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Thread: Alexander the Great Statue in Skopje

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    Alexander the Great Statue in Skopje



    Clip of Alexander III Macedon "the Great" Statue in Skopje - Made in Italy

    Alessandro Magno - il colosso di Skopje
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xziYWFI5nos

    Skopje - Guerriero a cavallo - Alexander - Mania - Macedonia
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBkMLoTpsDM


    Alexander the Great Quotes:

    A tomb now suffices him for whom the whole world was not sufficient.
    Alexander the Great

    Heaven cannot brook two suns, nor earth two masters.
    Alexander the Great

    How great are the dangers I face to win a good name in Athens.
    Alexander the Great

    I am dying from the treatment of too many physicians.
    Alexander the Great

    I am dying with the help of too many physicians.
    Alexander the Great

    I am indebted to my father for living, but to my teacher for living well.
    Alexander the Great

    I am not afraid of an army of lions led by a sheep; I am afraid of an army of sheep led by a lion.
    Alexander the Great

    I had rather excel others in the knowledge of what is excellent, than in the extent of my power and dominion.
    Alexander the Great

    I would rather excel others in the knowledge of what is excellent than in the extent of my powers and dominion.
    Alexander the Great

    Remember upon the conduct of each depends the fate of all.
    Alexander the Great

    There is nothing impossible to him who will try.
    Alexander the Great

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    More Alexander quotes;

    "For I (Alexander I) myself am by ancient descent a Greek, and I would not willingly see Hellas change her freedom for slavery." (Herod. IX, 45, 2 [Loeb])

    "Tell your king (Xerxes), who sent you, how his Greek viceroy (Alexander I) of Macedonia has received you hospitably." (Herod. V, 20, 4 [Loeb])


    "Now, that these descendants of Perdiccas are Greeks, as they themselves say, I myself chance to know." (Herod. V, 22, 1 [Loeb])


    The country by the sea which is now called Macedonia... Alexander, the father of Perdiccas, and his forefathers, who were originally Temenidae from Argos"
    (Thucydides 99,3 (Loeb, C F Smith)


    "But Alexander (I), proving himself to be an Argive, was judged to be a Greek;
    so he contended in the furlong race and ran a dead heat for first place."
    (Herod. V, 22, 2)



    The speech of Alexander I, when he was admitted to the Olympic games "Men of Athens...
    Had I not greatly at heart the common welfare of Hellas I should not have come to tell you; but I am myself Hellene by descent, and I would not willingly see Hellas exchange freedom for slavery....
    If you prosper in this war, forget not to do something for my freedom; consider the risk I have run, out of zeal for the Hellenic cause, to acquaint you with what Mardonius intends, and to save you from being surprised by the barbarians.
    I am Alexander of Macedon."
    (Herodotus, The Histories, 9.45)



    For a more interesting quote, here is a line from Homer's "The Iliad"

    "The Glorious son of Pelegon Said:
    'Great-hearted Achilles, why do you ask after my family? come from distant, fertile Paeonia, which I left for Ilium eleven days ago at the head of my long-speared Paeonian troops. I am descended from broad-flowing River Axius, Axius, source of the loveliest water in the land. Axius was the father of the famous spearman Pelegon and I, they say, am Pelegon's son. But enough now, glorious Achilles! let us fight'"

    The River Axius is known in Slavic as the Vardar River.

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    This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

    Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vallicanus View Post
    This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

    Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.
    How can it be provocation if the people are Macedonians and even if not so who cares in what country a statue is? If the same statue was in Serbia, Albania or Bulgaria who cares? No one only paranoid Greeks who think and yes think they are Macedonians but actually are nothing more then christian Turks (Assyrians, Kurds, Syrians, Armenians) and Sub-saharans or whatever they where before they came and become Greek (New identity). Instead come and see the statue and leave the fake conflict that is made up by fake Macedonians = Modern Greeks. There is no Greek or Slav Macedonians only original Macedonians = ethnic Macedonians.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DejaVu View Post
    How can it be provocation if the people are Macedonians and even if not so who cares in what country a statue is? If the same statue was in Serbia, Albania or Bulgaria who cares? No one only paranoid Greeks who think and yes think they are Macedonians but actually are nothing more then christian Turks (Assyrians, Kurds, Syrians, Armenians) and Sub-saharans or whatever they where before they came and become Greek (New identity). Instead come and see the statue and leave the fake conflict that is made up by fake Macedonians = Modern Greeks. There is no Greek or Slav Macedonians only original Macedonians = ethnic Macedonians.
    comment
    I quess Alexander was sub-saharan assyrian kurd Armenian Turk

    probably my village were still speak makedonian, an ancient makedonian city Balla we were that also,

    it might be an insult cause for some of them you call modern greeks, their fathers were in Alexanders army, or in epigonus apogonous army
    also a question
    so if they are modern greeks, and you ? you are an ancient greek?

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    Alexander was a brutal murderer!
    A war criminal!
    A plunderer, a thief!
    Period!

    It's idiotic in this time to ever think of granting this war monger a statue!
    Fascism seems to rule former Yougoslavia.

    Philip, Alexanders father, started to rob the silver out of modern day Bulgaria, and he used the silver to pay his troops AND bribe some kingdoms in modern Turkey.

    So, Philip could conquer Greece, because he bought peace with the regions in the east.

    Alexander remembered the treasure his father had payed, and went for it to get the silver back.
    Silver stolen from Thracia.

    So, Alexander was a looter, just the same as Julius Ceasar!

    You want proof?



    I made this photograph myself.
    Silver coin found in the vicinity of Ankara Turkey.

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    What did the Dutch do in south Africa? How many did they kill and how much was plundered? Same as all other conquests by their rulers.
    Agree with you about no need of statue from him or any other but same should be in any country then, not only different political view for some because it suits people.

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    the case of Alexander is strange.

    Skopje did well done and honour him,
    but skopje are in mania symptom with Argeiads, for inner consumption

    Alexander belongs to the one that some can name them warlord and other enlighted,
    we a butcher face many times, a good ruler many times, a civilization boost many times,
    even at india we see a man believes in a kind of Democracy, and discuse with his soldier, but we also see the 'loosing the holy meter' a turn to satrapism that day,

    he destroy Tyros etc
    but he build many alexandreias,
    a story tells about zoroastrian religion that leave dead to voltures in top mountains,
    in kalas we found the same habit only we found coffins by wood and dead are covered by rocks and sand in the coffin,
    In India even today there is a cast that eats the dead at night,
    we know that he knew and teach them not to do,
    Alexander was not Greed and we know that he was giving much gold to his troops Greek or foreign,
    Alexander was not a fortune Hunter, but a dream hunter,
    If Alexander was trully a butcher then he slain all, even Darius family.
    there are myths that he did not die in Babylon, but he divided his kingdom and he took non greeks and went to china,
    names like Yunan and Naxii, the thibet symbols. and Makedonian coins found in china could be part of another epic writting,
    all these part of myth, but I don't believe he leave his kids of the 2 wifes to be slain while he explored the world,
    Last edited by iapetoc; 11-07-11 at 02:08.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DejaVu View Post
    What did the Dutch do in south Africa? How many did they kill and how much was plundered? Same as all other conquests by their rulers.
    Agree with you about no need of statue from him or any other but same should be in any country then, not only different political view for some because it suits people.
    You don't know nothing about the Dutch in South Africa!!!
    When the Dutch colonized the city of Cape Town, no living soul was living there!
    The Zulu's came from Central Africa and moved to the south. The Zulu's and the Dutch both were farmers (Boers), and they both lived and worked peacefully when they met each other.
    It only became a problem when the British entered the scene.
    The Brits were after the gold, diamonds and other stuff they could steal from the region.

    The British started their racist regime, and blamed the Dutch, as ever!

    BTW.. The British got kicked their ass many times by both the Dutch Boers, and the Zulu's.

    Another BTW...
    Stay on topic!
    The remark you made has nothing to do with the topic about Alexander.
    And anyway, the Scandinavians shouldn't talk about other peoples behavior anyway!
    The Vikings were the greatest bastards in European history whatsoever!

    They caused the militarization of the European continent, that in the end caused the Crusader Wars.
    So, just shut up!

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    I think Dejavu is ignoring iapetoc and I because we quite easily defeat this notion of "macedonians" that the communists invented for this small piece of land called Vardar Banovina.

    Build as many statues as you want, it means little my Bulgarian friend, Goste Delchev would be laughing at this statue and others like it if he were alive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaert View Post
    You don't know nothing about the Dutch in South Africa!!!
    When the Dutch colonized the city of Cape Town, no living soul was living there!
    !
    Please someone invent logic quickly, I can't understand this!

    There was a city Cape Town without people and Dutch came colonizing this city without people. Only Dutch could have done this, right Reinaert?

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    1. Before the Dutch came there, the region around Cape Town was inhabited by Hottentots and Khapoid bushmen. But as for Europeans at this time they were considered as animals, Reinhaert is right, there were no people...

    2. Bantu people entered later the region of what is now North and Eastern South Africa. When the British fought war against the Boers, they pushed them into the regions of Transvaal and Oranje, where they massacred and slaughtered the Zulu. But as it were the British who pushed them, blame it on the British! Simple as that!

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    BS Mzungu

    Cape Town was only a trading post, and a point to get water and fresh fruit and vegetables.
    The only purpose of Cape Town (Kaapstad) was to supply the ships of the Dutch merchant navy.
    The Dutch didn't have a greed for land as the British did.
    The Dutch didn't even have enough people to take South Africa, dammit!

    There were no people living there when the Dutch started there.
    But in time, maybe some tribes got interested in living and trading in the vicinity of Cape Town.

    And excuse me Sir! There were never ever wars between the Boers and the Zulu!

    The British got their asses kicked by the Zulu in some battles however!

    Why does a German support the British propaganda?

    Don't mix up history!

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    The area of Cape Town WAS inhabited by bushmen:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Cape_Town

    The Dutch didn't come all alone, they also brought protestant French and German settlers with them, who weren't much better! All together these three formed the Boers. And they fought war against Zulus:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Trek

    Don't mix up history!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mzungu mchagga View Post
    The area of Cape Town WAS inhabited by bushmen:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Cape_Town

    The Dutch didn't come all alone, they also brought protestant French and German settlers with them, who weren't much better! All together these three formed the Boers. And they fought war against Zulus:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Trek

    Don't mix up history!
    Haha.. Read well what you quote!

    It's the other way around!

    And of course the British had interests in a war between the Boers and the Zulu.
    They manipulate local tribes if they get a chance!

    The Boers and Zulu both were farmers, and wanted to live in peace.
    What you quote is about a tribe that was looking for trouble, and started aggression.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaert View Post
    Haha.. Read well what you quote!

    It's the other way around!
    What? That Cape Town was inhabited by native Dutch, until Bushmen arrived with ships?

    And of course the British had interests in a war between the Boers and the Zulu.
    They manipulate local tribes if they get a chance!

    The Boers and Zulu both were farmers, and wanted to live in peace.
    What you quote is about a tribe that was looking for trouble, and started aggression.
    Wasn't it so that capitalist Boers entered lands which actually belonged to communalist Zulus who were fostered to sign a treaty they couldn't understand? Both language and content? What about the Apartheit system? Is it an English term introduced by the British?

    You're just repeating the same propaganda which is distributed by racist white South Africans [e.g. South Africa was uninhabited as the Dutch arrived, didn't want to take land of anyone etc...]

    Haha! Everybody in this forum knows that you're a racist and capitalist fascist who is working for the CIA!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaert View Post
    You don't know nothing about the Dutch in South Africa!!!
    When the Dutch colonized the city of Cape Town, no living soul was living there!
    The Zulu's came from Central Africa and moved to the south. The Zulu's and the Dutch both were farmers (Boers), and they both lived and worked peacefully when they met each other.
    It only became a problem when the British entered the scene.
    The Brits were after the gold, diamonds and other stuff they could steal from the region.

    The British started their racist regime, and blamed the Dutch, as ever!

    BTW.. The British got kicked their ass many times by both the Dutch Boers, and the Zulu's.

    Another BTW...
    Stay on topic!
    The remark you made has nothing to do with the topic about Alexander.
    And anyway, the Scandinavians shouldn't talk about other peoples behavior anyway!
    The Vikings were the greatest bastards in European history whatsoever!

    They caused the militarization of the European continent, that in the end caused the Crusader Wars.
    So, just shut up!


    I see that iberians are not the only europeans who try to hide their past atrocities during the "imperial times". No wonder Geert Wilders has so much support in his country.

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    Excuse him, he is brain damaged. Impossible to overcome the past, psychiatric treatment is required.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vallicanus View Post
    This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

    Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.
    Why Greeks can't share a hero. Can't Alexander the Great be a hero of two nations? I think Alexander would be ecstatic himself!
    What if Egyptians would erect a statue of Alexander in Alexandria? You would take it as provocation too?
    I think Alexander the Great would love to have his statues all over the middle east and Balkans. Would you still go against a wish and ambitions of Alexander?

    Why Alexander can't be a key stone, a stepping stone for a friendship of two or more nations. You would have a chance to build a future with your neighbors. You would find something that binds the nations together and work together. It would be easier to make friends and not enemies. Use it as a building block, make friends.

    I'm polish, and I don't mind sharing Copernicus with Germans. He was a Polish citizen, had German mother and Polish father. He was raised by German uncle, and wrote scientific papers in Latin and German, but not in Polish.
    Surely, the nationalistic part of me would love to declare him only polish as he was a polish citizen, but I know that the best benefits for Germans and Polish people will be if we share him together in name of good neighborly relationship. And why not? What harm will come from it?
    I'm sharing my greatest hero, how about you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeBrok View Post
    Why Greeks can't share a hero. Can't Alexander the Great be a hero of two nations? I think Alexander would be ecstatic himself!
    What if Egyptians would erect a statue of Alexander in Alexandria? You would take it as provocation too?
    I think Alexander the Great would love to have his statues all over the middle east and Balkans. Would you still go against a wish and ambitions of Alexander?

    Why Alexander can't be a key stone, a stepping stone for a friendship of two or more nations. You would have a chance to build a future with your neighbors. You would find something that binds the nations together and work together. It would be easier to make friends and not enemies. Use it as a building block, make friends.

    I'm polish, and I don't mind sharing Copernicus with Germans. He was a Polish citizen, had German mother and Polish father. He was raised by German uncle, and wrote scientific papers in Latin and German, but not in Polish.
    Surely, the nationalistic part of me would love to declare him only polish as he was a polish citizen, but I know that the best benefits for Germans and Polish people will be if we share him together in name of good neighborly relationship. And why not? What harm will come from it?
    I'm sharing my greatest hero, how about you?
    This is not at all what it is about, if it was just about this it wouldn't have been going on 20 years. This is about Bulgaria losing the second balkan war, to sum it up. I don't want to go over it all again becase we spent to much wasted time on this subject already.

    edit - this wikipedia page sums up the background to this "macedonian question" quite nicely, if you are still confused about the issue take the time to read it;

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogra...y_of_Macedonia
    Last edited by Elias2; 20-07-11 at 07:55.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vallicanus View Post
    This statue is clear anti-Greek provocation.

    Alexander was Macedonian Greek not a Macedonian Slav.
    Alex the Great was a Macedonian not a hellinas. Greek is a modern term. Had he been an Hellinas the matter was settled long a go. But he was not hellinas. Ancient greek writters said that. A number of English and German historians who wrote about Alex claim that Alex's mother Olimpia and grandmother Eurudice were Illyrian stock. I have read myself their books. There are a number of them. We Albanians cliam Illyrian ancesrtry. Having said that it means that by blood he was 75% Illyrian. Its recorded in history books that when they were trying to kill him to take the throne he found refuge in Illyria where his uncles were. Culturally though he was hellinas. He was educated with hellinas philosophy and whatever Hellas had to offer. Don't forget he conquered Hellas. Had he been Hellinas why would need to conquer it? Macedonia ceased being Macedonia around 4 th centuary a.d. That means if in Alexander times he was speaking Macedonian as his mother tounge he also was speaking Hellinas as a mean of higher education. In the 4th centuary ancient Macedonia was completly Hellenised, the lost their laguage. So you either to my opinion have no right to claim Alex as hellinas when he was not. Albanians have claimed it because Alex of Emadhia had mother and grandmother Illyrian but I don't think he belongs to us, since he sided with Greek culture. Macedonian Slavs have no connection at all with him. Their effort to claim him is laughable. Albanians in Emadhia have made this position clear but since they are enjoying the present greek macedonian show, they are stayin quiet. It could be that a small portion of today's Macedonians have blood connection with ancient people of Macedonia, but so are the Greeks. The bottom line: Alexander was not hellinas. He was educated with greek culture ,and fought to spread greek culture and was fond of it. At this point greeks are right. Slac Macedonians have no right to claim him whatsoever. Greeks of present day Macedonia in greece are the desendants of Alexander, so they can claim him as their own, but not the greeks of Crete, Athens, peloponesus. They are the decendents of Alex as much as Nigerians are.

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    Alex the Great was a Macedonian not a hellinas. Greek is a modern term. Had he been an Hellinas the matter was settled long a go. But he was not hellinas. Ancient greek writters said that. A number of English and German historians who wrote about Alex claim that Alex's mother Olimpia and grandmother Eurudice were Illyrian stock. I have read myself their books. There are a number of them. We Albanians cliam Illyrian ancesrtry. Having said that it means that by blood he was 75% Illyrian. Its recorded in history books that when they were trying to kill him to take the throne he found refuge in Illyria where his uncles were. Culturally though he was hellinas. He was educated with hellinas philosophy and whatever Hellas had to offer. Don't forget he conquered Hellas. Had he been Hellinas why would need to conquer it? Macedonia ceased being Macedonia around 4 th centuary a.d. That means if in Alexander times he was speaking Macedonian as his mother tounge he also was speaking Hellinas as a mean of higher education. In the 4th centuary ancient Macedonia was completly Hellenised, the lost their laguage. So you either to my opinion have no right to claim Alex as hellinas when he was not. Albanians have claimed it because Alex of Emadhia had mother and grandmother Illyrian but I don't think he belongs to us, since he sided with Greek culture. Macedonian Slavs have no connection at all with him. Their effort to claim him is laughable. Albanians in Emadhia have made this position clear but since they are enjoying the present greek macedonian show, they are stayin quiet. It could be that a small portion of today's Macedonians have blood connection with ancient people of Macedonia, but so are the Greeks. The bottom line: Alexander was not hellinas. He was educated with greek culture ,and fought to spread greek culture and was fond of it. At this point greeks are right. Slac Macedonians have no right to claim him whatsoever. Greeks of present day Macedonia in greece are the desendants of Alexander, so they can claim him as their own, but not the greeks of Crete, Athens, peloponesus. They are the decendents of Alex as much as Nigerians are.
    Can we stop with the propaganda, I dont know what we are trying to accomplish with this, what does it matter if Alexander was from Greece or where ever. Is anybody else tired of people going on about this, maybe its just me.
    Arguing about Alexander is like a regional pastime for Balkans, and just arguing in general.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthro-inclined View Post
    Can we stop with the propaganda, I dont know what we are trying to accomplish with this, what does it matter if Alexander was from Greece or where ever. Is anybody else tired of people going on about this, maybe its just me.
    Arguing about Alexander is like a regional pastime for Balkans, and just arguing in general.
    You are right about it. It would not make any difference now where he was from. My tirade was to explain that Macedonian and Greek( hellen) in not equivalent. Macedonians are hellenized people. Greek historians wrote that. Thats the place where we read history. Albanians did not write any history so we rely in Greek or Roman sources. Alexander's statue in Skopje is funny. Pella is where that should be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by albanopolis View Post
    You are right about it. It would not make any difference now where he was from. My tirade was to explain that Macedonian and Greek( hellen) in not equivalent. Macedonians are hellenized people. Greek historians wrote that. Thats the place where we read history. Albanians did not write any history so we rely in Greek or Roman sources. Alexander's statue in Skopje is funny. Pella is where that should be.
    Yes I agree with you, alexanders origin is in macedonia greece not FYROM. But if they want a statue in skopje, thats fine, they feel he is part of their history, and if that makes them content, then I say let them have it, it shouldnt really matter to us. None the less I feel that you are right in saying that the statue should be in pella.

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