hair
    freckling go to 30-40% in sommer for its inhabitants!!! (2,8-3,5% red and very reddish hairs!)
    at a lower level, Bretons present the same 'derive' as the Irish and Welsh people (the famous dark skinned Welshes is a romantic vision of Londoners)
    yes, there are some dark skinned people in Brittany, but rarer than black or near black haired people, and the most of them is to be found in Eastern romance speaking bretons - some very local districts have a little more 'dark' skins - in a whole, the Western Bretons have only 24% of dark haired dark eyed people (the categories brown hair-blue eyes and brown hair grey-green eyes are more numerous! - if you put the skin colour in the play, it is only something like 8%-10% of dark haired-dark eyed-dark skinned -
    and the famous mediterranean 'olive coloured' skins is much rarest than the white-yellow hue

  11. #61
    Elite member Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    70
    Posts
    4,362
    Points
    36,508
    Level
    58
    Points: 36,508, Level: 58
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 142
    Overall activity: 16.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    keep in mind there are only 30% or genuine Bretons in Brittant towns - do study the old rural breton speaking people

  12. #62
    Elite member Achievements:
    Three FriendsVeteran25000 Experience Points

    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    70
    Posts
    4,362
    Points
    36,508
    Level
    58
    Points: 36,508, Level: 58
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 142
    Overall activity: 16.0%

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    Quote Originally Posted by Wilhelm View Post
    Yes, Poland and Russia are predominantly dark-haired. As an example, the Polish national team (all ethnic polaks) :


    sorry, but this photo is of little worth for pigmentation: (with photos you nead a lot of photos of the same guys to be sure) - a TV match is far better for the people moves and the lights effects too.
    I have it in my drawers:
    A-11 men is not a nation -
    B- like a lot of them, this photo is darkning the hairs colours
    C- I believe there was only 2 true very dark brown men on this one (I've no time to search my archives)
    D- the others are brown hairs of different hues - the Polish people is one that presents the most every kinds of brown hair (very light/light/liddle/dark brown - the total is about 52-53% brown hairs, a maximum (in a mixing 50/50 "dark" genes" with "light "genes" the maximum in about 45% of middle hairs - we find often 50% but it could the effect of some genetic homozygotic brown hair' with less than 50-50 dark-light -
    onlyin ireland, Wales, Brittany I found more than 50% of middle hues -addition of old mesolithics people with true brown hair?
    I expect I'm not to hard in my writing.
    good evening.

  13. #63
    Junior Member Achievements:
    500 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    04-08-13
    Posts
    9
    Points
    934
    Level
    7
    Points: 934, Level: 7
    Level completed: 92%, Points required for next Level: 16
    Overall activity: 0%


    Country: Afghanistan



    I believe I may be able to contribute to this conversation. My Geno 2.0 Results have me as 46% Northern European, 36% Mediterranean, 17% Southwest Asian. Likewise includes 1.5% Neanderthal and 2.9% Denisovan. I am U106- and P312- which according to my research makes me R1B-L11*. Are there many of us on here? I happen to be 1 of 7 children, 6 of whom were male. I love the great ideas floating around these forums by the way. It is a real breath of electronic fresh air!

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Similar Threads

  1. Matching Ancient languages with Ancient tribes
    By zanipolo in forum Linguistics
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 24-07-11, 01:19
  2. New study on Jewish genes
    By Shasta in forum Autosomal Genetics
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 28-11-10, 11:22
  3. Funnelbeaker (TRB) DNA Study
    By MBH1963 in forum Neolithic & Chalcolithic
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-11-10, 09:13
  4. False study ?? What do you think
    By Wilhelm in forum DNA Testing & General Genetics
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 08-02-10, 18:46
  5. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-01-10, 16:07

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •