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Thread: Macedonians

  1. #876
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.

    Macedonians

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    With an ancestry of 10-14% Steppe
    the lowest Altaic component in all IE, almost 0%, even after 400 Ottoman-Turkish occupation,
    Only one sample of Ydna N found until now, at more than 20 000 000 Greeks of Hellas and diaspora (one found in Peloponese)
    There is NO chance that Greeks and especially the Mycenean part, to be origined from Seima Turbino.

    Seima Turbino is a culture of Ydna N, and heavily charched with Altaic Component.
    GENNETICS SPEAK
    if we follow the theory of Antoni, or Gibutas
    which does not fit in Helladic space, and Genetics,
    Then Greeks both Linguistically and gennetical Origin from Yamnaa, and Vucedol-Vatin alternative name Cetina,
    This is expressed By 1928, and has archailogical evidences, Carl Blegen,
    which is the descent of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin (Cetine),
    in fact Cetina is also a big split, giving also Latin to West, etc
    IRELAND GENETICALLY IS MORE POSSIBLE FOR SEIMA TURBINO, THAN GREECE, DUE to Altaic component

    The Genetical structure of Greece, almost Palaiolithic and Neolithic mixture,
    with the lowest STEPPE, and almost Zero Altaic,
    Shows other Theories as primary,
    Especially the Mycenean Branch Genetics Suggest rather a Neolithic origin
    or a South Caucasos origin, Armenia High Lands

    The R1a in Greece, and Greek world,
    is the only Ydna mark That may connect Greek to Baltics, As Hammond express it, (although I disagree)
    and came from the possible road of Yamnaa to Vucedol-Vatin (Cetina) (Croatia/Serbia today) with descent of Greeks at 3000 BC to the area of proto-Greeks

    Period,

    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS
    THE MOST BLIND OF ALL MEMBERS,


    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.














    SO THIS MEMBER,
    BLINDED BY ULTRA NATIONALISM.
    WITH MAYBE TRAUMAS IN HIS PSYCHOLOGY.
    NOW TELL US THAT MYCENEANS
    WERE CONNECTED WITH ALTAI Mt (nomatter Altaic component is almost Zero)

    SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, (Mycenean is one of the most typical IE)

    WERE HEAVILY hg Ydna N (Almost 0%, only one found until now in whole Greek nation)




    WHAT CAN SOMEONE SAY?

    Except a wish for Peace of Mind.

    I am sure Gods are with him,
    Gods protect and take care of such guys.

    you could read at least the Carl Blegen and Giannopoulos, and escape from your hell,
    even read about Seima-Turbino culture.
    or even trust Lazarides papper,
    But No, you insisted,
    may Gods protect your soul, cause mind ......
    You were and asking fo it,
    you scratch the sheperd's bat wrong way.


    Blevins the Catacomb culture, or the S Caucasos cultures were not enough for you,
    you have to Go to Altaic mountains and uralic languages?
    or you never of other IE cultures outside steppe?
    Again bla...bla no academic references just bitter bickering.

    Metallurgy spreading with Uralic language, this would be quite a scene. However, recent genetic testings of sites in south Siberia and Kazakhstan (Andronovo horizon) would rather support a spreading of the bronze technology via Indo-european migrations. So Seima Turbino and Mycenaeans remains a valid connection.

    As for the Vucidol - Mycenaean connection, that is hard to bridge due to the following....
    IMG_3243.jpg


    But keep trying or Patroclus is gone and that will be quite a loss.




    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

  2. #877
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
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    Country: Greece



    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    again bla...bla no academic references just bitter bickering.

    Metallurgy spreading with uralic language, this would be quite a scene. However, recent genetic testings of sites in south siberia and kazakhstan (andronovo horizon) would rather support a spreading of the bronze technology via indo-european migrations. So seima turbino and mycenaeans remains a valid connection.

    As for the vucidol - mycenaean connection, that is hard to bridge due to the following....
    IMG_3243.jpg


    but keep trying or patroclus is gone and that will be quite a loss.




    Sent from my iphone using eupedia forum


    BYE BYE BLEVINS13

    Forum members have memmory on what is published,
    most are more than 2 years, before Lazarides papper,
    look how many years you are,
    Only Blinded by ultranationalist hate like you, can not See and ask sources, Which I am forced to wrie at bottom of post.


    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Here is your answer

    Greek Branch of R1a
    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplo...NA.shtml#Greek

    But it seems that you Keep changing your mind about Greeks.....Attachment 11005


    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

    With an ancestry of 10-14% Steppe
    the lowest Altaic component in all IE, almost 0%, even after 400 Ottoman-Turkish occupation,
    Only one sample of Ydna N found until now, at more than 20 000 000 Greeks of Hellas and diaspora (one found in Peloponese)
    There is NO chance that Greeks and especially the Mycenean part, to be origined from Seima Turbino.

    Seima Turbino is a culture of Ydna N, and heavily charched with Altaic Component.
    GENNETICS SPEAK
    if we follow the theory of Antoni, or Gibutas
    which does not fit in Helladic space, and Genetics,
    Then Greeks both Linguistically and gennetical Origin from Yamnaa, and Vucedol-Vatin alternative name Cetina,
    This is expressed By 1928, and has archailogical evidences, Carl Blegen,
    which is the descent of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin (Cetine),
    in fact Cetina is also a big split, giving also Latin to West, etc
    IRELAND GENETICALLY IS MORE POSSIBLE FOR SEIMA TURBINO, THAN GREECE, DUE to Altaic component

    The Genetical structure of Greece, almost Palaiolithic and Neolithic mixture,
    with the lowest STEPPE, and almost Zero Altaic,
    Shows other Theories as primary,
    Especially the Mycenean Branch Genetics Suggest rather a Neolithic origin
    or a South Caucasos origin, Armenia High Lands

    The R1a in Greece, and Greek world,
    is the only Ydna mark That may connect Greek to Baltics, As Hammond express it, (although I disagree)
    and came from the possible road of Yamnaa to Vucedol-Vatin (Cetina) (Croatia/Serbia today) with descent of Greeks at 3000 BC to the area of proto-Greeks

    Period,

    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS



    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.



    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Tumulus-burial in Albania and problems of Ethnogenesis
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Iliria Année 1976 4 pp. 127-132
    Nicholas G. L. Hammond
    Tumulus burial ceased in Mycenaean Greece before 1400 b.c., yet when Achilles honours Patroclus in Iliad he uses a method of burial than used only in Albania and farther north. It is likely that Homer here reveals the origins of heroic practice, and very probably the origin of oral epic. The dramatic date of the poem was 200 years after the end of tumulus burial in Mycenaean Greece and Homer himself lived 600 and 700 years after that time. But he went correctly to the north-west for the origin of Achilles, tumulus burial and heroic practices. For Albania was and is the homeland of heroes.

    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Cetina related with Mycenaean civilization come on this is a joke not Seima -Turbino. Considering also lack of R1b so far and minimal step for sure Seima - Turbino.
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Mycenaean(Seima- Turbino culture) vs Illyrians (Kurgan Culture). So no, at that time only Illyrians used tumulus in the Balkans.
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post


    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum




    SO THIS MEMBER,
    BLINDED BY ULTRA NATIONALISM.
    WITH MAYBE TRAUMAS IN HIS PSYCHOLOGY.
    NOW TELL US THAT MYCENEANS
    WERE CONNECTED WITH ALTAI Mt (nomatter Altaic component is almost Zero)

    SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, (Mycenean is one of the most typical IE)

    WERE HEAVILY hg Ydna N (Almost 0%, only one found until now in whole Greek nation)




    WHAT CAN SOMEONE SAY?

    Except a wish for Peace of Mind.

    I am sure Gods are with him,
    Gods protect and take care of such guys.

    you could read at least the Carl Blegen and Giannopoulos, and escape from your hell,
    even read about Seima-Turbino culture.
    or even trust Lazarides papper,
    But No, you insisted,
    may Gods protect your soul, cause mind ......
    You were and asking fo it,
    you scratch the sheperd's bat wrong way.


    Blevins the Catacomb culture, or the S Caucasos cultures were not enough for you,
    you have to Go to Altaic mountains and uralic languages?
    or you never of other IE cultures outside steppe?


    a pathetic pittyfull aproach, by member Blevins13
    guided by hate of ultranationalism

    which with strange methods,
    want us to Believe that Myceneans are steppe Altaic people,
    and Spoke Uralic languages
    while Lazarides papper on Myceneans is clear of S Caucasos and Armenia highlands origin
    with low average 14% (10-20%) of Steppe, and Zero Altaic

    BLEVINS MYCENEANS DID NOT SPOKE URALIC,
    AS YOU LIKE THEM TO BE.
    BYE BYE


    The Academic pappers you ask

    • Marchenko et al. 2017.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 447.
    • ^ A Dictionary of Archaeology, edited by Ian Shaw, Robert Jameson, page 517
    • ^ Frachetti, Michael David, Pastoralist Landscapes and Social Interaction in Bronze Age Eurasia, pp. 52–3
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 444-7.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 443-4.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Anthony 2007.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Chernykh, E.N. (2008). "Formation of the Eurasian "Steppe Belt" of Stockbreeding cultures". Archaeology, Ethnology and Anthropology of Eurasia. 35 (3): 36–53. doi:10.1016/j.aeae.2008.11.003.
    • ^ Chernykh 1992, p.220-21, figs. 74, 75.
    • ^ Christian 1998.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Keys, David (January 2009). "Scholars crack the code of an ancient enigma". BBC History Magazine. 10 (1): 9.
    • ^ Higham, C.; Higham, T.; Kijngam, A. (2011), "Cutting a Gordian Knot: the Bronze Age of Southeast Asia: origins, timing and impact", Antiquity, 85 (328): 583–598, doi:10.1017/S0003598X00067971
    • ^ E. Chernykh The “Steppe Belt” of stockbreeding cultures in Eurasia during the Early Metal Age Trab. Prehist., 65 (2008), pp. 73-93, 10.3989/tp.2008.08004
    • ^ C. Der Sarkissian, O. Balanovsky, G. Brandt, V. Khartanovich, A. Buzhilova, S. Koshel, V. Zaporozhchenko, D. Gronenborn, V. Moiseyev, E. Kolpakov, et al., "Genographic Consortium Ancient DNA reveals prehistoric gene-flow from siberia in the complex human population history of North East Europe" PLoS Genet., 9 (2013), p. e1003296
    • ^ "The American Journal of Human Genetics: Volume 99, Issue 1: Human Y Chromosome Haplogroup N: A Non-trivial Time-Resolved Phylogeography that Cuts across Language Families", 7 July 2016, Pages 163-173
    • ^ http://eujournal.org/index.php/esj/a...view/4182/4018
    • ^ Lalueza-Fox, C.; Sampietro, M. L.; Gilbert, M. T. P.; Castri, L.; Facchini, F.; Pettener, D.; Bertranpetit, J. (2004), "Unravelling migrations in the steppe: mitochondrial DNA sequences from ancient central Asians", Proceedings of the Royal Society B: Biological Sciences, 271 (1542): 941–947, doi:10.1098/rspb.2004.2698, PMC 1691686, PMID 15255049
    • ^ Keyser, Christine; Bouakaze, Caroline; Crubézy, Eric; Nikolaev, Valery G.; Montagnon, Daniel; Reis, Tatiana; Ludes, Bertrand (2009), "Ancient DNA provides new insights into the history of south Siberian Kurgan people", Human Genetics, 126 (3): 395–410, doi:10.1007/s00439-009-0683-0, PMID 19449030




    bye bye little Goebels
    Last edited by Yetos; 08-05-19 at 21:16.
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

  3. #878
    Regular Member Piro Ilir's Avatar
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dibran View Post
    Not really. Nothing he said has a complete basis. Proto-Balto-Slavic was said to be related to possibly Proto-Dacian and Proto-Thracian. Proto-Thracian is not the same as thracian. Neither is Proto-Balto-Slavic the same as Slavic. The further you go back especially to the Proto-Balto-Slavic union, the difference with other indo european branches are far less so than is the case today. Also none of the thracians or illyrians discovered, or the ancient Greeks, had any I2a-Din/or R1a Z280/M458. The only R1a was the bronze age thracian. Even then, no one belongs to that branch. Certainly not common in Slavs any ways. From a a paternal Y standpoint, So far Slavs are not connected to any of them. Only very anciently with the M417 split with the Z93 Thracian. Also, from a autosomal standpoint, the illyrians and Thracians were Italian,Albanian Greek like. Less in the case of Balkan Slavs, and near non-existent in West or East Slavs.

    What is more probable and likely is that Proto-Balto-Slavs were closer to the Proto-Thracians and Proto-Dacians before they left the steppes. Proto-Balto-Slavs were likely akin to Proto-Thracians and Proto-Dacians, representing northern cousins that never migrated to the Balkans. Only with the fragile state of Rome, and the collapse of these peoples did the Sklaveni migrate South. They likely were always dealing with Daco-Thracians on the far northern border with them. Also, Most scholars acknowledge not all Illyrians were homogenous. They also likely were not linguistically connected in a recent sense either. Possibly branching out from the rest with the breakup of Indo-European.

    Perhaps some Geto-Dacians/Free Dacians that migrated north of the Danube formed a base for what would become Proto-Slavic. But in all likliehood they're distantly related and are merely northern cousins of the Thracians and Dacians, not those people themselves. Genetics/Archaeology will trump propaganda every time. So far Illyrians were R1b/J2/V13(all found predominantly in Albanians), Proto-Greeks were J2a, predominantly found in Greeks, and R1a-Z93 in a Bronze Age, likely Proto-Thracian grave(which is not recently related to Balto-Slavic Z280/M458 but distantly(5-6 thousand ypb).

    No one can deny South Slavs have Paleo-Balkan heritage, both autosomally, and through Y chromosome. Especially Bulgarians/Macedonians. However, to say All these paleo-balkan people were Slavic and further from Albanians and Greeks is about as propagandized as you can get. Whats more correct is that Proto-Balto-Slavs were ancestral cousins of Proto-Thracians/Proto-Dacians, only migrating as Proto-Slavs from the north much later, as opposed to their distant southern kin, who left the steppe before many of these lineages differentiated themselves.
    R1a- Z93 you said it was from Tracian iron age, right?!

  4. #879
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
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    Country: Greece



    ....................................

  5. #880
    Regular Member Dibran's Avatar
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    Country: United States



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Piro Ilir View Post
    R1a- Z93 you said it was from Tracian iron age, right?!
    Bronze age actually. Someone responded to you last page. It was before 1000BC. Genetically it came out North-European like. In all probability a Proto-Thracian.

  6. #881
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
    Join Date
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    Country: Albania



    Macedonians

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    BYE BYE BLEVINS13

    Forum members have memmory on what is published,
    most are more than 2 years, before Lazarides papper,
    look how many years you are,
    Only Blinded by ultranationalist hate like you, can not See and ask sources, Which I am forced to wrie at bottom of post.





    With an ancestry of 10-14% Steppe
    the lowest Altaic component in all IE, almost 0%, even after 400 Ottoman-Turkish occupation,
    Only one sample of Ydna N found until now, at more than 20 000 000 Greeks of Hellas and diaspora (one found in Peloponese)
    There is NO chance that Greeks and especially the Mycenean part, to be origined from Seima Turbino.

    Seima Turbino is a culture of Ydna N, and heavily charched with Altaic Component.
    GENNETICS SPEAK
    if we follow the theory of Antoni, or Gibutas
    which does not fit in Helladic space, and Genetics,
    Then Greeks both Linguistically and gennetical Origin from Yamnaa, and Vucedol-Vatin alternative name Cetina,
    This is expressed By 1928, and has archailogical evidences, Carl Blegen,
    which is the descent of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin (Cetine),
    in fact Cetina is also a big split, giving also Latin to West, etc
    IRELAND GENETICALLY IS MORE POSSIBLE FOR SEIMA TURBINO, THAN GREECE, DUE to Altaic component

    The Genetical structure of Greece, almost Palaiolithic and Neolithic mixture,
    with the lowest STEPPE, and almost Zero Altaic,
    Shows other Theories as primary,
    Especially the Mycenean Branch Genetics Suggest rather a Neolithic origin
    or a South Caucasos origin, Armenia High Lands

    The R1a in Greece, and Greek world,
    is the only Ydna mark That may connect Greek to Baltics, As Hammond express it, (although I disagree)
    and came from the possible road of Yamnaa to Vucedol-Vatin (Cetina) (Croatia/Serbia today) with descent of Greeks at 3000 BC to the area of proto-Greeks

    Period,

    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS
    THE MOST BLIND OF ALL MEMBERS,


    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.














    SO THIS MEMBER,
    BLINDED BY ULTRA NATIONALISM.
    WITH MAYBE TRAUMAS IN HIS PSYCHOLOGY.
    NOW TELL US THAT MYCENEANS
    WERE CONNECTED WITH ALTAI Mt (nomatter Altaic component is almost Zero)

    SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, (Mycenean is one of the most typical IE)

    WERE HEAVILY hg Ydna N (Almost 0%, only one found until now in whole Greek nation)




    WHAT CAN SOMEONE SAY?

    Except a wish for Peace of Mind.

    I am sure Gods are with him,
    Gods protect and take care of such guys.

    you could read at least the Carl Blegen and Giannopoulos, and escape from your hell,
    even read about Seima-Turbino culture.
    or even trust Lazarides papper,
    But No, you insisted,
    may Gods protect your soul, cause mind ......
    You were and asking fo it,
    you scratch the sheperd's bat wrong way.


    Blevins the Catacomb culture, or the S Caucasos cultures were not enough for you,
    you have to Go to Altaic mountains and uralic languages?
    or you never of other IE cultures outside steppe?


    a pathetic pittyfull aproach, by member Blevins13
    guided by hate of ultranationalism

    which with strange methods,
    want us to Believe that Myceneans are steppe Altaic people,
    and Spoke Uralic languages
    while Lazarides papper on Myceneans is clear of S Caucasos and Armenia highlands origin
    with low average 14% (10-20%) of Steppe, and Zero Altaic

    BLEVINS MYCENEANS DID NOT SPOKE URALIC,
    AS YOU LIKE THEM TO BE.
    BYE BYE


    The Academic pappers you ask

    • Marchenko et al. 2017.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 447.
    • ^ A Dictionary of Archaeology, edited by Ian Shaw, Robert Jameson, page 517
    • ^ Frachetti, Michael David, Pastoralist Landscapes and Social Interaction in Bronze Age Eurasia, pp. 52–3
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 444-7.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 443-4.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Anthony 2007.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Chernykh, E.N. (2008). "Formation of the Eurasian "Steppe Belt" of Stockbreeding cultures". Archaeology, Ethnology and Anthropology of Eurasia. 35 (3): 36–53. doi:10.1016/j.aeae.2008.11.003.
    • ^ Chernykh 1992, p.220-21, figs. 74, 75.
    • ^ Christian 1998.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Keys, David (January 2009). "Scholars crack the code of an ancient enigma". BBC History Magazine. 10 (1): 9.
    • ^ Higham, C.; Higham, T.; Kijngam, A. (2011), "Cutting a Gordian Knot: the Bronze Age of Southeast Asia: origins, timing and impact", Antiquity, 85 (328): 583–598, doi:10.1017/S0003598X00067971
    • ^ E. Chernykh The “Steppe Belt” of stockbreeding cultures in Eurasia during the Early Metal Age Trab. Prehist., 65 (2008), pp. 73-93, 10.3989/tp.2008.08004
    • ^ C. Der Sarkissian, O. Balanovsky, G. Brandt, V. Khartanovich, A. Buzhilova, S. Koshel, V. Zaporozhchenko, D. Gronenborn, V. Moiseyev, E. Kolpakov, et al., "Genographic Consortium Ancient DNA reveals prehistoric gene-flow from siberia in the complex human population history of North East Europe" PLoS Genet., 9 (2013), p. e1003296
    • ^ "The American Journal of Human Genetics: Volume 99, Issue 1: Human Y Chromosome Haplogroup N: A Non-trivial Time-Resolved Phylogeography that Cuts across Language Families", 7 July 2016, Pages 163-173
    • ^ http://eujournal.org/index.php/esj/a...view/4182/4018
    • ^ Lalueza-Fox, C.; Sampietro, M. L.; Gilbert, M. T. P.; Castri, L.; Facchini, F.; Pettener, D.; Bertranpetit, J. (2004), "Unravelling migrations in the steppe: mitochondrial DNA sequences from ancient central Asians", Proceedings of the Royal Society B: Biological Sciences, 271 (1542): 941–947, doi:10.1098/rspb.2004.2698, PMC 1691686, PMID 15255049
    • ^ Keyser, Christine; Bouakaze, Caroline; Crubézy, Eric; Nikolaev, Valery G.; Montagnon, Daniel; Reis, Tatiana; Ludes, Bertrand (2009), "Ancient DNA provides new insights into the history of south Siberian Kurgan people", Human Genetics, 126 (3): 395–410, doi:10.1007/s00439-009-0683-0, PMID 19449030




    bye bye little Goebels
    You are going crazy man it is not me ....I did not create this
    R1a Greek Branch
    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplo...NA.shtml#Greek

    I happened to agree with this. That is all.

    And I did not write this Hammond did.

    Tumulus Burials in South Albania

    Tumulus burial ceased in Mycenaean Greece before 1400 b.c., yet when Achilles honours Patroclus in Iliad he uses a method of burial than used only in Albania and farther north. It is likely that Homer here reveals the origins of heroic practice, and very probably the origin of oral epic. The dramatic date of the poem was 200 years after the end of tumulus burial in Mycenaean Greece and Homer himself lived 600 and 700 years after that time. But he went correctly to the north-west for the origin of Achilles, tumulus burial and heroic practices. For Albania was and is the homeland of heroes.

    Tumulus-burial in Albania and problems of Ethnogenesis
    Iliria Année 1976 4 pp. 127-132

    Nicholas G. L. Hammond



    The language used by Yetos is inappropriate.
    I invite moderator to do something here.

    And Yetos don’t copy from Wikipedia, show us academic papers for your statements.

    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

  7. #882
    Banned
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    Country: Albania



    [QUOTE=Yetos;575307]BYE BYE BLEVINS13

    Forum members have memmory on what is published,
    most are more than 2 years, before Lazarides papper,
    look how many years you are,
    Only Blinded by ultranationalist hate like you, can not See and ask sources, Which I am forced to wrie at bottom of post.





    With an ancestry of 10-14% Steppe
    the lowest Altaic component in all IE, almost 0%, even after 400 Ottoman-Turkish occupation,
    Only one sample of Ydna N found until now, at more than 20 000 000 Greeks of Hellas and diaspora (one found in Peloponese)
    There is NO chance that Greeks and especially the Mycenean part, to be origined from Seima Turbino.

    Seima Turbino is a culture of Ydna N, and heavily charched with Altaic Component.
    GENNETICS SPEAK
    if we follow the theory of Antoni, or Gibutas
    which does not fit in Helladic space, and Genetics,
    Then Greeks both Linguistically and gennetical Origin from Yamnaa, and Vucedol-Vatin alternative name Cetina,
    This is expressed By 1928, and has archailogical evidences, Carl Blegen,
    which is the descent of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin (Cetine),
    in fact Cetina is also a big split, giving also Latin to West, etc
    IRELAND GENETICALLY IS MORE POSSIBLE FOR SEIMA TURBINO, THAN GREECE, DUE to Altaic component

    The Genetical structure of Greece, almost Palaiolithic and Neolithic mixture,
    with the lowest STEPPE, and almost Zero Altaic,
    Shows other Theories as primary,
    Especially the Mycenean Branch Genetics Suggest rather a Neolithic origin
    or a South Caucasos origin, Armenia High Lands

    The R1a in Greece, and Greek world,
    is the only Ydna mark That may connect Greek to Baltics, As Hammond express it, (although I disagree)
    and came from the possible road of Yamnaa to Vucedol-Vatin (Cetina) (Croatia/Serbia today) with descent of Greeks at 3000 BC to the area of proto-Greeks

    Period,

    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS
    THE MOST BLIND OF ALL MEMBERS,


    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.














    SO THIS MEMBER,
    BLINDED BY ULTRA NATIONALISM.
    WITH MAYBE TRAUMAS IN HIS PSYCHOLOGY.
    NOW TELL US THAT MYCENEANS
    WERE CONNECTED WITH ALTAI Mt (nomatter Altaic component is almost Zero)

    SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, (Mycenean is one of the most typical IE)

    WERE HEAVILY hg Ydna N (Almost 0%, only one found until now in whole Greek nation)




    WHAT CAN SOMEONE SAY?

    Except a wish for Peace of Mind.

    I am sure Gods are with him,
    Gods protect and take care of such guys.

    you could read at least the Carl Blegen and Giannopoulos, and escape from your hell,
    even read about Seima-Turbino culture.
    or even trust Lazarides papper,
    But No, you insisted,
    may Gods protect your soul, cause mind ......
    You were and asking fo it,
    you scratch the sheperd's bat wrong way.


    Blevins the Catacomb culture, or the S Caucasos cultures were not enough for you,
    you have to Go to Altaic mountains and uralic languages?
    or you never of other IE cultures outside steppe?


    a pathetic pittyfull aproach, by member Blevins13
    guided by hate of ultranationalism

    which with strange methods,
    want us to Believe that Myceneans are steppe Altaic people,
    and Spoke Uralic languages
    while Lazarides papper on Myceneans is clear of S Caucasos and Armenia highlands origin
    with low average 14% (10-20%) of Steppe, and Zero Altaic

    BLEVINS MYCENEANS DID NOT SPOKE URALIC,
    AS YOU LIKE THEM TO BE.
    BYE BYE


    The Academic pappers you ask

    • Marchenko et al. 2017.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 447.
    • ^ A Dictionary of Archaeology, edited by Ian Shaw, Robert Jameson, page 517
    • ^ Frachetti, Michael David, Pastoralist Landscapes and Social Interaction in Bronze Age Eurasia, pp. 52–3
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 444-7.
    • ^ Anthony 2007, pp. 443-4.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Anthony 2007.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Chernykh, E.N. (2008). "Formation of the Eurasian "Steppe Belt" of Stockbreeding cultures". Archaeology, Ethnology and Anthropology of Eurasia. 35 (3): 36–53. doi:10.1016/j.aeae.2008.11.003.
    • ^ Chernykh 1992, p.220-21, figs. 74, 75.
    • ^ Christian 1998.
    • ^ Jump up to:a b Keys, David (January 2009). "Scholars crack the code of an ancient enigma". BBC History Magazine. 10 (1): 9.
    • ^ Higham, C.; Higham, T.; Kijngam, A. (2011), "Cutting a Gordian Knot: the Bronze Age of Southeast Asia: origins, timing and impact", Antiquity, 85 (328): 583–598, doi:10.1017/S0003598X00067971
    • ^ E. Chernykh The “Steppe Belt” of stockbreeding cultures in Eurasia during the Early Metal Age Trab. Prehist., 65 (2008), pp. 73-93, 10.3989/tp.2008.08004
    • ^ C. Der Sarkissian, O. Balanovsky, G. Brandt, V. Khartanovich, A. Buzhilova, S. Koshel, V. Zaporozhchenko, D. Gronenborn, V. Moiseyev, E. Kolpakov, et al., "Genographic Consortium Ancient DNA reveals prehistoric gene-flow from siberia in the complex human population history of North East Europe" PLoS Genet., 9 (2013), p. e1003296
    • ^ "The American Journal of Human Genetics: Volume 99, Issue 1: Human Y Chromosome Haplogroup N: A Non-trivial Time-Resolved Phylogeography that Cuts across Language Families", 7 July 2016, Pages 163-173
    • ^ http://eujournal.org/index.php/esj/a...view/4182/4018
    • ^ Lalueza-Fox, C.; Sampietro, M. L.; Gilbert, M. T. P.; Castri, L.; Facchini, F.; Pettener, D.; Bertranpetit, J. (2004), "Unravelling migrations in the steppe: mitochondrial DNA sequences from ancient central Asians", Proceedings of the Royal Society B: Biological Sciences, 271 (1542): 941–947, doi:10.1098/rspb.2004.2698, PMC 1691686, PMID 15255049
    • ^ Keyser, Christine; Bouakaze, Caroline; Crubézy, Eric; Nikolaev, Valery G.; Montagnon, Daniel; Reis, Tatiana; Ludes, Bertrand (2009), "Ancient DNA provides new insights into the history of south Siberian Kurgan people", Human Genetics, 126 (3): 395–410, doi:10.1007/s00439-009-0683-0, PMID 19449030




    bye bye little Goebels
    [/QUOT

    Why is it so hard for you to accept the facts?
    You have to be able to hear other sides arguments!
    Its time of iPhone and people have access instantly to information!
    Greek historiography has too many lies, no one believes them! Be kind, if you get nervous its not going to do any good to anyone, even to the moderators

  8. #883
    Regular Member zanipolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    You are going crazy man it is not me ....I did not create this
    R1a Greek Branch
    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplo...NA.shtml#Greek

    I happened to agree with this. That is all.

    And I did not write this Hammond did.

    Tumulus Burials in South Albania

    Tumulus burial ceased in Mycenaean Greece before 1400 b.c., yet when Achilles honours Patroclus in Iliad he uses a method of burial than used only in Albania and farther north. It is likely that Homer here reveals the origins of heroic practice, and very probably the origin of oral epic. The dramatic date of the poem was 200 years after the end of tumulus burial in Mycenaean Greece and Homer himself lived 600 and 700 years after that time. But he went correctly to the north-west for the origin of Achilles, tumulus burial and heroic practices. For Albania was and is the homeland of heroes.

    Tumulus-burial in Albania and problems of Ethnogenesis
    Iliria Année 1976 4 pp. 127-132

    Nicholas G. L. Hammond



    The language used by Yetos is inappropriate.
    I invite moderator to do something here.

    And Yetos don’t copy from Wikipedia, show us academic papers for your statements.

    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum
    https://www.academia.edu/34656422/Al...lasgian_thesis

    Achilles people where a branch of pelagasians
    Father's Mtdna H95a1
    Grandfather Mtdna T2b24
    Great Grandfather Mtdna T1a1e
    GMother paternal side YDna R1b-S8172
    Mother's YDna R1a-Z282

  9. #884
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
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    @ blevins13

    these are not academic words.
    These are words of your mind.
    YOU SNEAK AND HIDE BEHIND PAPPERS TO SPREAD POISON.
    PROVIDING AN ANTI-GREEK AGENDA, AS REACTION OF HATEFULL SOUL, DUE TO OVER NATIONALISM,
    LOOK WHAT YOU SAY TO US, TUMULI IS ALBANIAN MARK ??

    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    tumulus burial (generally accepted as marker of illyrians) in macedonia close to mount olympus before mycenaean expansion.

    https://www.researchgate.net/profile...ication_detail


    sent from my iphone using eupedia forum
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Tumulus-burial in Albania and problems of Ethnogenesis
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Iliria Année 1976 4 pp. 127-132
    Nicholas G. L. Hammond
    Tumulus burial ceased in Mycenaean Greece before 1400 b.c., yet when Achilles honours Patroclus in Iliad he uses a method of burial than used only in Albania and farther north. It is likely that Homer here reveals the origins of heroic practice, and very probably the origin of oral epic. The dramatic date of the poem was 200 years after the end of tumulus burial in Mycenaean Greece and Homer himself lived 600 and 700 years after that time. But he went correctly to the north-west for the origin of Achilles, tumulus burial and heroic practices. For Albania was and is the homeland of heroes.

    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Cetina related with Mycenaean civilization come on this is a joke not Seima -Turbino. Considering also lack of R1b so far and minimal step for sure Seima - Turbino.
    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum
    SO AFTER ALL THESE.
    AND NO MATTER THE ANSWERS WERE GIVEN TO YOU,
    YOU CONTINUE TO SNEAK AND HIDE, AND SPREAD YOUR ULTRANATIONALISTIC POSITION,
    LITTLE A TRUE GOEBELS CHILD, ONLY YOU NEVER THOUGHT THE RESULTS OF SCHOPENHAUER,
    WHICH FINALLY THE FIRST WHO BELIEVE HIS LIE, IS THE ONE WHO ATTACK WITH LIES,

    AND SINCE YOU DID ASK A SORRY FOR YOUR SPECULATED, POISONOUS POSTS, At LEAST TO THE MYCENEANS AND PATROKLOS WHO MADE THEM URALIC / Fino-Ugric SPEAKING
    I WILL EXPOSE YOU TO THE LIMIT.


    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS



    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.

    Understand it
    these happens when you cultivate wrong ideas, to prevail
    and use Schopehauer art of being right, to persuade about wrong being right
    the effect maybe be permanent in your brain.
    Last edited by Yetos; 08-05-19 at 22:19.

  10. #885
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    3 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    @ blevins13

    these are not academic words.
    These are words of your mind.
    YOU SNEAK AND HIDE BEHIND PAPPERS TO SPREAD POISON.
    PROVIDING AN ANTI-GREEK AGENDA, AS REACTION OF HATEFULL SOUL, DUE TO OVER NATIONALISM,
    LOOK WHAT YOU SAY TO US, TUMULI IS ONLY ALBANIAN MARK ??








    SO AFTER ALL THESE.
    AND NO MATTER THE ANSWERS WERE GIVEN TO YOU,
    YOU CONTINUE TO SNEAK AND HIDE, AND SPREAD YOUR ULTRANATIONALISTIC POSITION,
    LITTLE A TRUE GOEBELS CHILD, ONLY YOU NEVER THOUGHT THE RESULTS OF SCHOPENHAUER,
    WHICH FINALLY THE FIRST WHO BELIEVE HIS LIE, IS THE ONE WHO ATTACK WITH LIES,

    AND SINCE YOU DID ASK A SORRY FOR YOUR SPECULATED, POISONOUS POSTS, At LEAST TO THE MYCENEANS AND PATROKLOS WHO MADE THEM URALIC / Fino-Ugric SPEAKING
    I WILL EXPOSE YOU TO THE LIMIT.


    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS



    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.

    Understand it
    these happens when you cultivate wrong ideas, to prevail
    and use Schopehauer art of being right, to persuade about wrong being right
    the effect maybe be permanent in your brain.
    I think moderators should stop this inappropriate language and insults.... or they let us know that this is a place that anyone can bark what they can so we at least know what we are dealing with!!!!!!!!???????



    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

  11. #886
    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    I think moderators should stop this inappropriate language and insults.... or they let us know that this is a place that anyone can bark what they can so we at least know what we are dealing with!!!!!!!!???????



    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum
    I think Gods should punish you,
    For Insulting Ancient cultures,

    Listen what you say,
    ''TUMULI IS ONLY ALBANIA'',
    So Mycaenae was Albania? right?
    and Makedonians were Albanians? right?

    and when not succeded to convice you started to tell us that Mycaenae were Altaic? spoke Uralic? and carry Ydna N?
    How pathetic now to call moderators,Better call Gods to help you, if they can,
    I wonder in what species they transform you.

    you have been warned, that you move in strange fields, paranoia fields.
    but you kept scratching your back on the bat.
    I wonder !!!! did you change a little bit your mind?

  12. #887
    Regular Member Johane Derite's Avatar
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    3 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post

    Mycaenae were Altaic? spoke Uralic? and carry Ydna N?
    He never said any of that. You are one of the most dishonest, insulting, bad faith people on this site. All you do is manipulate and agitate. All blevins did was post what Maciamo has written on Eupedia, and he shared a quote of NGL Hammond about the archaeological record, and how there are clashes in the narrative that you support.
    "As we have already stressed, the mass evacuation of the Albanians from their triangle is the only effective course we can take. In order to relocate a whole people, the first prerequisite is the creation of a suitable psychosis. This can be done in various ways." - Vaso Cubrilovic

  13. #888
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.

    Macedonians

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    @ blevins13

    these are not academic words.
    These are words of your mind.
    YOU SNEAK AND HIDE BEHIND PAPPERS TO SPREAD POISON.
    PROVIDING AN ANTI-GREEK AGENDA, AS REACTION OF HATEFULL SOUL, DUE TO OVER NATIONALISM,
    LOOK WHAT YOU SAY TO US, TUMULI IS ONLY ALBANIAN MARK ??








    SO AFTER ALL THESE.
    AND NO MATTER THE ANSWERS WERE GIVEN TO YOU,
    YOU CONTINUE TO SNEAK AND HIDE, AND SPREAD YOUR ULTRANATIONALISTIC POSITION,
    LITTLE A TRUE GOEBELS CHILD, ONLY YOU NEVER THOUGHT THE RESULTS OF SCHOPENHAUER,
    WHICH FINALLY THE FIRST WHO BELIEVE HIS LIE, IS THE ONE WHO ATTACK WITH LIES,

    AND SINCE YOU DID ASK A SORRY FOR YOUR SPECULATED, POISONOUS POSTS, At LEAST TO THE MYCENEANS AND PATROKLOS WHO MADE THEM URALIC / Fino-Ugric SPEAKING
    I WILL EXPOSE YOU TO THE LIMIT.


    Tumuli was used By all Proto-Greeks, was used by Myceneans, and its evolution gave the famous Makedonian Toumbas, which are typically and characteristic
    and IS NOT ONLY Albanian, As you like it to be in your Brain, and in your Dreams,

    Btw
    did you go to a doctor to help you with Illyromania and Albanian only case?
    Don't leave it, it will hurt you more in Future,
    using Schopenhauer by the book, and step by step, makes people blind, and lost in space, or Only in, mass usage of Schopehauer it is just a shelf-exille from truth.

    BYE BYE BLIND BLEVINS



    Seima Turbino culture


    TheAltai Mountainsin what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of the cultural enigma of Seima-Turbino phenomenon.[7] The culture spread from these mountains to the west and to the east.[8] Artefact types such as spearheads with hooks, single-bladed knives and socketed axes with geometric designs traveled west and east.[9]

    migrations spread the Uralic languagesacross Europe and Asia
    .[11]

    Notable is the similiarity between the range of Haplogroup N3a3’6, especially in the western part of Eurasia and the distribution of the Seima-Turbino trans-cultural phenomenon during the interval of 4.2–3.7 kya. [13] Carriers of N3a1-B211, the early branch of N3a, could have migrated to the eastern fringes of Europe by the same Seima-Turbino groups. However earlier migration(s) cannot be ruled out either; a study of ancient DNA revealed a 7,500-year-old influx from Siberia to northeast Europe. [14] [15]

    BLEVINS
    THIS IS SEIMA-TURBINO
    ALTAIC
    URALIC LANGUAGES
    Hg N

    I tend to keep calm and show respect to you.
    But your egoism, Tumuli is Only Albanian origin
    did not leave me more, patience has limits.


    SO FORUM MEMBER BLEVINS13 WHICH BEFORE LAZARIDES PAPPER TOLD US OF HIS MYCENEAN ANCESTRY Due to R1b
    Now tells us that Myceneans were Altaic connected, SPOKE URALIC LANGUAGES, and were heavily charched with Hg N genetically.

    Understand it
    these happens when you cultivate wrong ideas, to prevail
    and use Schopehauer art of being right, to persuade about wrong being right
    the effect maybe be permanent in your brain.

    Members of this forum, I am not sneaking anything, this is public info from the links below . I tent to agree with this
    Eupedia:
    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplo...NA.shtml#Greek

    Or here

    https://www.historyfiles.co.uk/KingL...eceMycenae.htm

    So read and draw your own conclusions. Wrong ideas right ideas we are all here to learn not to be insulted.


    Mycenaeans

    The Mycenaeans were West Indo-Europeans, part of a much greater expansion and migration of Indo-Europeans (IEs) from the northern shores of the Black Sea and Caspian Sea. A general consensus of scholarly opinion was that they migrated into Eastern Europe from the Pontic-Caspian steppe in the period between 3300-2600 BC. After having left the main westwards migration of proto-IE around 2500 BC, they gradually blended into the indigenous population in the lower Balkans (the Pelasgians) between then and 2000 BC. However, in recent years that idea has undergone some refinement.

    Clearly the Mycenaeans were part of an imported steppe culture. But the close relationship between Mycenaean and proto-Indo-Iranian languages shows that these two branches divided fairly late, sometime between 2500-2000 BC. Archaeologically, Mycenaean chariots, spearheads, daggers and other bronze objects show striking similarities to the Seima-Turbino culture (between about 1900-1600 BC) of the northern Russian forest-steppes, known for the great mobility of its nomadic warriors (Seima-Turbino sites have been found as far away as Mongolia). It is therefore likely that the Mycenaeans descended from the steppe into Greece between 1900-1650 BC, where they intermingled with the locals to create a new, unique Greek culture. Naturally, as the new dominant force in the region, their language would also have dominated. The locals had gained between 62% and 86% of their DNA from people who had introduced farming from Anatolia as part of 'Old Europe'. They would have adopted this language fairly quickly and, if not them, then their children or grandchildren would have, which is why modern Greek expresses its IE origins so clearly. However, the IE influence on DNA in Greece was more subtle than across much of Europe, showing that these Mycenaean IEs arriving in Greece were less in number than some of their IE cousins.

    The new proto-Greek speakers covered a swathe of territory that reached as far north as Epirus. They emerged into the archaeological record rather suddenly, with the appearance of shaft grave royal burials around 1650 BC. but, whilst the first city states had emerged by 1600 BC (the same time at which Mycenaean culture also appears on Cyprus), the Mycenaeans did not form one nation state. Instead they banded their independent city states together under one leader in times of trouble. During their own time they were known primarily as Achaeans, after the Achaea region of Greece.

    Records on the Mycenaeans are very sparse, usually being limited to myths and legends. Many of their leaders are semi or wholly legendary. The latter are backed in lilac, usually for events prior to the Trojan War. Mycenaeans also established trading outposts on the Anatolian coast, and were possibly the Ahhiyawa mentioned in Hittite texts from the mid-fifteenth century onwards. Their civilisation seems to have flourished immediately following the fall of Crete, which seems to have dominated the Greeks up to that point.

    (Information by Peter Kessler, with additional information by Edward Dawson, from The Horse, the Wheel, and Language: How Bronze-Age Riders from the Eurasian Steppes Shaped the Modern World, David W Anthony, from The Illiad, Homer (Translated by E V Rieu, Penguin, 1950), and from External Links: Haplogroup R1a (Eupedia Genetics), and DNA clue to origins of early Greek civilization (BBC News), and Grave of the Griffin Warrior.)



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  14. #889
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    I think Gods should punish you,
    For Insulting Ancient cultures,

    Listen what you say,
    ''TUMULI IS ONLY ALBANIA'',
    So Mycaenae was Albania? right?
    and Makedonians were Albanians? right?

    and when not succeded to convice you started to tell us that Mycaenae were Altaic? spoke Uralic? and carry Ydna N?
    How pathetic now to call moderators,Better call Gods to help you, if they can,
    I wonder in what species they transform you.

    you have been warned, that you move in strange fields, paranoia fields.
    but you kept scratching your back on the bat.
    I wonder !!!! did you change a little bit your mind?
    Here you go again like it our not i am quoting Hammond, is this a lie?

    Tumulus-burial in Albania and problems of Ethnogenesis
    Iliria Année 1976 4 pp. 127-132

    Nicholas G. L. Hammond

    https://www.persee.fr/doc/iliri_1727...6_num_4_1_1174

    Tumulus Burials in South Albania

    Tumulus burial ceased in Mycenaean Greece before 1400 b.c., yet when Achilles honours Patroclus in Iliad he uses a method of burial than used only in Albania and farther north. It is likely that Homer here reveals the origins of heroic practice, and very probably the origin of oral epic. The dramatic date of the poem was 200 years after the end of tumulus burial in Mycenaean Greece and Homer himself lived 600 and 700 years after that time. But he went correctly to the north-west for the origin of Achilles, tumulus burial and heroic practices. For Albania was and is the homeland of heroes.





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    Regular Member Yetos's Avatar
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    Yes I know, The Eupedia articles,

    but
    similarities with Seima Turbino
    Does not mean Seima Turbino,

    so your sterile determine opinion, Kurgan= Greeks vs Tumuli=Albanians does not fit.

    the problem of IE theories for Greeks, and the oposite, of Greeks in IE world and expansion is bigger,
    and one more time I say it fits in all 3 theories, yet does fit to noone.

    So lets Stop smashing the Mosquito, and swallow the rope,
    cause if want propagandistic attacking policies, I can bring you many, as to anyone,
    But that poison brain and heart.

  16. #891
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    Macedonians

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Yes I know, The Eupedia articles,

    but
    similarities with Seima Turbino
    Does not mean Seima Turbino,

    so your sterile determine opinion, Kurgan= Greeks vs Tumuli=Albanians does not fit.

    the problem of IE theories for Greeks, and the oposite, of Greeks in IE world and expansion is bigger,
    and one more time I say it fits in all 3 theories, yet does fit to noone.

    So lets Stop smashing the Mosquito, and swallow the rope,
    cause if want propagandistic attacking policies, I can bring you many, as to anyone,
    But that poison brain and heart.
    There is no poison here, only information that already exists.... and I bring it here for the members as an option that I agree with. If you have more theories for Mycenaean and their link to Macedonians bring them for the members of this forum to evaluate.


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    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    There is no poison here, only information that already exists.... and I bring it here for the members as an option that I agree with. If you have more theories for Mycenaean and their link to Macedonians bring them for the members of this forum to evaluate.


    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

    Who cares about your opinion?
    You Have already prove who you are,

    Your Informations, that YOU Provide to us,
    that Myceneans were Heavily Altaic,

    SpokE Uralic Finno-Ugric,

    And Had Hg N

    Tumuli is Albanian and only Albanian mark !!!

    and all because you can not distinguish simmilar from being.

    YOU ARE NOT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUS.
    You Can NOT even Distinguish the similarity of group, whith the Belong to a group
    And I wonder why I still Speak to you,

    BYE BYE ........


    At Least Ridiculous posts and opinions, Not to use another word,

    Your answer is Given by Lazarides papper 2017,

    https://www.nature.com/articles/nature23310

    Offcourse 2 years now,
    And After all this sound in Forum about this papper that shocked many in scientific community,
    you never read it, or you will not,
    At least let me inform you, it is a search widely accepted, which offcourse will improve in Future,
    but fits with current data scientific community has.
    Well keep your crap-science of Tumuli is only Albanian and Albanian mark,
    who cares,

    ACCEPT IT, and if you can't Swallow It,

    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-40791188

    from the link :

    But the much more minor influx of Steppe people into Greece compared with northern Europe has led some to conclude that this migration could not have effected a change in language. This might imply that progenitors of Greek - and perhaps other Indo-European languages - were already established in the Aegean by the time the Steppe people arrived.




    BTW
    You know Echidna, stays always at same point, shrinking her body around her shelf, trusting in her venom power, never leaves her 'place'
    until her head is smashed.



    there are many descent Albanians here
    ,
    can't someone explain to him the Geneticks,
    and the Greek issue on Antoni's work? that Antoni's theory of horse wheel and chariot, can not trully explain Greeks and Myceneans, not even Anatolian ones
    and in Greece there is chance to spoke IE much before steppe reach N Europe and minor Asia.


    Blevins
    from the links

    Archaeologist Kristian Kristiansen of the University of Gothenburg in Sweden, who was not involved in the work, agrees. “The results have now opened up the next chapter in the genetic history of western Eurasia—that of the Bronze Age Mediterranean.”


  18. #893
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    Macedonians

    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    Who cares about your opinion?
    You Have already prove who you are,

    Your Informations, that YOU Provide to us,
    that Myceneans were Heavily Altaic,

    SpokE Uralic Finno-Ugric,

    And Had Hg N

    Tumuli is Albanian and only Albanian mark !!!

    and all because you can not distinguish simmilar from being.

    YOU ARE NOT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUS.
    You Can NOT even Distinguish the similarity of group, whith the Belong to a group
    And I wonder why I still Speak to you,

    BYE BYE ........


    At Least Ridiculous posts and opinions, Not to use another word,

    Your answer is Given by Lazarides papper 2017,

    https://www.nature.com/articles/nature23310

    Offcourse 2 years now,
    And After all this sound in Forum about this papper that shocked many in scientific community,
    you never read it, or you will not,
    At least let me inform you, it is a search widely accepted, which offcourse will improve in Future,
    but fits with current data scientific community has.
    Well keep your crap-science of Tumuli is only Albanian and Albanian mark,
    who cares,

    ACCEPT IT, and if you can't Swallow It,

    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-40791188

    from the search :

    But the much more minor influx of Steppe people into Greece compared with northern Europe has led some to conclude that this migration could not have effected a change in language. This might imply that progenitors of Greek - and perhaps other Indo-European languages - were already established in the Aegean by the time the Steppe people arrived.




    BTW
    You know Echidna, stays always at same point, shrinking her body around her shelf, trusting in her venom power, never leaves her 'place'
    until her head is smashed.



    there are many descent Albanians here
    ,
    can't someone explain to him the Geneticks,
    and the Greek issue on Antoni's work? that Antoni's theory of horse wheel and chariot, can not trully explain Greeks and Myceneans, not even Anatolian ones
    and in Greece there is chance to spoke IE much before steppe reach N Europe and minor Asia.
    This is the answer from Lazaridis (2017)
    Quote
    “Mycenaeans differed from Minoans in deriving additional ancestry from an ultimate source related to the hunter–gatherers of eastern Europe and Siberia”.

    No need to argue about me argue with me.

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    Last edited by blevins13; 09-05-19 at 17:00.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blevins13 View Post
    This the answer from Lazaridis (2017)
    Quote
    “Mycenaeans differed from Minoans in deriving additional ancestry from an ultimate source related to the hunter–gatherers of eastern Europe and Siberia”.


    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

    hahaha

    which was? average 14 % value from 10-20 %, even lower than today or that time S caucasus and Armenia highlands.
    same as today Greece has, and minest of all Europe !!! and almost 0% Altaic, and no hg N
    which means genetically has nothing to do with Seima-Turbino. but there are similarities in chariots and mobility style, as there are with Hettites,
    But no R1b, no R1a,
    as for the Greek branches of R1a, there are 3 types, and Greece in other conditions could be the homeland of R1a, cause has a very big variety,
    Macciamo express it well in Eupedia, using words simmilar, possible, might, cause he knows, avoiding identification=certification, in this case.
    the Myceane Genetics are outside Steppe theory, yet we accept them for that 14%,
    while the archaological evidences of coming of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin as express by Blegen and Giannopoulos fits better to steppe theories via Yamnaa.
    yet these theories from N Balkans still can not explain the Greco-Aryan, but can exlain the Greco-Latin,
    It is a big puzzle, which is partially solved according each theory, but can not solved/unite

    Before you spread any more poison I suggest you to find BMAC and Andronovo,
    the key to all theories of IE is there,
    and accept a sphairical view, comparing theories, before you make them a law
    and leave the Albanian and only the Albanian, cause if enter Linguistic/gennetics we will speak for years.

  20. #895
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    hahaha

    which was? average 14 % value from 10-20 %, even lower than today or that time S caucasus and Armenia highlands.
    same as today Greece has, and minest of all Europe !!! and almost 0% Altaic, and no hg N
    which means genetically has nothing to do with Seima-Turbino. but there are similarities in chariots and mobility style, as there are with Hettites,
    But no R1b, no R1a,
    as for the Greek branches of R1a, there are 3 types, and Greece in other conditions could be the homeland of R1a, cause has a very big variety,
    Macciamo express it well in Eupedia, using words simmilar, possible, might, cause he knows, avoiding identification=certification, in this case.
    the Myceane Genetics are outside Steppe theory, yet we accept them for that 14%,
    while the archaological evidences of coming of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin as express by Blegen and Giannopoulos fits better to steppe theories via Yamnaa.
    yet these theories from N Balkans still can not explain the Greco-Aryan, but can exlain the Greco-Latin,
    It is a big puzzle, which is partially solved according each theory, but can not solved/unite

    Before you spread any more poison I suggest you to find BMAC and Andronovo,
    the key to all theories of IE is there,
    and accept a sphairical view, comparing theories, before you make them a law
    and leave the Albanian and only the Albanian, cause if enter Linguistic/gennetics we will speak for years.
    As I said before it seems that Patroclus has left the building......and imagine what follows after..::: if this looks like poison to you that is your problem not mine.


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  21. #896
    Regular Member blevins13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    hahaha

    which was? average 14 % value from 10-20 %, even lower than today or that time S caucasus and Armenia highlands.
    same as today Greece has, and minest of all Europe !!! and almost 0% Altaic, and no hg N
    which means genetically has nothing to do with Seima-Turbino. but there are similarities in chariots and mobility style, as there are with Hettites,
    But no R1b, no R1a,
    as for the Greek branches of R1a, there are 3 types, and Greece in other conditions could be the homeland of R1a, cause has a very big variety,
    Macciamo express it well in Eupedia, using words simmilar, possible, might, cause he knows, avoiding identification=certification, in this case.
    the Myceane Genetics are outside Steppe theory, yet we accept them for that 14%,
    while the archaological evidences of coming of Greeks from Vucedol-Vatin as express by Blegen and Giannopoulos fits better to steppe theories via Yamnaa.
    yet these theories from N Balkans still can not explain the Greco-Aryan, but can exlain the Greco-Latin,
    It is a big puzzle, which is partially solved according each theory, but can not solved/unite

    Before you spread any more poison I suggest you to find BMAC and Andronovo,
    the key to all theories of IE is there,
    and accept a sphairical view, comparing theories, before you make them a law
    and leave the Albanian and only the Albanian, cause if enter Linguistic/gennetics we will speak for years.


    You posted Wikipedia to make your point as much as you can make a point from Wikipedia.

    As follows:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seim...ino_phenomenon


    In Wikipedia you will find also the opposite of your point.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronze_Age


    As I said before Uralic and metallurgy do not fit together.

    The Altai Mountains in what is now southern Russia and central Mongolia have been identified as the point of origin of a cultural enigma termed the Seima-Turbino Phenomenon.[27] It is conjectured that changes in climate in this region around 2000 BC and the ensuing ecological, economic and political changes triggered a rapid and massive migration westward into northeast Europe, eastward into China and southward into Vietnam and Thailand [28] across a frontier of some 4,000 miles.[27] This migration took place in just five to six generations and led to peoples from Finland in the west to Thailand in the east employing the same metal working technology and, in some areas, horse breeding and riding.[27] It is further conjectured that the same migrations spread the Uralic group of languages across Europe and Asia: some 39 languages of this group are still extant, including Hungarian, Finnish and Estonian.[27] However, recent genetic testings of sites in south Siberia and Kazakhstan (Andronovo horizon) would rather support a spreading of the bronze technology via Indo-European migrations eastwards, as this technology was well known for quite a while in western regions.[29][30]


    Enjoy


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    1 members found this post helpful.
    I know it's off topic but I have seen some Greeks with y-dna R1a-Z93 on some of these forums...
    One of the deep branches I've seen is R-F2935, https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-F2935/
    This is too old to seem connected with some medieval or modern Turkic people and dates as you see to the Bronze Age.
    The steppe element in the Mycenaeans could have very well been brought by some R1a-Z93 warriors when we consider that R1a-Z93 was found in Bronze age Bulgaria.
    As such, coupled with the similarities that Blevin mentioned above in regards of material culture, Seima-Turbino seems as a very good candidate...
    Also, these Mycenaeans look very eastern to my eyes:



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    Quote Originally Posted by Aspar View Post
    I know it's off topic but I have seen some Greeks with y-dna R1a-Z93 on some of these forums...
    One of the deep branches I've seen is R-F2935, https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-F2935/
    This is too old to seem connected with some medieval or modern Turkic people and dates as you see to the Bronze Age.
    The steppe element in the Mycenaeans could have very well been brought by some R1a-Z93 warriors when we consider that R1a-Z93 was found in Bronze age Bulgaria.
    As such, coupled with the similarities that Blevin mentioned above in regards of material culture, Seima-Turbino seems as a very good candidate...
    Also, these Mycenaeans look very eastern to my eyes:




    Yes I know,
    But can not find which tomb it was,
    If we are reffering to Kazanlak tombs, they are very very new,

    Notice the 3 options

    1 is to be older than Srubnaya so to be pre or proto Thracian from early devastations

    2a is to be Srubnaya culture,

    2b is to be the continuity of Srubnaya, a Scythian from minor Scythia

    3 is to be the Skudra, the Persian Satraps in Thrace if the tomb is after 500-550 BC

    from what I found genetists call him the lonely one migrant.

    If you can found the date of tomb and what auDna or what origin % will help a lot,

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    Why are allowed ad-hominem attacks in this thread?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LABERIA View Post
    Why are allowed ad-hominem attacks in this thread?

    indeed it is a very nice movie


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