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  1. #1
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    Haplogroup T

    Is this why Ethiopians don't look as black as pure Africans - high cheek bones (mongoloid characteristic).

    High percentages in northern Italy and Sicily. Must have crossed into Europe in Sicily and southern Iberian peninsula.

    I also question whether E-V13 took this same route through Tunisia into Italy, as well as through Anatolia into Greece.

    I don't see how the diffusion would have occured from Italy to Nothern Afirca since either this haplogroup crossed into Spain, to italy, to northern africa again, or crossed in both locations (Morocco, Tunisia) into europe.

    If it did cross in both Morocco and Tunisia, Tunisia may be an explanation for E-V13 from Tunisia to Sicily, to Albania.



    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...T_Y-DNA_II.svg

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    I've always been intrigued with this haplogroup, because it is very rare in Europe.
    The highest concentrations in Europe are given in the Spanish island of Ibiza, with almost 17%!!! Then in Andalusia with 6%.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y-DNA_h..._ethnic_groups

    It is believed that it was originated in the Middle East and was brought to Spain by the Phoenicians, as Ibiza was colonized by Phoenicians. Anyway, I guess now some compatriot will come to tell that is not true, that its origin is European and was led to Middel East by people from Ibiza. But we're used to reading the same thing again and again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferreiro_ View Post
    I've always been intrigued with this haplogroup, because it is very rare in Europe.
    The highest concentrations in Europe are given in the Spanish island of Ibiza, with almost 17%!!! Then in Andalusia with 6%.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y-DNA_h..._ethnic_groups

    It is believed that it was originated in the Middle East and was brought to Spain by the Phoenicians, as Ibiza was colonized by Phoenicians. Anyway, I guess now some compatriot will come to tell that is not true, that its origin is European and was led to Middel East by people from Ibiza. But we're used to reading the same thing again and again.

    I am glad that you are "intrigued" about it, because it actually happens to occur at higher frequencies among the Italians you desperately try to defend than the Spaniards you stupidly keep trying to attack:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_T_(Y-DNA)

    Like I said before, stop worrying so much about Spaniards and start worrying about your Italian people.

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    Eupidia show quite different frequencies of this haplogroup in Europe. The map showed in wikipedia is completely absurd, just looking at the frequencies showed near Central Europe it's easy to notice. Also, Africa is incomplete since Cameroon is not represented, and a large etc.

    Eupidia is by far more reliable.

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    It's really curious that he only talks about Spaniards seeing higher frequencies in other parts of Europe, specially near Central Europe. Of course, as I said, the map is completely wrong. Just note the fact he only uses the information (wrong or not) at his convenience.

    No credibility at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    It's really curious that he only talks about Spaniards seeing higher frequencies in other parts of Europe, specially near Central Europe. Of course, as I said, the map is completely wrong. Just note the fact he only uses the information (wrong or not) at his convenience.

    No credibility at all.

    I regret that the scientific report was not to your liking. By the way, I am not the author of the report. And I did not put that map!!! Again you are so ignorant!!!

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    You are not the author, but perhaps you are so stupid to give credibility to something you can compare here in Eupidia, and see by yourself the kind of nonsense it is.

    But the truth is that you know it perfectly, but prefer to show you didn't just to continue with your Ibero-Phobic agenda, your real and unique purpose.

    Why do you continue since you can check Eupidia and see that Wikipedia isn't reliable for this so? You are showing with your personal effort what you really are, trolleiro ;)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    You are not the author, but perhaps you are so stupid to give credibility to something you can compare here in Eupidia, and see by yourself the kind of nonsense it is.

    But the truth is that you know it perfectly, but prefer to show you didn't just to continue with your Ibero-Phobic agenda, your real and unique purpose.

    Why do you continue since you can check Eupidia and see that Wikipedia isn't reliable for this so? You are showing with your personal effort what you really are, trolleiro ;)
    Learn to read!
    I have not said anything about that map, neither for nor against.
    As for the percentage of 17% of Ibiza, the data is scientific. If you do not believe it, it's your problem, ignorant!

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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    It's not only for the map, the % are from Wikipedia (the same as the wrong map) and you can perfectly see the difference comparing with Eupidia. Look how Enthusiastic you were posting: oh! Andalusia 6%! XD, while checking Eupidia the score is just 3%.

    Do you like The global Italian score of haplogroup T? And what about Sicily? It looks so good when you check Eupidia!

    It's bad you still saying anything about this, and focus only in Spaniards. Sorry, but you can't fool anyone here since everybody knows your intentions. You are obsessed, absolutly brain damaged.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    It's not only for the map, the % are from Wikipedia (the same as the wrong map) and you can perfectly see the difference comparing with Eupidia. Look how Enthusiastic you were posting: oh! Andalusia 6%! XD, while checking Eupidia the score is just 3%.

    Do you like The global Italian score of haplogroup T? And what about Sicily? It looks so good when you check Eupidia!

    It's bad you still saying anything about this, and focus only in Spaniards. Sorry, but you can't fool anyone here since everybody knows your intentions. You are obsessed, absolutly brain damaged.
    I repeat the same: 17% from Ibiza is a scientific data, and not mine!!!
    I do not know the percentage in Sicily, as the link that I put it doesn't say it. If you know what percentage in sicily is, you share it with us!
    Now you can keep hitting your head against the wall. It's not my fault.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferreiro_ View Post
    I repeat the same: 17% from Ibiza is a scientific data, and not mine!!!
    I do not know the percentage in Sicily, as the link that I put it doesn't say it. If you know what percentage in sicily is, you share it with us!
    Now you can keep hitting your head against the wall. It's not my fault.
    I have to rectify because the data for Sicily does appear: 5% in East Sicily and 3% in West Sicily. How terrible it must be for you, Canovas.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y-DNA_h..._ethnic_groups

    Knovas, again you prove to be an ignorant man.

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    You don't know how to check Eupidia trolleiro? Do you think we are stupid or what? Insane! XD

    You can't deny this anymore. Mentioning Ibiza is not bad, but Andalusia is very suspicious since there isn't there not much haplogroup T for being remarkable. You could mention lot's of places before, but not, comming for you is imposible to expect this, like is imposible to expect you get the proper information, and not the one you need to follow your pathologic agenda.

    Go away to the emergency.

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    This is the list ordered from highest to lowest (green rectangle). Some samples (on the right of the green rectangle) are small and the percentages will be modified in the future, but the data of Ibiza is awesome.
    I am not racist, so these rare mixtures are very attractive to me.
    The problem with this haplogroup T is yours.


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    You are the only who prove his own ignorance checking not reliable information again, since several averages (for example your loved Andalusians) are wrong.

    Well, It's your choice. You can remain clueless for life if you want.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    You are the only who prove his own ignorance checking not reliable information again, since several averages (for example your loved Andalusians) are wrong.

    Well, It's your choice. You can remain clueless for life if you want.
    It's not my choice, it's a scientific choice.
    I'm sorry for you.

    In my opinion anyone who does not accept the scientific results should not participate in a forum on Y-DNA.

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    Then, you are late closing your account XD

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    Then, you are late closing your account XD
    Poor man.

    Here we have another file, from Wikipedia too. Some samples are very small, careful with that.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferreiro_ View Post
    Poor man.

    Here we have another file, from Wikipedia too. Some samples are very small, careful with that.

    Even when considering the larger (100+) samples, Italians still have more of it. Nice way of shooting yourself in the foot, t-r-o-l-l.

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    And now check here and realise that haplogroup T is not significant in Spain and Andalusians: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/europe...logroups.shtml

    Come on guy, you have work now observing other places with more significant presence of haplogroup T. Learn a little ;)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    And now check here and realise that haplogroup T is not significant in Spain and Andalusians: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/europe...logroups.shtml

    Come on guy, you have work now observing other places with more significant presence of haplogroup T. Learn a little ;)
    If we assume that T is Phoenician, I think that is maybe a little unexpected. Wasn't there significant Phoenician settlement in Spain, compared to the absurdly high T in Estonia (3.5%), which should have little? Perhaps that reflects odd sample sizes... I wish Maciamo would make his sources clearer, although they're usually decent estimates.

    Also, Maciamo's tables are for T+L... it may be useful to separate those.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knovas View Post
    And now check here and realise that haplogroup T is not significant in Spain and Andalusians: http://www.eupedia.com/europe/europe...logroups.shtml

    Come on guy, you have work now observing other places with more significant presence of haplogroup T. Learn a little ;)
    2.5% (T + L) in both Spain and Portugal. Let's assume that T makes up half of the category, so we are essentially dealing with ~ 1.25% for Iberia in total. And we are talking about haplogroups, which have no effect on phenotype. What a sick agenda the faux Galego has.

    Even the Alcase region of France has 5% of T + L.

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    No offense to Maciamo. But wikipedia is more reliable than this website. Ferreiro made a great point as always.

    This site is only managed by Maciamo, while wikipedia is managed by a lot of recognized genetists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canek View Post
    No offense to Maciamo. But wikipedia is more reliable than this website. Ferreiro made a great point as always.

    This site is only managed by Maciamo, while wikipedia is managed by a lot of recognized genetists.
    It's the other way around. WikiPedia is a "public encyclopedia". There are no "recognized geneticists" there writing articles at all. All articles are written by amateurs from the general public. Any clown with an agenda (like you) can waltz in and write and/or alter any article at his whim and fancy. Thus the quality of any given WikiPedia article varies greatly. Some are pretty well researched and written, others (the majority) are crap.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drac View Post
    It's the other way around. WikiPedia is a "public encyclopedia". There are no "recognized geneticists" there writing articles at all. All articles are written by amateurs from the general public. Any clown with an agenda (like you) can waltz in and write and/or alter any article at his whim and fancy. Thus the quality of any given WikiPedia article varies greatly. Some are pretty well researched and written, others (the majority) are crap.
    In fact, the moderators responsible for the Wikipedia Spanish and Portuguese people sections are clearly racist. They frame research information to make it seem that Iberians have large amounts of extra-European genetic influences - outrageously untrue. They even erase autosomal DNA studies, since these demonstrate that both peoples have exceedingly high European genetic affinities; Spain ~ 91% and Portugal ~ 85-86%, going by the latest updates.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey Moss View Post
    In fact, the moderators responsible for the Wikipedia Spanish and Portuguese people sections are clearly racist. They frame research information to make it seem that Iberians have large amounts of extra-European genetic influences - outrageously untrue. They even erase autosomal DNA studies, since these demonstrate that both peoples have exceedingly high European genetic affinities; Spain ~ 91% and Portugal ~ 85-86%, going by the latest updates.
    Yes, indeed, and this fake-Galician Italian clown is in fact a WikiPedia Vandal that goes by the name of "Galician77". He goes around altering WikiPedia articles in order to make the casual reader (whom we all know does not bother to check with other sources) think that Spain is some sort of extension of Morocco in Europe, while at the same time he tries to lower and minimize any of these Middle Eastern and North African haplogroups in Italy, which this self-hating racist hypocrite buffoon with a massive inferiority complex obviously thinks are a "blemish" on his Italian ancestral land. You can see him in action here, altering passages and percentages in the article about E1b1b that he keeps dishonestly presenting here as some sort of "authority":

    http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?...ldid=436450507


    Notice some examples that once again show his idiotic & blatant anti-Spanish & pro-Italian agendas. This, for example:
     
    The E1b1b clade is presently found in various forms in the [[Horn of Africa]], [[North Africa]], parts of [[Eastern Africa|Eastern]], [[Western Africa|Western]], and [[Southern Africa]], [[West Asia]], and [[Europe]] (especially the [[Mediterranean]] and the [[Balkans]]).

    He dishonestly changed to this:
     
    The E1b1b clade is presently found in various forms in the [[Horn of Africa]], [[North Africa]], parts of [[Eastern Africa|Eastern]], [[Western Africa|Western]], and [[Southern Africa]], [[West Asia]], and [[Europe]] (especially the [[Mediterranean Spain ]] and the [[Balkans]])

    Obviously trying to fool the casual reader who is not better informed into thinking that
    E1b1b is highest in Spain than anywhere else in the Mediterranean parts of Europe, which is obviously a total lie.

    This:

    European distribution has a frequency peak centered in parts of the [[Balkans]] (up to almost 50% in some areas)<ref name=Semino2004/><ref name=Pericic2005>{{Harvcoltxt|Peričic et al.|2005}}</ref>) and Italy, and declining frequencies evident toward western, central, and northeastern Europe.

    To this:
     
    The European distribution has a frequency peak centered in parts of the [[Balkans]] (up to almost 50% in some areas)<ref name=Semino2004/><ref name=Pericic2005>{{Harvcoltxt|Peričic et al.|2005}}</ref>) and Sicily, and declining frequencies evident toward western, central, and northeastern Europe.


    As he can't bear to have Italy (except Sicily, which he does not give a rat's ass about) be somehow associated with high frequencies of a haplogroup of ultimate North African origin.
     
    Once again:
     
    In Europe, E-M81 is found everywhere but mostly in the [[Iberian Peninsula]],

    To this:
     
    In Europe, E-M81 is found everywhere but mostly in the [[Iberian Peninsula]] Spain,


    Another one (this time inflating the frequency of E-M81 in Western Andalusia):
     
    Its frequencies are higher in the western half of the peninsula with frequencies reaching 8% in [[Extremadura]] and South Portugal, 9% in [[Galicia (Spain)|Galicia]], 10% in Western [[Andalusia]]

    Its frequencies are higher in the western half of the peninsula with frequencies reaching 8% in [[Extremadura]] and South Portugal, 9% in [[Galicia (Spain)|Galicia]], 18% in Western [[Andalusia]]

    I think that you get the picture of what this dishonest & fanatical anti-Spanish Italian clown devotes much of his time doing on the Internet. The reason why he does not like Eupedia as much as WikiPedia is because here he can't go around altering tables and frequencies, whereas in WikiPedia he has a much better chance of getting away with it. More honest people, specially Spaniards, should get involved in WikiPedia, BTW, and oppose & expose this (and other anti-Spanish) Wiki Vandal. He is so brazen and shameless that he actually had the balls of accusing another user of being a troublesome Vandal (what he actually is!) to one of those pseudo-moderators that Wiki has:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Andrew_Lancaster

    Scroll down to where it says "Vandalism from IP..." That's the pot calling the kettle "black" right there!

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