New map of E1b1b in Europe and the Middle East

I'd like to have Maciamo opinion on haplogroup E in Ile de France. Which subclades of E1b prevail there? Is there any historical reasons for the high frequency of E1b in île de France? Why is there more E1b in Ile de France than in Marseille area?
 
I'd like to have Maciamo opinion on haplogroup E in Ile de France. Which subclades of E1b prevail there? Is there any historical reasons for the high frequency of E1b in île de France? Why is there more E1b in Ile de France than in Marseille area?

Maybe because of the big number of people with a distant or recent maghrebian origin?
 
Maybe because of the big number of people with a distant or recent maghrebian origin?

The problem isthat in France the origin of samples members are not verified too deeply - at the Neolithic impact of Near-Easterners (J2/E1) and Caucasic People (G2/J2) would have been strong enough (30% ?) in ?le-de-France but I find it curious that this people could have stayed there 5000-6000 years without being overflowed or diluted by other historic newcomers - the kind of E2 is a problem too: which? the North-West-African one or the Near-Eastern-Balkanic one? so the problem of sampling is still the probable explication of these high (too high) percentages-
 
how yes no
You're right, it is hard to say.

If we read Kalevy Week (2008) about Balkan: "Clans E3b, J and G and represent the Early Farmers."

and author says that:

"About 25 kya (25000 years) the “Middle Eastern” Clan F sent another branch to Anatolia and further to the Balkans, and a new sub-Clan I emerged."

"Europe experienced a cooling climate and the onset of the Last Glacial Maximum (LGM)."

"About 10 kya (10000 years) the farmers of the Middle East, representing African Clan E (its sub-clan E3b) and two sub-clans of F (the “Caucasian” Clan G and the “Near Eastern” Clan J), spread to Anatolia and further to Greece and the Mediterranean coast."

"Clans I, E3b, J, and G all originate from the Middle East, but only E3b, J, and G (not I) belong to the group of “Early Farmers.”

"Clan I had spread into Europe before the emergence of effective domestication of wild plants and animals (i.e. the beginning of agriculture and cattle raising) in the Middle East."

"Clan I represents the “Old Europeans”."

...

I think that we can link Dacians, Thracians, Greeks and Illyrians with early farmers.

And linguistic researchs can be helpful.

For example Greek language can be linked with J2 and old Romanian and Albanian language can be linked with E1b1b.

Today the Romanian language is a Latinized but even so, between Romanian and Albanian there are many similarities.

There are opinions that Albanians originate from one of part Dacians, and although they are close to the Illyrians and the ancient Greeks, not originate from them.

Some consider that today's Albanian population is similar population of Peloponnese and that somebody can make connections Peloponnese-Epirus-Albania.

The third opinion is that Albanians come from Illyrians directly.

The problem with the second opinion is the difference in language between today's Greek and Albanian, although of course it is possible to exist different versions of why this was so (but I do not want speculate now).

The problem with the third opinion is that in today's Albanian has very few words related to the sea, but Illyrian language certainly had to have sea words because the Illyrians inhabited the Adriatic coast.

It is theoretically possible that today's Albanians are originally Dacians (from some mountainous areas today's Romania), but it would mean that the original Dacians are E1b1b.

I have some hypotheses regarding the ethnic Albanians...

1: I may hypothesize that Ancient Greeks and Ancient Macedonia (taking into account the ethnic majority) were comprised by current ethnic Albanians and Hellenic people
2: I may hypothesize based on the DNA facts data below that “Illyrians are direct descendants of I2a haplogroup.
3: I may also hypothesize (based on DNA data and the current locations of modern Albanians and Greeks) that current modern Greeks are not the only descendants of Ancient Greeks but it comprises of other ancient tribes (see below 1 to 7).
4: I may also hypothesize that current ethnic Albanians are neither the descendants of: Illyrians, Thracians, Dacians, Carpians (Carpathian) (and at that time there were no Greeks yet), but rather NATIVE people with the DNA of E-V13 which was pre Illyrian, Thracian, Dacian, Carpian (Carpathian) and Ancient Greek and Macedonian.

If we carefully look at the map and the highest percentages of E-V13, We can see that on the most areas where current ethnic Albanians live E-V13 has its highest percentages, Kosovo 47.5%, Albanians from Macedonia 39.1%, south Greece 43.5% (were ethnic Albanians called Arvanitas or Arberesh live), north Greece 35.4%, Arvanitas and Peloponnese area 47%% (it is known that Arvanitas lived in Peloponnese area too), and Albania with 27.5%. While the rest of the Greece (were traditionally is known that no Albanians live there) as of those from Crete have only 8.8%, Thrace 19%, and the rest of Greece overall, ethnic Greeks of today have only 19%, it also shows that they are much more Slavicized than Albanians with R1a 16% and I2a of 19%. In addition, based on a map shown with a percentage of E-V13, south Serbia (were ethnic Albanians live) has higher percentage of E-V13, and south east and north east part of Montenegro (were ethnic Albanians live) have also higher percentage.

1: Arvanitas based on Southwest Greece (Arberesh, who spoke a dialect of the Albanian language). It is also argued that Arvanitas were also on Peloponnese area of Greece.
2: Epirus (Where Gjergj Kastrioti Skanderbeg declared that he is a descendant of Epirus king of Pyrrhus),
3: Dardania (current Kosovo)
4: Current Albania
5: West (current) Macedonia.
6: the Very South of current Serbia
7: South East and north East part of current Montenegro

E-V13 is 10,000 years old, then we can argue that current ethnic Albanians are NATIVE inhabitants of Europe, it should be interested to see what DNA would the kings of Ancient Greeks have.
This also verifies why Greek and Albanian language is 5000 years old as argued in the recent study.
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...ience&module=Search&mabReward=relbias:w&_r=2&

It is argued that relatively small populations and the very non mixed of...Saami (Norway, Sweden, finish), Sardinians (Sardinia, very south of Mediterranean Dalmatia), Basques (North Spain) and Kosovar Albanians (Republic of Kosovo) are the very NATIVES of the European region.
Please refer to what native Saami, Sardinians, Basques and Kosovar Albanians should look alike
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardinian_people
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basque_people
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sami_people
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albanians_in_Kosovo

Autosomal DNA[edit]
Analysis of autosomal DNA, which analyses all genetic components has revealed that few genetic discontinuities exist in European populations, apart from certain outliers such as Saami, Sardinians, Basques and Kosovar Albanians. They found that Albanians, on the one hand, have a high amount of identity by descent sharing, suggesting that both Albanians from Albania and Kosovo derived from a relatively small population that expanded recently and rapidly in the last 1,500 years. On the other hand, they are not wholly isolated or endogamous, as they share a significant amount of descent with nearby Macedonian, Greek and Italian populations.[103]The recent growth is particularly evident in Kosovar Albanians, which show particularly high levels of homogeneity, in contrast to the diversity otherwise found in other Balkan populations.[104]
http://arxiv.org/pdf/1207.3815v1.pdf
Novembre J. et al. (2008) Genes mirror geography within Europe, Nature doi:10.1038/nature07331
 
I'd like to have Maciamo opinion on haplogroup E in Ile de France. Which subclades of E1b prevail there? Is there any historical reasons for the high frequency of E1b in île de France? Why is there more E1b in Ile de France than in Marseille area?

There is actually a wide diversity of E1b1b subclades in IDF : V13, M123, M81... The sample size is small though, so I wouldn't make too much of it until we have at least 500 samples.
 

This thread has been viewed 78431 times.

Back
Top